M is for Mama 6: M is for Mama 6: Temper Tantrum over Twins Twice

[TuringMachine]

16 minutes ago, luv2laugh said:

In one of her stories, she said Simon loves cooking and listed all of her recipes that he cooks. 
 

I’m starting to get a sense that Abbie sort of takes a “Wild West” approach to parenting. They need to follow her rules and schedule but aside from that, they are on their own. They need to finish math at the crack of dawn before she wakes up, they don’t have a playroom, they need to entertain themselves, learn to soothe themselves, and good luck. 

I feel like she’s not an emotionally available parent. She’s admitted she is not a natural nurturer compared to Ezra and that’s fine, not all women should be that way, but why have so many kids then?

They really are the Nauglers but with money, jobs, and education.

[luv2laugh]

I want to call attention to how Braggie views her "young men" vs. her "precious girls":

Quote

Ezra and Simon are encouraging me in #preachingtomyself as I face the prospect of raising up FIVE more young men (and, of course, my 3 precious girls) to love and follow the Lord.
It. Is. Worth. The. Work.

I just find it amusing that she likes to brag about how polite her children are:

Quote

Yesterday, my big boys (13 and 12) asked if I would get the email addresses of a few of their friends from their moms. When I asked why, they said, “Because we’re starting an online Bible study where we’re going to read through the whole Bible together and discuss it each week on Google hangouts.” I stopped short and grinned at them and told them what a fantastic idea I thought that was. “Yes ma’am!” They both said enthusiastically. “We’re inviting all our friends!” You guys. There is so much of this I can’t take credit for. The Lord is just good. But I think it would do mamas with younger kids a disservice if I pretend like I had *nothing* to do with it. Because it’s my *job* to have as much to do with it as humanly possible.

I feel sorry for Ezra and Simon because they've been parentified. However, I feel sorry for her 3 daughters because having had a mother like Abbie will probably consist of difficult memories for them down the line. I had a mother who was similar to Abbie who seemed to try to be competitive with me and even jealous as I became a teenager. When I was no longer an extension of my mother's sense of self, I was her competition. I'm glad Abbie's having twins that will be boys.

Edited May 6, 2020 by luv2laugh

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

So if the "big boys" only get 1.5 hours per week on the internet -- how are they going to have this Bible study in any depth?

Edited May 6, 2020 by Red Hair, Black Dress

[JermajestyDuggar]

I feel like so many large fundie families are checked out like Braggie. The Duggars, Bateses, Andersons to name a few. After so many, you are basically just trying to function and it’s probably almost impossible to be engaged with all of your kids. That’s what birth control is so great.

[SassyPants]

44 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I feel like so many large fundie families are checked out like Braggie. The Duggars, Bateses, Andersons to name a few. After so many, you are basically just trying to function and it’s probably almost impossible to be engaged with all of your kids. That’s what birth control is so great.

Birth control and a bit of common effing sense. NO 2 parents can pull off healthy, appropriate, sane, parent ( NOT OLDER SIBLING CENTRIC) care and child rearing. And I hope to God she reads this comment!!!!

SHIT...this should have said to mega numbers of kids, and that’s why most sane people, you know, people who are not willing to use and abuse other people ( or their own kids), DO NOT PROCREATE INSANE NUMBERS OF CHILDREN! 

Edited May 7, 2020 by SassyPants

[luv2laugh]

I was surprised that she shared in a story that part of the reason she started the gentleness challenge is because she struggles with anger and was upset with herself for yelling at the kids for not cleaning the basement well. She said that she didn’t want her kids to remember her that way. I think it’s possible that she felt that way because of the criticism she gets here because we’ve mentioned that she makes the kids clean to much and seems like she gets angry.

The Wild West parenting attitude of many quiverfull families is bothersome. Abbie or Karissa Collins (I forgot) has said things like she doesn’t understand why people think kids need so many things and why parents treat kids as if their fragile but this is because giving their kids quality parenting would overwhelm them. They can only do the bare minimum and let the older ones fill in the gaps.

