[CW: Child Sex Abuse] Josh & Anna 31: Charged on 2 LaCounts

[Sullie06]

19 hours ago, Howl said:

Came across this on a Twitter thread discussing why Christians and Evangelicals in particular don't want to come to terms with why people really leave the church.  Then this exchange happens: 

The "Josh Duggar didn't do anything wrong" wing-nut brigade is marching briskly along. 

These people are delusional. There is no way Homeland Security is going to consider ultrasound photo's child pornography. And the fact that people blindly believe this stuff is astounding. Even if you think Josh is the best thing since sliced bread you have to have at least a little common sense to know there is no way that is the case. 

[SassyPants]

16 minutes ago, Sullie06 said:

These people are delusional. There is no way Homeland Security is going to consider ultrasound photo's child pornography. And the fact that people blindly believe this stuff is astounding. Even if you think Josh is the best thing since sliced bread you have to have at least a little common sense to know there is no way that is the case. 

Remember, these are the kind of people who believe that Biden stole the election and only rigged the results in key, swing states. All the states that Trump won were legit, but the other states were rigged. There is no common sense there.

10 hours ago, viii said:

I think it’s more likely that nobody wants to live in the house where their beloved grandmother died. 

You’re reasoning like a thinking adult who was trained to handle/process as opposed to deny emotions. I’m not sure JB would reason like that. More likely he saw $$$ or someone offered him the right amount.

[Danica]

Regarding termination of parental rights… I divorced my husband because he was beating the heck out of the kids. He was supposed to pay me child support and he got no visitation.

 

He never paid me any child support for six kids, including one of his from his first marriage that I had gotten custody of. When he got to be about $30,000 behind I took him to court, but his attorney, who I had to pay, filed for visitation. I panicked.

 

So, I had my attorney ask his attorney if we could cancel out all existing and future child support in exchange for termination of parental rights.

 

Everybody ended up agreeing to it, and we got it signed by a judge. In the parking lot, my attorney told me not to tell anybody, because this is something that is never done, and she was worried about some kind of challenge to it. All of those kids are over 18 now, so I guess it doesn’t matter if I talk about it.

[artdecades]

44 minutes ago, Sullie06 said:

These people are delusional. There is no way Homeland Security is going to consider ultrasound photo's child pornography. And the fact that people blindly believe this stuff is astounding. Even if you think Josh is the best thing since sliced bread you have to have at least a little common sense to know there is no way that is the case. 

You’d think this would have come up in his hearing. You know, Josh’s lawyer saying “these are just ultrasound photos”. Wonder why they didn’t. ?

the mental gymnastics of these conspiracy theories is exhausting. Not only must the judge and homeland security be in on it, but also his lawyers. 

[TN-peach]

1 hour ago, Satan'sFortress said:

Sorry if this has been addressed. If Josh does take a plea deal, what would the timing likely be on that?

My speculation is that he won't plead guilty until after his attorneys have exhausted all avenues of attempting to exclude evidence.  There will be several motion hearings on excluding evidence is my guess before we get to a hearing or guilty plea.

[Alisamer]

18 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

I've given up on them. The fact that so many are also COVID conspiracists and anti-vaxxers leads me to think that their own delusions will ultimately, uh, limit their future influence on the rest of us. 

I certainly hope so. I hate being that kind of person but at this point I'm fed up to the point of "GDOAV" (go die of a virus) whenever I see Covid conspiracy theories or anti-vax people. They are the ones who are anti-mask, yet refuse to do the one simple FREE thing they can do to not have to wear masks anymore. I'd suggest they all start having Covid parties and contracting it deliberately to do their part toward herd immunity, except that circulating among unvaccinated people is what allows the virus to mutate into new variants, potentially putting the rest of us vaccinated people back into danger. I wish the virus was just sentient enough to seek out these people and take them out.

If it was a "plan" as they say, it would have been more targeted like that anyway. 

17 hours ago, ladyicantxplain said:

La-Miserables Duggar?... (you know, to commemorate the conception while living with LaCount...)

Terrible. I know. 

