Where in the World is Doug Phillips (Who is a Tool)? Part 12

[hoipolloi]

24 minutes ago, Howl said:

He also seems to be sending out tentacles to extend his range of influence with some flavors of Baptists and possibly other denominations -- a kind of Big Tent move. 

Yep. Voddie Baucham and many others who should know better are kissing Doug's ass and appearing with him at their events:

[treemom]

I don’t think Falwell Jr presents nearly the ongoing risk that Wilson does. So absolutely agree if we are thinking who presents the most danger or ongoing risk of damage over time, it probably isn’t him.

Wilson however I think absolutely presents a lot of danger.

[Sarcastically spinster]

On 8/15/2021 at 8:57 PM, Cults-r-us said:

So which guy do you think did the most damage? Vision forum, with its starving, honeschooling families and stay-at-home daughters, Spanky, with his terrible conduct as a drunk, controlling pastor and embezzler, or J.F. Jr., who may have actual blood on his hands from making Liberty U stay open during Covid plus being the first evangelical to endorse Trump?

Based on my personal experience with people who have come out of all of those - VF has by far done the most damage, and much of it through the SAHD movement.  Sproul's toxicity didn't spread quite as far, from my observations.  

[DomWackTroll]

"Sproul's toxicity didn't spread quite as far, from my observations."

Though Doug certainly had his own fawning "aristocrats" within VF, he was a lot more focused on outreach to the general public than R.C. Jr., IMO. As long as Spanky could hold exclusive parties with his "bros", get wasted, and ramble on about theology, he seemed happy enough. And his laziness in recruiting could always be blamed on the concept of limited atonement, so... 

[MamaJunebug]

1 hour ago, DomWackTroll said:

"Sproul's toxicity didn't spread quite as far, from my observations."

Though Doug certainly had his own fawning "aristocrats" within VF, he was a lot more focused on outreach to the general public than R.C. Jr., IMO. As long as Spanky could hold exclusive parties with his "bros", get wasted, and ramble on about theology, he seemed happy enough. And his laziness in recruiting could always be blamed on the concept of limited atonement, so... 

True, these.

And Doug P. maintained a shiny veneer over VF with the cosplay events and fancy catalogs during a much more stable time. (Oy vey, the thought of those times as more stable—!)

 OTOH, Doug W.’s time is ever closer for his ham-fisted, T*liban-degree of radicalization!to really spread.  Because about half of the country continues to look for an outrageous leader [sic] to “turn the USA back to god!”

 

[Columbia]

8 hours ago, Sarcastically spinster said:

Based on my personal experience with people who have come out of all of those - VF has by far done the most damage, and much of it through the SAHD movement.  Sproul's toxicity didn't spread quite as far, from my observations.  

I’m curious, if you knew anyone to come out of ARI/IBLP, how would you rank that among this list?

[hoipolloi]

Sounds like Be-All and/or some of the Phillips family came down with COVID.

From her public IG:

[JermajestyDuggar]

4 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Sounds like Be-All and/or some of the Phillips family came down with COVID.

From her public IG:

I assume almost all the fundies we really about on FJ have had it. So many are anti-mask, anti-vax, and still congregate in big groups indoors all the time. It just makes sense they would all get it eventually. 

[quiversR4hunting]

5 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Sounds like Be-All and/or some of the Phillips family came down with COVID.

From her public IG:

Any bet that a suggestion will not be get a vaccine even though studies have shown getting vaccinated after the virus does help with lingering symptoms? 

source: https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/vaccines-long-covid 

[Columbia]

1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I assume almost all the fundies we really about on FJ have had it.

Yeah, there’s been a lot of nonsense on the Vision Forum page, both from whoever’s running it and the commenters, about not getting the vaccine. 

[Pecansforeveryone]

Honestly the ones I am really surprised haven't caught COVID are the Rods. They have a massive family, travel constantly, and I am positive David has underlying health conditions. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

Honestly the ones I am really surprised haven't caught COVID are the Rods. They have a massive family, travel constantly, and I am positive David has underlying health conditions. 

Jill has claimed that they all had it last year. I doubt she got tested so who knows for sure. Her mom had covid pretty bad last year and Pastor Kevan (her mom’s pastor) almost died from it. So it probably went around the Rod family pretty early in the pandemic because they are reckless assholes. I wouldn’t be surprised if they get the delta variety now. You can get it more than once. And delta is more contagious. 

[Howl]

2 hours ago, quiversR4hunting said:

Any bet that a suggestion will not be get a vaccine even though studies have shown getting vaccinated after the virus does help with lingering symptoms? 

If Beall is still doing elder care, proof of vaccination may become a requirement for keeping her job. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

17 minutes ago, Howl said:

If Beall is still doing elder care, proof of vaccination may become a requirement for keeping her job. 

I doubt it. I know multiple people who work in nursing homes who refused to get vaccinated. And of course they got Covid. 

[quiversR4hunting]

26 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I doubt it. I know multiple people who work in nursing homes who refused to get vaccinated. And of course they got Covid. 

As of today, Biden wants to require covid vaccines for nursing home staff if the facility wants to continue receiving Medicare and Medicaid funding.  https://apnews.com/article/business-health-coronavirus-pandemic-nursing-homes-2e6189cd41068b1e0f643ee7e4bfbb92 

Edited August 19, 2021 by quiversR4hunting

[Bassett Lady]

“We are on the other side and experimented lots.”

