Dillards 84: Craving Attention

[louisa05]

7 minutes ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

I will respectfully stand by what I said. I am aware that many lay Catholic women have positions of leadership. That doesn't negate the overall patriarchal structure of the Catholic hierarchy. I know many Assembly of God churches and Salvation Army churches that ordain women. It doesn't negate the complementarianism in many evangelical churches. 

I think women should be ordained. But saying that the church not yet allowing it makes Catholics complementarians is a huge leap.  That theology of marriage is not taught in the Catholic Church. There is actually teaching that the mother plays the largest role in the “domestic church” that implies she is the spiritual leader in the home. That teaching doesn’t talk about cooking, cleaning or staying at home, either. And in the US women are absolutely not barred from leadership roles.  

[Pleiades_06]

21 hours ago, BernRul said:

still don't like Derrick, but anyone speaking out against abuse (and we know that abuse happened in the Duggar family and Gothard's cult) is a good thing, even if it hurts their career. 

I generally agree with you but am wondering if he’s speaking out of conviction or because he’s bitter about the falling out with JB and TLC? It seems like he wants to take the ship down out of revenge and not because he’s had a huge change of heart. But I could be wrong.

16 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

And in the US women are absolutely not barred from leadership roles.  

All the major leadership roles are only for men. What leadership roles are you thinking of?

The sexism in the Catholic Church was one of the major reasons I left. I remember being 8 years old and my sister asking the priest if she could be an altar girl. He gave her some spiel about how girls had other roles to play but couldn’t serve in our parish. Granted our parish was more conservative than most , but come on.
 

[louisa05]

40 minutes ago, Pleiades_06 said:

I generally agree with you but am wondering if he’s speaking out of conviction or because he’s bitter about the falling out with JB and TLC? It seems like he wants to take the ship down out of revenge and not because he’s had a huge change of heart. But I could be wrong.

All the major leadership roles are only for men. What leadership roles are you thinking of?

The sexism in the Catholic Church was one of the major reasons I left. I remember being 8 years old and my sister asking the priest if she could be an altar girl. He gave her some spiel about how girls had other roles to play but couldn’t serve in our parish. Granted our parish was more conservative than most , but come on.
 

Ministry directors, youth directors, head of finances, business managers, superintendent of diocesan schools, members of church and school boards, presidents of church and school boards, school administrators, etc...,.
Again, I’m not disputing the problem with ordination.  But equating that 100% to the complementarianism in the evangelical world where women are allowed no roles in churches beyond children’s ministries and encouraged to not speak in church and to not work outside the home in the name of godliness is a stretch. The position of women I. The American Catholic Church has a ways to go but it’s not the same as evangelical complimentaroanism. Not even close. I’ve been in both worlds. I was only completely voiceless in one. 

[HideousGreenShirt]

The Dillards and this thread have been getting more interesting lately.

I doubt there will ever be an explosive tell-all that will actually give us the answers and insights we want. But, if Derick continues to drop these little tidbits and perhaps Jill opens up a little more, then I think we will get an idea of what these two have gone through. 

Amy's NDA (whenever it runs out) and relationship with Jill will be interesting to follow too. 

These two posts from Jill's Instagram story today stood out. In the tie dye outfit, she looks so happy and cute and non-Duggar. And this message about loving seeing her sons being imaginative and creative is encouraging, especially after Jana and Josie's painting incident. 

[SassyPants]

I wonder if the first ah-ha that Derick imparted was that you don’t have to have baby every year to be a good, faithful, Christian and that sex can be for pleasure too? Because at this point, they are either preventing or there is something else going on. I wonder if Jill is able to recognize that you can do, know, appreciate children far more when there are fewer in the mix? When there’s a couple it’s imaginative play, and when there’s a dozen it’s a chaotic mess.

[libgirl2]

1 hour ago, HideousGreenShirt said:

The Dillards and this thread have been getting more interesting lately.

I doubt there will ever be an explosive tell-all that will actually give us the answers and insights we want. But, if Derick continues to drop these little tidbits and perhaps Jill opens up a little more, then I think we will get an idea of what these two have gone through. 