Misericordia? 

I seriously hope one of the Duggarlings somewhere along the lines goes goth and does tell-all interviews.

41 minutes ago, Jess said:

So, basically the list of Anna’s LLCs are a list of companies for which she is the registered agent or a listed officer. Someone posted the list originally on reddit I think and thought registered agent =ownership. Registered agent just means the person designated to accept service on behave of the LCC. Basically it means if the LLC is sued this is the person who gets the paperwork to and they will pass it on to the attorney. The registered agent is not necessarily a shareholder. 

Once a company I worked with had some legal mediation thing going on and needed an officer of the company to go attend, and of course the owners were off skiing in Vail and couldn't be bothered to go to the mediation. So they made me a listed officer for the day and ordered me to go and just not say anything. So I dutifully dressed up, went to the meeting, sat there and listened, and that was that. I'm still not sure what the point of all that was. Or even how legal it was. They were a touch shady IMO.

[JenniferJuniper]

22 minutes ago, TN-peach said:

My speculation is that he won't plead guilty until after his attorneys have exhausted all avenues of attempting to exclude evidence.  There will be several motion hearings on excluding evidence is my guess before we get to a hearing or guilty plea.

I agree.  I think this is exactly what will happen, and it will take time.  Even after he pleads guilty, there will a gap in time before he's sentenced, and he'll probably be able to stay out of prison until then.

The Rebers should buckle up.  The sex pest will be in their midst for a long time to come. 

[Mama Mia]

37 minutes ago, artdecades said:

You’d think this would have come up in his hearing. You know, Josh’s lawyer saying “these are just ultrasound photos”. Wonder why they didn’t. ?

the mental gymnastics of these conspiracy theories is exhausting. Not only must the judge and homeland security be in on it, but also his lawyers. 

I looked at that twitter feed. It’s really, really hard to tell if the guy is a regular run of the mill Q type conspiracy theorist, obsessed with the Duggar’s, or is trying to be an over-the-top satire account. There are a lot of parody accounts on twitter, specifically aimed at being so extremely outlandishly Q/MAGA (or ultra-woke) that people will realize they are joking —, they’ll often throw in regular level political to make it hard to guess -- but things have gotten so bizarre and delusional - you can’t be sure anymore! 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

28 minutes ago, Mama Mia said:

I looked at that twitter feed. It’s really, really hard to tell if the guy is a regular run of the mill Q type conspiracy theorist, obsessed with the Duggar’s, or is trying to be an over-the-top satire account. There are a lot of parody accounts on twitter, specifically aimed at being so extremely outlandishly Q/MAGA (or ultra-woke) that people will realize they are joking —, they’ll often throw in regular level political to make it hard to guess -- but things have gotten so bizarre and delusional - you can’t be sure anymore! 

That's what we used to call poe, back in the day.  The name actually came from the guy calling out how hard it is to satire creationists because their beliefs are so absurd to start with.

https://turbofuture.com/internet/Poes-Law-and-Internet-Satire

[Mama Mia]

11 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

That's what we used to call poe, back in the day.  The name actually came from the guy calling out how hard it is to satire creationists because their beliefs are so absurd to start with.

https://turbofuture.com/internet/Poes-Law-and-Internet-Satire

Thank you!! My brain could NOT remember that term! Great article. It really does get harder every day to tell.

Edited May 13, 2021 by Mama Mia

[Jackie3]

1 hour ago, Danica said:

Regarding termination of parental rights… I divorced my husband because he was beating the heck out of the kids. He was supposed to pay me child support and he got no visitation.

 

He never paid me any child support for six kids, including one of his from his first marriage that I had gotten custody of. When he got to be about $30,000 behind I took him to court, but his attorney, who I had to pay, filed for visitation. I panicked.

 

So, I had my attorney ask his attorney if we could cancel out all existing and future child support in exchange for termination of parental rights.

 

Everybody ended up agreeing to it, and we got it signed by a judge. In the parking lot, my attorney told me not to tell anybody, because this is something that is never done, and she was worried about some kind of challenge to it. All of those kids are over 18 now, so I guess it doesn’t matter if I talk about it.

