Bro Gary Hawkins 13: What's the other one, Becky?

[ignorantobserver]

On 6/20/2020 at 3:03 AM, thoughtful said:

I think Gary uses "saints" to mean "saved people." Mormons sometimes refer to individuals in their church as saints, and I even remember a "we are all saints" theme for November 1 at the Episcopal church I worked for. So it's not unheard-of in other groups.

Technically speaking, in any Christian denomination a saint is just someone who is in heaven / is definitely saved. Using it for living people is unusual and seen as pretty shocking in most circles because, well, it's up to God to decide of a person's fate, typically after their death. Depending on whether one accepts the idea of a "communion of saints", living humans might be unable to know whether a dead person is in heaven or not (Reformed idea) or able to know for sure in some rare, very clear-cut cases (Catholic idea), with the fate of most deceased being unclear. For a rather liberal church, "we are all saints" just means "God saves everyone"/"takes everyone to heaven" (the implication on November 1st being that this applies to the dead, not the living).

In the cultish sense that I suspect Gary uses, saints are the members of the right church as opposed to the terrible people outside.

 

On 6/19/2020 at 8:22 AM, thoughtful said:

"When does a baby start sinnin'? Maybe a day and a half - maybe a little quicker than that - after it's born."

He asks if they've ever played with a baby who was a few days old,  making it giggle, then turned off the light and left the room, asks "y'know what happens?" then gives an incredibly loud shriek. "You can say that isn't sin if ya want to, but that's the biggest sin they ever was for a baby, amen."

I am a little slow... what is he talking about ? The baby starts crying ? Masturbating ? Celebrating a Black Mass ? What is the sin here ?

Edited June 21, 2020 by ignorantobserver

[Seahorse Wrangler]

I hope you have seen this before..

 

Spoiler

 

 

[thoughtful]

Last night, under the tent, on the gravel.

On his way up to the piana (aka keyboard on a table, with a too-short chair), Gary cracks his joke about Paul and Jailhouse Rock. One person laughs heartily.

I skipped the Hawkinses singing.

Gary always goes back to his seat/pew after singing, I guess to get his Bible, while everyone waits. Why not bring the Bible to the front when you sing, Gary?

Jacob brings him a water bottle. The way Jacob has been bringing them is starting to remind me of the exhausted, exasperated soldier who brings Washington's dispatches in the film 1776 (as at the beginning of this clip):

Gary talks about the weather - it's hot, hope they don't have to take the tent down before the 25th due to rain, he can't put it up if it got wet, how little time he has before getting to the next gig, etc.

Gary, they're not there to hear your personal problems.

The Bryants need a van. Gary, they're not there to hear other people's personal problems.

Gary tells his story about wanting to speak on two subjects, and Becky telling him she couldn't sit through 16 points. It gets a big laugh.

These people are from the "yelling back at the preacher and supporting him" tradition, and they start out with him, but get quieter and quieter - I think they just get tired of him.

Here we go - Gary tells us to turn to Luke 16 . . . then . . .

Nope - more rambling, about listening to God when God tells him what to preach, he can only preach to the ones that are up to the hearing of the word, people are noticing the tent being up, how he told "a black guy" who came and asked if the sale was still on (there's been reference to this before - I think the mission had a yard sale) - Gary invited him to church, he said "maybe next time," Gary told him "next time" is tomorrow night. Finally:

Luke 16 - the rich man and Lazarus.

Gary revs up to full bull-seal bellowing very quickly. We've heard this one before - Hell is a bad place, watch Estus Pirkle's The Burning Hell.

"Hell is in the center of the earth" and people are "fryin' like sausage."

Gary believes there are people on earth "that God has given up on."

"Sodomites was mintioned a while ago - y'can call 'em whatever ya wanna call 'em, the Bible calls 'em sodomites, that's what they are, amen? If they are not saved, and they - I don't know how far you have to git into that uh - git into that mess before God gives you up to a reptobate mind, and before God gives you up. But ah will tell you this much - ah have known people who've been sodomites, that have got saved."

"Ah didn't git the high-dollar education, ah didn't go to all the high-dollar colleges."

"Ah got on Facebook 'n' did a live chat today because ah got some people who think I should just be on Facebook all the time - they don't realize I got a life, gotta do other thangs."

"Ah don't know how Brother Oscar does it, works all day long. At least he says he works all these hours, ah'll just have to go over and (unintelligible) Ah'm jokin'. But he works all these hours, and he's comin' over here every night preachin.'"

Gary zigs and zags through a dozen or more sentence fragments to talk about how he used to "work a job" as well as preaching. Walmarts gets in there somehow. Gary mocks preachers who think they're above working a job.