Amy's NDA (whenever it runs out) and relationship with Jill will be interesting to follow too. 

These two posts from Jill's Instagram story today stood out. In the tie dye outfit, she looks so happy and cute and non-Duggar. And this message about loving seeing her sons being imaginative and creative is encouraging, especially after Jana and Josie's painting incident. 

I like the tie dye outfit. I would wear it! It would be neat for hanging around the house or running errands etc on the weekends. Jill looks good in it too. 

[Bad Wolf]

2 hours ago, Pleiades_06 said:

I generally agree with you but am wondering if he’s speaking out of conviction or because he’s bitter about the falling out with JB and TLC? It seems like he wants to take the ship down out of revenge and not because he’s had a huge change of heart. But I could be wrong.

All the major leadership roles are only for men. What leadership roles are you thinking of?

The sexism in the Catholic Church was one of the major reasons I left. I remember being 8 years old and my sister asking the priest if she could be an altar girl. He gave her some spiel about how girls had other roles to play but couldn’t serve in our parish. Granted our parish was more conservative than most , but come on.
 

We celebrated 150 years in our church last uear, and had a service straight from the prayer book back then. Our acolyte is a girl, which wasn't allowed back then, so they painted a moustache on her and changed her name. It was a lot of fun, followed of course by a potluck.

 

[HereticHick]

I'm so sad that Cow Appreciation Day is canceled this year. How will Fundies get free food? Weren't the Dillards et al in to this back in the day?

[also, since fundy kids can't dress up for satanic Halloween, it was one of the few chances they had]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/10/business/chick-fil-a-postponing-cow-appreciation-day/index.html

[SassyPants]

4 minutes ago, HereticHick said:

I'm so sad that Cow Appreciation Day is canceled this year. How will Fundies get free food? Weren't the Dillards et al in to this back in the day?

[also, since fundy kids can't dress up for satanic Halloween, it was one of the few chances they had]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/10/business/chick-fil-a-postponing-cow-appreciation-day/index.html

The Duggars are all about anything that they can get for free, from dental work to chicken, donuts and messy ice cream sundaes. Thou shall not grift and thou shall not reproduce children willy nilly should be commandments 11 and 12.

[LacyMay]

4 hours ago, Pleiades_06 said:

I generally agree with you but am wondering if he’s speaking out of conviction or because he’s bitter about the falling out with JB and TLC? It seems like he wants to take the ship down out of revenge and not because he’s had a huge change of heart. But I could be wrong.

I think his reason for speaking out is conviction but I also think he's motivated by bitterness and a need for attention/feeling special/needing the spotlight to shine on him. 

It's unfortunate because he talks about wanting to raise his kids away from the dog and pony show but he can't seem to deal with just living a quiet low key life. He has to do interviews, drop little teaser nuggets and blast how bitter he is. 

He could use his platform to talk about the dangers of christian patriarchy or child abuse in the church or the need for more regulation in reality TV. But he chooses to toss out snipey vague comments and insults towards his in laws.

[Glasgowghirl]

Jill's threads have been keeping me amused the past day or so. 

Yesterday my family suffered a horrible loss, my auntie Mary died in a house fire, my cousin and his 9 year old son had being staying with her too but had gone Loch Lomond fishing with a friend and his son. 

[Bobology]

@Glasgowghirl, so very sorry about your auntie and for your entire family. That's just horrible.

[Pleiades_06]

31 minutes ago, Glasgowghirl said:

Jill's threads have been keeping me amused the past day or so. 

Yesterday my family suffered a horrible loss, my auntie Mary died in a house fire, my cousin and his 9 year old son had being staying with her too but had gone Loch Lomond fishing with a friend and his son. 

How horrible-I’m so sorry.

[PlentyOfJesusFishInTheSea]

On 7/8/2020 at 2:52 AM, Kayleigh83 said:

Amy’s most recent Instagram post was a little cryptic - it’s a selfie of her and Jill, and the caption reads “ You smile just a bit brighter these days! So proud of you hippie chick!”

Could just be Amy angling for attention at least to some degree, because of course there’s lots of speculation in the comments. But it does make you wonder what is making Jill smile and making Amy proud....

