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Jed and Katey 2: The Hidden Engagement?


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Snarkasarus Rex

KJ has a long history of lying, so I have a feeling she read @Marionette's comments and embellished them to make the story more 'juicy'.  Notice she never mentioned a 'feud' until something about it was mentioned here on FJ.  She's 'borrowed' stories from Reddit as well, so taking something from here and running with scissors is on brand for her.

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It very much looks like that Bates-boy is driving to Arkansas in a grandmothers livingroom. 

Jedey and the Easter Wedding. Giving He is Risen a whole 'nother meaning. 😉

No mask on your face, you big disgrace, spreading your germs all over the place. 

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dawn9476

Maybe when WACB says it's for "financial reasons." They mean Jim Bob is making sure Jed is marrying into a well off family so they don't run into a Caldwell situation where a son married into a family that seems to have no money and the family seems to be mooching off the son-in-law and his family.

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Snarkasarus Rex
3 minutes ago, dawn9476 said:

Maybe when WACB says it's for "financial reasons." They mean Jim Bob is making sure Jed is marrying into a well off family so they don't run into a Caldwell situation where a son married into a family that seems to have no money and the family seems to be mooching off the son-in-law and his family.

I think this is the situation as well.  The Kellers, Seewalds, and Caldwells have all likely been helped financially by the Duggars in some form or fashion...Boob probably realized that while that dependency keeps those families in line, it's not sustainable in the long run.  The other families have been at least self-sufficient, if not well off.  

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xenobia

I recognised some of the wording from the strange betrothal vows. Here's Jed's words:

Quote

Katelyn Nakastu, in the presence of God and our family and friends, I pledge to take you as my future wife. I have prepared my works without and made it fit for myself in the field and now prepare a home for us to live. Until that time, I pledge to sustain your good reputation by staying within the sight of others when we are together. I pledge to keep my way pure and honour you with my eyes, my mind, and my heart. I'll protect you by having no intimate physical contact, until that day when God allows, I will come receive you as my wife

 

Proverbs 24:27 (Something called BRG version - I googled it)

Quote

"Prepare thy work without, and make it fit for thyself in the field; and afterwards build thine house".

 

I think that the vows are a mix of quotes from the bible and words used in the betrothal ceremonies of whatever church they attend. I'll see if I can find out more about it. Google is my friend. 

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SassyPants
50 minutes ago, dawn9476 said:

Maybe when WACB says it's for "financial reasons." They mean Jim Bob is making sure Jed is marrying into a well off family so they don't run into a Caldwell situation where a son married into a family that seems to have no money and the family seems to be mooching off the son-in-law and his family.

A mooch really doesn’t want another mooch encroaching on his territory. Without mooching JB would have a whole lot less than he does now. 

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AussieKrissy
On 3/21/2021 at 6:46 AM, Kjaerringa said:

I am gobsmacked that the engagement video is up on the Nakatsu family site, but that there is complete silence from the Duggar machine.  Is it possible that Jed went rogue? The engagement itself...while slightly reminiscent of Jessa's...was far too lovely in every detail to be orchestrated (and paid for) by Duggardom, even with Jana's skills.

My other thought was that it was a TLC production from the get go, and that the Nakatsus are savvier about negotiating than previous brides' families. Perhaps they negotiated the right to announce. I am also wondering if the fact that they are doing a live feed wedding for invited guests might also turn into a premium based TLC event....to be announced later, by the network.  This could be a marketing ploy to rev up interest, just as I suspect the Vuolos are keeping Baby Jo's face hidden to do the same...(unless they are doing treatments on her birthmark. Sometimes those can grow a bit, depending on the vascular nature of the birthmark, and in the not long distant past, some fundamentalist groups considered birthmarks judgement on the parents for straying from doctrine...for whatever reason.) Lots of speculation, obviously.

Wait, what? When did I miss the revelation of a birthmark? 

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SassyPants

Oh and a poor preacher, Ben and Jeremy better take note...

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lexiloumarie
1 hour ago, Italiangirl said:

I don't get the problem of the different religions of the parents regarding the custody agreement, I mean why should that be a problem? If mom is part of a church and dad of another until they both agreed on the custody what this has to do with the agreement? Can someone explain? 