 

WHAT! You experimented on your children?

You won’t get a vaccination, but you will run experiments on your own children. That is so sick and horrifying. I have never been so ANGRY, at her, as I am right now. 
 

What a monster. 
 

When my children are ill I take them to our fully licensed physician and then I follow their orders, to the letter. 

[Bastet]

A friend is a social worker here and she says that a requirement for nursing home staff will cause them to quit to become home health aides thus causing widespread staffing problems. And I’m talking Massachusetts here. They’ll have to include all health workers to avoid a crisis. 

[Howl]

1 hour ago, Bassett Lady said:

“We are on the other side and experimented lots.”

We don't know if they got sick before vaccinations were available.  However, if they ARE antivax, f*** them.  I'm also thinking they had zip for health insurance although Beall may have some coverage through her job (if she still has a job). 

[hoipolloi]

Lots of our snarkees are anti-vax and love to post memes & comments about "free-dumb" and "personal responsibility." 

Then there are the ones -- in influential positions -- who ridicule warnings about COVID, tell others not to get vaccinated or wear masks, and then demand top-notch medical care for their family members who fall seriously ill with COVID.

AKA, Fuck Around and Find Out.

Edited August 19, 2021 by hoipolloi

[Sarcastically spinster]

17 hours ago, Columbia said:

I’m curious, if you knew anyone to come out of ARI/IBLP, how would you rank that among this list?

Plenty.  I was actually thinking about that before I got to your comment.  

I think ATI/IBLP probably was worse because it managed to get more into the mainstream.  VF was, at least from my observations, more isolationist - there were "us" or "them", and not a whole lot of in between.  I was friends with many in VF, but I was still a "them", even to my friends.  It was harder to really be a part of VF if you weren't going to conferences.  They also didn't generate entire curriculums etc. the way ATI did.  ATI/IBLP didn't have the same level of hard distinction.  There were people who used some of the materials but weren't as deep in, etc.  I've seen Gothard's umbrella of authority diagram so many places that people have no idea it originated with ATI/IBLP.  VF was a little further "out there" to many, and so they were less likely to absorb anything without realizing. 

[Columbia]

4 hours ago, Sarcastically spinster said:

I think ATI/IBLP probably was worse because it managed to get more into the mainstream.  VF was, at least from my observations, more isolationist

That’s interesting. I always thought of Vision Forum as the more public organization and ATI as more isolationist. Did you find that there was a lot of overlap between the two? Or did they tend to stick to their own camps? I know DPIAT had a very high opinion of Gothard. 

[danvillebelle]

28 minutes ago, Columbia said:

That’s interesting. I always thought of Vision Forum as the more public organization and ATI as more isolationist.

I had never heard of IBLP/ATI before the Duggars came to prominence on TLC.  And I'd been involved in homeschooling/attending conventions/buying books since 1996.  

[AnnaSofia]

I'm not sure what their stance is on vaccinations, but I don't think the Phillips are anti-mask. Beall made a pro-mask post on Instagram fairly early on in the pandemic, and it's still up:

Unless the reference to it being April 1st implied that it was an April Fool's joke.

 

Faith has posted numerous pics wearing a mask, as well as making and selling a batch or two of them:

That said, she's been hopping flights all through the pandemic, including long before vaccines were an option, so it would amaze me if she's never had it (and brought it back to the rest of the family).

There's been a lot of anti-mask/anti-vaccine rhetoric in the comments on the VF Facebook page, but little of it seems instigated by whoever is running the page. At the beginning of the pandemic, the posts (by Doug, I assume) seemed to focus on historical significance, comparisons to the Spanish Flu outbreak, etc.

None of the posts seemed particularly anti-science, but after it was obvious that most of their supporters were Covid denier types, there was a lot more about "personal liberty", yadda yadda.

It wouldn't surprise me if most of the Phillips family themselves got vaccinated, especially with an eye toward possible international travel in the future.

[Cults-r-us]

On 8/18/2021 at 11:37 PM, Columbia said:

I’m curious, if you knew anyone to come out of ARI/IBLP, how would you rank that among this list?

There were numerous accounts of the abuse in ARI when Bill G was being sued for sexual abuse.

Toxic, destructive churches that scar their members for life are a dime a dozen, so Doug's antics at Bourne Assembly were abysmal but commonplace. Same for Spanky, but add fleecing to his list. 

However, the great social experiment Quiverful was a bandwagon that provided a cash cow for authors and homeschool merchandise. So a lot of the damage done by VF was done in concert by people like Nancy Campbell (remember  those awful adoptions) and other influencers. Homeschool conferences were popular with this crowd. You could get a book signed by the Duggars and buy vests from the Maxwells, as well as books on abusively raising children (Michael Pearl) and keeping your children captive, especially daughters.

As was pointed out, the heyday for all this wss then, Doug Wilson is now.

[Howl]

Gothard was hugely popular and influential for a time, filling large venues, jetting around the world, maintaining multiple properties, and I'll bet there was a radio program in there somewhere. 

Perhaps the damage was done with his school curriculum, which (from what I've read)  is apparently both stultifying and toxic, with the added benefit of killing critical thinking skills.  A particularly horrible aspect of the Gothard teaching was assigning blame and at least partial responsibility to victims of sexual abuse.  

But all things patriarchy are destructive to girls and women, and all of them promoted that to some degree or another.