Botkin 2: Geoff Tried to Advise Trump

[CyborgKin]

Well that's a solid diss, and a WandaVision reference to boot!

[Howl]

9 minutes ago, CyborgKin said:

Well that's a solid diss

An extremely solid diss and a major swipe at his upbringing. 

I really do want to know where the other Botkin sprogs fall on the continuum. I don't think there will be other defectors like Ben and Audri, BUT things may change up a bit once Geoff falls off his perch. 

[hoipolloi]

7 hours ago, Howl said:

I really do want to know where the other Botkin sprogs fall on the continuum.

And Victoria. Whatʻs she thinking about all of this?

Judging from his recent videos, Geoff has not only gone off the deep end but is halfway to the bottom of the Marianas Trench. 

[MamaJunebug]

7 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

And Victoria. Whatʻs she thinking about all of this?

Judging from his recent videos, Geoff has not only gone off the deep end but is halfway to the bottom of the Marianas Trench. 

I don’t mean to mock the man’s mental demise. What I do mean to LOL at “is halfway to the bottom of the Marianas Trench”—will be using it early & often!!! Thank you!!   

[Columbia]

8 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

And Victoria. Whatʻs she thinking about all of this?

I imagine she is a prime gaslighter, and sees no problem with everything that happened to Audri. 
 

A long time ago I listened to her “She Shall Be Called Woman” lectures. In the very first episode Victoria got a question from a listener who said that she thought she was being submissive to her husband, but her husband said she wasn’t, and she wanted to know what to do. Victoria’s answer was, either:

1. You’re not actually submissive, and need to repent to your husband

2. You weren’t submissive in the past, but you are now, and your husband doesn’t trust you. You still should repent to him. 
 

There was no possibility that she actually was submitting to him and it just wasn’t enough to make him happy. Victoria never even mentioned it. 
 

I got chills first listening to that, and again thinking about it now. Imagine being a new wife in that congregation, doing everything you can to please your husband, asking the pastor’s wife for advice, and being told “you just need to submit harder.” I’m sure the Botkins would say that they completely repudiate prosperity gospel teachings, but that’s basically a patriarchy prosperity gospel that they’re peddling. 

[Howl]

2 hours ago, Columbia said:

I’m sure the Botkins would say that they completely repudiate prosperity gospel teachings, but that’s basically a patriarchy prosperity gospel that they’re peddling. 

To be a legit in patriarchal fundy-dom,  one MUST have the successful home- or family-based business, and T-Rex Arms has come through big time for the Botkin Borg.  Not only is it a successful family business, it sells a dick-centric product, so bonus points there! 

 

Edited April 15, 2021 by Howl

[AnnaSofia]

I still find it ironic that after years of holding themselves up as the cultured intelligentsia of the evangelical set, they ended up pushing firearm accessories. And that it took until child number seven (out of eight) before someone hit on a genuinely marketable idea. Better late than never, I suppose.

[Howl]

1 hour ago, AnnaSofia said:

And that it took until child number seven (out of eight) before someone hit on a genuinely marketable idea.

Yes, and they would be as poor as the proverbial church mice (I have a vision of genteel Victorian poverty) if that business wasn't keeping them all afloat. 

Edited April 15, 2021 by Howl

[hoipolloi]

4 hours ago, Columbia said:

Imagine being a new wife in that congregation, doing everything you can to please your husband, asking the pastor’s wife for advice, and being told “you just need to submit harder.”

This is fundie Christianity in a nutshell: insist on constant obedience to impossible standards and then, when you can't meet those standards, you're told "You're doing it wrong."

Also, this is how abusive leadership stays in power. As long as they are the sole arbiters of doing things the right way, no one else can gainsay them.

[AnnaSofia]

Err, too late for the edit window, but correction to my last post; it should have read offspring number six of seven, not seven of eight. I must have had the Phillips family on the brain.

[Sarcastically spinster]

23 hours ago, Howl said:

I really do want to know where the other Botkin sprogs fall on the continuum. I don't think there will be other defectors like Ben and Audri, BUT things may change up a bit once Geoff falls off his perch. 

I don't know the Botkins personally though I've met some of them (and could have met more).  I know people who do.  I don't go asking, but I hear things sometimes.  I haven't heard anything about other Botkins making moves towards breaking away the way Ben and Audri have.  