You are so brave, and such a good mother. Your kids (especially your stepkid!) is very lucky.

[artdecades]

1 hour ago, Mama Mia said:

I looked at that twitter feed. It’s really, really hard to tell if the guy is a regular run of the mill Q type conspiracy theorist, obsessed with the Duggar’s, or is trying to be an over-the-top satire account. There are a lot of parody accounts on twitter, specifically aimed at being so extremely outlandishly Q/MAGA (or ultra-woke) that people will realize they are joking —, they’ll often throw in regular level political to make it hard to guess -- but things have gotten so bizarre and delusional - you can’t be sure anymore! 

I am nearly incapable of telling the difference these days between Poes and actual batshit crazy people.

[bertnee]

I checked out that guy's twitter and I'm 40/60 on real versus troll. But it's so hard to tell, unfortunately.

[JenniferJuniper]

37 minutes ago, bertnee said:

I checked out that guy's twitter and I'm 40/60 on real versus troll. But it's so hard to tell, unfortunately.

I'm 100% troll. 

 

[Cam]

15 hours ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

 

My brother didn't say one word, just crumpled her card and dropped it at his feet and we walked in like she wasn't there.  I was about to lose my shit but stayed quiet because he handled that like a boss.

 

Hell yes he did!!!

[Alisamer]

Ultrasound photos? Really? I'm betting troll as well. 

Although it's so hard to tell. Some people are incredibly gullible, and some are incredibly stupid, and some people just don't think critically.

[Cheetah]

1 hour ago, JenniferJuniper said:

I'm 100% troll. 

 

I hope you are right but after the past few years I'm leaning the other way....  

[nokidsmom]

On 5/11/2021 at 1:45 PM, Candycane36 said:

We have seen Josh humiliatie Anna on screen, when he made a comment about Anna swallowing a pill, he also made comments about his sister's incest was something they do in Arkansas. Josh has visited strip clubs, paid for sex workers , cheated, lied, hid money from Anna, indulged in inappropriate online sites, and now facing jail time. it this was not enough to convince Anna to leave, than nothing ever will. Anna does has choices, and she is choosing to stay with Josh.

Agreed, Anna has dealt with a lot of what other people would consider absolute dealbreakers in a marriage / relationship and yet she has chosen to stay.   Even by "biblical" standards, she had moral grounds to seek a divorce back when Joshley was caught cheating.   But she remains and I honestly think it's 1) because she loves Josh in spite of his treatment of her and 2) she is very vested in her life as part of the Duggar borg.   She gets too much out of that life both materially (support from JB) and emotionally (being SAHM, validation from fanbase) to really want to change it.  

I still think that if any divorce occurs, it will probably be Josh who will initiate it.  

[JenniferJuniper]

14 minutes ago, nokidsmom said:

I still think that if any divorce occurs, it will probably be Josh who will initiate it.  

I've always felt that is the most likely outcome for their marriage.  I think a lot depends on Jim Bob. Josh is so freaking lazy that if Jim Bob is willing to keep him on the dole post-prison if he stays with his family, he may well stay.  If Jim Bob forces him out into the world because there's no point in pretending  any longer that Josh isn't what he is,  I think he'll dump the marriage and the kids and never look back. But getting employment as a convicted felon will not be easy and so far in life Josh has always wanted easy. 

[Dandruff]

22 minutes ago, nokidsmom said:

I still think that if any divorce occurs, it will probably be Josh who will initiate it.

I believe JB and Josh will do what's in their best interests, and that Anna is somewhat of a pawn in those decisions and negotiations.  For now, Anna appears to be stuck in Duggarville since Josh is entitled to visitation with his kids.  I suspect JB is encouraging family and possibly friends to shower Anna and the kids with love while he takes care of all business.  Once it's known whether Josh is/isn't going to prison, I suspect JB and Josh will come to an agreement regarding potential issues such as divorce and support for Anna and the kids, and Anna would then be a position of trying to advocate for herself against two possible "opponents".

