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Plathville Coming to TLC


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DalmatianCat
7 hours ago, Marmion said:

So...Ethan told his parents he wanted no contact and Olivia is stating (complaining? not quite sure) that they haven’t made any attempts to contact them? I get that there are a lot of issues with this family, but if the child says “don’t contact me” and the parents (in this instance) respect the request isn’t that what they wanted? If his parents kept trying to contact them she would probably be giving interviews stating/complaining that his parents don’t respect their boundaries. It’s hard to discern what Ethan genuinely wants and what Olivia is just telling him he wants.

 

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freethemall
On 12/18/2020 at 8:14 AM, JermajestyDuggar said:

It makes sense. They all live in southern Georgia. I imagine most of the fundies in southern Georgia have run across one another at some point. 

There are some old blog posts from both the Plath and Morton old blogs of those 3 families all hanging out - Mortons, Plaths, Roberts. And not just acquaintances - the Mortons went to Joshua's funeral, and Barry was a groomsman in Kressants wedding and usher in Bret Allan/Katie wedding.

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JermajestyDuggar
12 minutes ago, freethemall said:

Theres a thread on r/fundiesnarkuncensored i think with a link to some old blog posts from both the Plath and Morton old blogs of those 3 families all hanging out - Mortons, Plaths, Roberts. And not just acquaintances it seems - the Mortons went to Joshua's funeral, and Barry was a groomsman in Kressants wedding and usher in Bret Allan/Katie wedding.

Most fundie friends don’t shock me when they post pictures together. Like when you see Lourdes was a bridesmaid at Kristin Baird’s wedding before VF blew up and GD got big. All of these fundies need to stick together. Their power is in numbers. They support each other’s businesses. They intermarry. They provide important connections. The ones that surprise me are the fundie families that mostly stick to themselves. That is usually pretty detrimental to their future success. 

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So-Virgin-It-Hurts
3 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

They intermarry. They provide important connections.

Sounds just like the inbred houses of European royalty.

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Natalie22
9 hours ago, DalmatianCat said:

So...Ethan told his parents he wanted no contact and Olivia is stating (complaining? not quite sure) that they haven’t made any attempts to contact them? I get that there are a lot of issues with this family, but if the child says “don’t contact me” and the parents (in this instance) respect the request isn’t that what they wanted? If his parents kept trying to contact them she would probably be giving interviews stating/complaining that his parents don’t respect their boundaries. It’s hard to discern what Ethan genuinely wants and what Olivia is just telling him he wants.

 

I think it's a bit more complicated than that.  I'm sure the discussion was a bit more nuanced.  More along the lines of because you talk and treat us this way, it's better for us to not have contact.  Let us know if you're willing to hear our needs and change your behaviour.  Even though they're estranged, they could also have used Barry (who seems to have a bit of a better relationship) or use Micah or Moriah to arrange for Ethan & Olivia to still have some contact with his siblings while they work things through.  

I also think that it really highlights your shortcomings as a parent if when your child says please don't contact me if you don't ask what would need to change for your child to feel more comfortable and/or what reconciliation may look like.  It seems incredibly childish to just react to a situation like this as if there is nothing they could possibly do to signal that they're making changes, are open to reconciling, etc.  and just act confused that when they 'respect' their decision that there is absolutely nothing they could do.  

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snickerz

The Plath parents show the opposite of Unconditional Love. Their love for their kids is 100% conditional. We'll love you IF you do what we say. We'll accept you IF you live by our rules.  We'll welcome you IF you do things our way. They don't see that THEY are the reason they are losing their children. If they keep it up, they will lose more of them, too. They need to stop being so judgmental and accept their children for who they are. Celebrate with them for their successes even if they aren't what the parents would choose. Have fun with them (like when the dad & boys jumped off the swing over the lake.) Stop lecturing at them every time they see them about how they're wrong and you're so disappointed in them. Ugh.