Kids need a lot of attention tending to their emotional needs... 

Edited May 7, 2020 by luv2laugh

[medimus]

1300 square feet! Is not small. I just looked up what that is in square meters, that's 120 square meters!!! that's bigger than most houses in this entire country! I would call that a large house! Sorry I am just very surprised at what some people consider small. 

Some examples: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/176-oldbridge-station-osberstown-naas-co-kildare-w91-y0aa/4425392

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/27-glencairn-avenue-the-gallops-leopardstown-dublin-18/4338364

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/no-34-castle-court-killiney-hill-road-killiney-county-dublin/4428107

 

[danvillebelle]

Braggie: thinks if they just read the Bible every day and keep living the sparkly happy shiny Jesus instagram life her kids will turn out exactly like she wants them to/thinks they will.

Me:  Oh, honey.  Life just does not work that way.

My kids were raised in a Christian home.  We read the Bible.  We prayed.  We went to church a lot.  We used Christian homeschool curriculum.  

They're all adults now.  Out of 4, only one still identifies as Christian (but rarely attends church).  The other three are atheist, agnostic, and studying green witchcraft.  Two are straight, one is asexual and one is pansexual.  I accept them all and love them unconditionally no matter what.  They've always known that.

And I'm not Christian any longer either.  

I feel for her kids, because with that number....the statistical chance of one or more of them being not neurotypical, having a genuine learning disability, and part of the LGBTQ+ community is...well, I feel for them.  Because you know good and well Braggie would not be happy with a child who does not fit into her Anthro-rug-lined box.

Edited May 7, 2020 by danvillebelle
more

[JermajestyDuggar]

5 hours ago, medimus said:

1300 square feet! Is not small. I just looked up what that is in square meters, that's 120 square meters!!! that's bigger than most houses in this entire country! I would call that a large house! Sorry I am just very surprised at what some people consider small. 

Some examples: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/176-oldbridge-station-osberstown-naas-co-kildare-w91-y0aa/4425392

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/27-glencairn-avenue-the-gallops-leopardstown-dublin-18/4338364

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/no-34-castle-court-killiney-hill-road-killiney-county-dublin/4428107

 

It’s definitely considered small in the US. My family of 4 lives just fine in that amount. But in the US, if you look at the average size of homes, it’s much more than 1300. Braggie’s house is out of the norm though. Practically no one lives in a house as big as her.

[danvillebelle]

We finished raising our 4 kids in a 1284 sq. ft. apartment.  It was cozy, but not cramped by any stretch of the imagination.  Now we are four living in an 1800 sq. ft. house and it feels SO SPACIOUS.  I can't imagine living in anything larger, I'd feel lost.

I was struck by that picture Braggie posted of one of the little boys reading in bed...that tiny little boy in a big, high-ceiling room with bare white walls.  There's nothing appealing or cozy about it at all IMO.  

[luv2laugh]

4 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

It’s definitely considered small in the US. My family of 4 lives just fine in that amount. But in the US, if you look at the average size of homes, it’s much more than 1300. Braggie’s house is out of the norm though. Practically no one lives in a house as big as her.

It depends on where in the US. That would be a large home in New York. Out in the boonies? Yep, it’s small.

Bigger does not = better or = $$$

Edited May 7, 2020 by luv2laugh

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 minutes ago, luv2laugh said:

It depends on where in the US. That would be a large home in New York. Out in the boonies? Yep, it’s small.

Bigger does not = better or = $$$

Oh no I’m from “the boonies” and almost no one has a 6000 sq ft house. 3000? 4000? Sure! But rarely 6000. Isn’t her house 6000 sq ft? Or am I remembering wrong?

[feministxtian]

My townhouse is just over 1300 sqft and it's too damn small. Might be because I don't have the space to spread out my paints and other shit. The bedroom that was supposed to be "my" room is full of shit that got shifted when my son moved in. I want to get the hell out of this place anyway...

