Bro Gary Hawkins 16: In BetWeen

[thoughtful]

Wednesday morning's second video starts with good music, and this time the shouting and screaming is less than usual, so we get to hear some of it. There are some nicely-played instrumental breaks in this special, and the screaming is usually in response to something in the lyrics.

But the second number, a gentle ballad, is drowned out by the bizarrely loud shrieking and howling. The musicians stop, the pastor shouts at everyone, and they all bellow, scream and roar animal noises back at him for a while, then the same song continues.

The pastor, sounding fake-choked-up, talks about how being saved changed one of the men - before that, he had long hair and liked rock and roll.

He asks the missionaries to stand up. He gets all faux-weepy again as he talks about how they need money. Well, one of them also needs help, and another needs a wife.

He insists that "you can do more than you can do" to help.

The next preacher, whose name is McFadden, starts with a verse Gary loves, but goes on:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jude+1%3A22-25&version=KJV

He tells two stories about kids he grew up with (being sure to make reference to the one-room schoolhouse) who didn't get saved until they were middle-aged.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+9%3A1-2&version=KJV

If God could save Saul/Paul, He can save anyone.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+27%3A39-44&version=KJV

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=luke+23%3A37-43&version=KJV

Like Gary, he comments as he goes along. Unlike Gary, he reads pretty well. However, he pronounces malefactor as "male factor," as if it meant testosterone, not bad guy.

He tells them about Jacob DeShazer and the conversion of Mitsuo Fuchida, and the story of his family getting saved.

Pretty calm, by their standards.

 

 

 

[Alisamer]

15 hours ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

Actually the divisions among themselves may save America from Christian theocracy. 

I live in hope.

[Four is Enough]

You know, pretty much since this pandemic began, there have been online and televised church services available to whoever wants to watch.

This is not new. I remember in the 50s, watching the "Mass for Shut-Ins" on television when the snow was so bad my mother didn't want to walk to church with an 8 and 5 year old, pushing a 2 year old in a stroller..

 

My grandmother, of a different sect, sang over the radio for her church's show . She was one of a revolving set of singers/groups who sang for them.. 

So really, Gary, why so exercised that people aren't coming to church NOW? If weather prohibited, or health prohibited, and they listened or watched THEN, why is it not ok to do the same NOW?

[Xan]

1 hour ago, Four is Enough said:

So really, Gary, why so exercised that people aren't coming to church NOW? If weather prohibited, or health prohibited, and they listened or watched THEN, why is it not ok to do the same NOW?

$$$$$$

If they're listening from home, there's no one to throw money into the collection plate.  And if the churches aren't getting enough money, they're not about to bring in visiting preachers to ask for more.  Gary doesn't get paid if the people stay home and he's aware that, if people can listen to their pastor from the comfort of their own homes, they might never come back on a regular basis.  

I think he also believes that he's more powerful and persuasive if you listen to him in person.  That way you can respond "Amen" to him and assure your place in his Heaven.  He needs that feedback.  Let's me honest here.  Gary wouldn't care if the Black Death was running rampant through the USA.  He'd still tell people to be in church.  For him, that's easier than actually having to find a real job.

[Black Aliss]

On 1/28/2021 at 9:41 AM, thoughtful said:

Gary (with, I assume, Becky's help, since, other than random capitalization, this is mostly correct) posts, and the commenters chime in with "not us!" and "they'll be sorry when they burn in Hell" answers.

  Hide contents

 

 

I hadn't realized Biden was going to start closing all the churches so quickly! I guess just the KJB bible believing churches.

[thoughtful]

18 minutes ago, Xan said:

$$$$$$

If they're listening from home, there's no one to throw money into the collection plate.  And if the churches aren't getting enough money, they're not about to bring in visiting preachers to ask for more.  Gary doesn't get paid if the people stay home and he's aware that, if people can listen to their pastor from the comfort of their own homes, they might never come back on a regular basis.  

I think he also believes that he's more powerful and persuasive if you listen to him in person.  That way you can respond "Amen" to him and assure your place in his Heaven.  He needs that feedback.  Let's me honest here.  Gary wouldn't care if the Black Death was running rampant through the USA.  He'd still tell people to be in church.  For him, that's easier than actually having to find a real job.

I agree, and would add one thing. Any action (or inaction) that is the opposite of what any Democrat wants is important to do, and make sure everyone knows you are doing it.