Classic Amy vaguebooking! ?

[Snarkasarus Rex]

You know, I think Amy and Jill should write a book together.  Shared experiences but from different perspectives.  It doesn’t even have to be a ‘tell-all’, just how their family influenced them and why they chose a different path. I think it would sell pretty well.  

[JordynDarby5]

7 hours ago, Glasgowghirl said:

Jill's threads have been keeping me amused the past day or so. 

Yesterday my family suffered a horrible loss, my auntie Mary died in a house fire, my cousin and his 9 year old son had being staying with her too but had gone Loch Lomond fishing with a friend and his son. 

I'm so sorry. That's horrible.

[IsmeWeatherwax]

@Glasgowghirl I'm so sorry for your loss xx 

[just_ordinary]

On 7/10/2020 at 8:04 PM, SassyPants said:

I wonder if the first ah-ha that Derick imparted was that you don’t have to have baby every year to be a good, faithful, Christian and that sex can be for pleasure too? Because at this point, they are either preventing or there is something else going on. I wonder if Jill is able to recognize that you can do, know, appreciate children far more when there are fewer in the mix? When there’s a couple it’s imaginative play, and when there’s a dozen it’s a chaotic mess.

To the bolded: I don’t think that’s a valid conclusion. It’s not unreasonable to not conceive for quite some time with two young children when you only have sex when both partners are really into it. If nothing else is going on I would assume they are just not actively trying to get pregnant. They are probably both tired and exhausted, especially now that kindergarten for Israel clearly hasn’t started and dropping them off with the little aunties at Duggarville isn’t an easy option. Not having much sex isn’t unusual in that “phase of life” and hopefully this means that Jill and Derick have a more acceptable mindset about what is expected of women regarding availability and so on.

[Grace]

6 hours ago, just_ordinary said:

To the bolded: I don’t think that’s a valid conclusion. It’s not unreasonable to not conceive for quite some time with two young children when you only have sex when both partners are really into it. If nothing else is going on I would assume they are just not actively trying to get pregnant. They are probably both tired and exhausted, especially now that kindergarten for Israel clearly hasn’t started and dropping them off with the little aunties at Duggarville isn’t an easy option. Not having much sex isn’t unusual in that “phase of life” and hopefully this means that Jill and Derick have a more acceptable mindset about what is expected of women regarding availability and so on.

Except hasn't she outright said something about having sex 3-5 times a week?

[Four is Enough]

I almost couldn't recognize Jill in that athleisure outfit. She looks so young and happy! Something is agreeing with her!

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

I fully believe they are preventing. I think Cathy has had a lot of influence on both of them in the last 2 or so years, while she's got horrid beliefs, they are no where near what JB&M preach. 

I can see these two being done having kids, but I can also see them having 2 more in a few years, but I can't see them having more than 4 tops. Like JinJer they will have a "small" family, at least by Duggar standards. 

[Snarkasarus Rex]

I also think they’re not done yet, but as your kids get older and more fun, you start to wonder if you really want to do it all over again. After a while they might decide two’s enough. Derick’s work prospects (or lack thereof) will also come into play.

Derick in his usual vague way has hinted about preventing in the recent past.

[HideousGreenShirt]

Well, she's just stated that she is not pregnant in a comment on her latest ig post:

Spoiler

I'm not going to read into her response whether they're done having kids, but I won't be surprised if they don't have any more kids. Or they don't have any more until Sam is in school and Derick is settled into a real job (hopefully, who knows with him).

I'm adding these from her story too. I like that she's getting some alone time and has a close (non-related) friend who appears to be supportive and frequently watches her boys. This friendship seems more genuine than the ones we previously discussed on this thread. 

Spoiler

 

[Pecansforeveryone]

If she is in fact, taking up running good for her. A stress release, time alone, a hobby, all of which could be very good for her. 

[Pleiades_06]

36 minutes ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

If she is in fact, taking up running good for her. A stress release, time alone, a hobby, all of which could be very good for her. 

Your words “time alone” made me realize she’s probably never had much time alone from kids. Ever. I would feel so burned out in her place.