Duggars Raided by Homeland Security

[AliceInFundyland]

You know, a bunch of polygamist women and children were viciously shot by a drug cartel en route from Colonia LeBaron in Mexico and the US Border.

It "probably" had to do with decades of disputes over water rights between various parties. But, it's not clear.

 

We have a thread about it in quiverfull of fundamentalist mormonism

Here is a good article. I recommend getting into the flds and polygamist memoirs. There's some great ones. Much much more interesting than the Duggars

Here's an article on an actual scandal

https://www.thedailybeast.com/a-new-twist-in-the-horrific-massacre-of-american-mormon-moms-and-kids-in-mexico

[FluffySnowball]

4 hours ago, OMG said:

J-boob would never let Anna off his property.

After we learned she had to sleep in the same room as Josie Duggar, there might be more truth to your statement than I’d like to imagine. I’m sure the Duggars would try to guilt trip and pressure Anna into staying, no matter what Josh did (if he indeed committed a crime). 

[TheMustardCardigan]

Maybe I am just being a pessimist, but does anyone else feel like if it's tax evasion or some kind of financial issue with MedicCorps, that won't be enough for TLC to remove them from the air? Just thinking about how so many people handwave away things like Trump not releasing his tax returns in this day and age.

[nelliebelle1197]

1 hour ago, JordynDarby5 said:

Just saw the thread title and had to rub my eyes and pinch myself to make sure I wasn't dreaming. I'm not dreaming. Its real! Well, not really a raid. Just probably questioned. I'm trying to stay rational too. Its not that I don't think JB is shady, he is as shady as hell. But I don't want to get disappointed if nothing comes from it.  

Yeah, I am not sure. @Buzzard , who knows things, is not convinced.

[redsmomma29]

OK so, my theory is if it is Josh related then it is CP or sex trafficking related because if that is not the case then JB has to be involved for sure. Money laundering,tax evasion, really anything else besides pure sex crimes. JB keeps such a tight rein on this family that unless it is really doors closed, illegal/exploitative pornography JB has to be involved. 

Also I am amazed that the married and adult Dugger spawn allow/allowed JB to negotiate with TLC and keep the money. Anna has been on the post 19k shows and had to sell their house and move into the tin can guesthouse? Jill was on lots of episodes, and even with Dwreck and his nasty tweets, she/the couple should have been paid.  That is slave labor in my book, just because JB has a contract, does not mean that the rest of the family has to be filmed for free.....so maybe child labor/labor law violation related offenses for JB?

Probably not Bahamas related because no Bates rumors/news so far.....

[tabitha2]

It’s going to have to have someone going to Jail over Child related crimes to get the show off the air. Shady Money finagling is simply not going to do it. So we should very much Wish for the Duggars to be able to stay on the air. 

[xtwheeler]

. If it is DHS (including ICE under that administrative umbrella) my first instinct, given the Duggars are hypocrites to the max, is that it is possible they were maybe investigating employment of undocumented workers. Can't you see JimBob who I assume wants no immigrants exploiting undocumented workers? 

The only person I know arrested by ICE is my old high school teacher who got caught up in a huge ICE raid on undocumented workers tied to human trafficking. His charge was, unfortunately, child porn (which I'm not suggesting here). I just using the example of how things we think are not under any particular jurisdiction (I'm so sorry) might cover things we'd never think of. 

[clueliss]

Off of Wikipedia - a screen cap of the list of child agencies for Homeland Security

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

15 hours ago, RosyDaisy said:

Wouldn't they have their own public relations department?

 I wouldn't think so, 1 public relation departments can handle several different departments, general there is only 1 PR department for any one major corporation, keeps the information streamlined and makes the company/agency look like the right hand knows what the left hand is doing. 

[JenniferJuniper]

43 minutes ago, redsmomma29 said:

Also I am amazed that the married and adult Dugger spawn allow/allowed JB to negotiate with TLC and keep the money. Anna has been on the post 19k shows and had to sell their house and move into the tin can guesthouse? Jill was on lots of episodes, and even with Dwreck and his nasty tweets, she/the couple should have been paid.  That is slave labor in my book, just because JB has a contract, does not mean that the rest of the family has to be filmed for free.....so maybe child labor/labor law violation related offenses for JB?