If a Democratic politician came out in favor of not plucking out your own pubic hairs one by one, these shitheads would be running to the stalls of the mens' room to start plucking, and screaming "thank you Jesus!" for every hair.

[Ozlsn]

4 hours ago, Four is Enough said:

You know, pretty much since this pandemic began, there have been online and televised church services available to whoever wants to watch.

This is not new. I remember in the 50s, watching the "Mass for Shut-Ins" on television when the snow was so bad my mother didn't want to walk to church with an 8 and 5 year old, pushing a 2 year old in a stroller..

My grandmother, of a different sect, sang over the radio for her church's show . She was one of a revolving set of singers/groups who sang for them.. 

So really, Gary, why so exercised that people aren't coming to church NOW? If weather prohibited, or health prohibited, and they listened or watched THEN, why is it not ok to do the same NOW?

Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Sunday mornings we still have televised church services for those who want them - which was often the elderly, unwell or remote who couldn't get to church easily.

 

2 hours ago, thoughtful said:

I agree, and would add one thing. Any action (or inaction) that is the opposite of what any Democrat wants is important to do, and make sure everyone knows you are doing it.

If a Democratic politician came out in favor of not plucking out your own pubic hairs one by one, these shitheads would be running to the stalls of the mens' room to start plucking, and screaming "thank you Jesus!" for every hair.

Tempting, tempting...

[Ozlsn]

On 1/22/2021 at 10:32 AM, thoughtful said:

Hey, Gary doesn't pick on you for not pooping on the sidewalk or being careful not to run people over with your car, so be nice to him when he does it, OK? Because, as we all know, not hurting Gary's feelings is much more important than keeping people healthy. Amirite?
 

I suspect Gary's feelings are more mixed after no preaching, more kitchenwork. Then again, I think they were based entirely on Trump signs to begin with, so..

On 1/25/2021 at 4:40 PM, thoughtful said:

This guy is a dancer, stamper, pounder and squatter. He also does the Pope dope line.
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

  

 

 

He is also the spitting image of a bandmaster on the other side of the planet, which made me do a double take and burst out laughing.

On 1/26/2021 at 11:23 AM, thoughtful said:

 The host preacher (I think) blah-blah-blahs (with a few sudden screams) to the end. I zoned out a bit, but did catch his mention of a Brother Bill who "bombed the Vatican with 80,000 Chick tracts.

You would think this would make the news, seriously. Granted I'm imagining it as a "Dambusters" type affair, rather than the littering it more likely was.

 

[thoughtful]

I will get to more of the camp meeting videos tomorrow. Gary says GOD was there last night, and I can't wait to hear that!

Also, poor Jacob.

Edited January 30, 2021 by thoughtful
riffle

[Four is Enough]

So God came himself to lure Gary's youngest into serving him.. uh-huh.

[thoughtful]

Gary's announcement about Jacob got some comments, and they only make me sadder about the prospect of yet another kid growing up to this life of grifting and sore throats from screaming (aka being a preacher like his father and grandfather), or grifting and godbothering people (aka being a missionary):

Spoiler

Hey, Jacob, you could still believe in God, go to trade school or college, and do work that actually helps people here on Earth before shuffling off this mortal coil. Just a thought.

Wednesday evening at the camp meeting starts with coronavirus-passing prayers - mostly quiet, with one wailer.

Host pastor Lindsey holds up a necklace and says "Somebody found - ah'm gonna call this a lady's necklace, just to be safe." A man in the group calls out "Uh-oh!" and another man yells "It's mahn, brother!" There was also a knife found "One you boys - don't forget this knife."

Yes, even lost-and-found announcements and the jokes that follow them need to drive home their idiotic gender role shit.

They sing Glory to His Name, Glad Reunion Day, and a fast and jolly rendition of Take My Hand Precious Lord,  then another prayer. There is a mostly-drowned-out special of God's Amazing Grace Still Amazes Me. I'm pretty sure that the Lindseys, the people in the linked recording, are the people singing at the camp meeting. I don't know if they are related to the host pastor, but they do get to do a lot of numbers, so I've go my suspicions.

They are occasionally drowned out while singing He'll Do It Again, Bring It All to Him, and It Matters to the Master. Their last number I couldn't find anywhere, but the refrain ends with "on the far side, we'll be home."