[catlady]

we're 3 adults in 1000sf.  there's plenty of room with the exception of a dedicated workspace for me right now.  we had a den with a desk and pc, but we converted it to a tv room when Cousin moved in (the only other tv is in the living room), and I don't have a desk anymore (I work at the dining room table). 

I grew up in a tiny rural town, but most people had little ranch houses, single-wide trailers, or old farm houses.  few of the farmhouses were particularly large. 

so, yeah, I agree that the Braggie Firetrap is a serious anomaly.  and I will always think of it as a firetrap given the layout of the bedrooms.  it seems like she drew a big rectangle and added interior walls at random while skewing her budget toward maximum square footage.  there's so much wasted space and illogical placements.

[SuperNova]

4 hours ago, danvillebelle said:

We finished raising our 4 kids in a 1284 sq. ft. apartment.  It was cozy, but not cramped by any stretch of the imagination.  Now we are four living in an 1800 sq. ft. house and it feels SO SPACIOUS.  I can't imagine living in anything larger, I'd feel lost.

I was struck by that picture Braggie posted of one of the little boys reading in bed...that tiny little boy in a big, high-ceiling room with bare white walls.  There's nothing appealing or cozy about it at all IMO.  

Similar experience here. We raised Baby Nova in a 1200 sq ft house and it was plenty of space. She moved out to attend college and we moved to a new house several years after that. Our current house 2100 sq ft and it's spacious but not overwhelming. I wouldn't go bigger because I don't want to clean anything bigger than this house. I have health issues and sometimes the upkeep is more than I can handle.

[JermajestyDuggar]

I was watching “Bargain Mansions” and Tamara Day had renovated a big old house and made it have 5 bedrooms, 3.5 baths. It was about 3,000 sq feet. She actually said that it would make a great starter home for a family. I was like, “wtf?!?!”

Edited May 7, 2020 by JermajestyDuggar

[luv2laugh]

Do any of you follow Kendra Tierney from Catholic All Year? She's a perfect comparison of Abbie.

What kind of home can you get in a better city with 10 kids if you're far wealthier than Braggie Abbie?
A peek at Kendra Tierney's instagram may provide an answer:  https://www.instagram.com/kendra_tierney/?hl=en

Kendra has 10 kids. She is married to Jim Tierney, the Harvard and Stanford MBA grad who is the COO of an urgent care center in Los Angeles, CA. Obviously, he makes a lot of money $$$... far, far more than Shaun Halberstadt.

If we judge from Instagram, you would not exactly know that Kendra Tierney is far richer than Abbie from the photos. In many Instagram photos, the 10 kids look cramped in like a bunch of sardines .

However, if you perform due diligence, you'll note:
Kendra lives in Los Angeles, CA compared to a town of ~1,500 in east Texas... "Location, location location!"

Quality vs. quantity:
If you take a close look at photos of Kendra's house and rooms, and pay attention to detail, you'll note that the house is richer in regards to quality compared to Abbie's house.

Which home is smaller? Kendra's, by far. Which home is far more $$$? Kendra's, by far.

Bigger does not = richer

However, if we want to be an Instagram Queen like Braggie Abbie, all of the Mormons living in cheap McMansions out in Utah may be onto something...

Edited May 7, 2020 by luv2laugh

[klein_roeschen]

1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I was watching “Bargain Mansions” and Tamara Day had renovated a big old house and made it have 5 bedrooms, 3.5 baths. It was about 3,000 sq feet. She actually said that it would make a great starter home for a family. I was like, “wtf?!?!”

I can't imagine living in such a big house, being the one to pay the heating bill and being the one to clean that much of space.

And a starter home is a foreign concept here in Europe. You may rent your first apartment and get a bigger one if your family grows, but if you buy a house, that's for a lifetime.