[starfish]

On 4/15/2021 at 3:54 PM, Sarcastically spinster said:

I don't know the Botkins personally though I've met some of them (and could have met more).  I know people who do.  I don't go asking, but I hear things sometimes.  I haven't heard anything about other Botkins making moves towards breaking away the way Ben and Audri have.  

I still hope to see the day when one of the Botkinettes flees the compound in the middle of the night on the back of a motorcycle holding on to the leather jacket of a totally inappropriate suitor. Or goes out of the front door in the middle of the day while announcing she's headed to college. I mean, a FJ-ite can dream, right? 

 

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

On 4/18/2021 at 9:19 AM, starfish said:

I still hope to see the day when one of the Botkinettes flees the compound in the middle of the night on the back of a motorcycle holding on to the leather jacket of a totally inappropriate suitor. Or goes out of the front door in the middle of the day while announcing she's headed to college. I mean, a FJ-ite can dream, right? 

 

Keep dreaming

https://www.instagram.com/p/CN2i0ZcBAXV/?igshid=refkkfebkfjc

 

[CyborgKin]

On 4/19/2021 at 3:19 AM, starfish said:

I still hope to see the day when one of the Botkinettes flees the compound in the middle of the night on the back of a motorcycle holding on to the leather jacket of a totally inappropriate suitor.

 

That's basically the mental image that inspired my first novel...

 

4 minutes ago, JemimaPuddle-Duck said:

Keep dreaming

https://www.instagram.com/p/CN2i0ZcBAXV/?igshid=refkkfebkfjc

 

A week ago on that account:

Quote

churchandfamilylife

Jeff Pollard will bring us a message on “A Woman’s Highest Calling” at the Singles conference May 19-20.

“What is a woman’s highest calling in this life? Being a wife? A mother? While these are high, lofty, and biblical goals, they do not always materialize for some women who deeply desire them...Is she then a failed human being, an object to be pitied, a second-class Christian? The answer is no if parents, especially fathers, and she understand her highest calling.”

backpedalling in high gear!

[Howl]

4 minutes ago, CyborgKin said:

The answer is no if parents, especially fathers, and she understand her highest calling.”

I wonder if emotional incest will be discussed...

8 minutes ago, CyborgKin said:

...Is she then a failed human being, an object to be pitied, a second-class Christian?

So, IF she doesn't understand her highest calling (which I'm assuming means supporting the patriarch without reservation), it's OK to pity her, assume she's a 2nd class Christian and see her as a failed human being?

[Columbia]

3 hours ago, JemimaPuddle-Duck said:

Keep dreaming

https://www.instagram.com/p/CN2i0ZcBAXV/?igshid=refkkfebkfjc

 

Ooooh. They want questions? Do I have questions. Somehow I don’t think they’d get past the censors. 
 

I’m sure they were scheduled to speak before Audri’s denouncement of their church, but I wonder if that will color their talk at all. Some mention of witnessing to lost family members, or the like. I am very curious to hear if they discuss singleness in light of being SAHDs, or if they’re going to try for a broader approach. The issue with that is their experience as single women is wildly different than that of a 35 year old living on her own. I don’t know if they’ll ever be applicable to a wider audience, and I don’t know if they realize that. 

[hoipolloi]

Interesting that the Botkinettes are now joining the Scott Brown grifters' circuit, under his rebranding from the NCFIC to Church and Family Life. In the linked video, Scott tells us that heʻs wanted to change the name for over 10 years. 

 

 

[Howl]

6 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Interesting that the Botkinettes are now joining the Scott Brown grifters' circuit, under his rebranding from the NCFIC to Church and Family Life. In the linked video, Scott tells us that heʻs wanted to change the name for over 10 years. 

Interesting.  I checked out the Board, and one of the board members went to Univ of Texas @ Austin, Texas Tech law school and is an elder at North Gabriel Christian Assembly, which led me to believe he's local to me and sure enough, the church meets in Cedar Park, a suburb of the sprawl that is now the Austin greater metropolitan area.  "A significant part of Don’s practice involves fighting to defend Christian, homeschooling families against usurpatious government interference."

Don Hart's actual name is Bobby Don Hart, Jr., which is SO Texas. His Heritage Defense "law office" is a PO Box in Liberty Hill, which is up the road a little bit from Austin.  His bio lists "rancher" so I suspect it's a home office in the countryside. 