I know they mean the far side of the Jordan metaphorically, and in Heaven literally, but, of course, my brain went here:

Spoiler

Hey, I kept with the theme, at least!

Pastor and the congregation exchange some yells, and the next preacher comes up. He starts with sadness and gets that choked up voice pretty quickly.

He tells them that, when they get saved, their hands, feet, stomach, pancreas and brain are not saved.  Yes, he specifies the pancreas.

He warns them to take depression seriously, and not dismiss people who suffer from it - that's downright progressive, for one of these guys.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm+77%3A1-9&version=KJV

After verse 2, he says the word "sore" does not have the usual meaning - it means a hand that is reaching out. He doesn't make it clear how he makes that rather bizarre leap. I looked up the original Hebrew, and he's right - it's "my hand," not "my sore." It's implied that what's streaming all night is the psalmist's eyes, but it seems a word is missing.

https://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt2677.htm

Quote

The text however is doubtful. The verb which means literally ‘was poured out,’ is not a natural one to apply to the hand; and the use of the same verb, and substantives derived from the root of the verb rendered ‘slacked,’ in Lamentations 2:18-19; Lamentations 3:49, with reference to tears, suggests that the original reading may have been, ‘Mine eye poured down in the night, and slacked not.’

https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/77-3.htm

But I thought God re-wrote all of that old Hebrew and Greek stuff in 1611. So, if it says "sore" in the KJV, isn't that what God wrote?

Some of his other points:

Doubt comes from the devil.

Our God is a God of suffering.

But things cheer up (well, sort of - he's still pretty glum, when he's not shouting) - verses 10 on say what you must do:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm+77%3A10-20&version=KJV

I recommend a good therapist, myself.

He tells a long story about his bus and how God showed him that he had to live with it and keep dealing with its repairs, rather than selling it, because He gave it to him. Then God miraculously sent him to a man who repairs the kind of bus he has, and even sent a man to this camp meeting who knew why it was making a noise.

He screams "GOD, takin' keer of His bus!" several times.

Oh, and he rattles off the date, time and location of when he was saved at age 14, and what kind of car his parents drove him home in.

He says he could stand there for hours and tell of the thousands of dollars God has sent his way, and he knows they could do the same.

He says we are "predestinated" to be conformed to the image of Jesus.

He finishes by saying that God wants us to call out to Him: "Abba." He pronounces it like the rock group, not the Hebrew word, so I expect him to break into Dancing Queen, or possibly:

Spoiler

 

But he just walks away.

Pastor Lindsey follows up. He always caps off every message with his own thoughts - he seems incapable of simply thanking the previous preacher without intoning about what they really meant or how it relates to him, in his beautiful, deep speaking voice.

I get some satisfaction when the video cuts him off in mid-sentence.

Edited January 31, 2021 by thoughtful
clarity

[clese]

GodI  miss Gary's facebook! I snort and chortle and sometime cry through these reviews. I need to.set up a fake account somehow??

[thoughtful]

Wednesday evening continued. Pastor is still pontificating as the second video starts, intoning "somebody close to you will have to crucifah you."

He can't wait to get to Heaven and talk to Peter. in the meantime, he and his wife sing while offering is given. This time, the bins are placed on the dais, and people have to come up to drop money in.

All sing At the Cross, then pray. Pastor asks if anyone knows who Darlene Rose is, and tells them they have to hear or read her testimony. I think he's on a Japanese prison camp missionary kick these days.

He introduces the next preacher (well, that's new - usually they just come up), Robert Hale, who is a missionary to the jails in Virginia "they got an idiot that runs Virginia" (lots of shouts of agreement), "and so he cain't git in jail. He's just before breakin' the law so they'll incarcerate him."

Hale comes up, and tells them he just found out they won't let him back in the prisons, probably for the rest of the year, and that makes him mad. He says that different from angry - "mad's when ya wanna explode, angry's when ya wanna smack somebody."

But all is well - they want to use Google Meet, and do it twice a week rather than only once, so he is OK with that.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=genesis+1%3A1-5&version=KJV

He'd read a quote from Tennyson: "the clock beats out the little lives of men."  His subject today is time. He goes off on a tear about animals living according to God's law, not caring about the time of day, like humans. His examples are that he's seen deer and rabbits, in his night-vision cameras, frolicking and eating in his yard.