Reality show kids aren't protetcted in Arkansas so, I don't think it's related to working kids.  And the kids on the show today don't work nearly as much as say Jackson and Hannie did back in the day.  And they were really little.

I remaind shocked that the "outsider" sons and daughters-in-law don't push back on JB.  I mean, I know Derick has to some degree, but the rest aren't discontented at all?  Your point about Anna is spot on.  The Duggars have put her through hell.  And her reward is that she gets to live in a large metal shed with her POS husband and 6 little kids.  Jim Bob has totally fucked her over.  

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

3 hours ago, FluffySnowball said:

After we learned she had to sleep in the same room as Josie Duggar, there might be more truth to your statement than I’d like to imagine. I’m sure the Duggars would try to guilt trip and pressure Anna into staying, no matter what Josh did (if he indeed committed a crime). 

I was noting Anna is looking and dressing more and more like Michelle every time we see her.  As the other married women are moving further away from long lose skirts and tops Anna is diving deeper in. I also think there is a genuine affection for Anna not only by the older sisters but JB & M as well. 

Add to that JB doesn't want 6 of his grandkids running off to God knows where where he can't keep them under his thumb. 

[Buzzard]

1 hour ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

Yeah, I am not sure. @Buzzard , who knows things, is not convinced.

I'm still not, but I'M LAYING CLAIM TO SMUGGLES' MUGSHOT if he does get picked up!

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

4 hours ago, AliceInFundyland said:

You know, a bunch of polygamist women and children were viciously shot by a drug cartel en route from Colonia LeBaron in Mexico and the US Border.

It "probably" had to do with decades of disputes over water rights between various parties. But, it's not clear.

We have a thread about it in quiverfull of fundamentalist mormonism

Here is a good article. I recommend getting into the flds and polygamist memoirs. There's some great ones. Much much more interesting than the Duggars

Here's an article on an actual scandal

https://www.thedailybeast.com/a-new-twist-in-the-horrific-massacre-of-american-mormon-moms-and-kids-in-mexico

Thanks for this, I'm going down this rabbit whole, this is fascinating. 

[ViolaSebastian]

17 minutes ago, clueliss said:

Off of Wikipedia - a screen cap of the list of child agencies for Homeland Security

Hmm...Domestic Nuclear Detection Office. Maybe Jenny built a reactor in the basement?

[tabitha2]

No matter what Anna Feels or does not feel she has Five kids and soon to be new born to consider and they must come first.  This is the only life they know, they are settled in every way with all the family and all physical comforts children require.

[FluffySnowball]

6 minutes ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

I was noting Anna is looking and dressing more and more like Michelle every time we see her.  As the other married women are moving further away from long lose skirts and tops Anna is diving deeper in. I also think there is a genuine affection for Anna not only by the older sisters but JB & M as well. 

Add to that JB doesn't want 6 of his grandkids running off to God knows where where he can't keep them under his thumb. 

I agree! My guess is that Anna dives ever deeper into the faith and cult to find solace. Her life isn’t working out well, no matter how she might try to twist and turn the facts. 

As for the genuine affection from JB and Michelle, I want to agree cause I get the same impression, but they treat her so shady that I wonder how honest their care for her wellbeing can actually be. They want to control her and keep her and the children in the fold. If Anna wanted to leave or make drastic changes, I’m not sure JB and M would remain so loving and sweet. 

2 minutes ago, tabitha2 said:

No matter what Anna Feels or does not feel she has Five kids and soon to be new born to consider and they must come first.  This is the only life they know, they are settled in every way with all the family and all physical comforts children require.

You’re right and I know what you mean by “physical comforts” but I still thought of corporal punishment the moment I read it. Anna’s sweet and meek, but she’s also deep in the cult and I am sure she believes in beating her children. 

[CarrotCake]

25 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Hmm...Domestic Nuclear Detection Office. Maybe Jenny built a reactor in the basement?

Yes please!

This would be the best outcome of this mystery.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 hour ago, FluffySnowball said:

I agree! My guess is that Anna dives ever deeper into the faith and cult to find solace. Her life isn’t working out well, no matter how she might try to twist and turn the facts. 

As for the genuine affection from JB and Michelle, I want to agree cause I get the same impression, but they treat her so shady that I wonder how honest their care for her wellbeing can actually be. They want to control her and keep her and the children in the fold. If Anna wanted to leave or make drastic changes, I’m not sure JB and M would remain so loving and sweet. 

You’re right and I know what you mean by “physical comforts” but I still thought of corporal punishment the moment I read it. Anna’s sweet and meek, but she’s also deep in the cult and I am sure she believes in beating her children. 

I wonder if she isn't trying to emulate Michelle and asking Michelle how to be a more Godly wife, so she she can "heal Joshly of his sins". ?

Or perhaps JB & M have moved them closer to home so JB can keep Josh in line and Michelle can train Anna in being a proper wife to keep a Josh in check. I'm sure they may have thought Anna was the problem because they didn't want to believe that Josh was, but they have to know in some small part of their little minds that it is Josh and THEIR failings as parents that have cause this.  But who knows, Anna looked like she was in a cult on Tuesday's show, where as the other girls look more "normal".

Edited November 21, 2019 by allthegoodnamesrgone

[Cleopatra7]

16 minutes ago, FluffySnowball said:

I agree! My guess is that Anna dives ever deeper into the faith and cult to find solace. Her life isn’t working out well, no matter how she might try to twist and turn the facts. 

As for the genuine affection from JB and Michelle, I want to agree cause I get the same impression, but they treat her so shady that I wonder how honest their care for her wellbeing can actually be. They want to control her and keep her and the children in the fold. If Anna wanted to leave or make drastic changes, I’m not sure JB and M would remain so loving and sweet. 

You’re right and I know what you mean by “physical comforts” but I still thought of corporal punishment the moment I read it. Anna’s sweet and meek, but she’s also deep in the cult and I am sure she believes in beating her children. 

There is a good bbc documentary you can see on YouTube called Russia’s Lost Princesses that is about Tsar Nicholas II’s four daughters and it makes the case that their parents’ terrible decisions, both in the family unit and as rulers, sealed their tragic fates. What stood out to me is that the girls lead a very Duggar-ish lifestyle in many ways: they all dressed alike, shared a singular identity, lived in a single dorm-like room, and had no contact with other people their age. Even their cousins the Windsors thought the Romanov daughters were weird and sheltered, which is saying something. The Tsar and Tsarina loved their children very much, but it was the wrong kind of love that led them and Russia off the rails. 

I think Anna is in a somewhat similar situation. JB and Michelle no doubt love Anna, but it’s a controlling love that isn’t good for her (not that she realizes it). At the very least, Anna should have gotten her own room when she stayed at the TTH while her kids stayed in the dorms. She has no identity to them other than being Mrs Josh Duggar and can’t even sleep in a room of her own.

[Pretzel]

34 minutes ago, Cleopatra7 said:

I think Anna is in a somewhat similar situation. JB and Michelle no doubt love Anna, but it’s a controlling love that isn’t good for her (not that she realizes it). At the very least, Anna should have gotten her own room when she stayed at the TTH while her kids stayed in the dorms. She has no identity to them other than being Mrs Josh Duggar and can’t even sleep in a room of her own.

I think we're projecting way too much into Anna staying with the girls in their room. Maybe at the time the guest room was occupied by someone or something else. My guess is, however, that she stayed there so the other girls could help her with the little kids during the day but especially at night. Meredith was a teeny tiny infant. Anna was devastated and a mess. IIRC she mentioned being barely able to decide what to do next so she could only focus on 15 minutes at a time. That sounded Teri Maxwell level depressed. Maybe she was glad about not having to be alone. We don't know so many things or reasons and explanations of the snippets we see on TV, it's hard to draw conclusions from that. 

Edited November 21, 2019 by Pretzel
grammmmurr.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 hour ago, Cleopatra7 said:

There is a good bbc documentary you can see on YouTube called Russia’s Lost Princesses that is about Tsar Nicholas II’s four daughters and it makes the case that their parents’ terrible decisions, both in the family unit and as rulers, sealed their tragic fates. What stood out to me is that the girls lead a very Duggar-ish lifestyle in many ways: they all dressed alike, shared a singular identity, lived in a single dorm-like room, and had no contact with other people their age. Even their cousins the Windsors thought the Romanov daughters were weird and sheltered, which is saying something. The Tsar and Tsarina loved their children very much, but it was the wrong kind of love that led them and Russia off the rails. 