I wonder whether JB has contracts with family members to not write tell-alls.  If so, and if Josh were to breach the contract while wanting a divorce, would the potential proceeds of a book end up going to Anna and the kids for support or to JB due to breach of contract?  P.S.  I'm not an attorney.

[Jess]

4 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

I believe JB and Josh will do what's in their best interests, and that Anna is somewhat of a pawn in those decisions and negotiations.  For now, Anna appears to be stuck in Duggarville since Josh is entitled to visitation with his kids.  I suspect JB is encouraging family and possibly friends to shower Anna and the kids with love while he takes care of all business.  Once it's known whether Josh is/isn't going to prison, I suspect JB and Josh will come to an agreement regarding potential issues such as divorce and support for Anna and the kids, and Anna would then be a position of trying to advocate for herself against two possible "opponents".

I wonder whether JB has contracts with family members to not write tell-alls.  If so, and if Josh were to breach the contract while wanting a divorce, would the potential proceeds of a book end up going to Anna and the kids for support or to JB due to breach of contract?  P.S.  I'm not an attorney.

So, the federal judge allowing Josh supervised visitation does not mean Anna is stuck. She could file for divorce and custody that would be handled in state court. 

[Alisamer]

9 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

I wonder whether JB has contracts with family members to not write tell-alls.  If so, and if Josh were to breach the contract while wanting a divorce, would the potential proceeds of a book end up going to Anna and the kids for support or to JB due to breach of contract?  P.S.  I'm not an attorney.

I think if there's not a divorce, whether he goes to prison or not (but especially if he does) - there's going to be a big "redemption" money-grab with him trotted out at the center. JB will have a book ghost-written about Josh's experience as a "fallen man of God" and how he "came back into the fold" and "defeated his demons" and all that, and it'll be heavily promoted in Christian circles along with a speaking tour. 

That might be why JB hasn't completely dropped him yet. While he's in prison, he and Michelle can capitalize on their struggles as "parents of a fallen son" and then once he's out they can come up with a redemption narrative and associated income from that. It'll be easier for Josh than getting a real job, and keep the fam in the spotlight.

It's all about the money with JB. 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Just now, Jess said:

So, the federal judge allowing Josh supervised visitation does not mean Anna is stuck. She could file for divorce and custody that would be handled in state court. 

Does anyone know if allowing it requires it?  Hypothetically say Anna doesn't want to take the kids to see him.  Wouldn't he have to go to court and get a visitation order?  Another hypothetical, if she wanted to take the kids and go be with her family in Florida for a while would that be allowed without the court issuing an injunction to stop her?  

I know in their world her obedience doesn't require court orders, I'm just wondering what rights she has to keep the kids from him if she wanted to.

Also - does anyone know if the media is still camped out at the Reber's house?  

[JenniferJuniper]

3 minutes ago, Alisamer said:

I think if there's not a divorce, whether he goes to prison or not (but especially if he does) - there's going to be a big "redemption" money-grab with him trotted out at the center. JB will have a book ghost-written about Josh's experience as a "fallen man of God" and how he "came back into the fold" and "defeated his demons" and all that, and it'll be heavily promoted in Christian circles along with a speaking tour. 

*snip*

It's all about the money with JB. 

I agree 100% with your last line, but given the nature of the alleged crimes, I don't see book deals in anyone's future.  With the possible exception of Jill.  (And James someday.  As always, I'm looking at you, James.) Everyone else remained too close to the flame. 

[nokidsmom]

23 minutes ago, JenniferJuniper said:

I've always felt that is the most likely outcome for their marriage.  I think a lot depends on Jim Bob. 

8 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

I believe JB and Josh will do what's in their best interests, and that Anna is somewhat of a pawn in those decisions and negotiations. 

@JenniferJuniper and @Dandruff agreed, I think much will depend on JB and what kind of deal he is willing to offer, depending on the case length / outcome, if he will continue to subsidize Joshley's life or write him off as a lost cause and cut him loose.  I think in either case it will be less about Anna best interests, and more about JB saving his brand and his money.