Josh, Anna, M'Kids 21: This Thread Can Drink Now

[coexist]

1 hour ago, LucilleJ said:

I choose poorly my words, for me rapper choose manly, butch... names for their boys and when I heard/read Marquise, this is what I think about -> hence my "precious" comment (again if his name was Marquis no problem). I didn't know the purpose of those kind of name before the explanation from Cleopatra7.

Given that 50-cent other child is Sire, I think it fit with that explanation and there isn't really kr8iv spelling here just misspelling.

 

Then about Gary maybe if the spelling was Gari it would be weird to Japanese people (even if I'm not convinced because Japanese don't use romaji to write japanese word)?

I think it's maybe part of a cultural thing, in France I can't think of someone using Con as a nickname for Connor/Conrad... because con is a slur, but in america (anglo-saxon?) it's not a problem to give someone Dick as a nickname for Richard, even to high up men, and it's also a slur. [I have read an old romance book where they translated Connor/Con to Samuel/Sam to avoid that]

 

Gotcha! Thanks for explaining what you meant by precious.

I speak and read Japanese and yes, you're right that there's a difference between "Gary" and what would be "geri" in romaji. It doesn't fit the complaint you had about people understanding the meaning of the foreign word they intend to use as a name, so I apologize for that. I wanted to only focus on the sounds of the syllables because it is sometimes the case with unconventional black names that sounds and rhythms of the syllables together are what goes into the name, not necessarily the meanings of the names. (This isn't true for all African-Americans obviously, nor is it the case for every single AA that chooses to use an unconventional name.)

50 Cent very well may have chosen Marquise because he wanted another title name to go with Sire but had no clue Marquise is the feminine form. They also might've just liked the sound. It was a fairly common name for boys around the time my daughter was born or maybe slightly before, but the people I know who have used it also used other "-ese" ending names. For instance, I have a nephew whose middle name is Taquese. Means absolutely nothing from an etymological standpoint, but his parents liked the way it sounds. (They don't also have a Marquise, but my nephew's mother does have other family members  with that and similar names.)

Edited December 2, 2019 by coexist
Added the last line. Also gonna add a dead parrot for myself, lol!

[Alisamer]

13 minutes ago, coexist said:

50 Cent very well may have chosen Marquise because he wanted another title name to go with Sire but had no clue Marquise is the feminine form. 

Titles and royalty are definitely not the first thing that came to my mind when I heard the name "Sire". 

I'm kind of torn on the naming law issue. When does a name slip from "stupid" to "abusive"? If constant teasing of a child by a parent is abusive (and it definitely can be), then naming a kid something that invites constant teasing might be abusive as well. Or it might not. 

[neuroticcat]

It’s tough too because kids/adults can be abusive about mainstream names as well.

[FluffySnowball]

20 minutes ago, neuroticcat said:

It’s tough too because kids/adults can be abusive about mainstream names as well.

Not on a serious note, but the discussion and especially your comment, @neuroticcat, made me think of this scene from Full House (back in the good old days when the show was still funny and far away from the Fuller House disappointment it is today): 

 

[Pretzel]

Y'all are blowing these "naming laws", i.e. naming regulations, way out of proportion. People do just fine here. People have exotic names and people give and are given names of all kinds of cultures and backgrounds.

If the official that is registering the kid is concerned about the child's best interest and is therefore questioning a name choice, but said choice can be explained properly, the name will pass. I think that is what @Iamtheway meant. It doesn't mean someone from X culture can't name their kid a name from Z culture, but due to being ESL sometimes we don't know how to properly describe stuff.

Having naming regulations also doesn't mean people all need to be called Jane, Anne, or Catherine. It's not like that. When, and I say when, it comes to an official debate over a name, it's decided on a case-by-case basis rather than a catalogue that lists appropriate names. AFAIK there's no such thing. There is, however, a list of 'interesting' names that have established a precedent case.

@CarrotCake I disagree. I see why some of these names on your list would cause confusion in your language and country, but some of them are perfectly fine names in other cultures. Therefore, I see where Americans come from when they become wary of other countries' naming regulations. These regulations are not made to just willy-nilly thwart random people's naming process because they cause confusion in a specific language. They were made to justify an official intervention if a name choice causes harm and a child's well-being is at stake. It is of utmost importance to make a precise distinction here.

[Glasgowghirl]

19 hours ago, KeepingChrysanthemum said:

I've even gotten used to Spurgeon ?

Same, I would never use the name but Spurgeon is so adorable and in a way suits his name. I still prefer Elliott though. 

[AliceInFundyland]

This whole concept of name choices causing harm is kind of a crap shoot.

I do think the best a parent can do is Google it and see if anything weird oe scandalous is out there.

But even then -

My poor name: 8th grade, I went to a private school - class of 40. The other new girl had a kind of similar name

Like Jana and Johanna. She was more popular, as usual. The entire year we both went by Jana.

That sucked. The government might have gotten a better spelling imposed, but it would not have prevented that nastiness. Preteens are horrible creatures.