Self-awareness is not his strong suit.

Gary's got a brother-in-law who's so smart you could blindfold him, take a laptop apart, and he could put it back together. But that's not what's going to get him into Heaven.

He keeps saying what sounds like "you need to accept it when God is dealin'."

Spoiler

  ? Or maybe:

   ?

Not enough preachers preach on Hell, because they "skeered that they'll skeer people to death. If that's what you want to call it, 'n' God'll git their hearts, honey, ah'm willin' to skeer anybody."

Gary reads Matthew 19:21 - 1 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

Gary encourages giving, and tells them a story about how he spent more than he could afford traveling because someone "begged" him to come preach, then put his last $50 in the collection plate. He says he made a profit. Well, OK, he says  "ah got back more than ah give."

That sounds like prosperity gospel, and a bald-faced bid for them to give you money out of superstition, Gary - not cool.

While he has them turn pages to Genesis, he says "Lord, ah told you this wasn't gonna go over good, but ah'm glad ah obeyed You amen."

Now that's some hubris.

"You have never really met a real . . . uh . . . what is it ah'm tryin' to think of . . ." several people say "atheist" and he gets his groove back. "You've never really met a real atheist, ya say how do you know? Right before they get in trouble you know what their first statement is? 'Oh, God.' Every tahm."

Tadpoles . . . damn - still SSN.

Another 13 minutes of yelling about people burning in Hell, and he's done.

 

Edited June 21, 2020 by thoughtful
why do I never see the riffles before I submit?

[thoughtful]

38 minutes ago, ignorantobserver said:

I am a little slow... what is he talking about ? The baby starts crying ? Masturbating ? Celebrating a Black Mass ? What is the sin here ?

You are not slow. You understand how babies function (and you didn't see Gary's fabulous screeching imitation of a baby crying - my words couldn't possibly do it justice).

Gary is talking about the baby crying because it has suddenly been left alone in the dark. To him, Michael Pearl and their ilk, that is sinning.

 

[Dana723]

45 minutes ago, thoughtful said:

"Ah didn't git the high-dollar education, ah didn't go to all the high-dollar colleges."

 

You're kidding.

[thoughtful]

6 minutes ago, Dana723 said:

You're kidding.

I was going to post this right after it, but the post was already long:

Spoiler

 

[thoughtful]

 

I actually tried to watch The Burning Hell. I found out that Jack Hyles has a cameo in it. I wonder if Gary ever made the connection that he was goat-sitting for the son of someone in one of his favorite movies.

I mean, if I was goat sitting for Ava Astaire-McKenzie, I'd want to tell her how much I admired her father's work.

And I must be the bearer of sad tidings:

Clearly the work of Satan.

Edited June 21, 2020 by thoughtful
added link

[wallysmommy]

Beansie was in the internet creating havoc.  

Thank you, @thoughtful for the good laugh at Jesus dealing cards at the last supper.  If he was dealing quarter roulette, I would be all in.

I continually be totally confused as to how this nitwit got custody of his kids.  I would love to see the transcript of the custody hearings because it's too insane to even think that he would be the better parent.

[thoughtful]

Becky, Becky, Becky - get a clue.

So, you weren't crazy about him as president, and you think you are making a brilliant point. But he wasn't someone who declared war on his own country and killed fellow Americans, then was not immortalized in bronze until 80 years later, just to scare already disenfranchised people.

I hate the Confederate statues because of the racism and fear-mongering they represent. But can't you at least recognize that revering statues of people who were active, violent, traitors to your country is very bizarre?

As with your stupid toddlers should apologize meme, there is no comparison.

Edited June 21, 2020 by thoughtful
missing word - Satan took it!

[Four is Enough]

14 hours ago, Lillymuffin said:

You know what Billy Joel said, “I’d rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints.” (The sinners really are more fun.) 

We Catholic girls really do start much too late...

 

13 hours ago, ignorantobserver said:

I am a little slow... what is he talking about ? The baby starts crying ? Masturbating ? Celebrating a Black Mass ? What is the sin here ?

Because a baby saying by crying, "I'm frightened" or "where did you go" or "help" or "I'm hungry" is a SINNER donchaknow

[ignorantobserver]

13 minutes ago, Four is Enough said:

Because a baby saying by crying, "I'm frightened" or "where did you go" or "help" or "I'm hungry" is a SINNER donchaknow

What kind of sick mind imagines that a crying baby has somehow bad intentions ? These people are insane. I knew the Pearls encourage hitting young toddlers, but newborns ?

