Alyssa & John 5: She's Raising Fashion Conscious Girls

[HerNameIsBuffy]

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Thanks @AliceInFundyland for the title quote.

Edited January 2, 2020 by Coconut Flan

[Deleorean88mph]

Alyssa is starting to homeschool Lexi with these videos. She's turning 3 this month. I think that school at such a young age should be learning how to interact with other children her age, share toys, follow directions, etc. Watching cute videos to learn letters is fine but more for the entertainment value. 

[Melissa1977]

Homeschooling with videos sounds L.A.Z.Y in my opinion.

It's sad. I bet Alyssa would enjoy dressing up the girls and taking them to school every morning, being a volunteer mom for school events, and telling John to help with the girl's homework. She's just not fit for homeschooling. 

Edited January 1, 2020 by Melissa1977
Spelling

[VBOY9977]

23 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

Homeschooling with videos sounds L.A.Z.Y in my opinion.

It's sad. I bet Alyssa would enjoy dressing up the girls and taking them to school every morning, being a volunteer mom for school events, and telling John to help with the girl's homework. She's just not fit for homeschooling. 

She schools Allie with videos too. She even said once in a comment that she gets ready while Allie “does school”. I honestly don’t know how much you can really learn from videos. I would use it as a complementary measure but not as the main tool for schooling. 

[PurpleCats]

I’m sure she was ‘schooled’ in a similar manner, and the people around her so the same.  If you don’t see different, IBS hard to know different. 

[Seculardaisy]

2 hours ago, PurpleCats said:

I’m sure she was ‘schooled’ in a similar manner, and the people around her so the same.  If you don’t see different, IBS hard to know different. 

She was. Kelly has mentioned in their show before that she used the Abeka videos for schooling and that’s how she was able to manage her time (that and forcing the older girls to do whatever the videos didn’t cover.)

[Jigsaw3]

Alyssa mentioned in her Instagram that she and John have shut down their Jonny on the Spot cleaning business.  She didn't say why; it was around the time she had her first surgery, but she didn't cite her health as the reason.

We had some speculation about their finances around the time of her second surgery. If they've shut down the cleaning business, that must have a considerable negative impact on their income. John's shady MLM can't be making up for that decrease. Interesting times all around...

(As a side note, I always respected Alyssa for being loud, proud, and unafraid to get down and dirty in a very physical and demanding job such as cleaning. The Bates kids definitely acquired a work ethic from somewhere -- and it's not from shiftless grifting Gil.)

[Deleorean88mph]

5 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

Homeschooling with videos sounds L.A.Z.Y in my opinion.

It's sad. I bet Alyssa would enjoy dressing up the girls and taking them to school every morning, being a volunteer mom for school events, and telling John to help with the girl's homework. She's just not fit for homeschooling. 

It will certainly make fundie history when one of them decides on public/private school over homeschooling.  If Alyssa is (understandably) feeling overwhelmed and using videos as the primary teaching method when the girls are so young, it will only get harder when they get older. 

[indianabones]

Here's what she told people in the comments.

[HereticHick]

Alyssa and John may have also realized that with 3 small children to take care of, it was difficult to have a side business. 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

12 hours ago, Jigsaw3 said:

The Bates kids definitely acquired a work ethic from somewhere -- and it's not from shiftless grifting Gil.)

It may actually have been from Gil.  A lot of people develop traits opposite of their parents in an effort to avoid the trauma that comes with how they were raised.

Pre-TV Gil and Kelly were certainly a cautionary tale and it wouldn't surprise me if some of them developed a work ethic as a defense mechanism.

[nokidsmom]

30 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Pre-TV Gil and Kelly were certainly a cautionary tale and it wouldn't surprise me if some of them developed a work ethic as a defense mechanism.

I have often thought that pre-TV, the older kids in particular would have memories of some pretty tough times back when Daddy insisted on grifting and the takeaway for them (or some of them at least) would be to avoid ever dealing with that again.

I know it's been said here before, if the Bateseseses kids succeed, it will be in spite of Gil and Kelly and not because of them. 

[rebeccawriter01]

3 hours ago, nokidsmom said:

I have often thought that pre-TV, the older kids in particular would have memories of some pretty tough times back when Daddy insisted on grifting and the takeaway for them (or some of them at least) would be to avoid ever dealing with that again.

I know it's been said here before, if the Bateseseses kids succeed, it will be in spite of Gil and Kelly and not because of them. 

Agreed. Many times (my mother's family as an example), the oldest children (especially girls) are told they have to sacrifice so much because mom's having another baby. My mom is the oldest of eight and would have to miss school to care for the younger siblings who were sick. Then she would get sick too and miss more school. She worked two jobs after school to earn money for a car and things she wanted (clothes). Her father, who was always quitting jobs and looking for new ones would "borrow" her car most days to supposedly look for another job. 

