Erin & Chad 7: Reckless Behavior in a Pandemic Has Consequences

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 minute ago, JDuggs said:

Claire Spivey Duggar has a brother named Taylor and a sister named Carson, two names that I associate in general with the other sex.

Taylor used to be much more common for boys. Now it’s thought of a girl name because once a name goes girl, it doesn’t go back. 

[pupper]

19 hours ago, Expectopatronus said:

I have never seen Finley or Finn for a girl and I don’t really like it but it is better than the other options. Who the heck would name their kid Harbour, Scotland or Ireland? Avonlea isn’t much better but it has some appeal as a name rooted in classic children’s literature. Anne is pretty feisty; would they want their kids to read the books? Plus, she went to college and worked outside the home. The horror! 

But it baffles me that Erin would choose a gender neutral name like Findley when gender stereotypes are so emphasized in their beliefs.

Just now, pupper said:

But it baffles me that Erin would choose a gender neutral name like Findley when gender stereotypes are so emphasized in their beliefs.

Also wanted to add that I recently met a young woman with the first name of Stewart. That was a new one to me.

[JDuggs]

17 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Taylor used to be much more common for boys. Now it’s thought of a girl name because once a name goes girl, it doesn’t go back. 

And as Taylor was dropping like a rock for boys (ranked #348 in boys names in 2012 after peaking in the early 90’s in the #50s), the Spiveys still chose it for their boy. Taylor for girls peaked in the 90’s in the top 10 and was still in the #50s when this particular Taylor was born. So I think by 2012, most people were considering Taylor a girls name for babies.

Edited October 22, 2021 by JDuggs
Typo

[medimus]

40 minutes ago, pupper said:

But it baffles me that Erin would choose a gender neutral name like Findley when gender stereotypes are so emphasized in their beliefs.

Also wanted to add that I recently met a young woman with the first name of Stewart. That was a new one to me.

It's the age thing, i highly recommend that baby name wizard article, it ralks about red v blue states and values and how in naming it is all basically overridden by age.

[Johannah]

I have a name trend obsession that runs even deeper than my fundie obsession, so fundies naming their babies is kind of like Christmas for me. 

I actually generally like Erin’s naming style, much more than that of other fundies. If anything, some of her choices are a little too common for me (Carson, Brooklyn, and Everly are all extremely common names right now in the US, even if people don’t realize they are). Finley is also pretty common in the US, for both girls and boys. I know several little girl Finleys, and more girl Finleys than boys. 

Rather than being gender neutral (like Jamie or Pat) or place names (like Paris or Tennessee), I would describe her style as surname names (there are a lot of place names, particularly in the UK and parts of the US, that are originally surnames). Finley is definitely a surname name, even though there are towns named Finley/Findlay.

I also think it’s worth noting that the place names she’s using are not Russia or California. They all end in lyn/land (pronounced almost the same at the end of the name). I think the lyn/land ending feminizes the name for some people (Brooklyn, Holland, Scotland, Ireland, etc). She’s never going to name a kid Tanzania just because it’s a place name. She’d be more likely to use a name like Lachlan or Oakland or Camden. 

Also worth noting that surname names are more popular/common in the south in general (like Taylor or Carson Spivey or names like Sutton or Addison regardless of gender). I also think regardless of the reason, I’m personally glad those kids have more gender neutral names (anything to counteract the giant hair bows and strict gender roles). Carson is also a surname name that is frequently used for girls, so I’m hoping she continues the trend and has little boys named things like Parker or Callan instead of Robert and Richard. Also, Carson and Everly are definitely more flexible and preferable to hyper-biblical names like Nehemiah and Esther. Imagine leaving Christianity/fundamentalism and explaining why you have a name like Nehemiah. 

Also worth mentioning that even Erin’s unused name choices on her 5th child list are not without precedent (except maybe Harbor). Alec Baldwin and Kim Basinger have a daughter named Ireland. Kourtney Kardashian’s daughter is named Penelope Scotland. Holland Taylor is a famous actress. Avonlea is not so different from popular names like Everly or Adaleigh. Brighton is similar to other surname names like Peyton and Leighton. 

Her style may seem offbeat, but I definitely would not categorize it as 16 and pregnant. In my opinion, Tori wins that award for names like Kade and Kolter (completely invented names, kreaytivv spellings, and heavy use of the letter K tend to be hallmarks of 16 and pregnant style naming).

Edited October 22, 2021 by Johannah
Forgot about Holland Taylor

[JermajestyDuggar]

49 minutes ago, JDuggs said:

And as Taylor was dropping like a rock for boys (ranked #348 in boys names in 2012 after peaking in the early 90’s in the #50s), the Spiveys still chose it for their boy. Taylor for girls peaked in the 90’s in the top 10 and was still in the #50s when this particular Taylor was born. So I think by 2012, most people were considering Taylor a girls name for babies.