[Xan]

1 hour ago, ignorantobserver said:

What kind of sick mind imagines that a crying baby has somehow bad intentions ? These people are insane. I knew the Pearls encourage hitting young toddlers, but newborns ?

I think in Gary's mind (and the Pearls' and the Duggars' and the Rods', etc.), a baby crying for attention is being selfish and trying to control the parents.  The only people that fundies allow to be selfish are the parents -- particularly the father.  He's the head of the family and he gets what he wants when he wants it.  They try to make certain that the children learn early on that they should be satisfied with whatever food or attention they are given and aren't to ask for more.

The entire idea of blanket training just makes me physically ill.  And the thought that Gary believes that babies are sinning when they're just trying to get someone to comfort them is distressing.  He believed this was a good thing to say out loud.  

No, Gary.  Just... no.

Edited June 21, 2020 by Xan

[thoughtful]

1 hour ago, ignorantobserver said:

What kind of sick mind imagines that a crying baby has somehow bad intentions ? These people are insane. I knew the Pearls encourage hitting young toddlers, but newborns ?

They recommend a lot of "flicking" for babies. After that, it's "switching," with a flexible object. They have gotten the goal of causing stinging pain without leaving a mark or permanent damage (that authorities could see) down to an art, disgustingly enough.

And they do seem to believe that a baby crying, or not silently going right to sleep, is sinning by being selfish. If I remember correctly (I just can't bear to look at To Train Up a Child again), there is some acknowledgment of a baby's not knowing any better, but they recommend training it out of them anyway (which I suspect is just Pearl's trying to put a "Godly" spin on his not wanting to be bothered by the sound of crying babies).

I think the idea that the baby would be a newborn might be Gary's muddled invention, though - after all, he also describes the baby giggling at adult play. I suspect Gary has paid no attention whatsoever to babies and knows nothing of developmental stages.

Speaking of parents:

Yes, even Gary's Fathers' Day tribute has to be all about belief and preaching and going to church. A simple "I love you, Dad" is out of the question.

And, of course, things like staying nearby or visiting often, keeping in touch, and actually helping Dad care for his very ill Mom, and for him as he ages, or helping to support them financially or emotionally are pipe dreams - that kind of honoring one's parents isn't even on Gary's radar.

He's boasted in several sermons about how his big sacrifice for his parents was staying away for 14 days when he first got back into NC after traveling - time which he spent doing as he pleased, in his usual selfish way, so it's not like it was a big hardship. Becky is the one who mentions his parents' health, and talks to them on the phone.

And, Gary, unless one of you has head lice, it's "not," not "nit."

Spoiler

Did everybody just scratch their heads?

 

[AmazonGrace]

16 hours ago, thoughtful said:

Becky, Becky, Becky - get a clue.

So, you weren't crazy about him as president, and you think you are making a brilliant point. But he wasn't someone who declared war on his own country and killed fellow Americans, then was not immortalized in bronze until 80 years later, just to scare already disenfranchised people.

I hate the Confederate statues because of the racism and fear-mongering they represent. But can't you at least recognize that revering statues of people who were active, violent, traitors to your country is very bizarre?

As with your stupid toddlers should apologize meme, there is no comparison.

So she is offended because a black man was a president.

[Dana723]

1 hour ago, AmazonGrace said:

So she is offended because a black man was a president.

I can always tell when someone I know is racist because they say either one of two things about Obama:

 

1.  He's not really black - he's only half black.

2.  I don't like him but I'm not racist. 

 

If you don't like someone, that's one thing.  There's no reason to put the "He's not really black" or "I'm not racist" in there.  Just say, "I don't like him because blah blah blah" and leave it at that.

[thoughtful]

Some of these people have very bizarre conspiracy theories to try to cover up their racism. The comments under the original post are something else.

It's very similar, to me, to the way they use religion and faith. Their beliefs are right,  they have all the answers, and are the only ones going to Heaven. But, lest that look prideful, they insist they are not exalting their sinful, worthless selves, they're "boastin' on Jesus." They know they're saved, and rest of us will burn in Hell, but they're not excluding us, because we could become like them. The Bible is right because they believe the things in it, and they believe those things because they're in the Bible.

Their politics and racism are harder to defend, but they try the same tactic. Obama is not white, and a Democrat, that's enough reason for them to hate him. But some are too canny to say that outside of their immediate circle.  Someone tells them an idiotic, vicious lie about him (some include race-based suspicions, like thinking he is a Muslim from Kenya, some are anti-liberal, some are just random shit), and they believe it because he's a non-white Democrat and they already hate him. They even persuade themselves that good things he did were bad (how dare he give us health insurance!). And around and around it goes. Eventually, they get to having so many crazy stories they believe, they can even pretend that racism has nothing to do with it, and argue against Obama's worth using imaginary stories of the horrible things he did, without ever mentioning race.