That doesn't mean they don't care about time, doofus, it means they are nocturnal or crepuscular animals.

He goes through all kinds of ways of measuring time. A measure of time is what you see on a headstone - a date, then a dash, then another date - a man's life. A moment of time is the present. The mention of time is the future.

I think you're making shit up, Hale - most of us talk about seconds, minutes, days, etc.

Anyway, they believe in scripture, but some people believe in millions and billions of years - there is some mocking laughter at this, and I think I hear someone say "stupid." Hale goes on "they still believin' - they just believe in the wrong thing."

He goes on to say that we've had two hundred years of believing what one man had to say. Yes, it's all Darwin's fault. I guess there's been no scientific research since then. A few of them yell like a lynch mob that wants to go string Darwin up right now.

Hale claims that his dad, at 11 years old, was at the Scopes "monkey trial." He makes it clear that evolution is "a lahhhh straight outta hell," a theory is just a guess, he doesn't know how they can look at a rock and just know it's two billion years old - you know the drill. Not very original, Hale.

OK, back to time. They (who? he doesn't say) used water tables, hourglasses, batteries, solar clocks, to measure time. None of them are perfect. That's why we have leap year. "Every year, we lose 25% of our time - er, y'know - 15 minutes - or, quarter of a day."

Whew - he finally got there.

"They're trying to change tahhhm as we know it." Again, who is "they," and wtf are you talking about?

"It's always been, as long as ah kin remember, that was 300 years B.C. - before Christ." He cracks the "after death" joke about A.D., then explains that it's actually "year of our Lord, Anna DoMINah."

I have no idea if he actually knows how to pronounce it or not, but I think pronouncing anything from Latin correctly is forbidden to these guys, for fear someone will think they are a secret papist.

He says that now some literature says B.C.E., which he claims stands for "before the current era." No, it stands for "before the common era," I've been using it for decades, and am glad to see anything in the culture that we are all supposed to share that doesn't make people include Jesus or any other religious reference.

He lets us know when he got saved, September 8, 1984, and somewhere, he has a newspaper clipping from shortly after that, with a quote from Ted Turner, talking about trying to achieve world peace, in which Turner said something about hoping people in the future will think of time as BP - before peace - and AP - after peace.

Hale makes no point. I guess it's supposed to stand on its own as a horrible attack on Christianity.

Clocks are man-made, need adjusting, and are loud and aggressive.

He mocks his doctor, who wants to test him for sleep apnea, and claims the doctor told him to take the clock out of his bedroom, keep the room completely dark, and keep a record of any time he wakes up during the night. So he's pissed about the fact that he has to get up, go to the room with the clock, and record what time he woke up.

Sundials are man-made, but God-powered, fixed in direct sunlight, never need adjusting, and are silent, calm, and will always be there to guide you (of course, then he points out that they are useless at night and when it's cloudy, and somehow connects that to Satan ).

The clock watches, the sundial witnesses, the sun is of God and is trying to find you. The sun stood still for Joshua - he says we know now that "it was the earth stopped." Wait, now science and fact are OK? The KJV bible says God stopped the sun, not the earth.

I was already thinking of Inherit the Wind when he got into evolution, now that he's mentioned Joshua and the sun standing still, I had to go watch this scene:

https://www.americanrhetoric.com/MovieSpeeches/moviespeechinheritthewind.html

Hale has an explanation for why everyone didn't slide off of the earth - God did it.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+corinthians+4%3A17&version=KJV

Someone in his home church died of Covid this morning (he makes sure to say "and he did have it"). Before he died, he tells us, the man said "ah don't want to be put on no recitation - resus - resuscitate me." It seems this poor man was afraid his Medicare wouldn't pay for everything if it took a long time to get him well, and his wife would lose the house. He was insisting on no ventilator or resuscitation because he wanted to move on, and let her have his life insurance.

Hale admires that. He thinks we should all get our eyes off of ourselves and think about others, like this man did.

Call me crazy, but I would have preferred that he'd had universal health care. Going by what I've seen, he probably also had a pastor who insisted that everyone keep coming to church, maskless. Maybe he could have lived longer with some precautions and that "socialism" they're all so afraid of.

Hale quotes Revelation  - there will come "a tahm when tahm will be no more." If you're not saved, you'll burn in hell, in darkness for all time.

He sings a few lines from from various hymns, then asks someone to pray.

This whole sermon made me feel like I was reading a post from Taryn.

I think, instead of this long harangue, this would have been a better message:

Spoiler

 

 

Edited January 31, 2021 by thoughtful
riffles

[forgetmenow]

16 hours ago, thoughtful said:

Someone in his home church died of Covid this morning (he makes sure to say "and he did have it"). Before he died, he tells us, the man said "ah don't want to be put on no recitation - resus - resuscitate me." It seems this poor man was afraid his Medicare wouldn't pay for everything if it took a long time to get him well, and his wife would lose the house. He was insisting on no ventilator or resuscitation because he wanted to move on, and let her have his life insurance.

Hale admires that. He thinks we should all get our eyes off of ourselves and think about others, like this man did.

Call me crazy, but I would have preferred that he'd had universal health care. Going by what I've seen, he probably also had a pastor who insisted that everyone keep coming to church, maskless. Maybe he could have lived longer with some precautions and that "socialism" they're all so afraid of.

Ugh, and these are the people who get so worked up about the apocryphal "death panels."  It's particularly upsetting to me that it all comes down to money for for him and that he's encouraging people to think this way.  Damn, these guys are a special kind of greedy and stupid.

[Don'tlikekoolaid]

Another School failure.  Poor Caleb, these kids don’t have much of a chance.

Spoiler

 

[thoughtful]

1 hour ago, Don'tlikekoolaid said:

Another School failure.  Poor Caleb, these kids don’t have much of a chance.

I agree. It's such a horrible thing to do to kids.

Gary posted - he got to Met the Pastor and Family, and, I assume, went to church in the mission Trailer. Oh, boy!

Back to the camp meeting - Thursday morning, first video.

It starts with the coronavirus-passing - er, that is, prayer ritual:

Spoiler

Pastor Lindsey say that, when they get to Heaven, they will listen to Jesus preach. Then they all bellow When the Roll is Called Up Yonder, Haven of Rest, with lots of shouting. Someone prays, with more shouting. The first special is Some Day, which this group sings a cappella, so the shouting and screaming annoys me even more than usual. Then I'm Amazed, and another gentle song I couldn't find anywhere.

Pastor gets up again, and says he hates to put time limits on anyone, but they need to be sensitive to the Lord, then introduces Michael Smith. I don't know if Smith has a reputation for long messages and that was a warning, or what.

Michael says he's least among them and doesn't deserve to be there. Of course.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=joshua+7%3A1-12&version=KJV

Michael emotionally prays about how perfect the KJV is, and weepingly reiterates that he is the least among them, and needs the anointing power, etc. for way too long.

He screams, and they scream back, about the fact that the chapter starts with "but." The Lord may give you victories, but you still have responsibility to obey. Long rant about the devil putting things like entertainment and light shows in church in the path of young people.

This guy has the moves down:

Spoiler

 

He does a long screaming rant about how, if shouting makes you uncomfortable down here, you'll be even more uncomfortable in Heaven, and he and the men scream and bellow back and forth for a long time about all the reasons people will be shouting in the afterlife.

But, in Joshua, their shouts turned into pouts, and that was their problem. He says it's OK to complain to the Lord, as long as you know you're always wrong and He's always right. He noodles around with some numerology about the number 36, then does another long screaming rant begging for God's help, as the men scream back at him.

He asks if they have any grudge or bitterness toward anyone there, and warns them that God won't be on their side if they do, and revs up to another screamfest before he ends with another long prayer.

Well, it was loud, but it was short.

[thoughtful]

Thursday morning, second video - it starts with five minutes of quiet piano music. For most of that time, some very small children are standing there, lined up.

The collection bins are at the front of the dais again, but nobody comes up to them. Pastor Lindsey finally speaks, but I can't catch what he is saying - something about the fact that there's no rush to get to the next preacher, the Lord's up here doin' business, the Big Preacher's there.

He says his daughter is playing the piano, and that the kids are four of his 19 grandchildren. They sing Bless the Lord, drowned out on the chorus by shouting men. For All He's Done starts with a solo by the tiniest child, a girl. Before she finishes the first line, a man roars out "Sing it, baby!" and another "Oh, yeah, sing it!" More whooping and hollering follows, and I swear they sound like men yelling "take it off!" at a stripper. I half expect to hear Rosalind Russell yell "Dip!" or "Give 'em a glove!" from offstage.

BTW, this song contains the line "Even though I don't deserve to live" - a lovely thought to teach to children.

The video skips ahead - I don't know why. I Can Go In, with intermittent shouting drowning it out - older kid and an adult.

Next preacher - if Lindsey says his name, I miss it. He says he comes from a broken home, and describes himself as a "first generation Christian." He's going to try to obey the Lord, because his "picker is broken" - he needed God to pick his wife, and to pick what he will say.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+corinthians+2%3A1-5&version=KJV

He argues against an intellectual, factual, doctrine-arguing approach to Christianity - he's not worried about his outline, he wants to be in line - with God. He's better at sounding like he does genuinely respect learning and study than Gary ever is, but his point is that the spirit has to be there.

He says when Paul said "I determined," it means "I condemned." "That's what that word means - look it up." I did (not that I needed to, but I thought maybe there was an obscure archaic meaning) -  it doesn't.

He tells a story of an old Indian chief listening to a huffing and puffing white preacher, then judging the sermon: "Big thunder - no rain."

God is not an education, He is a revelation.

He tells a story about a preacher who was called up to preach (by Chuck Colson, of all people!) when he wasn't ready. He imitates the guy "fumbling around" and saying "I'm the least of all of us here" and "I'm just nobody - usually when you got everybody's gotta tell you that, it's not what they're thinkin' at all. I lost you on that, but it's the truth anyway."

Well, since just about all of these guys start their messages with that shit, including the guy who just spoke before him, I can see why he lost them.

The guy in the story "just took it into the tank - we've all done it" so he just decided to start reading his Bible. And God started dealing with him. During a break, he talked to someone who was fired up, upset about the guy who wasn't ready, and eager to preach. He got his chance, and never had to go past his reading - he had the power, and this preacher's problem was solved (he never says what it was) and lots of people got saved.

He tells a story of an uneducated preacher who got a message out of John 5, telling people their problem is that they thought they were "impo'tant," and, like the man in the story, they'd been lying for years and needed to tell the truth.

They howl at this as if it was the funniest and most original story ever. And, of course, three people got saved that day, and the whole front row was filled with doctors. I have no idea if he means medical doctors, other preachers with doctorates, or what, but it's clear that the point is that an uneducated man who misinterprets what he reads can be more powerful spiritually than the educated.

I guess there is hope for Gary  yet.

He also mocks people who just yell out how much they love the KJV when they feel like they are losing the crowd, or imitate other preachers.

So, let's see - preachers should be educated, and prepared to preach at any moment, but it all has to be Spirit-driven and sincere, and they should never fall back on the things all of the preachers say all of the time.

OK - I hope your preaching always lives up to those standards, fella.

[Dana723]

1 hour ago, thoughtful said:

"picker is broken"

Please tell me I'm not the only one who misread that and started laughing...

[Bluebirdbluebell]

10 hours ago, Don'tlikekoolaid said:

Another School failure.  Poor Caleb, these kids don’t have much of a chance.

  Hide contents

 

This is one of the worst spelling/grammar mistakes I've seen from a fundie kid. Most of the other mistakes are grammar and wrong word usages that are almost correct and could be the result of fast-typing, autocorrect, etc. That doesn't even look close.  I feel sorry he can't spell better. 

[Xan]

11 hours ago, thoughtful said:

They howl at this as if it was the funniest and most original story ever. And, of course, three people got saved that day, and the whole front row was filled with doctors. I have no idea if he means medical doctors, other preachers with doctorates, or what, but it's clear that the point is that an uneducated man who misinterprets what he reads can be more powerful spiritually than the educated.

Some of the fundies we follow push this idea.  They like to think that education isn't necessary and I think it's from deep-seated feelings of inferiority.  There's no good reason for this because extended education isn't a good fit for everybody and we all know some very smart people who didn't get degrees and some very stupid people with lots of letters after their names.  Education isn't an indicator of the value of a person.  

What the fundies could say is "I'm just as good as you" but what they end up saying is "I'm better than you".  This makes them no different from the "elite intellectuals" that they dismiss.  It's still snobbery.  And it isn't Christian at all.  