[JermajestyDuggar]

7 minutes ago, klein_roeschen said:

I can't imagine living in such a big house, being the one to pay the heating bill and being the one to clean that much of space.

And a starter home is a foreign concept here in Europe. You may rent your first apartment and get a bigger one if your family grows, but if you buy a house, that's for a lifetime.

I think starter homes are only a concept for certain people in the US. It’s a pretty privileged mindset. In my opinion, the majority of people in the US aren’t going to have a “starter home.” 

Confession: I thought our current home would be our “starter home” when we bought it ten years ago. But I deprogrammed myself over the years and realized I’m actually happier in a smaller home with a smaller mortgage. I never want to feel “house poor.” Which basically means you buy the biggest and most expensive home you can get. But you can’t do anything extra like go on vacation, activities, etc because most of your money goes to your house through the mortgage, electricity, gas, and water bills. 

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

Kendra's house isn't smaller than Braggie's -- it's much, much larger. In fact it's huge.  It's a mansion.  

The Tierneys bought a 10 bedroom (you read that right), multi-bathroom (7 I think) semi fixer-upper 1920's estate with large grounds and a pool that Kendra named "Gramblewood." Her hubby makes serious bank (always has), and I believe her family has money. They have spent tres, tres beaucoup bucks having it renovated, although Kendra has obsessively done some things herself. Like stenciling every inch of the walls, floor and ceiling of one room (more on that later). She's as material things obsessed as Braggie.

Because Kendra is an uber fundie Opus Dei  Catholicer-than-thou Catholic mother, she doesn't believe that any child, no matter how old, should have his/her own room or have any privacy at all.

Thus Kendra reduced those 10 bedrooms to 4 -- one for her and hubby, a guest room, a girls room and a boys room.  Her 16-year old DaughterMom sleeps in the same room as her 1 year-old sister and the 3 other girl siblings.  Her 18-year old SonDad and the other 4 boy siblings, including his 2-ish year old brother sleep in the boys room.  The children are packed like sardines in rooms that resemble submarines with bunk bed towers in rows.  There are pictures on her FB/blog. The children's bathroom(s) (there may be 2) also don't afford any privacy.

Kendra turned the other 6  bedrooms into her office, who knows what all, and a private home chapel (the stenciled room) that she recently had consecrated.  Until 2 years ago she home schooled all the children, but has recently relented and send the oldest 4-5 to private, strict Opus Dei Catholic school. She still home schools the younger ones.

TL;DR  Kendra's mansion only looks cramped because she forces all the children into only a few rooms and she enforces togetherness -- no going off by one's self to read or whatever.  No privacy is the watchword in Kendra's kingdom.

She is as shiny happy Jesus-y fake humble bragg-y as Braggie.  She blogs about her house and children and not using birth control at all and her cool hip-ness and her printables business and her speaking engagements and her books (she's an author dontcha know) All. The. Time.  Kendra is the bestest Catholic that ever Catholiced. And like Braggie makes dang sure that the rest of us know we're doing faith all wrong. 

As a Catholic myself she chaps my lips and makes my spleen itch the same way Braggie does.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Red Hair, Black Dress

[So-Virgin-It-Hurts]

2 hours ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

and a private home chapel (the stenciled room) that she recently had consecrated. 

Holy shit - a private chapel!? Does she think she's royalty?

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 minutes ago, So-Virgin-It-Hurts said:

Holy shit - a private chapel!? Does she think she's royalty?

She seems to! Here’s a pic:

[katilac]

 

On 5/6/2020 at 2:03 PM, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

So if the "big boys" only get 1.5 hours per week on the internet -- how are they going to have this Bible study in any depth?

I'm assuming that's their motivation for the bible study - to get extra time on the internet. Bible study still means talking to your friends, and there's at least a bit of wiggle room for socializing. 

8 hours ago, klein_roeschen said:

I can't imagine living in such a big house, being the one to pay the heating bill and being the one to clean that much of space.