[Rachel333]

Naming regulations might be used sparsely in some countries, but they can be more restrictive in others. From what I understand, Iceland has fairly narrow restrictions on names. If one or both parents are Icelandic then the names have to be from a list of pre-approved Icelandic names or be approved by the government. Names must work with Icelandic grammar rules, and so they can't have letters like "c" that don't exist in Icelandic. A few years ago they rejected the name "Harriet." That decision was eventually reversed, and plenty of Icelanders disagree with the policy, including the former mayor of Reykjavik Jón Gnarr, who called it, "unfair, stupid [and] against creativity".

[FundieCentral]

@neuroticcat and others: 

Being European, I suppose I just feel a sense of solidarity with the country I live in now (and the country I come from). There is no third-party called “the government”. It’s us. It’s my neighbors, my friends, people I know, who I elected to represent me. The civil servants in our registry office are not some sort of evil overlords that take pleasure in denying parents their chosen names - they are fellow citizens, and in fact some of them are my friends’ parents and other people I would consider my peers. So when they deny a name, they don’t do so because they’re powertripping; it’s because they, as fellow citizens and members of this community, have an interest and a stake in my child’s wellbeing. We are part of the same “Solidargemeinschaft” (solidarity community), or in idiomatic speech - we’re all sitting in the same boat! If they express a serious concern about my chosen name, then maybe it is me who needs to consider their criticism. I may just find that their concern is valid. In practice, easy compromises can often be found, such as making the spelling a little easier or altering the part of he name that’s a company name. I.e Nutella wouldn’t go, but Nurella is perfectly fine! 

The naming rules are also generally very straightforward.  I don’t know anyone who has ever come into contact with them. If a name is established as a first name somewhere on this planet, it can be used unless there is an unfortunate overlap in meaning that could lead to ridicule, confusion, or would be grossly offensive. If you want to create a new name, you can, provided the name falls within the rules of orthography and again does not constitute an undue burden, invites ridicule etc... (In practice: Mahatakil - probably fine. Xvxvxvxv - would not be accepted due to being unpronounceable and causing undue hardship). 

Edited December 3, 2019 by FundieCentral

[Maggie Mae]

Dhong is a popular Asian name and sounds like dong (slang word for male genitals) in English. I've known people with the name all my life. Kids joke but most get over it. 

Adults who can't comprehend that sometimes words mean different things in different languages, though, that's just sad. 

[Iamtheway]

6 hours ago, Eponine said:

I am so baffled by this. Who decides what is "culturally appropriate" for someone? How is that determined?

I feel like both @Pretzel and @FundieCentral have already answered excelently. But what I meant by culturally appropriate was that if someone wants to name their child something that is denied, for example because it means ”shithead” in Swedish, they can appeal and show that it’s actually a family name or a reasonably common name in their culture and if they don’t care that it means ”shithead” they should be allowed to use it. I don’t think any of the names from your list would be banned for anyone here. They all sound like names and wouldn’t cause harm. 

I think you should know that both ”Kossa” (cow) and ”Pucko” (stupid) is on the list of names that have been aproved (for adults I hope). So it’s not a very strict law. It’s also pretty easy to change your name when you’re an adult. 

5 hours ago, nausicaa said:

One of the examples on the banned list that was posted was "Avicii." Like I said before, I think it's a stupid name, but if two young parents have him as their favorite DJ and want to name their kid after him, how is that any less valid than two 40 year old PhDs wanting to name their son "Johann" because of their love for classical music? A lot of those names on the list (yes, even "Sock") seemed fairly harmless and were a long way from "Shithead."

That list wasn’t from Sweden so I don’t know if Avicii or Sock would be approved here (I think both should be). 

4 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

Why would we want to waste a judge's time on deciding what names are OK for which person? 

Yeah, Sweden didn’t use to be very diverse so the naming laws used to be simple. There’s lots of new people here now though from many different cultures so it will get harder. No judge is involved though. You register the name of your child and some office worker at the tax office approves it.

[Kailash]

Barely related to the discussion at hand but last night I couldn’t sleep so I tried to pick one boy’s name and one girl’s name beginning with the letter A. It was quite difficult. I only made it to M.

[Pretzel]

9 minutes ago, Kailash said:

Barely related to the discussion at hand but last night I couldn’t sleep so I tried to pick one boy’s name and one girl’s name beginning with the letter A. It was quite difficult. I only made it to M.

Do you think that is how Josh and Anna settled on the  'M' letter theme? 

[Kailash]

10 minutes ago, Pretzel said:

Do you think that is how Josh and Anna settled on the  'M' letter theme? 

? More likely that they could both think of several names beginning with M. I could barely come up with 2 names I genuinely liked for some letters. Add in the father’s opinion and my kids would not have names at all!

[Vivi_music]

1 hour ago, Kailash said:

Barely related to the discussion at hand but last night I couldn’t sleep so I tried to pick one boy’s name and one girl’s name beginning with the letter A. It was quite difficult. I only made it to M.

