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AMA with former ATI member


nelliebelle1197
Message added by nelliebelle1197

This is a reminder that we are not here to dox the AMA writer. But rip her ridiculous story all to hell. I mean rip it. But just don’t dox her.

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Flyinthesoup
5 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

There are also quite a few inaccuracies.  Andrea and Rusty Yates were not Gothardites but Michael Woroniecki followers,  David Waller is the Director of ATI not the president. The police report on Josh did not mention digital penetration ...

I had to look up Andrea Yates to find out the timing of when she killed the children for their ages, and ATI, along with finding out who Michael Woroniecki is. From the Wiki on Andrea, her eldest child was just 7 years old at time of death.  It's highly unlikely they would have been involved with AIT at that time, unless it was briefly.  That would only leave IBLP that they could have been involved in at the time.  It doesn't sound like that was part of their life, reading up on Rusty and Michael.  I wonder why u/Jays_Motorcycle would claim that connection?!

Edited by Flyinthesoup
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I haven't read the Reddit stuff and this is the first I'm reading of this thread here, but IMO Pa Keller isn't smart enough to traffic a sandwich for lunch in a brown paper bag.

Andres Yates’ husband is way more guilty than her imo.

Yeah, I think it’s totally ridiculous. I don’t really buy this idea that Pa Keller has dirt on the golden families and that’s why he keeps making good matches for his kids, either. First of all,

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HerNameIsBuffy
4 hours ago, Beermeet said:

What do you guys think of the Pa Keller stuff?  He's supplying prison men for David to screw in exchange for marrying Pris?  Forget everything else, that is some shit. This person is saying that Pa Keller has a whole gay sex trafficking thing going on. This person should go the police with this stuff, speak to the media, not do a Reddit AMA. 

I haven't read the Reddit stuff and this is the first I'm reading of this thread here, but IMO Pa Keller isn't smart enough to traffic a sandwich for lunch in a brown paper bag.

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Maggie Mae
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You would be surprised how little interest and empathy the mainstream media has in poor uneducated white people from the South who are racist Trump supporters. They don't see victims of generations of poverty and abuse, they see deplorables. They have consistently ignored the rise of politicized fundamentalism because it hasn't directly affected them yet. When it does ... it will be too late.

I was skeptical and then I got to this. This is so fake.

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singsingsing
48 minutes ago, Maggie Mae said:

I was skeptical and then I got to this. This is so fake.

Yeah... I mean, I don't know, but I feel like every time I turn around the mainstream media is talking about/to "uneducated white people from the South who are racist Trump supporters."

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Maggie Mae
5 minutes ago, singsingsing said:

Yeah... I mean, I don't know, but I feel like every time I turn around the mainstream media is talking about/to "uneducated white people from the South who are racist Trump supporters."

Yes, and it's something that people from the now thankfully quarantined the_donald liked to say. And "AskTrumpSupporters" .. and wherever else they hang out. Even NPR talks about the "plight" of the uneducated white people from rural America.

I think it was in context to why she didn't take the interviews with Diane Sawyer or whatever. Of course the media would eat up a story about sexual abuse and scandals in a trailer park. It reinforces believes. It's voyeuristic. It's reality TV. People love crime TV.

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indianabones
3 hours ago, Flyinthesoup said:

I remember seeing a video clip of this, years and years ago, but I think it was called, "Reversal Choir".  I do not think it was vasectomy as women were having reversals, too....unless perhaps it got nick named that. :D I just Googled my words and a link came up from an old blog from 2004 , he refers to it as the, "Baby Reversal Choir".  Apparently the choir sent a letter to headquarters, unhappy with how they have been treated....interesting!  For me, when I saw that video clip and heard the name, I was embarrassed for children in the choir and amazed at how many children were in it.

That blog post is satire.

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She did mention in a reply to someone that she used to post her story in a forum where people doxed her and didnt believe her story, she also mentioned having a freejinger account (username: the vasectomy reversal choir). 

Personally i tend to believe her in all the facts she shared, they all seem believable and agree with things we have heard before.

Now there is a part of what she is claiming that is just speculation, the part about the kellers, the part where she says jim bob sexually abused his daughters...i dont think she is actually claiming that it is factual, people ask and she gives an opinion. She says she doesnt personally know this families, so how she would even know that? its 100% speculation. I think its not a good idea mixing facts with your own speculation on an IAMA because it makes you lose credibility.

