Erin & Chad 6: Angling for a Vow Renewal Ceremony

[tanba]

It’s interesting to me that this was the first time they actually came right out and said: we wanted at least 10 kids. Guessing they weren’t planning on leaving it up to god after all...

[JermajestyDuggar]

9 minutes ago, tanba said:

It’s interesting to me that this was the first time they actually came right out and said: we wanted at least 10 kids. Guessing they weren’t planning on leaving it up to god after all...

I am relieved they don’t have 10. I imagine Erin would become a carbon copy of Kelly with 10+ kids.

Edited February 26, 2021 by JermajestyDuggar

[tanba]

2 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I am relieved they don’t have 10. I imagine Erin would become a carbon copy of Kelly with 10+ kids.

Yes! I just had only heard them talking about “leaving the number of children up to God”, never mentioning a specific number, so I thought it was interesting. They might argue that God does not want them to have additional children, and I do think that having 4 kids will ensure a better life for those four than a potential 19, especially as Erin apparently considers her upbringing perfect. 

[libgirl2]

9 minutes ago, tanba said:

Yes! I just had only heard them talking about “leaving the number of children up to God”, never mentioning a specific number, so I thought it was interesting. They might argue that God does not want them to have additional children, and I do think that having 4 kids will ensure a better life for those four than a potential 19, especially as Erin apparently considers her upbringing perfect. 

So then they have to think that God struck her down because he doesn't want her to have more kids and be blessed. 

[Jackie3]

1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I hate seeing a mix of bio and older adopted kids in fundie families. I think fundies will always compare their bio kids to the adopted ones and treat them differently. Just my observation. 

Older adopted kids are usually from foster care. You think it's better for them to remain in foster care, moving to a new home every year, with a trash bag for luggage? 

Fundy familiea are awful, but there are things that are worse.

[EmiSue]

3 minutes ago, Jackie3 said:

Older adopted kids are usually from foster care. You think it's better for them to remain in foster care, moving to a new home every year, with a trash bag for luggage? 

Fundy familiea are awful, but there are things that are worse.

A lot of fundies don't understand the trauma kids in foster care or orphanages have experienced and then don't know how to help those kids thrive. I'm a former foster parent currently pursuing international adoption. Parents who aren't prepared for these issues can do more harm than good for these kids. It takes a major willingness to parent differently than fundies are used to being raised and raising their bio kids and I really hope none of the families we follow get into that without some major re-education first. 

[MomJeans]

I am genuinely shocked that Erin is publicly (and personally) admitting that Covid could have caused her medical issues.  I really expected her to say "I had Covid twice, but this wasn't related."   There is so much denial about science in fundie-land, I just expected it to continue.  

I feel bad for Erin, because she wasn't raised to understand science enough to protect herself. She is an adult now, but will likely always be a victim of the beliefs she was raised to have.  As someone with infertility though, I hope she can, in time, appreciate how much more she'll have to give to the four children they have.  

[Bluebirdbluebell]

There are so many considerations here. 

First Erin had COVID twice is infuriating! They learn nothing.

Second, I think Erin and Chad assumed they would have at least ten kids since his parents had 10 and hers had 19. If things had gone according to plan, she probably have the 5th one now. Conservatively 4 more in her 30s and at least 1 in her 40s. That would be more slower than Kelly Jo and still put her at 10 kids. 

Third in terms of adoption lots of variables. In order to qualify to be foster parents, Erin and Chad would have to move. They only have 2 bedrooms and kids of different genders can't sleep in the same room. 

Fundies have isssues with adoption. Kelly seems to have a strange relationship with her adopted sisters. She also pushed her adopted daughter-in-law Whitney back towards the birth parents. 

 

[tanba]

58 minutes ago, Jackie3 said:

Older adopted kids are usually from foster care. You think it's better for them to remain in foster care, moving to a new home every year, with a trash bag for luggage? 

Fundy familiea are awful, but there are things that are worse.

I was a foster kid (in Germany, so we luckily did not have trash bags, but instead plastic bags from the supermarket). I’m always struggling with this issue: if all the options suck, which one to choose? Imagine they adopt a kid from foster care who turns out to be gay, and they send them to conversion therapy or something. Or just a girl who doesn’t conform to their standards. They probably believe in beating kids, and Christian adopters aren’t exactly known for keeping the kids with them no matter what. It might be more traumatizing to be sent back/rehomed after a failed adoption than to move foster families every couple of months/years. At the same time, the system is broken, and foster kids are often exposed to violence even in the system. I got relatively lucky I would say, and stayed with one foster family for 18 months. They were raging alcoholics, and definitely emotionally abusive, but never hit any of us, so standards in the system are indeed low.