 

I also think Olivia seems to be kind of bullying Ethan into doing things he doesn't want to do (like the tattoo). She seems to gaslight his feelings. I don't think this marriage is going to work out long term.

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DalmatianCat
1 hour ago, Natalie22 said:

I think it's a bit more complicated than that.  I'm sure the discussion was a bit more nuanced.  More along the lines of because you talk and treat us this way, it's better for us to not have contact.  Let us know if you're willing to hear our needs and change your behaviour.  Even though they're estranged, they could also have used Barry (who seems to have a bit of a better relationship) or use Micah or Moriah to arrange for Ethan & Olivia to still have some contact with his siblings while they work things through.  

I also think that it really highlights your shortcomings as a parent if when your child says please don't contact me if you don't ask what would need to change for your child to feel more comfortable and/or what reconciliation may look like.  It seems incredibly childish to just react to a situation like this as if there is nothing they could possibly do to signal that they're making changes, are open to reconciling, etc.  and just act confused that when they 'respect' their decision that there is absolutely nothing they could do.  

I’m sure it was a lot more nuanced (then again...I think Olivia only reports things that paint her in a good light). Olivia and Ethan (and any adult children) are certainly allowed to decide to cut off contact with someone if they don’t think it is healthy, BUT it should not be used as a way to force the other party to agree with you, which is the vibe I got from that article. It seemed like a manipulation tactic to get Ethan’s parents to let them have alone time with the kids and I’m honestly not surprised it’s backfired so far. From Kim and Barry’s perspective they were probably always on edge and paranoid if Ethan and Olivia were around the little kids and were relieved when they voluntarily decided to cut off contact. Barry and Kim think Ethan and Olivia are wrong and they’re right, and Ethan and Olivia think Kim and Barry are wrong and they’re right. I get what Ethan and Olivia are trying to do, but I’m not sure it’s working out the way they want. The whole family could use a lot of counseling.

 

54 minutes ago, snickerz said:

I also think Olivia seems to be kind of bullying Ethan into doing things he doesn't want to do (like the tattoo). She seems to gaslight his feelings. I don't think this marriage is going to work out long term.

I’ll be curious to see how the relationship goes when Olivia has finally taught Ethan all the “scandalous” things she knows. In a way, the relationship is similar to the one with he has with his parents she just pulls him in the opposite direction and is not content to let him be himself. Does she really love him just for him, or because she can guide him through a life transition she went through a couple years ahead of him? They kind of remind me a couple that would be on “Married at First Sight” or “The Bachelor”...I kind of get how it could work, but I kind of don’t.

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Natalie22
5 hours ago, DalmatianCat said:

I’m sure it was a lot more nuanced (then again...I think Olivia only reports things that paint her in a good light). Olivia and Ethan (and any adult children) are certainly allowed to decide to cut off contact with someone if they don’t think it is healthy, BUT it should not be used as a way to force the other party to agree with you, which is the vibe I got from that article. It seemed like a manipulation tactic to get Ethan’s parents to let them have alone time with the kids and I’m honestly not surprised it’s backfired so far. From Kim and Barry’s perspective they were probably always on edge and paranoid if Ethan and Olivia were around the little kids and were relieved when they voluntarily decided to cut off contact. Barry and Kim think Ethan and Olivia are wrong and they’re right, and Ethan and Olivia think Kim and Barry are wrong and they’re right. I get what Ethan and Olivia are trying to do, but I’m not sure it’s working out the way they want. The whole family could use a lot of counseling.

 

 

I understand that Olivia and Ethan are adults, but they're actually 21-22.  That's incredibly young for anyone, but especially for two people so sheltered and controlled as children.  They've barely had any control over their lives except for about 2 years.  Yes, I wouldn't recommend every choice and way they communicated them, but they're doing an amazing job for people with so little experience.  

If we compare them to other families FreeJinger has known for longer, they are the same age as Josie Bates and Jedidiah and Jeremiah Duggar.  Usually people have been incredibly patient and understanding of other fundy kids as they move away from their prior life.  I think Olivia and Ethan deserve that same amount of time and patience we give the other families.  