Is it a problem even when the parents aren't divorced? Maybe it's just me but I know several people in my acquaintance in rich one of the parents is religious and the other not or not so much and there isn't any problem about the kids, in the meaning that the kids decided if they align more with one or the other and act consequently going to church or not with one or the other 

Some courts (states/counties?/idmk) have a requirement that the status quo be maintained for the kids - at least that's how it was a explained to me. I was a toddler so I have no idea the exact legal statues. Essentially, you don't want anything else disrupting the kids lives at that moment so introducing a conflict over churches (LDS beliefs would not be in harmony with the IFB beliefs at all) that could be used to divide the children isn't allowed. 

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Aine
27 minutes ago, lexiloumarie said:

Some courts (states/counties?/idmk) have a requirement that the status quo be maintained for the kids - at least that's how it was a explained to me. I was a toddler so I have no idea the exact legal statues. Essentially, you don't want anything else disrupting the kids lives at that moment so introducing a conflict over churches (LDS beliefs would not be in harmony with the IFB beliefs at all) that could be used to divide the children isn't allowed. 

I read an article somewhat recently about women leaving Orthodox Jewish communities who have kids and secular courts making judgments around the mother having to continue to raise the children in accordance with Hasidic customs/traditions/religion.

...just went to find it and this is the link: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/12/07/when-one-parent-leaves-a-hasidic-community-what-happens-to-the-kids

The mother in the story also came out as gay but the crux of her losing custody was more to do with her change in religious beliefs, customs, and lifestyle no longer being in accordance with those the court said should be maintained for the children for stability.

Maybe something like that happened with the Nakatsu family?

But also, by the time Katey began homeschooling at 13, she was old enough that the courts would have taken her desires into account to an extent and homeschooling would have only added to the gradual brainwashing throughout her teens.

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Natalie22

Similar to what @Aine said, this is what I thought of.  I'm pretty sure it's not every state, but basically if you change your religious beliefs around the time your were divorced or after, your ex can still force you to comply with the former religious tradition or you can lose custody.  This makes some since in ideal circumstances (i.e. no crazy beliefs, no abusive spouses or communities), but when people leave really strict religious sects, this can cause huge issues and is used as a way to deter people from leaving or to try and remove any custody rights of a parent who has left a religious group.  

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Johannah
1 hour ago, Aine said:

I read an article somewhat recently about women leaving Orthodox Jewish communities who have kids and secular courts making judgments around the mother having to continue to raise the children in accordance with Hasidic customs/traditions/religion.

...just went to find it and this is the link: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/12/07/when-one-parent-leaves-a-hasidic-community-what-happens-to-the-kids

The mother in the story also came out as gay but the crux of her losing custody was more to do with her change in religious beliefs, customs, and lifestyle no longer being in accordance with those the court said should be maintained for the children for stability.

Maybe something like that happened with the Nakatsu family?

But also, by the time Katey began homeschooling at 13, she was old enough that the courts would have taken her desires into account to an extent and homeschooling would have only added to the gradual brainwashing throughout her teens.

You would think the status quo would have included the kids continuing to attend a real school rather than suddenly being homeschooled. 

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ihaveanexamintwodays
1 hour ago, Aine said:

....
the crux of her losing custody was more to do with her change in religious beliefs, customs, and lifestyle no longer being in accordance with those the court said should be maintained for the children for stability.

Maybe something like that happened with the Nakatsu family?

But also, by the time Katey began homeschooling at 13, she was old enough that the courts would have taken her desires into account to an extent and homeschooling would have only added to the gradual brainwashing throughout her teens.

 

11 minutes ago, Johannah said:

You would think the status quo would have included the kids continuing to attend a real school rather than suddenly being homeschooled. 

But Katey's birth parents divorced while they were still "normal" Christians. It wasn't until after Kory remarried that they went IBLP. So if mom was/re-became LDS (or had some other major shift of faith and habits) and that caused marital strife and post-divorce huge changes, that could be seen as inconsistency for two young children. If per @Laura2730's screenshots the 2 elder siblings are >5 and >7 years older than Katey they'd have been teenagers at the time of divorce and may've chose to go with their mother - or mother may've been their primary guardian anyways from pre-Kory.