I think Anna is in a somewhat similar situation. JB and Michelle no doubt love Anna, but it’s a controlling love that isn’t good for her (not that she realizes it). At the very least, Anna should have gotten her own room when she stayed at the TTH while her kids stayed in the dorms. She has no identity to them other than being Mrs Josh Duggar and can’t even sleep in a room of her own.

Oh another family I'm fascinated with, I've seen this, and you are right, I never put the two families in the same space like this, but you are right. Both fathers need for control mixed with their fear of the outside world and losing their children to it.  Vastly different worlds but the same basic feelings underneath it all.

 

1 hour ago, Pretzel said:

I think we're projecting way too much into Anna staying with the girls in their room. Maybe at the time the guest room was occupied by someone or something else. My guess is, however, that she stayed there so the other girls could help her with the little kids during the day but especially at night. Anna was devastated and a mess. IIRC she mentioned being barely able to decide what to do next so she could only focus on 15 minutes at a time. That sounded Teri Maxwell level depressed. Maybe she was glad not having to be alone. We don't know so many things or reasons and explanations of the snippets we could see on TV, it's hard to draw conclusions from that. 

I think you are right, Jana Jinger and Joy were all still home when they moved back home & Joshy went to sleep away Jebus camp. Anna got some help with her small ones at night, which sadly Jana, Jinger & Joy were used to, and Anna got some "adult" company with the sisters, she wasn't isolated with the kids in a different home. We have to remember, these folks are used to sleeping dorm style so sleeping alone isn't normal to them.

Edited November 21, 2019 by allthegoodnamesrgone

[tabitha2]

Well.  The Duggars have Josh and the Windsor’s have Andrew...One is a carnival ride pony and one is a thoroughbred but the Horse is the same color. All types of parents and families can produce dysfunctional children and I am sure the disappointment, anger and sadness and self blame is pretty much the same whether you are Royal or flat out basic like the Duggars. Humans are humans. 

Edited November 21, 2019 by tabitha2

[Syriana]

3 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

I wonder if she isn't trying to emulate Michelle and asking Michelle how to be a more Godly wife, so she she can "heal Joshly of his sins". ?

 

If Anna is doing this - and within the world of Duggar it's a perfectly reasonable idea - she needs to re-read the Bible.  Change is internal, you can't fix/correct/heal the sins of someone who doesn't want to change.

Quote

Or perhaps JB & M have moved them closer to home so JB can keep Josh in line and Michelle can train Anna in being a proper wife to keep a Josh in check. I'm sure they may have thought Anna was the problem because they didn't want to believe that Josh was, but they have to know in some small part of their little minds that it is Josh and THEIR failings as parents that have cause this.  But who knows, Anna looked like she was in a cult on Tuesday's show, where as the other girls look more "normal".

They'd have had to be engaging in some serious self-deception if that's the case (not impossible!), Josh was off the rails sexually before he married Anna and they know it.  Poor parenting won't have helped Josh develop a healthy mindset, but it's also true that there are people raised by good parents who go off the rails/fail to develop an appropriate moral conscience when it comes to sex - and if you've molested children and/or cheated on your partner like Josh has then your moral compass has strayed from true north!

 

Edited November 21, 2019 by Destiny
edited out weird spacing issues

[quiversR4hunting]

12 hours ago, grandmadugger said:

RE Medicorps 

Were any of the Bates listed on the official documents? I don’t know if we would know if the feds showed up at the Batesssss anyway. They keep a lower profile and live in the boondocks. It doesn’t seem like they have pissed their local community off the way the Duggars have. So someone could have been at the Batesssss and we might not know. 

if it is Medicorps- HS could still be working the case on the Bates angle and they don't have enough evidence yet to raid/interview the Bates members involved. 

10 hours ago, neuroticcat said:

According to Jana’s Instagram, all the Duggars were at Silver Dollar City today, so I cant think they’re too shaken up, right?

I think this a cover with their social media message - we are fine, it is fake news - go on an outing to show everyone that everything is perfectly fine. 

[tabitha2]

Or to distract themselves and comfort the young kids. Get out, shake it off and get their heads straight.