I think it's also important to remember that it is TLC making their show.  For whatever reason, TLC seems to be incredibly supportive of Christian Fundamentalists, helping to hide the Duggar scandal, picking up the Bates even with their KKK room, and somehow hiding how bad Kim has been at educating her children until some of the older kids forced them to cover it.  I wouldn't be surprised if they are skewing the editing to make Kim & Barry look more reasonable.

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QuiverFullofBooks

Recapping “Welcome to Plathville”: A Third of the Season, Part 1

Episode 7, “The Open Road”

* Micah, Moriah, Ethan, and Olivia have a picnic. Ethan doesn’t know what a charcuterie board is. They don’t get together much even though they live close. Ethan tells them about his tattoo. Olivia has uploaded old silly videos that the Plath kids made to her phone. They miss their siblings.

* Lydia talks to Kim about how she’s been interested in a guy for years. She saved a box full of notes from him. Lydia has prayed about it and decided that God has told her that this guy isn’t the one. Kim tells Lydia she had four ex-boyfriends at her wedding, and it’s fine if Lydia takes an interest in different guys.

* Gratuitous shots of scantily clad Micah.

* Lydia goes over to Moriah’s and tries on a few dresses that are midway between their dress standards. Lydia talks about Biblical modesty and wraps herself up in a blanket. Lydia’s upper arms are more tanned than I would have thought. Micah shocks her with his modeling photos. Moriah does Lydia’s makeup (with hideous fuchsia lipstick) . Lydia tells her she’s decided she’s not interested in the guy anymore, and Moriah tells her that the guy has a girlfriend. Lydia feels at peace.

* Ethan joins Olivia in LA. He’s prepared a surprise, even though she doesn’t like surprises. She’s apparently finished her business and gotten a break, and she seems happy to be with him. He rents a convertible and looks like a “stud.” He thinks pot smells like “sour ocean.” Olivia is annoyed when he announces that he will never ever try it. LA gives Ethan some culture shock.

* Ethan makes a “spread these legs” joke about separating chopsticks. He has a dirty mind. His parents never told him about sex. The first time he masturbated was accidentally while he was lying on the floor at church, under the chairs where his parents were sitting. 

* Gratuitous shots of Micah exercising shirtless. 

* Ethan and Olivia head out to the desert. They’re happy. She’s booked a retreat. They wear masks, for the first time in the episode. It’s very new age. They get a couples’ massage and he’s nervous, so he keeps talking while Olivia’s trying to relax (“Do you massage animals?”). Also, his feet stink. He’s got a serious farmer’s tan. 

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QuiverFullofBooks

Recapping “Welcome to Plathville”: A Third of the Season, Part 2

Episode 8, “My Everything”

* Micah, Moriah, Max, and their friend Saralyn go to the river. They discuss their strict upbringing. Saralyn is going to FSU and loves it, and her family is being more supportive now. Moriah wants to go too, but she’s more into music, and she also admits that she hasn’t actually graduated from high school. There are gorgeous outdoor scenes, brought to you by the sponsorship of Georgia’s tourism agency.

* Out in California, Ethan and Olivia are leaving the retreat. Olivia tries to get Ethan to eat gummy bears, but he realizes that they are pot edibles and refuses. Ethan has set up a surprise. Olivia is nervous about it. The surprise is a session with a tantric teacher. Tantra is expansion and liberation. Ethan thought this was a marriage retreat. He doesn’t do New Age stuff. Then it does turn to marriage counseling. Olivia says she wishes Ethan would enforce boundaries and she cries. They flash back to Ethan not defending Olivia from Barry”s criticism. They sit very close and say what they mean to each other. Olivia says she can’t be everything for Ethan, and the teacher gently encourages her to be more positive.

* Micah gets a call from a modeling agency in Miami and agrees to sign with them.

