Andrea Mills 2: Watching Tom Appear to Lose His Mind

[Spanger]

Whole-heartedly agree with @ViolaSebastian it’s really gross that Tom said he would put some donations into a retirement account for himself.  WTF.  Not college savings for the kids, not a rainy day fund for unexpected emergencies- either of those would totally make sense and somehow seem way less offensive in my book.  But a retirement account for himself is basically saying “Oh, I’m worried about my own future and what will happen to me when I’m unable to work.”  It seems pretty narcissistic to me.

The people stretching their means RIGHT NOW gave him that money so he can help with the needs of his KIDS.  RIGHT NOW.  I doubt too many of them care about how Tom will fund his twilight years.  He needs to wake up and think about putting his kids before himself.

[formergothardite]

5 hours ago, under siege said:

Andrea really had it all planned out for Asher. In this video, she explains that she got the idea from a YouTuber Dad of many who has his own gardening business, how busy he is, and how she hopes this will be Asher someday.

That was awful. His Christmas gifts were things that she had decided he needed for a career she decided he had to have. The eight year old got a bunch of herbal stuff that Andrea mostly already had around the house because Andrea had decided she had to learn about herbs. The seventeen year old boy got a crock pot, recipe books and kitchen utensils because she wants to make sure he can cook when he moves out. 

Some of the kids got gifts that they wanted but some got gifts that she had decided they had to have and enjoy. It was about what she wanted, not what they wanted. Andrea was a selfish mother. 

[can'tstopwatching]

59 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

Some of the kids got gifts that they wanted but some got gifts that she had decided they had to have and enjoy. It was about what she wanted, not what they wanted. Andrea was a selfish mother

But as Tom always says, “the kids never want anything for Christmas!” whenever people ask what the kids like, before they have a chance to answer. He brags about it (as if that’s something to even brag about) even though it’s obviously not true, they may not be greedy for new toys but that doesn’t mean they don’t have their own opinion on what they’d like to get. But he doesn’t care what they want and doesn’t want to hear it from them so he can keep bragging.

[Kailash]

I really wonder if Andrea would have parented the same way if she had known she wasn’t going to be able to finish raising them. Would she have forced Tom into being an active parent or would religion have kept their household the same? I really wish she could speak from the beyond. I know in my own life I’m re-evaluating my daily interactions with my child and my spouse.

[can'tstopwatching]

7 hours ago, under siege said:

Considering the pantry is not on the same level as the kitchen it is very doable to turn it back into a bedroom (she says it originated as a spare bedroom)

There’s a video with a plan of the house at the end of it that helps show how big those rooms are. The only issue is they didn’t put a vent in the pantry room because they’re bad at planning.

[Renee]

15 hours ago, SIngingforsupper said:

I was also shocked when she said in the same video that the kids will take care of them in their old age because she and Tom provided for them and for that reason they have no retirement savings. So Mills kids get to work and be ready to care for Dad in his old age.

It was in her budgeting video. She mentioned that she and Tom had no monthly allotment in their budget for retirement savings (other than paying into social security). She said they expected the kids to support them in their old age, because she and Tom had cared for the kids.

That's flip flopped the wrong way. I expect my grown daughter to care for her children, as I cared for her.

My question for Tom: have he and Andrea been caring financially for their parents? There was no mention in the budgeting video about money tagged to go to their parents or other family members. Yet they expect their kids to support them in their old age.

[formergothardite]

2 hours ago, can'tstopwatching said:

But he doesn’t care what they want and doesn’t want to hear it from them so he can keep bragging.

Sadly it sounds like they are used to this since Andrea didn't care either. These poor kids have been raised to not even be able to get Christmas presents they want. They get the stuff their parents decide they want. 

 

[Koala]

2 hours ago, formergothardite said:

Sadly it sounds like they are used to this since Andrea didn't care either. These poor kids have been raised to not even be able to get Christmas presents they want. They get the stuff their parents decide they want. 

 

Yet Tom and Andrea kept lists of stuff they wanted to be spoiled with for Christmas.

Most parents I know would skip on getting each other gifts, in favor of getting half way decent gifts for the kids.  I HIGHLY doubt Thomas actually wanted a crock pot & homemade cookbook (mostly based on the fact that Andrea acknowledged he probably wouldn't want it).

Sorry- that's what you buy when they actually move out.  Like a housewarming gift.  It's not Christmas for a 17 year old.  