And a starter home is a foreign concept here in Europe. You may rent your first apartment and get a bigger one if your family grows, but if you buy a house, that's for a lifetime.

Most people with huge houses are not doing their own cleaning. 

I'm American but don't get the starter home thing. Moving is so much work, lol. To add to the crazy, a fair number of people buy a starter home, move to a bigger one when they have kids, then downsize to a smaller one when the kids move out. 

Edited May 8, 2020 by katilac

[TuringMachine]

Just dove a bit into her blog / instagram. She has a blog post about what she liked about living through a renovation, the first of which was that all her kids toys were packed up. Apparently her husband had to convince her not to give all their toys away. And the kids rooms. Ugh. Looking at the before floor plan, it looks like a couple of the bedrooms would have had to go anyway to make it function as a modern single family home, but they definitely didn't need to force all boys and girls to share a room. Speaking of, I noticed the girls get their own beds but the boys have to share triple bunk beds? That room is big enough for at least some of them to get a single.

Oh and she claims the kids all want to sleep together in one big pile. Yeah NicNog claimed that too to justify having all ten (at the time) kids sleeping on a single wooden shelf. I believe them both equally.

I will say though, as cheaper as Braggie's house clearly is, I gotta give her the point for design. Kendra's taste in flooring and wallpaper is... interesting.

Also who names their house?

Edited May 8, 2020 by TuringMachine

[luv2laugh]

6 hours ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

Kendra's house isn't smaller than Braggie's -- it's much, much larger. In fact it's huge.  It's a mansion.  

The Tierneys bought a 10 bedroom (you read that right), multi-bathroom (7 I think) semi fixer-upper 1920's estate with large grounds and a pool that Kendra named "Gramblewood." Her hubby makes serious bank (always has), and I believe her family has money. They have spent tres, tres beaucoup bucks having it renovated, although Kendra has obsessively done some things herself. Like stenciling every inch of the walls, floor and ceiling of one room (more on that later). She's as material things obsessed as Braggie.

Because Kendra is an uber fundie Opus Dei  Catholicer-than-thou Catholic mother, she doesn't believe that any child, no matter how old, should have his/her own room or have any privacy at all.

Thus Kendra reduced those 10 bedrooms to 4 -- one for her and hubby, a guest room, a girls room and a boys room.  Her 16-year old DaughterMom sleeps in the same room as her 1 year-old sister and the 3 other girl siblings.  Her 18-year old SonDad and the other 4 boy siblings, including his 2-ish year old brother sleep in the boys room.  The children are packed like sardines in rooms that resemble submarines with bunk bed towers in rows.  There are pictures on her FB/blog. The children's bathroom(s) (there may be 2) also don't afford any privacy.

Kendra turned the other 6  bedrooms into her office, who knows what all, and a private home chapel (the stenciled room) that she recently had consecrated.  Until 2 years ago she home schooled all the children, but has recently relented and send the oldest 4-5 to private, strict Opus Dei Catholic school. She still home schools the younger ones.

TL;DR  Kendra's mansion only looks cramped because she forces all the children into only a few rooms and she enforces togetherness -- no going off by one's self to read or whatever.  No privacy is the watchword in Kendra's kingdom.

She is as shiny happy Jesus-y fake humble bragg-y as Braggie.  She blogs about her house and children and not using birth control at all and her cool hip-ness and her printables business and her speaking engagements and her books (she's an author dontcha know) All. The. Time.  Kendra is the bestest Catholic that ever Catholiced. And like Braggie makes dang sure that the rest of us know we're doing faith all wrong. 

As a Catholic myself she chaps my lips and makes my spleen itch the same way Braggie does.

Wow, I didn’t know that. Kendra Tierney deserves her own thread. She is something else... I never knew there were fundie Catholics until I came across her.

I will give Braggie Abbie credit for something... She is VERY good at getting expensive things at a bargain. 

Edited May 8, 2020 by luv2laugh