[sixcatatty]

On 1/30/2021 at 11:38 PM, thoughtful said:

Wednesday evening continued. Pastor is still pontificating as the second video starts, intoning "somebody close to you will have to crucifah you."

He can't wait to get to Heaven and talk to Peter. in the meantime, he and his wife sing while offering is given. This time, the bins are placed on the dais, and people have to come up to drop money in.

All sing At the Cross, then pray. Pastor asks if anyone knows who Darlene Rose is, and tells them they have to hear or read her testimony. I think he's on a Japanese prison camp missionary kick these days.

He introduces the next preacher (well, that's new - usually they just come up), Robert Hale, who is a missionary to the jails in Virginia "they got an idiot that runs Virginia" (lots of shouts of agreement), "and so he cain't git in jail. He's just before breakin' the law so they'll incarcerate him."

Hale comes up, and tells them he just found out they won't let him back in the prisons, probably for the rest of the year, and that makes him mad. He says that different from angry - "mad's when ya wanna explode, angry's when ya wanna smack somebody."

But all is well - they want to use Google Meet, and do it twice a week rather than only once, so he is OK with that.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=genesis+1%3A1-5&version=KJV

He'd read a quote from Tennyson: "the clock beats out the little lives of men."  His subject today is time. He goes off on a tear about animals living according to God's law, not caring about the time of day, like humans. His examples are that he's seen deer and rabbits, in his night-vision cameras, frolicking and eating in his yard.

That doesn't mean they don't care about time, doofus, it means they are nocturnal or crepuscular animals.

He goes through all kinds of ways of measuring time. A measure of time is what you see on a headstone - a date, then a dash, then another date - a man's life. A moment of time is the present. The mention of time is the future.

I think you're making shit up, Hale - most of us talk about seconds, minutes, days, etc.

Anyway, they believe in scripture, but some people believe in millions and billions of years - there is some mocking laughter at this, and I think I hear someone say "stupid." Hale goes on "they still believin' - they just believe in the wrong thing."

He goes on to say that we've had two hundred years of believing what one man had to say. Yes, it's all Darwin's fault. I guess there's been no scientific research since then. A few of them yell like a lynch mob that wants to go string Darwin up right now.

Hale claims that his dad, at 11 years old, was at the Scopes "monkey trial." He makes it clear that evolution is "a lahhhh straight outta hell," a theory is just a guess, he doesn't know how they can look at a rock and just know it's two billion years old - you know the drill. Not very original, Hale.

OK, back to time. They (who? he doesn't say) used water tables, hourglasses, batteries, solar clocks, to measure time. None of them are perfect. That's why we have leap year. "Every year, we lose 25% of our time - er, y'know - 15 minutes - or, quarter of a day."

Whew - he finally got there.

"They're trying to change tahhhm as we know it." Again, who is "they," and wtf are you talking about?

"It's always been, as long as ah kin remember, that was 300 years B.C. - before Christ." He cracks the "after death" joke about A.D., then explains that it's actually "year of our Lord, Anna DoMINah."

I have no idea if he actually knows how to pronounce it or not, but I think pronouncing anything from Latin correctly is forbidden to these guys, for fear someone will think they are a secret papist.

He says that now some literature says B.C.E., which he claims stands for "before the current era." No, it stands for "before the common era," I've been using it for decades, and am glad to see anything in the culture that we are all supposed to share that doesn't make people include Jesus or any other religious reference.

He lets us know when he got saved, September 8, 1984, and somewhere, he has a newspaper clipping from shortly after that, with a quote from Ted Turner, talking about trying to achieve world peace, in which Turner said something about hoping people in the future will think of time as BP - before peace - and AP - after peace.

Hale makes no point. I guess it's supposed to stand on its own as a horrible attack on Christianity.

Clocks are man-made, need adjusting, and are loud and aggressive.

He mocks his doctor, who wants to test him for sleep apnea, and claims the doctor told him to take the clock out of his bedroom, keep the room completely dark, and keep a record of any time he wakes up during the night. So he's pissed about the fact that he has to get up, go to the room with the clock, and record what time he woke up.

Sundials are man-made, but God-powered, fixed in direct sunlight, never need adjusting, and are silent, calm, and will always be there to guide you (of course, then he points out that they are useless at night and when it's cloudy, and somehow connects that to Satan ).