They try to form a bubble out of circular arguments, making it thicker and stronger and more slippery on the outside with every dumb conspiracy theory, then live inside that bubble, thinking that we can't see that they think they're "it," as Gary would say, for being the only true believers, and that they are shitty racists.

Those bubbles are clear, assholes. We can see it all.

Spoiler

 

[thoughtful]

I haven't seen videos from Through the Grace of God Ministries on any of the Hawkins' Facebook pages since Friday night. I know Gary said he didn't go live last night because of Internet problems.

I looked on Mims' page, and there were videos for last night, this morning and this evening, inside the mission.

I listened to about a half-hour of one - it skipped enough that I really couldn't hear much content, but I did not hear or see Gary or Becky in the congregation. Then the playback got really weird, and other things were going on with my Internet, so I got off and got on again. And they are gone!

They may have decided to take them down because the quality was so bad, and I just happened to catch part of one before they did so. But I know I saw that there were three, they were definitely all indoors, and I didn't see or hear Hawkinses.

It could be that they came indoors due to weather, the availability of someone to help take down the tent yesterday that wouldn't be there later, or just feeling like it wasn't working. And it may be that I just happened not to hear or see a Hawkins in the part that I watched.

But there was congregational singing, and Gary is hard to miss! I can't help wondering if they gave up on Gary due to his idiotic preaching, or ejected him due to doctrinal differences or his and Becky's racism.

In other news, I looked at the Facebook page of Gary's newly-married daughter, who is, let's just say, a chip off the old block.

Spoiler

https://www.facebook.com/liana.lynn.7106/

I saw the little bit of a wedding video. That father-daughter walk down the "aisle" was even more pitiful in video than it was in a still shot. Gary's hands were in his pockets the whole way. The groom grabbed the bride by the shoulders and corrected where she was standing for the ceremony by physically moving her there.

I'm an informal person, who hates ceremony and dressing up, so it's not the setting, the casual dress or the lack of a major party that bothers me. There's just something so miserable about the video and pictures.

The groom may just not like being photographed, and grabbing and moving her may just have been out of nervousness, but he almost always looks like he's about to get angry, to me.

Spoiler

 

 

[Ozlsn]

7 hours ago, thoughtful said:

The groom grabbed the bride by the shoulders and corrected where she was standing for the ceremony by physically moving her there

That is a red flag. If he's acting like that in public at the wedding I very much doubt he's acting better in private. I still wonder a lot about Gary getting custody, and it wouldn't surprise me if his daughter is (subconsciously) picking men like her father.

I hope like hell that if my suspicions are correct his daughter realises sooner rather than later and gets out.

[AmazonGrace]

Spoiler

Ok folks if we want AMERICA back. We the people of GOD will have to turn to GOD. If you want to see some Sparks we will have to turn to GOD. If we want our Family's we will have to turn to GOD. Whatever it is that we would like to see we will have to turn to GOD. Nothing is impossible with GOD. GOD wants to but do we want HIM to.
Bro Gary Hawkins

Gary thinks you can do nothing without God. And funnily enough he is doing nothing. 

Jethere wants $1500. 

[PumaLover]

Wow, that was the worst quality wedding video I've ever seen! Also it looked like the groom actually shoved her! That was forceful. She's so tiny compared to him, too. 

Reminds me of my super godly Christian ex husband, who was one way in public and another behind closed doors. Somehow I guess I just brought out a lot of anger in him. Our first Christmas as a married couple, we were trying to carry a Christmas tree up our apartment stairs and he got mad for some reason and shoved me with it and I almost fell backwards down the stairs. 

So Christlike, right!?

[smittykins]

21 hours ago, Dana723 said:

I can always tell when someone I know is racist because they say either one of two things about Obama:

 

1.  He's not really black - he's only half black.

2.  I don't like him but I'm not racist. 

 

If you don't like someone, that's one thing.  There's no reason to put the "He's not really black" or "I'm not racist" in there.  Just say, "I don't like him because blah blah blah" and leave it at that.

How long before she says “Michelle is ReAlLy A MaN”?

On the 20/20 episode about IFB abuse/the Tina Anderson case(which may still be on YouTube), Tina mentions that a baby who is fed and dry cries “from his own selfish will, and where his will is, God’s will cannot be.” 

Edited June 22, 2020 by smittykins

[samurai_sarah]

Carry on here: