Botkin 2: Geoff Tried to Advise Trump

[AnnaSofia]

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So please help me with all the Botkins and their spouses. Of course I know Ben and Audri. And the 2 unmarried sisters. But I get the other boys mixed up in age and who they are married to. 

 

The Botkin sons are, in order: Isaac, David, Ben, Lucas, and Noah.

Isaac is married to Heidi (née Roach)

David is married to Nadia (née Noor)

Ben is married to Audri (née Vernier)

Lucas is married to Kara (née Dabbs)

Noah is still single.

IIRC, the older boys married in backwards birth order, Ben first, then David, then Isaac. Lucas and Noah are both quite a bit younger.

Edited November 3, 2021 by AnnaSofia

[Columbia]

On 11/1/2021 at 11:13 AM, Howl said:

I don't see Geoff ever setting the chickens free, a la Maxhell.  He seems to be getting more entrenched in the Christofascist crazy. 

I don’t know. I think he’s tolerating a lot of stuff from Lucas that he wouldn’t have 5 years ago. I’m not sure why, but I get the impression that AS & E stying at home is more important to their extended church community than to Geoff himself. Geoff seems to go where the money goes, and now that’s less religion and more crazy political videos on YouTube. Also, if word got out that he didn’t let them leave if they wanted to, that would add to the increasing bad press that TRex Arms seems to be getting. 

[hoipolloi]

32 minutes ago, Columbia said:

I think he’s tolerating a lot of stuff from Lucas that he wouldn’t have 5 years ago.

Lucas is supporting the family. Geoff may be crazy but he's not stupid enough to jeopardize his meal ticket.

What bad press is TRex Arms getting? That sounds interesting!

[Columbia]

1 hour ago, hoipolloi said:

What bad press is TRex Arms getting? That sounds interesting!

It seems like the holsters themselves may be average to okay, but the Botkin reputation precedes itself. 
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?45695-T-Rex-Arms-Holsters-Love-Hate/page3

ETA: 

 

Edited November 5, 2021 by Columbia
ETA

[Howl]

ModLite: "Manufacturer of American-made mission specific lighting systems for Law Enforcement and Military applications."

I just re-read the ModLite statement.  They *may* be saying they won't do business with wing nuts who believe insane shit and post it on their social media. 

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"...we believe in honesty, integrity and transparency. We believe that those with a public platform, including ourselves, have an obligation of standards for information that is presented...In light of continuous ongoing behaviors and failure to rectify them, ModLite Systems has made the very difficult decision to cease business in its entirety with T Rex Arms. 

I don't follow Lucas on Instagram, but a few years ago he posted homophobic comments on his account and was called out for it by some of followers. 

Just checked a few current Insta posts.  He's a 2nd Amendment fanatic and does a LOT of product reviews. He has 364K followers on Instagram.  He also agreed with a follower's post that clearly shows he despises Biden and the current administration. 

My feeling is that ModLite may be taking a big risk here.

T Rex Arms has 70 employees. They are not a small company. 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

On 11/2/2021 at 8:43 PM, AnnaSofia said:

 

The Botkin sons are, in order: Isaac, David, Ben, Lucas, and Noah.

Isaac is married to Heidi (née Roach)

David is married to Nadia (née Noor)

Ben is married to Audri (née Vernier)

Lucas is married to & Kara Dabbs (engaged)

Noah is still single.

IIRC, the older boys married in backwards birth order, Ben first, then David, then Isaac. Lucas and Noah are both quite a bit younger.

Lucas and Kara are engaged. Their wedding is a few weeks away.  According to registry finder, they're getting married November 21, 2021.  Here is the link.   Probably a few wedding photos will surface on social media. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

10 minutes ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

Lucas and Kara are engaged. Their wedding is a few weeks away.  According to registry finder, they're getting married November 21, 2021.  Here is the link.   Probably a few wedding photos will surface on social media. 

They got married early. 

[hoipolloi]

26 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

They got married early. 