Edited by llucie
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Palimpsest
1 hour ago, Flyinthesoup said:

I had to look up Andrea Yates to find out the timing of when she killed them and ATI, along with finding out who Michael Woroniecki is. From the Wiki on Andrea, her eldest child was just 7 years old at time of death.  It's highly unlikely they would have been involved with AIT at that time, unless it was briefly.  That would only leave IBLP that they could have been involved in at the time.  It doesn't sound like that was part of their life, reading up on Rusty and Michael.  I wonder why u/Jays_Motorcycle would claim that connection?!

The timeline is roughly this:

1961 - Gothard started  Campus Teams.

1974 - he changed its name to Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts. And the 70s were really his heyday before the Steve Gothard sex scandal broke circa 1980.

1984 - he started the "Advanced Training Institute" (ATI) a homeschooling curriculum.

1989 - he changed the whole organization's name again to Institute in Basic Life Principles (IBLP).  ATI was under that IBLP umbrella.

Gothard certainly wasn't the only lunatic Fundie patriarchal Quiverfull preacher out there at the time.  Check out McCotter (and others) as well.  Big Botkin connection there with McCotter.

The Michael Woroniecki and Yates connection is  well documented, although Rusty Yates denies it.  Loudly.

The evidence for a Bill Gothard and Yates connection is actually non-existent,   Although sloppy researchers (Gawker, I am looking at you!) think everything Quiverfull = Gothard = Yates.

Andrea Yates is the "famous" QF murderer.  Everyone who hates QF wants to claim her.  That poor woman.

 

 

 

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Palimpsest
8 minutes ago, llucie said:

She did mention in a reply to someone that she used to post her story in a forum where people doxed her and didnt believe her story, she also mentioned having a freejinger account (username: the vasectomy reversal choir). 

Only a couple of problems with that.  I'm a tool using primate who can work the search function on FJ pretty well. 

AND .. we have no member by that name.  Nor has FJ ever doxed anyone.  

I don't see where they say they were actually doxed anywhere.  Could you quote it - TIA.

I saw where they said they were not believed (on a nameless forum) because of a photo showing them wearing shorts prior to joining ATI.  I call bull-crap on that being FJ because we have plenty of former ATI and IBLP people here who have pointed out that they wore shorts and pants.

Interesting that she attempted to cry victim and head off skepticism in advance though.

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Flyinthesoup
1 hour ago, indianabones said:

That blog post is satire.

Yes, it is, by an ex-ATI guy. Thus, why I am not sure it was called, "Reversal Baby Choir", nor the "Vasectomy Choir". I recall it being referred to as the "Reversal Choir".

Edited by Flyinthesoup
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Palimpsest
3 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

The more I read the more I feel a Razing Ruth at the laptop.  This all fits her MO superbly well.  

It does increasingly smell familiar.  It wouldn't be the first time she has reappeared.  And she's pretty darn good at faking it.

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singsingsing

There was recently a post on another popular subreddit (r/relationships possibly?) from the perspective of a young women from a fundamentalist family who was a lesbian and being forced into a marriage with a man. For the record, the entire post seemed totally fake to me, but it was an extremely popular post. Someone recommended that she check out FJ, and another person warned her against it because apparently FJ regularly belittles people from fundie backgrounds who come here looking for help (what?) and doxes people. 

I am not sure who FJ has ever doxed besides maybe Razing Ruth, which I'm not sure qualifies as 'doxing'... but maybe that's where this latest AMA author got the idea?

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1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

Only a couple of problems with that.  I'm a tool using primate who can work the search function on FJ pretty well. 

AND .. we have no member by that name.  Nor has FJ ever doxed anyone.  

I don't see where they say they were actually doxed anywhere.  Could you quote it - TIA.

I saw where they said they were not believed (on a nameless forum) because of a photo showing them wearing shorts prior to joining ATI.  I call bull-crap on that being FJ because we have plenty of former ATI and IBLP people here who have pointed out that they wore shorts and pants.

Interesting that she attempted to cry victim and head off skepticism in advance though.

To be fair she didnt mention what forum it was, but it inmediately made me think of racing ruth. Hopefully she was talking about another place and it wasnt a preventivevely attempt to defend herself of any acusation.