* Olivia photographs a couple on the beach right before they leave. Ethan has a surprise picnic for them, with champagne. Olivia feels like they’ve worked through a lot on the trip. Ethan gives her a new wedding band and engagement ring and tells her that someday they will have the wedding of her dreams. She hasn’t been wearing her original rings because Kim helped pick them out (whoa). They’ve already had one vow renewal. Olivia is impressed and she admits that she underestimated Ethan.

* The whole family (minus Ethan and Olivia) visit Joshua’s grave. Micah wishes he had a brother who was his buddy, like Ethan and Issac. Moriah thinks about Joshua all the time. Barry asks about their memories of the day, and Lydia’s memories are honestly so awful that I don’t want to tell you. Kim wanted to die. Barry told himself that he would never accuse Kim because she was already devastated. They put rubber ducks (and flowers) on the grave because Joshua liked them. If God can get them through this, they can get through anything.

Although this was clearly filmed during the pandemic, there wasn’t a single mask in this episode.

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DalmatianCat
19 hours ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

 

* Out in California, Ethan and Olivia are leaving the retreat. Olivia tries to get Ethan to eat gummy bears, but he realizes that they are pot edibles and refuses. Ethan has set up a surprise. Olivia is nervous about it. The surprise is a session with a tantric teacher. Tantra is expansion and liberation. Ethan thought this was a marriage retreat. He doesn’t do New Age stuff. Then it does turn to marriage counseling. Olivia says she wishes Ethan would enforce boundaries and she cries. They flash back to Ethan not defending Olivia from Barry”s criticism. They sit very close and say what they mean to each other.

This what makes me feel uneasy about Olivia...on one hand she wants Ethan to enforce boundaries, but on the other hand, she is clearly not respecting his boundary/desire/whatever when it comes to trying pot. The concept of boundaries is obviously tricky and new to him and his wife is asking him to do something that she ‘s not reciprocating. I feel sorry for the guy.

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QuiverFullofBooks

Recapping “Welcome to Plathville”: A Third of the Season, Part 3

Episode 9, “I Came to Say Goodbye”

In the B plots, Micah signs with the modeling agency and Moriah records a song.

Even more than most episodes, this seems to be real conflict acted out for the cameras. Olivia tells us that Ethan’s been thinking about boundaries since the California trip. He finds some old birthday cards from his siblings and suddenly gets really mad at his parents, and drives over to their house to chew them out. Olivia opts to stay in the car, parked out of sight.

Ethan has Kim and Barry walk out into the yard so that he can tell them that he’s saying goodbye forever because they’re going to move at some point. (Mmkay...) He regrets not standing up for Olivia more. He remembers Barry saying, “Have a nice life living in bondage,” which Barry says (in a later TH) referred to unforgiveness, not to his life with Olivia. Kim and Barry say they will always love him. Then he also wants to say goodbye to the siblings, along with Olivia, at the car, not in the house or yard. Kim and Barry are offended and not okay with leaving the kids alone with someone who hates them so much. The kids come out of the house. Kim and Barry want to come along to the car, but Ethan insists that he doesn’t want Olivia to see them. The kids try to get them to compromise and are ignored. Kim says “This is my property!” and Barry heads for the car. Ethan grabs Barry and Issac breaks up the potential fight. Ethan hugs the kids and leaves. The other Plaths hug and sob. Giving Barry the benefit of the doubt, he has resting dopey grin face. Kim is baffled and hurt. It will take a miracle. Ethan is glad he said something at last; Olivia says nothing and looks sad.

Ethan keeps an old car he’s fixing up at Micah and Moriah’s. He goes over there to tell them about the confrontation with their parents. They’re supportive, and make a pinky promise that they will stay in touch.

Micah and Moriah visit their family and have a civil, supportive conversation, in a deliberate contrast with the Ethan/Olivia situation. Kim says she would go to a bar to hear Moriah sing. The little kids can have coffee once a week, earning Kim some teasing about how she didn’t allow that for the older ones. They also give the kids hugs “from Ethan and Olivia.”  This makes Kim and Barry sad and regretful.