My mom speaks of days when her family didn't have enough money for lunch for all the kids in school. There was no free or reduced program back then. So my mom would take two pieces of bread (stale) and pretend she had at least a sandwich. My mother would get to go to her grandparents' home and the hotel they owned for summer vacation to work and earn money at the hotel. My grandfather made her return home early because her mother had another baby. 

She is very careful with money and before she retired worked as hard as she could to work her way up the corporate ladder. She never earned her degree, having to drop out when my grandfather lost another job and almost lost the house. She had moved out but he came begging for help and she quit college to work 80 hours a week to help out. 

I can see that same fear of having to go back to that kind of life in how Zach, Michaela, and Alyssa interact with the world. I don't really see it with Nathan and Erin too much. Even Lawson tends to have that hoarding thing some families like that can spawn. Michaela reminds me a lot of my mother (sounds strange since I am older than her). Zach does apparently more than his deputy/police work, as he was doing construction projects and filling in on the tree service even before Chad opened his business. Michaela did open her own online store with her sewing projects (probably not all that profitable), finished her AAS and got into a nursing program. Alyssa worked along with John in the cleaning business and seems to manage her family without as much help as some. She has his family, but she's not able to drop the kids off at Gil and Kelly Jo's house for one of the sisters to watch at the drop of a hat. 

I think the three of them did see things they don't want to repeat. Zach has made comments and there was the story about the kids fighting over the left overs from the steak dinners the parents used to have after each kid was born. I would bet Alyssa and Michaela saw some crap when there wasn't enough money for food for everyone (watering things down, etc.).  

[neuroticcat]

This is really insightful. I also remember on one of the early Bates shows they had to borrow money from Lawson (who had his own landscaping business at the time) to buy the week’s groceries, so I don’t doubt any income the older kids initially made (or their free labor for the tree business) helped pay for family needs.

They didn’t seem too embarrassed by it in the show so my guess it was normal for them to contribute in that way. It also explains why all of them are heavily trying to be influencers and get income and free stuff that way. The older kids must remember the vast difference pre fame/house remodel/ income and after. 

What gets me is I imagine Gil and Kelly are attributing all the blessings as a direct result of their faithfully following ATI cult teachings all these years. ?

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 hour ago, rebeccawriter01 said:

. I would bet Alyssa and Michaela saw some crap when there wasn't enough money for food for everyone (watering things down, etc.).  

My heart breaks for your mom - and I have such admiration that she overcame so much.

Regarding the above, even what they showed (without shame) was haunting to me.  I remember the episode on the Duggar's show before they had their own where they showed preparing "dinner."  

Dinner was a piece of fried bologna topped with a scoop of mashed potatoes and slice of American cheese.  That's not a proper dinner for growing kids and it clearly wasn't a one off as it was used to show how they eat economically.  

Since then I've wondered what "dinners" looked like when the cameras weren't rolling.

Edited January 2, 2020 by HerNameIsBuffy
words are hard

[ShesCrafty]

2 hours ago, rebeccawriter01 said:

Zach has made comments and there was the story about the kids fighting over the left overs from the steak dinners the parents used to have after each kid was born. 

Holy crap, I’ve never heard this story before. Gil and Kelly are such awful parents. 

[rebeccawriter01]

17 hours ago, neuroticcat said:

This is really insightful. I also remember on one of the early Bates shows they had to borrow money from Lawson (who had his own landscaping business at the time) to buy the week’s groceries, so I don’t doubt any income the older kids initially made (or their free labor for the tree business) helped pay for family needs.

In the old Nightline stories (My Extraordinary Family and others), they show Lawson doing the shopping because he was more cost conscious (at least according to Gil) and he paid for it. He told the reporter that he often did that and they tried to pay him back. Indicating how often that must have happened, he was aware of the price and quantity changes on things like cold cuts. He also mentioned loaning money to Erin for school and Zach for a truck. These were the same magazine show stories where Gil spoke of simply taking the kids to the ER for medical treatment and not having insurance. 

Alyssa was interviewed about cooking for the family, which she said she had done since she was a preteen. They reused the same footage when there was a story featuring her getting married. I truly think her getting married at the age she did was simply seeing the writing on the wall. Erin was married and so was Zach. Michaela was at home but Alyssa could surely see that she was about to be even more of a sister mom in charge as the girls aged up and got married. Not saying she didn't fall in love. I just think she also found a way out (limited, but still not as much).

Given how she is shown (neat, wanting order, disliking chaos), I would bet she had moments of stress with how the Bates house can be at times. Even Josie let it slip when they were looking for apartments that the house was never clean, etc.  

16 hours ago, ShesCrafty said:

Holy crap, I’ve never heard this story before. Gil and Kelly are such awful parents. 