They did. She announced it on IG last month.

[Bluebirdbluebell]

My apologies to @AnnaSofia. I was wrong, because the registry is still up and showing the wrong date, I thought they weren't married yet. 

[starfish]

On 11/6/2021 at 4:02 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

They got married early. 

They were terrified MamaJuneBug would show up and report back to us heathen at FJ. 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

Getting married early doesn't seem like a fundie thing to do.

[CyborgKin]

I found Geoff! He's here to tell us that police are good and we mustn't surrender our values to Critical Race Theory

And that all you need to give your children a phenomenal education is the ability to communicate with your child  

 

And he says he and his wife were victims of the public school system.  And he thinks it's a big accomplishment that he taught his children "the hardest language in the world, English" so obviously he and anyone can teach their children anything effectively. And he claims to have effectively taught his kids to effectively fix the things in the world that are broken and they are doing that.

 

After that he's asked about minutemen and goes on for a while about how all men should obtain and train with military weapons to be ready (and that there shouldn't be a standing army)

 

Later he gets onto the ATF, OSHA and IRS being unconstitutional blah blah blah unscrupulous government controlling people blah blah businesses that follow the rules that 'arbitrarily' apply at over 100 employees are cowardly etc

 

Edited November 22, 2021 by CyborgKin

[danvillebelle]

His photo needs to be in the dictionary next to the entry for "bloviate."  He is the absolute undisputed champ.

[Columbia]

48 minutes ago, CyborgKin said:

And he says he and his wife were victims of the public school system.

In her curriculum CDs, Victoria is always talking about how she didn’t learn anything at all in public school and is so ignorant and had to learn right alongside her children. Maybe she didn’t have good teachers, or maybe she didn’t like classes, or maybe she was just lazy, but whatever it was she seems almost proud of how ignorant she is. 

[hoipolloi]

5 hours ago, Columbia said:

Maybe she didn’t have good teachers, or maybe she didn’t like classes, or maybe she was just lazy, but whatever it was she seems almost proud of how ignorant she is. 

Geoff and Victoria met at the University of Oklahoma at Norman in the 1970s. According to Cindy Kunsman's research, that's where they and Geoff's brother, Greg (father of Katie, IIRC), and his wife became enmeshed in the Great Commission Cult Church. Geoff, and probably Victoria, left college apparently without completing their degrees. So, whatever Victoria did or didn't learn while in school is on her and maybe her insane husband.

Geoff also tells anyone who will listen to (or video) him that he was raised as a Marxist before converting to Christianity. This is a fucking lie as his parents were conservative and devout Christians all their lives and raised their four children, including Geoff, in their faith. 

Oh, and that asshat video? Geoff is accusing Nelson Mandela of being a communist and pushing critical race theory in South Africa in the 1980s. 

 

[zee_four]

8 hours ago, Columbia said:

In her curriculum CDs, Victoria is always talking about how she didn’t learn anything at all in public school and is so ignorant and had to learn right alongside her children. Maybe she didn’t have good teachers, or maybe she didn’t like classes, or maybe she was just lazy, but whatever it was she seems almost proud of how ignorant she is. 

G&V would have been in public school in the 50s and 60s right? Wouldn't that make their teachers have been the Greatest Generation that they feitishize? Who had real Christian values and where the men were real men and the women were ladies? 

How can that be the case if those heroes were no different than what they consider to be "socialist CRT woke brainwashers?"

Just another example of fundies changing the narrative to suit whatever point they're sensationalizing.

 

[Howl]

4 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

and Geoff's brother, Greg (father of Katie, IIRC), and his wife became enmeshed in the Great Commission Cult Church.

I'd be interested in Katie Botkin's story of how she left the reservation and if any (or all) of her family are "still in."  My impression is that her family moved to Moscow, ID at some point.   She was a strong Doug Wilson critic, speaking out against both Wilson and the CREC on her blog.  

She has a new baby this year and tweets very occasionally. 