Edited by ihaveanexamintwodays
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baldricks_turnip
3 hours ago, Marionette said:

 With this and JB asking Paul to close the church due to Covid, several families left. So really, the Caldwells were (if not still) on the outs with.... almost everyone.

I'm surprised that JB took Covid seriously at all!

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Cheetah
3 hours ago, dawn9476 said:

Maybe when WACB says it's for "financial reasons." They mean Jim Bob is making sure Jed is marrying into a well off family so they don't run into a Caldwell situation where a son married into a family that seems to have no money and the family seems to be mooching off the son-in-law and his family.

Wait - the older Caldwells are mooching off of Joe?  

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Vivi_music
On 3/20/2021 at 7:16 PM, artdecades said:

TLC has a really tight leash on the 90 days cast. Even when fans find marriage certificates for couples they won’t admit to being married on social media. The serious fans know it’s good ole tlc fraud but love to play detective and the casual fans feel like they are watching something unfold in real time. It seems to work really well for that franchise. 
 

I wonder if they are trying the same with the Duggars to help drum up the same kind of intense fan base 90df has. 

That could be a good explanation as to why the Duggar clan is so secretive about the Jed/Katey thing. TLC always seem to think the viewers are just a bunch of idiots who can't keep trakc of timelines.

That also would be totally in line with the caption @Italiangirl showed earlier in the thread. The episode description mentions the birth of Brooklyn Praise while the family is preparing for Easter, which totally doesn't make sense, since that child was born in February. Does TLC really think we don't see these little warp in time? Also note from myself: I'd hate to have a TV show dictate my life, when I'm suppose to announce an engagement, celebrating a fake Easter in february, etc.

Spoiler
On 3/20/2021 at 12:19 PM, Italiangirl said:

This is all that there is on the TLC site, is unclear if it just a special or the first ep of the new season. Will Jed marriage be feature on the show? Or will they just ignore it like it seems they have done with Justin's? Screenshot_20210320-171441_Reddit.thumb.jpg.a691af31b1589f355b33bb460cee5e78.jpg

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Bluebirdbluebell
6 hours ago, Snarkasarus Rex said:

I think this is the situation as well.  The Kellers, Seewalds, and Caldwells have all likely been helped financially by the Duggars in some form or fashion...Boob probably realized that while that dependency keeps those families in line, it's not sustainable in the long run.  The other families have been at least self-sufficient, if not well off.  

The Swansons moved from Georgia to Arkansas after Lauren got with Josiah. They weren't that well off before. (Dad had a lawn-care business and 8/9 kids to support.) They are probably getting support from the Duggars. 

The Kellers still in Florida and I don't think they get much money. The Seewalds get the odd trip from Ben and Jessa, but I doubt they get much either. 

It wouldn't surprise if the camp didn't pay to well and the Forsyths got some money from the Duggars. 

There's some way you can look up who has an LLC in their name. On other snarksites, people look up the LLCS the Duggars have and also have found a few for some of the in-laws. 

JB should keep Joe and Kendra close, because they likely to have the most children. 

Fun Fact: Katey is a few weeks older than Kendra. 

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Sabine
6 minutes ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

JB should keep Joe and Kendra close, because they likely to have the most children. 

poor kendra. 

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AussieKrissy
1 hour ago, Vivi_music said:

That could be a good explanation as to why the Duggar clan is so secretive about the Jed/Katey thing. TLC always seem to think the viewers are just a bunch of idiots who can't keep trakc of timelines.

That also would be totally in line with the caption @Italiangirl showed earlier in the thread. The episode description mentions the birth of Brooklyn Praise while the family is preparing for Easter, which totally doesn't make sense, since that child was born in February. Does TLC really think we don't see these little warp in time? Also note from myself: I'd hate to have a TV show dictate my life, when I'm suppose to announce an engagement, celebrating a fake Easter in february, etc.

  Hide contents

 

How the hell? Easter has not even happened yet!!!

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Joe Pukepail
On 3/19/2021 at 7:41 AM, AprilQuilt said:

So, I know a good bit about attitudes to marriage in the Medieval era as that's at the heart of the project I'm currently working on for my job. At time marriage was regarded as a sacrament you were able to confer on yourself - you did not need a holy person or witnesses there to hear you make the vows, because you were of course doing it in God's presence.