I have a 16 year old son and a 15 year old daughter.  They are getting new computers for their big Christmas gifts.  I get that Andrea and Tom couldn't afford that, and that is 100% fine, but the gift should at least be something the kids want.  If you only have $20 to spend per kid, let the $20 be on an item they will actually enjoy.  Andrea seemed bent on forcing them into potential career paths (that 100% didn't involve college) via their Christmas presents.  That sucks.  

[Saywha?]

I kind of don’t care what he does with the money. But the more I watch old videos I get sad and mad he refuses them dental care. Then I think... bunch of money... take your poor kids to an actual dentist (Andrea did not go to dental school to my knowledge... geez) 

[mollysmom]

I watched a few of Rachel's YouTube videos out of curiosity. I don't know. I definitely definitely think she has a crush on Tom & would gladly be the next Mrs. Mills but I don't think Tom would be into her. I know she REALLY strokes his ego & he certainly isn't much to look at either but I still can't see him going for her. That's all I'm going to say about that. I want to say more but it will just come out as mean so I'll stop. 

[Spanger]

10 minutes ago, mollysmom said:

I watched a few of Rachel's YouTube videos out of curiosity. I don't know. I definitely definitely think she has a crush on Tom & would gladly be the next Mrs. Mills but I don't think Tom would be into her. I know she REALLY strokes his ego & he certainly isn't much to look at either but I still can't see him going for her. That's all I'm going to say about that. I want to say more but it will just come out as mean so I'll stop. 

But... but...  I'm feeling extra snarky and I want to read what you have to say...

You can come sit by me / send me a private message instead if you want.  LOL

[Giraffe]

3 minutes ago, Spanger said:

But... but...  I'm feeling extra snarky and I want to read what you have to say...

You can come sit by me / send me a private message instead if you want.  LOL

@mollysmom, can I be on the pm, too? I was going to type out what Spanger said and saw they beat me to it ?

[mollysmom]

Ok I'll just say it as nicely as I can. I specifically remember a point when I was a teenager & I realized that I was not pretty. So I decided that day (I clearly remember this) that I'd better have a good personality because I sure didn't have the looks. That day I kind of decided on the personality I have today. (happy, bubbly, class clown) You kind of have to have one or the other (looks or personality) Rachel has neither. 

[FecundFundieFundus]

I'm totally down with forcing teens to learn necessary basic life skills, but wow is it shitty to make it their gift. And everything the kids got was "their color code." What if Thomas doesn't like blue or Judas thinks neon orange is unsuitable for household goods? 

[mollysmom]

@Spanger & @Giraffe we can all sit in the prayer closet together sipping wine & eating chocolate  

[Spanger]

I didn't think it was that mean... and for the record, I'll take personality over looks any day, whether for myself or for a partner.  What's the saying - "Beauty fades, dumb is forever" - ?

Also- the more I read about Tom, anyone who would fawn over him like he's some kind of catch, well, if they catch Tom, they deserve what they get.  I think he might be one of the least desirable fundy males I've read about on here.  I used to think this was a nice-ish family, but my opinion of him drops the more I learn.  Blech.

[FluffySnowball]

16 minutes ago, mollysmom said:

@Spanger & @Giraffe we can all sit in the prayer closet together sipping wine & eating chocolate  

Please let me join! Sounds like a great time. I’ll bring apple pie! 

[raspberrymint]

Or you could just be nice for the sake of being nice...

[formergothardite]

45 minutes ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

but wow is it shitty to make it their gift. And everything the kids got was "their color code." What if Thomas doesn't like blue or Judas thinks neon orange is unsuitable for household goods? 

I thought of that when watching the gift wrapping the younger girls only got things in their approved color. No thought seemed to go into what if they happen to like another color? 

[Saywha?]

If I had to bet money.... I bet Tom lets the color thing die out in the next six months.  One less thing to keep track of. 

[ViolaSebastian]

I've told this story before, but the lack of dental care these kids get sticks in my craw and every few years or so I trot it out again when the subject comes up. Icky bit about dental stuff under the spoiler...

Spoiler

Ahem. My ex-husband was fundie-lite. His family, like many of the families we discuss here, was extremely lack on dental care. As in, when I met him at 25, he had only been to a dentist once in his entire life. Now, this horrified me in general, but specifically, it horrified me because, specifically, he had this mysterious brown gunk that would be on his teeth. It was absolutely disgusting and his breath was disgusting. In preparation for our wedding, I gently suggested he go to the dentist to get his teeth cleaned. He did, and the dentist told him that he would lose his teeth if he didn't have an expensive and painful procedure that involved pushing his gums down and scraping under them. Five years later, he had yet to do the procedure. I had to sit him down and tell him that his mouth was disgusting and that I didn't like to kiss him because of it. Only then did he acquise and get it done. But by then it cost us thousands of dollars, which was a huge burden on us--and was, of course, really painful.