The clock watches, the sundial witnesses, the sun is of God and is trying to find you. The sun stood still for Joshua - he says we know now that "it was the earth stopped." Wait, now science and fact are OK? The KJV bible says God stopped the sun, not the earth.

I was already thinking of Inherit the Wind when he got into evolution, now that he's mentioned Joshua and the sun standing still, I had to go watch this scene:

https://www.americanrhetoric.com/MovieSpeeches/moviespeechinheritthewind.html

Hale has an explanation for why everyone didn't slide off of the earth - God did it.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+corinthians+4%3A17&version=KJV

Someone in his home church died of Covid this morning (he makes sure to say "and he did have it"). Before he died, he tells us, the man said "ah don't want to be put on no recitation - resus - resuscitate me." It seems this poor man was afraid his Medicare wouldn't pay for everything if it took a long time to get him well, and his wife would lose the house. He was insisting on no ventilator or resuscitation because he wanted to move on, and let her have his life insurance.

Hale admires that. He thinks we should all get our eyes off of ourselves and think about others, like this man did.

Call me crazy, but I would have preferred that he'd had universal health care. Going by what I've seen, he probably also had a pastor who insisted that everyone keep coming to church, maskless. Maybe he could have lived longer with some precautions and that "socialism" they're all so afraid of.

Hale quotes Revelation  - there will come "a tahm when tahm will be no more." If you're not saved, you'll burn in hell, in darkness for all time.

He sings a few lines from from various hymns, then asks someone to pray.

This whole sermon made me feel like I was reading a post from Taryn.

I think, instead of this long harangue, this would have been a better message:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

I haven't been in a Kentucky jail or prison since January last year--and don't expect to go into one until fall at the earliest. I actually have a reason: I represent some of them.

I'm not mad about it; I wouldn't be going anyway. We have too many COVID outbreaks in our penal institutions for this immune-suppressed asthmatic to be comfortable. We have Zoom, Teams, the phone and letters. I can deal and I don't even yell about it.

Edited February 1, 2021 by sixcatatty
fumble fingers

[Alisamer]

On 1/30/2021 at 11:38 PM, thoughtful said:

Call me crazy, but I would have preferred that he'd had universal health care. Going by what I've seen, he probably also had a pastor who insisted that everyone keep coming to church, maskless. Maybe he could have lived longer with some precautions and that "socialism" they're all so afraid of.

This is Trump 3:16 - 'Tis better to die for lack of health care than to give a dollar to help someone else... it might go to someone who doesn't "deserve" it. 

These people suck. 

This guy could have worn a mask, stayed home, and if he got Covid got full treatment. But because they are all against nationalized healthcare (which this guy technically had a weak form of anyway!) they are lauding this dude for choosing to just die so his wife would get some money. And why are they against national healthcare? It might help women who don't want to get pregnant to not get pregnant. It might help LGBT+ people. It might help immigrants. They don't want THEIR money to help any of these people... no matter how indirectly. They want to claim to pray for these people while gloating over anything bad that befalls them so they can use them as an example of "God's punishment for sin".

15 hours ago, thoughtful said:

Gary posted - he got to Met the Pastor and Family, and, I assume, went to church in the mission Trailer. Oh, boy!

Hey, my church also has a Mission Trailer! (It is, incidentally, parked in my parents' back yard, beside their travel trailer.)

You know what it is? It's a trailer full of shovels, rakes, tools and other equipment so the mission team can go help people in need in the town. No preaching involved. 

13 hours ago, thoughtful said:

He tells a story of an uneducated preacher who got a message out of John 5

I cannot be the only person thinking of this John 5, who I would much rather get a message from:

Spoiler

 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

2 hours ago, Alisamer said:

This is Trump 3:16 - 'Tis better to die for lack of health care than to give a dollar to help someone else... it might go to someone who doesn't "deserve" it. 

These people suck. 

No that's Reagan 3:16. He started this back in the 1980s. He had all this rhetoric around welfare queens and people blowing their food stamps on expensive foods. 

[Don'tlikekoolaid]

2 hours ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

No that's Reagan 3:16. He started this back in the 1980s. He had all this rhetoric around welfare queens and people blowing their food stamps on expensive foods. 

And AIDS, don’t forget what that fucker did to the Gays!

[mango_fandango]

So, when’s Bro Gary going to be talking about the Supper Bowel? It’s happening this Sunday, after all.