Basically it was felt by many theologians that marriage vow itself was consensual and did not require consummation to further indicate that consent, whereas others maintained that sexual consummation was required to nail that vow down. However, broadly speaking it was felt that marriage vows might be interpreted in one of two ways:

sponsalia de futuro, essentially 'I will marry you', and particularly employed by children who would not be able to express their full consent to the marriage by consummating it for many years to come. This was regarded as a contract but it could be dissolvable.

sponsalia de praesenti, 'I marry you', which was binding at the moment it was uttered.

A good example of sponsalia de futuro would be the alleged promises exchanged by Anne Boleyn and Henry Percy, and the reason everybody was so anxious to establish whether they had slept together, because a promise followed by sex would have created a binding marriage, and rendered her subsequent relationship with Henry VIII bigamous. Another might be the alleged secret marriage between Edward IV and Lady Eleanor Talbot: if he had promised to marry her in order to get her into bed, their relationship would again be considered full marriage.

It's particularly interesting in regards to the de futuro vows made between Edward's 5-year-old son Richard of Shrewsbury and Eleanor's 4-year-old niece Anne Mowbray because the terms of that union stated that even if Anne died before maturity, ie did not live to consummate their marriage, Richard would still inherit all her goods. This was an obvious land grab but it does highlight the limits of a standard de futuro vow, ie that it would have to be officially dissolved before the parties moved on, and the children were regarded as having 'married', but it did not have the same benefit of marriage in terms of access to the spouse's property. Anne basically occupied a similar middle ground the S'Morton blog describes: she lived in the Royal household and yet her property was not accessible to her 'husband'. In fact she did predecease him, aged 8, but he then became the younger of the Princes in the Tower and didn't outlive her by much.

Hmm, anyway. So. The serious nature of what marriage and betrothal is may go back a lot longer than the Medieval era.

I don't know what your job is, but I want it.

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Joe Pukepail
On 3/20/2021 at 3:51 PM, Snarkasarus Rex said:

Kory and Kim divorced and Kory is remarried to Kerry. He’s retired now according to his LinkedIn profile and they recently moved to Springdale.  Just a few miles from TTH...

Not sure about the older brothers...their blog only mentions Katey and Lauren.

My mom's aunt had five children and gave them all K names. Every year, she'd sign her Christmas card, "From Gail and The Five Ks". My brain has a similar reaction to reading Kory-Kimberly-Kerry-Katey. How does anyone keep them straight?

It's hard enough when everyone has different names. I never met my great-grandpa, but we joke that whenever he was looking for one of the kids, he'd forget which one he was hollering for and just start spluttering, "BobGeorgeRedTimTerryTJ - GODDAMN IT, GET IN HERE!"

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Italiangirl
2 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

How the hell? Easter has not even happened yet!!!

The only half reasonable thing I could see about this mess is that somehow they have decided to celebrate a little early as a family so after the newlyweds could go on their honeymoon and the other kids could go by their inlaws to celebrate if they wanted or something similar. You know sometimes people say Christmas with your's Easter with whoever you want...

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medimus

At the top of the episode description it also says 'episode 2', so where is episode one. Why is it easter before easter (though it does say preparations I suppose) and why isn't Jinjer baby 2's birth being shown. Really odd.

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Johannah
41 minutes ago, medimus said:

At the top of the episode description it also says 'episode 2', so where is episode one. Why is it easter before easter (though it does say preparations I suppose) and why isn't Jinjer baby 2's birth being shown. Really odd.

It says they “celebrate Easter” and “get together for an Easter brunch” to meet BP. Makes zero sense. This is extreme even for TLC given that the show is airing March 30th and Easter still won’t even have happened yet. 

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justmy2cents
1 hour ago, medimus said:

At the top of the episode description it also says 'episode 2', so where is episode one. Why is it easter before easter (though it does say preparations I suppose) and why isn't Jinjer baby 2's birth being shown. Really odd.

TLC had a birth special for Evy Jo. 
It’s strange that they’re not advertising a new season. I could see them showing the birth and then going back to where they left off last year. 

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AprilQuilt
5 hours ago, Joe Pukepail said:

I don't know what your job is, but I want it.

it is a good job! It's a bit specific and outing but I get to work with/adjacent to museums and academia while having a bit more fun.

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