I don't remember which episode but Zach took Whitney to the restaurant that Gil always took Kelly to after she gave birth. He commented to Whitney that his parents would bring home a doggy bag and the kids would fight over who got it. It made me think of the 19KAC episode where the Duggars "surprised" the family at a restaurant. Gil allowed the children to order soda instead of water. He almost told them that it was because TLC was paying, but changed it to say it was a special occasion. I wonder how many times they had to do that but Gil and Kelly drank what they wanted.

My parents were frugal. I didn't get a lot of name brand stuff growing up. Normally I got one big toy thing I wanted (Cabbage Patch Kid, etc.) and a lot more of the knock off brand stuff. However, my parents never had nice meals and left me to eat the scraps. They are less frugal now, helping me to purchase my first home. When I had horrible medical bills that were beyond my abilities, they helped and covered a lot of it. They refer to that as me spending my inheritance. Both of my parents are from large families and decided to only have one child. They have both said they didn't want me to grow up like they did. 


 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 hour ago, rebeccawriter01 said:

I don't remember which episode but Zach took Whitney to the restaurant that Gil always took Kelly to after she gave birth. He commented to Whitney that his parents would bring home a doggy bag and the kids would fight over who got it.

This is absolutely sickening.

I don't even give my dogs treats until I have one in my hand for each of them.  

Remember their horses?  

[nokidsmom]

1 hour ago, rebeccawriter01 said:

I truly think her getting married at the age she did was simply seeing the writing on the wall. Erin was married and so was Zach. Michaela was at home but Alyssa could surely see that she was about to be even more of a sister mom in charge as the girls aged up and got married. Not saying she didn't fall in love. I just think she also found a way out (limited, but still not as much).

I always felt Alyssa get out as soon as she could in the way she was able.  Especially I learned that she was doing cooking duty for years, that girl was over it and wanted out.  Not that she doesn't love John, I believe she certainly does, but she struck me as ecstatic that comes from being relieved on her wedding day.

The story about the kids fighting over the doggy bag is absolutely disgusting.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 minute ago, nokidsmom said:

I always felt Alyssa get out as soon as she could in the way she was able.  Especially I learned that she was doing cooking duty for years, that girl was over it and wanted out.  Not that she doesn't love John, I believe she certainly does, but she struck me as ecstatic that comes from being relieved on her wedding day.

The story about the kids fighting over the doggy bag is absolutely disgusting.

This reminds me of something my grandma said about my grandpa.  She said she was glad he was easy to love, because she'd have married the devil himself to get off the farm.  She said she fell in love with him quickly after they were married and she got very, very lucky that he was a good man since she didn't really know that when she married him.  

Not saying that applies to Alyssa as they had a longer time to get to know each other and I'm sure she loved him - but I think she also probably considers herself very lucky in getting a man she loves and a ticket out of that life.

[nokidsmom]

11 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Not saying that applies to Alyssa as they had a longer time to get to know each other and I'm sure she loved him - but I think she also probably considers herself very lucky in getting a man she loves and a ticket out of that life.

They were special friends for some time before they courted then got engaged IIRC.    I have no doubt she loves John, she seems very happy with him, both of them seem very happy and she strikes me as knowing she was very lucky.   Out of all of the Bateseses kids I am the most happy for her.  

[Lgirlrocks]

I’m pretty sure they had the shortest courtship ever. I think it was two months. 

[justmy2cents]

14 hours ago, Lgirlrocks said:

I’m pretty sure they had the shortest courtship ever. I think it was two months. 

According to their old blog Kelly said they considered going straight to engagement but thought it would be fun to court.  It seems the  wedding was already in the works by the time of the courtship announcement was made.

Edited January 4, 2020 by justmy2cents

[Iamtheway]

On 1/2/2020 at 6:53 AM, VBOY9977 said:

I honestly don’t know how much you can really learn from videos.

Miniway watches a lot of videos (for fun, not for ”school”) and he can sing the whole ”Baby shark” song so ... 

[HideousGreenShirt]

Ugh I always forget how badly they came across on those specials @rebeccawriter01 mentioned.

https://youtu.be/Eh_njlNFEls

This one shows 18 year old Lawson shopping (doesn't talk about him paying) but it does say that he goes to the store almost every other day and the bill. In this episode is $258.

They also make "snow ice-cream" with the reporter which appears to horrifyingly be literal snow from the ground outside mixed with something. 

Erin, Alyssa and Tori are asked about privacy (6 min 38 seconds in), Erin insists that they get privacy when they want and Alyssa looks less than thrilled. 

It's obvious that Alyssa escaped the second she was able to, wasn't there some talk of the families waiting to allow them to court until she turned 18? According to fundi wiki, the couple met when she was 17-18 and helping with his dad's campaign. John proposed courtship days before her 19th birthday, then they were engaged 2 months later and married 4 months after that. 

That being said, I think John is one of the better fundie husbands (in that he values her health, appears supportive and involved with the kids) and they seem well matched as a couple.