Hudson Taylor is also a well known historical Christian. That’s why the Bontragers have a son named Hudson and a son named Lincoln Taylor. They also have a Carson for Ben Carson. There’s a lot of overlap in some names in fundieland because they love to name their kids after Christian heroes. Even if it is becoming more popular with girls. 

[JDuggs]

I was watching an MLB game this summer and the pitcher and hitter were named Addison and Madison. It was like a flashback to one of my daughter’s softball games. I live near a big Midwestern city and have never met or knew of a male Addison or Madison of any age. These types of names for boys are probably highly concentrated in the South.

[JuanitaBanana]

I'm confused by the name of Erin's son... They named him Charles after his father and grandfather but they call him "Carson"? That seems so weird to me. Why not use his middle name if you don't like Charles? And Tori did the same thing. His first son is Robert but they call him Kade??? I just don't get it. I also think that Charles and Robert are much better names than Carson and Kade. 

My son is named after my husband and father in law but we called him by his middle name. It turns out that his middle name was super popular and they were like 5 little boys with the same name in his kindergarden class so he now goes by his first name. 

[raayx01]

5 minutes ago, JuanitaBanana said:

I'm confused by the name of Erin's son... They named him Charles after his father and grandfather but they call him "Carson"? That seems so weird to me. Why not use his middle name if you don't like Charles? And Tori did the same thing. His first son is Robert but they call him Kade??? I just don't get it. I also think that Charles and Robert are much better names than Carson and Kade. 

My son is named after my husband and father in law but we called him by his middle name. It turns out that his middle name was super popular and they were like 5 little boys with the same name in his kindergarden class so he now goes by his first name. 

They  probably didn't like Stephen or Ellis either

[LanaBanana]

22 minutes ago, JuanitaBanana said:

I'm confused by the name of Erin's son... They named him Charles after his father and grandfather but they call him "Carson"? That seems so weird to me. Why not use his middle name if you don't like Charles? And Tori did the same thing. His first son is Robert but they call him Kade??? I just don't get it. I also think that Charles and Robert are much better names than Carson and Kade. 

My son is named after my husband and father in law but we called him by his middle name. It turns out that his middle name was super popular and they were like 5 little boys with the same name in his kindergarden class so he now goes by his first name. 

Erin said her FIL (Chad's dad/Charles Steven II) goes by Steve, so that might have something to do with it. Chad isn't a nickname for Charles either, so taking liberties with nicknames doesn't seem to bother the Paines.

Idky the don't just call Kade by his middle name though. Probably because Tori likes the trendier names.

[JermajestyDuggar]

Nicknames run rampant in my family. So I don’t care much about nickname. But I do think it’s strange when someone uses a completely different name as a nickname. Both erin and Tori named their first child after their husband and then gave them completely different names to call them by everyday. I have a son named after his father and his nickname makes sense. It’s not just some completely different name. If their sons developed nicknames that were just evolved naturally, then I would get it. Like a kid named Charles but the sibling called him “Bubba” for brother. Then it becomes a nickname everyone calls him. Those make sense to me too. There are a lot of people in my family with nicknames like that. 

[raayx01]

5 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Nicknames run rampant in my family. So I don’t care much about nickname. But I do think it’s strange when someone uses a completely different name as a nickname. Both erin and Tori named their first child after their husband and then gave them completely different names to call them by everyday. I have a son named after his father and his nickname makes sense. It’s not just some completely different name. If their sons developed nicknames that were just evolved naturally, then I would get it. Like a kid named Charles but the sibling called him “Bubba” for brother. Then it becomes a nickname everyone calls him. Those make sense to me too. There are a lot of people in my family with nicknames like that. 

I think Carson can be a variant of Charles, it's Kade that doesn't go with Robert. They say it means the 4th in Hebrew, but I think someone on here say's it doesn't 

[JermajestyDuggar]

4 minutes ago, raayx01 said:

I think Carson can be a variant of Charles, it's Kade that doesn't go with Robert. They say it means the 4th in Hebrew, but I think someone on here say's it doesn't 

Carlson could be a variant of Charles. But Carson means son of Carr, not son of Charles. 

[lumpentheologie]

3 hours ago, Johannah said:

Also, Carson and Everly are definitely more flexible and preferable to hyper-biblical names like Nehemiah and Esther. Imagine leaving Christianity/fundamentalism and explaining why you have a name like Nehemiah. 

Huh, I've never thought of Esther as a hyper-biblical name. It's my sister-in-law's name, and my husband's family are all atheists. 

[anjulibai]

5 minutes ago, lumpentheologie said:

Huh, I've never thought of Esther as a hyper-biblical name. It's my sister-in-law's name, and my husband's family are all atheists. 

There's a Book of Esther in the Bible......

[lumpentheologie]

6 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

There's a Book of Esther in the Bible......

I'm aware that it's from the bible, I just think of it as a name that non-religious people use too.  Like Ruth.  Not like Nehemiah. 