In the final scene, Kim has the family (not including Micah and Moriah) dress up for dinner on their back patio, and she shoves a cream pie in Isaac’s face. Almost certainly having been tipped off, he immediately jumps up and and starts throwing pie. On rewatching, this is very fake - the producers are putting new pies on a table between shots. No one yells, “My good dress!” It’s mostly the girls squealing while Issac throws pie and Barry hilariously keeps eating his dinner. Everyone throws some pie, except Barry, who to his credit, only shoves a pie in his own face. Kim is happy to have pulled off a prank and have everyone laughing again.

All of Moriah’s THs were filmed at the same time, so she’s wearing the same stripper outfit in each episode, with a neon green one-shouldered spandex top. And again, no masks at all, though Kim makes a joke about Micah modeling them.

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Pecansforeveryone

I have only watched little bits and blurbs of the show. So I have no children and will probably never have them. ...But I am feeling a little sympathy for Kim not wanting to leave Olivia alone with the little kids. If you think someone will disregard your rules while you are away, I for one wouldn't leave them alone with my child. If there more to this, than what I am interpreting? 

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DalmatianCat
29 minutes ago, Pecansforeveryone said:

I have only watched little bits and blurbs of the show. So I have no children and will probably never have them. ...But I am feeling a little sympathy for Kim not wanting to leave Olivia alone with the little kids. If you think someone will disregard your rules while you are away, I for one wouldn't leave them alone with my child. If there more to this, than what I am interpreting? 

Most parents I know wouldn’t leave their kids alone with someone who would disregard their rules. Whether the rules are reasonable is a different argument and that’s what people tend to get hung up on in the Olivia vs. Kim debate.

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Soulhuntress

A thought on Olivia/Ethan.  The family vibe is almost like something out of Unorthodox or a similar setting.  With modern clothing.   

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Markie

I watched this season. I hope things go well for the Plath kids. 

Ethan and Olivia: hopefully will continue counselling and working on their communication. As was said upthread, Olivia needs to respect Ethan’s choices and not force hers on him (marijuana gummy bears), just as she expects him to respect hers. I’m pulling for them. 

Micah: Hope his modelling career does well and maybe he can take some acting classes. He is finding himself so hope he remains single while he does that. 

Moriah: Love her new hair style and make up on her recent Instagram. Would love to see her go to college and earn some technical skills in the music industry if that’s where her heart lies. 

Lydia: I can see her going on missions and marrying a guy she meets on one. Hope she continues having  relationship with her estranged family. I would like to see Lydia become less fundie but not sure that will happen. Please not a Rod pairing!

Isaac: I can see him wanting to leave. I hope he studies hard on his own (because his mom doesn’t appear to teach) and gets a part time job to help save up for college. Looks like he is into flight. 

The 3 Little Girls: They must hate being referred to as a pod, but I don’t know much about them. Their teen years will be quite different than their elder siblings. I’d like to see Kim join up with a Homeschool Co-op. She seems well spoken and might enjoy focusing on Language Arts and the Social Sciences, whereas maybe another parent in a Co-op would be better able to teach Math and Science. 

Barry and Kim: They need a lot of frank  self reflection and a willingness to change and adapt. Can’t see it happening, but strangers things have happened...

Hosanna and hubby: Anyone know when they had the baby, the sex, the name? Just curious. 

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JermajestyDuggar

We know nothing about Hosanna’s baby. I’m surprised Jill hasn’t spilled the beans yet. I can almost guarantee Nurie visited her and the new baby when they were in Ohio. Hosanna doesn’t live that far from the Rods.

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quiversR4hunting
2 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

We know nothing about Hosanna’s baby. I’m surprised Jill hasn’t spilled the beans yet. I can almost guarantee Nurie visited her and the new baby when they were in Ohio. Hosanna doesn’t live that far from the Rods.