ETA: Well, my goodness.  Less than a minute after I posted the above, I opened twitter and this was the FIRST TWEET in my feed! 

Katie than says,  "Does this dance piece contain religious imagery? Obviously."

Edited November 22, 2021 by Howl

[MamaJunebug]

Gregory Botkin MD practices in Bonners Ferry, Idaho, 160 miles from Moscow, Idaho. 
 

He earned his degree from the U. of Oklahoma, but I don’t judge.   #AnybodyButTheSooners - that’s how Big Daddy JB raised us!  

Edited November 22, 2021 by MamaJunebug

[hoipolloi]

6 hours ago, Howl said:

My impression is that her family moved to Moscow, ID at some point. 

Yes, they've been there a long time. There have also occasionally been visits between Geoff's & Greg's families. 

More on Geoff Botkin's "marxist" upbringing, from the ineffable Katie Botkin:

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As far as the wishes of my Grandfather [Geoff's father] were concerned, the four children were trained to be conservative, God-fearing Christians, although they were apparently not forced to go to church every Sunday. I suppose my uncle might believe that the fact that he learned math from teachers whose salaries were paid by taxes means that he was implicitly inculcated with the idea that taxes should pay for education — while perhaps concurrently assuming that taxation (or public school) is more or less Marxism.

 

[JermajestyDuggar]

Victoria is obviously an idiot. 
 

You never stop learning! Does she not realize this? I learn something new every damn day. No matter how much you learn in public school or private school, you will keep learning if you put some effort in. When I help my son with his math homework, I learn new ways to come up with an answer. That doesn’t mean my school didn’t teach me math. They did. But there are multiple ways to get an answer. And there’s nothing wrong with that. If she thought she should have graduated high school knowing everything, then she need a swift kick in the backside. 

[MamaJunebug]

3 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Victoria is obviously an idiot. 

I tried to listen to her child-raising CDs, and couldn’t.  However, I heard enough to come  away with a definite opinion of her as mean and sniping. 

[Columbia]

1 hour ago, MamaJunebug said:

I tried to listen to her child-raising CDs, and couldn’t.  However, I heard enough to come  away with a definite opinion of her as mean and sniping. 

I think I’ve said this before, but in her “She Shall Be Called Woman” CDs she answers a question from a woman who said that she thought she was being submissive to her husband, but her husband said she wasn’t. Victoria gave her two options: 

1. You aren’t really submitting and need to repent and actually do it. 
 

2. You are submitting now, but you weren’t previously and your husband doesn’t trust you and you need to repent to him. 
 

There was no option for a woman who is submitting but it’s just not enough for the husband. She never mentioned it or or suggested it. Whatever it is, you just need to submit harder and apologize. I’ve thought about that a lot in relation to Audri and Ben, especially Audri. What awful things might she have been told by her mother-in-law while she and Ben were in the throes of spiritual abuse and trying to get out of their church?

[Columbia]

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2022/02/02/hillsdale-college-tennessee-charter-schools-partnership-gov-bill-lee/9303810002/
 

What do you want to bet that Geoff is involved with this? He’s lectured and written for Hillsdale before, and a few of his sons have been associated with the school. This would explain part of where Geoff gets his money (certainly not from Western Conservatory) and why he hasn’t put out any more silly videos for the past month, and maybe even his new ASSCult (Atlantic Society for the Study of Culture.)

[Howl]

55 minutes ago, Columbia said:

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2022/02/02/hillsdale-college-tennessee-charter-schools-partnership-gov-bill-lee/9303810002/

Pardon my French, but this is so f**ked up.  It's the camel's nose under the tent, as they say, to get private religious schools masquerading as public education paid for by tax payers. 

[Katzchen24]

If anyone is interested, Jen from the Fundie Fridays YouTube channel has just put up a very interesting summary of the Botkins. It also touches on VF, the Tool, Bradrick! and Voddie Baucham as well. I feel so much sadder for the girls in these cults, and so much angrier about Geoff and his ilk.