[Johannah]

32 minutes ago, lumpentheologie said:

I'm aware that it's from the bible, I just think of it as a name that non-religious people use too.  Like Ruth.  Not like Nehemiah. 

I agree it’s not as extreme as Nehemiah, but I’ve personally never met an Esther or a Ruth under age 50 who isn’t pretty religious, usually Orthodox Jewish. I think both names were more commonly used by people of all faiths in previous generations. Maybe Hadassah is a better example? Or Praise?

Edited October 22, 2021 by Johannah
Added Praise

[Johannah]

Also, Harbor sounds just like Harper. I wonder if that’s why the sound appeals to her. It would be very annoying to constantly say, not Harper, it’s har-BOR.

 

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Johannah said:

Also, Harbor sounds just like Harper. I wonder if that’s why the sound appeals to her. It would be very annoying to constantly say, not Harper, it’s har-BOR.

 

I could see Josie using Harper for a girl. That seems like her taste.

[HeartsAFundie]

7 hours ago, JuanitaBanana said:

I'm confused by the name of Erin's son... They named him Charles after his father and grandfather but they call him "Carson"? That seems so weird to me. Why not use his middle name if you don't like Charles? And Tori did the same thing. His first son is Robert but they call him Kade??? I just don't get it. I also think that Charles and Robert are much better names than Carson and Kade. 

My son is named after my husband and father in law but we called him by his middle name. It turns out that his middle name was super popular and they were like 5 little boys with the same name in his kindergarden class so he now goes by his first name. 

Regarding Erin, I think they came up with "Carson" as a way of shortening "Charles Stephen".  Carson is the fourth one in his family to be formally named Charles Stephen.  I would assume Dr. Paine's dad, the first Charles Stephen, went by Charles, Charlie or Chuck; Dr. Paine, Chad's dad and Charles Stephen Jr. went by Steve; and Erin's husband, AKA Charles Stephen III, was nicknamed Chad.   If Carson someday has a son and carries on the "Charles Stephen" tradition, it sure will be interesting to see what nickname they'll come up with for #5. 

As far as Tori goes, Kade is Robert Ellis Smith IV and they claim "Kade" is a derivative of "Quade" which means "4".  That's a lot of mental gymnastics for a nickname.  

 

Edited October 23, 2021 by HeartsAFundie

[neurogirl]

From the video, Erin said they really really thought this new baby would be a boy. They did the early blood test and didn't believe it, and didn't believe it for a while. She seems pretty baffled at the possibility of 4 girls in a row, even though Alyssa did it too! I think they named the baby Finley assuming it would be a boy. And now that's how they think of the baby, even though they are having a daughter! They gave the "God chooses our family so boy or girl, this was the perfect addition" and did a good job with it but they way they talked about their disbelief I get the sense there's some disappointment from more than just Carson. But this is just my speculation!

 

[adidas]

On 10/22/2021 at 4:05 AM, Dbm said:

they choose from these 

 

 

  Hide contents

 

SOTRT fail, yet again. Her handwriting is atrocious. It took me at least 5 re-reads to understand the first word. I thought it said harlot.

[bettertomarry]

21 minutes ago, adidas said:

SOTRT fail, yet again. Her handwriting is atrocious. It took me at least 5 re-reads to understand the first word. I thought it said harlot.

For a moment I read "Ireland' as "Cleveland'.   Now that would be an interesting name!

[ihaveanexamintwodays]

56 minutes ago, adidas said:

SOTRT fail, yet again. Her handwriting is atrocious. It took me at least 5 re-reads to understand the first word. I thought it said harlot.

That's typical fundie calligraphy script. Also, her writing of "Harbor" is the correct way to write it in cursive....with a lowercase-H and extra loops, to make it "fancy" aka less-legible haha. I admittedly did read "Brighton" as "frighten" though, with her capital-B looking lowercase-f ish xD and I can def see how her "Ireland" looks like it starts with "c-l-"

38 minutes ago, bettertomarry said:

For a moment I read "Ireland' as "Cleveland'.   Now that would be an interesting name!

 

[zee_four]

If you think Erin's naming style, which is straight white insta/pinterest millennial southern chic (I can imagine all those names popping up on SEC sorority alumn 2005-2015 newsletter baby announcements if such things exist, is strange, you'll love Utah Mormon names. Those women are the original OG of believing traditional spelling is for coffee drinking heathens up borth in Sin City- SLC, and that changing Cs to Ks, adding ayden to the end of anything and that Is and Es should be completely eliminated and replaced with Ys (the more the better) is THE way you fast track yourself to winning the best Jello receipe of the ward, becoming the leader of your Relief Society chapter and most importantly to ensure your kids are either 18 year old Missionaries with the best assignments or that they marry the most hottes- I mean modest returning missionary before they finish their sophomore year in Family and Marriage Studies at BYU. I admire their tenacity that has actually reclaimed names that formerly belonged only to middle school girls choosing the most mature and trendy spelling for their names and/or stage names assigned to apathetic dancers at seedy strip clubs.