Anyway, my point is that these families ARE NOT saving money by not taking their kids for regular dental check-ups and cleanings. They're just pushing the expense down the road to when these children become adults and have to go about fixing the dental problems they have from lack of regular care and check-ups. What could have been a $100 cleaning turned into a $9,000 nightmare. 

[Palimpsest]

56 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Anyway, my point is that these families ARE NOT saving money by not taking their kids for regular dental check-ups and cleanings.

But, but, but .... eggs, butter and oatmeal cure cavities!  According to Andrea.

And (IMO) at least one of the Mills kids is going to need braces.  Not for cosmetic reasons.  His overbite is going to get worse and his teeth are obviously overcrowded.  Poor kid.

[Caroline]

5 hours ago, Koala said:

Yet Tom and Andrea kept lists of stuff they wanted to be spoiled with for Christmas.

Most parents I know would skip on getting each other gifts, in favor of getting half way decent gifts for the kids.  I HIGHLY doubt Thomas actually wanted a crock pot & homemade cookbook (mostly based on the fact that Andrea acknowledged he probably wouldn't want it).

Sorry- that's what you buy when they actually move out.  Like a housewarming gift.  It's not Christmas for a 17 year old.  

I have a 16 year old son and a 15 year old daughter.  They are getting new computers for their big Christmas gifts.  I get that Andrea and Tom couldn't afford that, and that is 100% fine, but the gift should at least be something the kids want.  If you only have $20 to spend per kid, let the $20 be on an item they will actually enjoy.  Andrea seemed bent on forcing them into potential career paths (that 100% didn't involve college) via their Christmas presents.  That sucks.  

My husband and I have invested a significant amount of money in cast iron cookware recently that will definitely outlast us.  He loves to cook, and it gets used a lot.  My young adult daughter has learned to make some really nice things with different pieces, and we have bought pieces of different colors and styles with her in mind.  I would not give her a piece for Christmas though!  She'll have all this beautiful cookware later on when she will really appreciate it.  She's in graduate school and not living on her own yet.  I don't see her settling down anytime soon, so we'll use it for now.   We give her books and specific clothing she asks for for Christmas.  Why not?  Those Mills kids have no voice in anything.

 

8 hours ago, Renee said:

It was in her budgeting video. She mentioned that she and Tom had no monthly allotment in their budget for retirement savings (other than paying into social security). She said they expected the kids to support them in their old age, because she and Tom had cared for the kids.

That's flip flopped the wrong way. I expect my grown daughter to care for her children, as I cared for her.

My question for Tom: have he and Andrea been caring financially for their parents? There was no mention in the budgeting video about money tagged to go to their parents or other family members. Yet they expect their kids to support them in their old age.

If they don't encourage their kids to get reliable jobs and good educations how well will their kids be able to take care of them?  I know they're are not guarantees, but they aren't even giving their kids a chance to venture out and imagine other ways of living and working.    Also:  It's great when adult children can and want to help their parents financially if their parents need help, but it should never be an expectation.  Just my opinion.  Things are hard enough for this generation trying to pay off student loans.  I can't imagine also burdening my child with the expectation that she was also responsible for our financial concerns. But I don't have a bunch of kids because I can't afford a bunch of kids.

 

[closetcagebaby]

2 hours ago, raspberrymint said:

Or you could just be nice for the sake of being nice...

Tom really hasn’t done anything to deserve my or anyone’s kindness or respect.  

Edited October 26, 2019 by closetcagebaby
Making my point clearer.

[raspberrymint]

9 minutes ago, closetcagebaby said:

Tom really hasn’t done anything to deserve my or anyone’s kindness or respect.  

I wasn't talking about Tom.  I was responding to the idea of being nice in order to have something to offer other people if you're not pretty.

(If I had considered myself not pretty as a teenager, I would probably have been a lot less nice.  I treat people like they treat me, which was especially true back then.  I'm nicer now just to avoid drama -  and because I don't want to hurt anyone.  Sometimes that can't be avoided.)

Edited October 26, 2019 by raspberrymint
Grammar and a story