He's a speaker for hire, of course, and created this: Balancing the Sword: A Comprehensive Study Guide to Life's Manual.  I had to edit the title, and they should too.  The 1990's called and want their web site back; it's a mess! 

Anyway, some gems that alert you that this guy is way into defending child abuse in the name of God:

Quote

Defending Your Heritage: A Biblical Perspective on the Dangers Threatening Your Family
Tribulations are promised. The biblical family is under attack, and we must respond properly. Christian zeal is chilled whenever a family is persecuted or intimidated for honoring God. Labeling biblical obedience as "criminal" slanders the Gospel.

@Howl's best narrator voice: Prosecution for child abuse is NOT an attack on "The Biblical family." 

Moving right along: 

Quote

Biblical Discipline in the Home
Don Hart examines the biblical command to lovingly discipline our children and surveys the status of corporal punishment laws throughout the United States, with specific emphasis on the host state.

If you invite Dan to speak at your conference or order his CD, he can answer So. Many. Questions: 

• How can churches be ready and prepare their flocks for persecutions from lawsuits and criminal prosecutions?
• Can churches help members conscientiously object to
  • forced vaccinations! 
  • mandatory health insurance!
  • women in the military!
  • other offensive government edicts! 

To his credit, he's been a Board member and general counsel to...wait for it...Vision Forum Ministries! 

My absolute favorite part is the disclaimer at the bottom, because, well, lawyer:

Quote

Disclaimer:  Balancing the Sword makes no claims about the speakers' faith, ability, materials, etc.  This speaker profile information is being provided free of charge.  Please click the links and do your own research before issuing an invitation to your conference.  Postings are subject to change.

I'm not sure why, but if I dug deep enough, I'm a gonna bet these people have a dog-breeding business. 

Summary: Church and Family Life is the same patriarchal, complementarian, no-birth-control bull shit, SAHD, SAHM brutally oppressive wing-nut brand it's always been. 

Edited April 20, 2021 by Howl

[hoipolloi]

5 hours ago, Howl said:

Summary: Church and Family Life is the same patriarchal, complementarian, no-birth-control bull shit, SAHD, SAHM brutally oppressive wing-nut brand it's always been. 

Yep.

Thanks for the deeper dive in Bobby Don Hart who, BTW, was a board member of Vision Forum at one time, along with Scott & Jim Zes...

Would love to know what's been more lucrative for Scott Brown and family these past 8-10 years: the grift ministry of NCFIC/Church & family or Scotty's real estate business in Wake Forest, NC?

[Howl]

2 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Scotty's real estate business in Wake Forest, NC?

I'd guess Scotty makes pretty good bank on real estate in Wake Forest. They also have some cottage industries going at their farm, like goat's milk yogurt or some such.  Can't really remember -- it was something that came up when Kelly's marriage to Bradrick! fell apart and she moved back home. 

I'd guess the ministry makes no money, or operates at a loss. 

Edited April 20, 2021 by Howl

[Bluebirdbluebell]

Was Geoff Botkin on the boards of Vision Forum as well?

[Columbia]

1 minute ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

Was Geoff Botkin on the boards of Vision Forum as well?

No, he was just Doug’s “manly friend.”

[Bluebirdbluebell]

3 minutes ago, Columbia said:

No, he was just Doug’s “manly friend.”

Thank You. Still Geoff has found old friends.

Edited April 20, 2021 by Bluebirdbluebell

[Howl]

Quote

Can churches help members conscientiously object to...women in the military!

I wanted to note that Bobby Don covers this topic, but it would be a pretty damn hard pull these days because there are a LOT of women at all ranks in all branches of the armed forces. I'd guess his recommendation these days: don't enlist. 

38 minutes ago, Columbia said:

No, he [Geoff B.] was just Doug’s “manly friend.”

Kinda makes you wonder how long their handshakes lasted. 

Edited April 20, 2021 by Howl

[Petronella]

On 4/19/2021 at 10:02 PM, JemimaPuddle-Duck said:

Keep dreaming

https://www.instagram.com/p/CN2i0ZcBAXV/?igshid=refkkfebkfjc

 

Could someone quote or screenshot this? For me it just leads to an Instagram login page...