I do this when I can't get to sleep. I learned the trick from my Mom. Much more fun than counting sheeps. I try to do the whole alphabet - A, B, C, D, E, F, etc. and find the most names I can for one letter. If I have not fallen asleep when doing the girls, I switch to boys and restart the whole alphabet. It's not names I necesseraly like, just names I can think off the top of my head. My mom and me call it the ''name game".

Hahaha!

[scoutsadie]

1 hour ago, Vivi_music said:

I do this when I can't get to sleep. I learned the trick from my Mom. Much more fun than counting sheeps. I try to do the whole alphabet - A, B, C, D, E, F, etc. and find the most names I can for one letter. If I have not fallen asleep when doing the girls, I switch to boys and restart the whole alphabet. It's not names I necesseraly like, just names I can think off the top of my head. My mom and me call it the ''name game".

Hahaha!

Ha, I haven't thought of or used this trick in awhile to bring on sleep, so thanks to @Kailash and you for mentioning it! 

Sometimes I also do "songs with women's names" or songs mentioning colors. I have a ridiculously large (and mostly useless) store of song lyrics in my brain for some unknown reason.

[Quiver Full of Kittens]

3 hours ago, Kailash said:

Barely related to the discussion at hand but last night I couldn’t sleep so I tried to pick one boy’s name and one girl’s name beginning with the letter A. It was quite difficult. I only made it to M.

I’m in the middle of a not sleeping streak, so I’ll try this trick tonight. Here’s hoping it’s not another fall asleep at 4am, wake up at 6am kind of night! 

[LacyMay]

I pick a "theme" and then go down the alphabet and think of as many from each letter as possible (ie characters in Shondaland, places I've been etc) 

I might try the 1 boys bame 1 girls name tonight though. 

Will try to remember to update if I make it past M ?

[mango_fandango]

When I’ve played The Sims (2, 3 and 4) I’ve done name themes for my fundie Sim families. Usually it’s been a single letter, and sometimes it’s been biblical and alphabetical names. The only difficult letter I had was F; there aren’t really any Biblical names that begin with F. The F child was a girl, and I thought Faith was a little too obvious and didn’t really fit with her siblings, so I went with Francesca. If she’d been a boy I’d have probably gone with Freddie. I would like to install a mod in future that increases the household size to 24, meaning 22 potential kids! I’m sure the parents would become too old by that point, though. The 22nd letter is V... no biblical V names, so I’d probably go with something like Victor, and then Vanessa or Valerie. Or just skip it and choose a single-letter theme. 

[AmericanRose]

Does "during Maryella's pregnancy" make anyone else go "??" It makes it sound like Maryella was pregnant.

And of course Hope came from Jesus. Predictable.

[Iamtheway]

16 minutes ago, AmericanRose said:

Does "during Maryella's pregnancy" make anyone else go "??" It makes it sound like Maryella was pregnant.

And of course Hope came from Jesus. Predictable.

Known for their good grammar they are not. 

[scoutsadie]

3 hours ago, Quiver Full of Kittens said:

I’m in the middle of a not sleeping streak, so I’ll try this trick tonight. Here’s hoping it’s not another fall asleep at 4am, wake up at 6am kind of night! 

Sad to report that tonight, the game didn't help me sleep. I did male/female names through the alphabet, then song lyrics or titles beginning with each letter, then Harry Potter-themed names or items, and then stressed for awhile about job prospects that haven't panned out...then picked up my Fire tablet again and here we are at 3:41 am.

[CarrotCake]

11 hours ago, Pretzel said:

@CarrotCake I disagree. I see why some of these names on your list would cause confusion in your language and country, but some of them are perfectly fine names in other cultures. Therefore, I see where Americans come from when they become wary of other countries' naming regulations. These regulations are not made to just willy-nilly thwart random people's naming process because they cause confusion in a specific language. They were made to justify an official intervention if a name choice causes harm and a child's well-being is at stake. It is of utmost importance to make a precise distinction here.

Personally I think the names I mentioned cause harm to a child in the future. 

I don't care about names that mean something else in another language but if they are a common swearing word in the country that the child grows up in parents should be at least notified.

[Gobbles]

2 hours ago, scoutsadie said:

Sad to report that tonight, the game didn't help me sleep. I did male/female names through the alphabet, then song lyrics or titles beginning with each letter, then Harry Potter-themed names or items, and then stressed for awhile about job prospects that haven't panned out...then picked up my Fire tablet again and here we are at 3:41 am.

I had huge problems with falling asleep. Like it took hours for me. I couldn't get my brain to stop thinking. Since I found my new technique it takes me less than 10 minutes. I listen to a audio book (nothing to exciting, something I know in and out, currently fairy tales) and the thing is that you have to turn the volume really low, so that you are barely able to hear and that you need to concentrate on it to understand. That gives my brain something to do, problem solved.

[SassyPants]

I woke up at 0300 and finally just got up at 0500. I’m retired, and the no sleeping thing really pisses me off. Finally when I can sleep in, I no longer have the ability to even sleep through the night. Oh, and the thoughts that jump from one topic to the next...and Christmas is only 3 WEEKS AWAY...and I’m hosting, and I leave for a trip on the 26th. Life is cruel. I will try the naming game tonight.