Here she mentions her username, she is replying to someone mentioning the vasectomy reversal choir is a cool name.

 

 

Edited by llucie
edit to add: that i also used the search function and no person with that username seems to exist. It is posible that she used to have an account and she deleted it? although she does talk in the present tense about her username.
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thoughtful

Well, clearly I didn't try enough google searches the first time. I just tried again, and did find two more references to Gothard's Reversal Choir, one in the book God's Harvard, about Liberty University.

http://overcominghomeschoolheather.blogspot.com/2015/07/we-cant-all-have-full-quiver.html

https://books.google.com/books?id=SPj6mi4Dh5MC&pg=PT100&lpg=PT100&dq="reversal+choir"+ATI&source=bl&ots=MtlJHjRbxE&sig=ACfU3U1_eNyJeG_IhY9Hl-1T_fh1cK2ZcQ&hl=en&ppis=_e&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwimx9Ljm8PmAhUHnOAKHcAtCnMQ6AEwAHoECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q="reversal choir" ATI&f=false

I'm still a skeptic about the AMA person.

Edited by thoughtful
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Destiny

I read most of it, and I call shenanigans. That person may be ex-ATI, but the more salacious stuff comes across as a cry for attention. Honestly there’s nothing in there that I would not be able to write and I wasn’t the ATI brand of fundie. 

It seems like RR to me tbh.

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Beermeet

I went to look again and found new comments and answers,  some 6 hours old.  It's odd it's still going. Her answers have changed tone, imo.  Gentler (?)  Seems like gratification has been achieved and is still being enjoyed.  There is a lot of ass kissing comments to read and reply to.

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Giraffe
4 minutes ago, Beermeet said:

I went to look again and found new comments and answers,  some 6 hours old.  It's odd it's still going. Her answers have changed tone, imo.  Gentler (?)  Seems like gratification has been achieved and is still being enjoyed.  There is a lot of ass kissing comments to read and reply to.

I’m assuming the person is fake and is most likely reading here. That may be contributing to the change in tone. 
 

👋 whoever you are! 
 

:popcorn:  

Edited by Giraffe
Awww! I was going for the moving popcorn icon; to me it’s more sarcastic.
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adidas
58 minutes ago, Beermeet said:

I went to look again and found new comments and answers,  some 6 hours old.  It's odd it's still going. Her answers have changed tone, imo.  Gentler (?)  Seems like gratification has been achieved and is still being enjoyed.  There is a lot of ass kissing comments to read and reply to.

And offers of money are being posted now too.

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SusanAtTheLastBattle

I am extremely skeptical about the AMA, but I will say there is another high profile ATI-connected murder. Joshua Komisarjevsky, one of the perpetrators in the Cheshire home invasion murders in 2007, was homeschooled in ATI.

Homeschoolers Anonymous collected the available info on this, with links to news sources: https://homeschoolersanonymous.org/2014/03/10/when-homeschoolers-turn-violent-joshua-komisarjevsky/

FYI, this is a gruesome crime to look into with both sexual violence and killing, so only go down that rabbit hole if you’re ready.

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smittykins

I remember watching an episode of People Magazine Investigates on ID about that crime.  I didn’t know that about Komisarjevsky.

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PlentyOfJesusFishInTheSea

Maybe this person grew up in ATI and is indulging in a lot of speculation, but she's also indulging in a lot of "I was so SMART I had to leave, even though I'm so BEAUTIFUL too and was highly prized."

Sure, lady.

Also I found this gem from Jay's Motorcycle: "I would be surprised if JB and Michelle allowed their children to interact with POC. IBLP is racist AF."

We know the Duggars have friends of colour: The Hartanos, the Whites, the Jacksons, etc.

The issue isn't skin colour, it's that people have to be in their cult or apparently in similar-enough cults like Vision Forum. I don't think IBLP has a lot of black families (probably because, yes, IBLP is pretty racist), but I don't think the Duggars would bat an eye about hanging out with them, as they drink the same koolaid.

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11 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

We don't delete accounts.  

The fact that she lied about that makes her super suspicious. Because why lie about that? its not like anyone on reddit would care if you have an account here or not. And if you are even lying in unnecesary details why should i believe everything else?

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