Considering she is part of a TLC family and her and her husband have a music (?) "Ministry", it is surprising how much we don't hear about them. At the same time, I'm glad they aren't starting a blog/vlog "ministry" about marriage or courting or music or all three. I am glad they are keeping to themselves. 

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Markie

I see on Hosanna and Timothy N’s website, they have some Florida concerts on February 18 & 21. Perhaps they will stop by the Keller’s or Nuratan can attend one of the performances. Wonder who will babysit? The baby should be about 4 months then give or take a month. 

 

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freethemall
On 1/15/2021 at 8:49 PM, DalmatianCat said:

Most parents I know wouldn’t leave their kids alone with someone who would disregard their rules. Whether the rules are reasonable is a different argument and that’s what people tend to get hung up on in the Olivia vs. Kim debate.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who has been thinking this. The drama with Kim and Olivia comes down to each setting and breaking each other's boundaries, and I think Ethan and Olivia have failed to see that Kim and Barry are entitled to having boundaries with the young kids still under their roof, whether or not they disagree with the parenting style (and abuse is a separate issue, but for instance limited sugar is something non-fundie parents do and is something you can disagree with but not laughingly break when they're not around). I'm sure Kim has a deep distrust after what happened with Micah and Moriah which explains not wanting Isaac to go over there by himself, which Ethan has claimed is the main point of contention with the parents. I think there's compromise somewhere in there and it's in realizing the respect has to go both ways.

I also say that as a parent, even with them being fundie in a situation like this I can imagine there's a lot of legitimate heartache for Kim and Barry. 

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Don'tlikekoolaid

I thought it was wrong for Ethan and Olivia to buy all that junk food for the little kids.  I can see them sneaking in a treat or two but what they fed those kids was way over the top.  As a parent I would be very unhappy and it would make me wonder what’s next.

I don’t like defending those parents, they’re horrible, but they are the parents of those kids.

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Four is Enough

Is it Ethan (the oldest boy) who smiles all the time and seems as dumb as a rock? How did he ever get married?

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SweetLaurel
On 1/15/2021 at 7:15 PM, Pecansforeveryone said:

I have only watched little bits and blurbs of the show. So I have no children and will probably never have them. ...But I am feeling a little sympathy for Kim not wanting to leave Olivia alone with the little kids. If you think someone will disregard your rules while you are away, I for one wouldn't leave them alone with my child. If there more to this, than what I am interpreting? 

Most parents leave their kids alone with people who disregard their rules.  They are called grandparents.  Grandparents are going to let them stay up late, give them more sugar than allowed and run wild.  The kids don't die and they know the difference between the rules at home and the rules at Grandmas.  They have for generations.   Letting the kids talk to their siblings alone for half an hour should not negate any upbringing they have had.  If a half an hour with someone who disagrees with how you live totally makes the kid reject their life and all their values...well maybe you should reevaluate your life and values.  

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QuiverFullofBooks
33 minutes ago, Four is Enough said:

Is it Ethan (the oldest boy) who smiles all the time and seems as dumb as a rock? How did he ever get married?

Yes. He’s pretty cute and she was desperate to get away from her own controlling fundie parents (and have sex, of course). He’s not as dumb as he looks, but he’s got a lot of learning to do.

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Pecansforeveryone
1 hour ago, Don'tlikekoolaid said:

I thought it was wrong for Ethan and Olivia to buy all that junk food for the little kids.  I can see them sneaking in a treat or two but what they fed those kids was way over the top.  As a parent I would be very unhappy and it would make me wonder what’s next.

I don’t like defending those parents, they’re horrible, but they are the parents of those kids.

Yes and yes. People can talk about grandparents "spoiling" grandchildren all the time but even that is not an unlimited entity. I mean if someone were raising their children vegetarian, theywould be livid if your parents snuck them a bacon cheeseburger. I do think Kim and Barry are too strict. I despise threats of hellfire and shunning. It damaged me greatly. However, if on an overnight to their grandparents my young children were say allowed to watch an R rated movie that would be the end of overnights at grandparents for a minute. 

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