[adidas]

1 hour ago, EmiSue said:

A lot of fundies don't understand the trauma kids in foster care or orphanages have experienced and then don't know how to help those kids thrive. I'm a former foster parent currently pursuing international adoption. Parents who aren't prepared for these issues can do more harm than good for these kids. It takes a major willingness to parent differently than fundies are used to being raised and raising their bio kids and I really hope none of the families we follow get into that without some major re-education first. 

I can’t help but think of poor little Huxley Stauffer  

[rebeccawriter01]

5 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I think they are ok with adoption since Kelly’s two sisters are adopted. I think Michael and Brandon will eventually adopt. I’m thinking they want a healthy newborn and those are hard to find. Sometimes you wait years for a healthy newborn. I’m afraid Erin would adopt older kids and expect them to conform to their fundie standards just like their bio kids. I hate seeing a mix of bio and older adopted kids in fundie families. I think fundies will always compare their bio kids to the adopted ones and treat them differently. Just my observation. 

I see people reference Beth and Becca (Kelly Jo's adopted sisters) often when trying to think about any of the Bates adopting. Kelly Jo's mother wasn't and isn't an IBLP follower. Her mother was divorcee who decided to adopt after Kelly Jo was already married and having kids. We don't really know the full story, but Beth and Becca are not IBLP followers either. The one whose wedding was shown had a child out of wedlock. Kelly Jo's relationship with her older sisters and her younger adopted sisters has always seemed very strange on the show. 

Michaela has mentioned that adoption might be an option. She has also said and alluded to the idea that Brandon was not on board with adoption. That is very likely a big stumbling block. Brandon still works for IBLP and has contact with people from the group who are his colleagues and probably friends. While I think he does love and care about Michaela, a decision like adoption could mean a harder time for him at work and even in the social circles. He might agree at one point, but I think it will take some time. 

Many times you will see fundie families adopt internationally with the mindset that they are rescuing a child from a heathen upbringing. I'm guessing that somehow makes the sins of the father less? I adopted internationally because of issues with single women adopting where I was living. But I was surprised at the number of evangelicals who were adopting through the same agency. I stood out. 

Edited February 27, 2021 by rebeccawriter01

[AussieKrissy]

Catty comment. I think living with a hormonal and heartbroken Erin at the moment would be hell! Fuck early menopause I am both sorry for her and scared for the rest of the family. I don’t think she will be able to keep sweet.  

[dawn9476]

6 hours ago, tanba said:

It’s interesting to me that this was the first time they actually came right out and said: we wanted at least 10 kids. Guessing they weren’t planning on leaving it up to god after all...

10 is how many Alyssa wanted at first to per a YT Q&A. But after she started having them, she lowered it down to six. Now she's says she may stick to the four b/c of how she gets so sick during pregnancies. 

Edited February 27, 2021 by dawn9476

[indianabones]

How many other Bates are going to come out with having had COVID multiple times now that Erin has?

Edited February 27, 2021 by indianabones

[Giraffe]

2 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

Catty comment. I think living with a hormonal and heartbroken Erin at the moment would be hell! Fuck early menopause I am both sorry for her and scared for the rest of the family. I don’t think she will be able to keep sweet.  

This is why I feel for Michael right now. I don’t picture Erin having any sensitivity towards Michael. Erin will likely think she’s going through the exact thing Michael is being completely unaware that mourning infertility after four kids is not like not being able to have any. 
 

I’m not trying to diminish Erin’s grief because I have no doubt she will mourn, but it’s not the same as what Michael’s experiencing and I hope Erin’s grief doesn’t compound Michael’s pain. 

[Melissa1977]

7 hours ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

Fundies have isssues with adoption. Kelly seems to have a strange relationship with her adopted sisters. 

I think Kelly's sisters where adopted when she was a late teen (I wrote late teen, but I may be wrong. I read another post where it says they were adopted when Kelly was already married) and they and they were adopted by her mom&new husband. I'm not sure if after divorce Kelly lived with her mom or with her dad, but I suspect she was in better terms with her religious dad, and not very well with her mom. I understand the distance between them. And well... we all know about the Bates confederate room, so maybe Kelly wasn't happy about her sisters skin colour (this is speculation!). 

4 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

Catty comment. I think living with a hormonal and heartbroken Erin at the moment would be hell! Fuck early menopause I am both sorry for her and scared for the rest of the family. I don’t think she will be able to keep sweet.  

She said she has 1/3 ovary left. Is it possible doctors left it to keep her ovulating and avoid full menopause? I agree menopause and 4 little kids is a very bad combo. 

Edited February 27, 2021 by Melissa1977
Correct information

[Bluebirdbluebell]

16 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

She said she has 1/3 ovary left. Is it possible doctors left it to keep her ovulating and avoid full menopause? I agree menopause and 4 little kids is a very bad combo. 

From the article it sounds like she hasn't been able to avoid menopause. She mentions mood swings, heat flashes and hormone issues.

I will say I have a little sympathy for her dealing with out of whack hormones. 

Quote

The reality star opened up about her “crazy” hormones, saying that she is “either crying or upset.” Paine, 33, has been “taking care” of his wife and their children — Charles, 5, Brooklyn, 4, Everly, 2, and Holland, 15 months.

The UPtv personality is also suffering from “night sweats … and mood swings, almost like when you go through menopause.”

 

[marmalade]

If she goes on HRT, does anyone know if there is a possibility that she could still conceive? I mean, before all this happened, Chad could practically breathe on Erin to knock her up. IOW, she's a fertile Myrtle.

[raayx01]

28 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

I think Kelly's sisters where adopted when she was a late teen (I wrote late teen, but I may be wrong. I read another post where it says they were adopted when Kelly was already married) and they and they were adopted by her mom&new husband. I'm not sure if after divorce Kelly lived with her mom or with her dad, but I suspect she was in better terms with her religious dad, and not very well with her mom. I understand the distance between them. And well... we all know about the Bates confederate room, so maybe Kelly wasn't happy about her sisters skin colour (this is speculation!). 

She said she has 1/3 ovary left. Is it possible doctors left it to keep her ovulating and avoid full menopause? I agree menopause and 4 little kids is a very bad combo. 

Kelly said she went and lived with her dad. Plus she's probably also not close with her sister because she's teaching her kids about purity and her sister gets married after she has a baby

[Melissa1977]

3 minutes ago, marmalade said:

If she goes on HRT, does anyone know if there is a possibility that she could still conceive? I mean, before all this happened, Chad could practically breathe on Erin to knock her up. IOW, she's a fertile Myrtle.

With all her clotting disorders and bleeding, I doubt any doctor will put her in fertility hormones. 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

18 minutes ago, marmalade said:

If she goes on HRT, does anyone know if there is a possibility that she could still conceive? I mean, before all this happened, Chad could practically breathe on Erin to knock her up. IOW, she's a fertile Myrtle.

She says in the article it would take a miracle. I have known and heard stories about people who have conceived against the odds. I actually know quite a few people who have conceived babies with only one ovary, but that ovary was intact. Erin has only 1/3 of an ovary left.

It's possible, but not probable.

[Laura2730]

Sounds like Long Covid to me:

Spoiler

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(20)30330-8/fulltext

 

[lumpentheologie]

10 hours ago, tanba said:

Imagine they adopt a kid from foster care who turns out to be gay, and they send them to conversion therapy or something. Or just a girl who doesn’t conform to their standards.

I completely agree. Recent studies have shown that about a third to a quarter of foster kids identify as LGBTQ, so I really hope none of them are adopted (or even fostered) by fundies. 

[QuiverFullofBooks]

8 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

they were adopted by her mom&new husband.

I thought Kelly’s mom was single when she adopted the girls (and probably lonely). She married her husband who just died quite recently; it was a plot line on the show. 

[DarkAnts]

I am having a hard time being sympathetic for people who ignored widely published CDC guidelines. Yes, it's sad Erin lost her fertility. But, her own actions caused her to get COVID twice. Her reckless actions caused her infertility. 

Many people who get COVID are following the guidelines. They got it from someone who was not following them. How many people in her community got sick because of her family's reckless behavior?  How many people has her family killed because they refuse to follow the CDC guidelines?