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samurai_sarah

John Shrader 18: Hell freezing over despite climate change

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Ozlsn
4 hours ago, ViolaSebastian said:

I thought this was an interesting quote from his first Reddit comment. I mean, pretty much the whole world acknowledges Anna made a bad call (who amongst us hasn't as a freakin' 19-year-old? Most of ours weren't an inescapable marriage to a molester, though), but it seems very bitchy to describe your own sister-in-law that way.

Same. It also assumes Anna had a lot more choice than I suspect she did/does. It also makes John sound jealous of/basking in superiority to Anna's husband while dressing it up as criticism of her. I think if either Anna or Esther had had more agency and certainly more education then both might have made - and been allowed to make - very different choices in life. John's not exactly a great catch either.

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formergothardite
7 minutes ago, Ozlsn said:

Same. It also assumes Anna had a lot more choice than I suspect she did/does. It also makes John sound jealous of/basking in superiority to Anna's husband while dressing it up as criticism of her. I think if either Anna or Esther had had more agency and certainly more education then both might have made - and been allowed to make - very different choices in life. John's not exactly a great catch either.

The quote also downplays one of the real reasons the discussion of John got started. His wife Esther's insane claims about radiation. That and John being a complete jerk on FB, cramming his kids in a pop-up camper, and doing stupid things like taking pictures while driving in bad weather and hanging a fan from the ceiling in front of a child's face. 

If John wasn't so bizarre he would have been quickly forgotten. 

Edited by formergothardite

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Alice in Fundieland

Our dog is recovering from surgery to repair a torn ACL/CCL and needs to have the same surgery done on another leg, we just found out we need to have several thousand dollars of electrical work done at our house, and my husband lost his job today. The prospect of John Shrader doing an AMA or joining us here at FJ is getting me through this day. It has been a welcome distraction.

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CTRLZero
1 hour ago, formergothardite said:

His wife Esther's insane claims about radiation.

A couple of times I've plunged into the archives to start at the beginning of the Shrader saga and, I swear, every time I happen across that radiation attaching to electrolytes* business I burst out laughing.  WTF?!?

*I can't recall the exact language, so maybe it's time for another foray. 

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ViolaSebastian

Update on Reddit: the mods over on r/FundieSnark are discussing the possibility of allowing John to do an AMA, but it's not looking good. His previous comments have been removed.

Quote

I will discuss this with the mods. However, I highly doubt we'd give you a platform.

The vast majority of us find the beliefs you espouse repugnant. Furthermore, this is a snark subreddit.

We've done AMA's in the past with people who grew up in the Quiverfull Cult, and they speak of how damaging it is.

On a personal level, people like you would deny me the constitutional right to reproductive care. You would rather I risk my life by growing a zygote into a fetus, therefore risking my life and leaving my family without a mother and wife.

Again, I'll discuss it but I would not hold out for one. You are all too happy to shill your cult and abhorrent beliefs, whether we want to hear about it or not.

r/cults is that way.

His comments are still accessible through Reddit. I don't know what they're replying to, but....

Quote

Really wish you wouldn't make light of my gorgeous and amazing wife. I agree there are crazies and kooks in cults that are as you described. We're not. I highly value my wife's input, concerns, counsel and advice. Ask her, she has a FB page too, through which she can be contacted.as well.

Peace,

JS

Quote

My Facebook page is public, and I can bcc easily and readily contacted through it and Messenger. You got questions, and genuinely want answers? I'm available my friend.

Already had one person do so. They learned a lot on that phone call. You should take me up on my offer!

Peace,

JS

Quote

Can you please provide ONE screen shot of me "not-so-subtly asking for money"? Put up, or with all due respect, quit lying about me. That's just so wrong...and you're hurting innocent people here...

Peace,

JS

Quote

Ok, here goes:

*Roderick was one of the first people we met in Kafue. He asked to join our free Bible college, we paid for his wedding, refurbished an abandoned house for him, helped outfit it, etc. He went sideways when I had to correct him on something (actually a minor matter, happens with students/teachers), so he resigned the school, left the church, and it went downhill from there. He has recently apologised and is allowing his wife and children to attend services, but he mostly does not come. He's actually contacted me several times since I've been in the States. I still care deeply for him and he knows it. Don't believe me? Message him through FB and ask him! *I was willing to go anywhere in the world. Too much to go through here, but we basically heard about Zambia in 2011 or 2012. The rest is history. *I actually invited David to work together, and I coined "TeamZambia" He and his (originally also my) sending church changed their doctrinal view on repentance, something I discussed in-depth with both him and the church when we met each other, and when he recommended us going out of that church. I didn't fight him over the name/website when we parted ways. I tried to take the high road. *We had been in the camper roughly 7 months before Sophia was born. We "were on the road" to visit churches that invited us to come and share about our burden for Africa. I, after "cold calling" churches for a couple days (the SOP for "deputation"), canned that and just waited for invites. We NEVER asked ove single church for financial support. They were impressed by that, having been inundated with just such requests constantly. *I have never claimed "local people" threatened us. It was one guy, joined by his friend, and he said to me, "I will make your wife and children to suffer." He is the same one who accused me of forging papers (Not Visa issues, lol). You can believe whatever you want, but again, contact Roderick. He has first hand knowledge of these things. *The "legal issues" was a charge of forging paperwork, I was investigated, and was found innocent, obviously. You can get kicked out of Zambia for taking a picture of a bridge or Official Building, trust me, I know someone that happened to! Thanks for the questions. Why don't you take me up on my offer and contact me through our officially fb page/messenger, let's talk. You just might be surprised. The gal that did so this am was!

Peace,

JS

Quote

Wow, would love to know where you got your info, you're way off base on quite a few fronts. We actually have a Siberian church supporting us, a church in the Caribbean the same, also a church in Singapore, our supporting church in China actually flew my wife and I there back when their economy was stronger, my mother came and helped watch the kids, and we also have five Hispanic congregations that support us, not counting our churches across the US. You really need to check out your sources. Also, I challenge you to screen shot ONE time when I have "begged for money or supplies," please provide some proof to back up your words, because I NEVER mention needs or ask for ANYTHING! That's probably the most laughable slander. One of the things our supporting pastors/churches have repeatedly commented is how they appreciate the fact that I simply do not ask for money/things. Anyone here interested in actual facts is welcome to peruse our page. The latest/easiest one is my recent video and posts about my major back surgery. Find ONE time that I have mentioned or alluded to needing help financially, I challenge you. The chickens were not for us, we were attempting to help men support themselves. They drove the business into the ground. We could go on. I'm not going to argue with anyone, but I had a lovely chat this am with someone who took me up on my offer, contacted me through our FB page and Messenger, and actually got the full story. It was very refreshing, and she was the very first one to EVER do so. My offer stands. I'm not a monster, I'm a human being, and you guys are hurting a genuine family who is actually helping people in ways you don't even know, medically, education (secular schooling, not "religious"), providing free clean water, but who cares about that, right? We're helping orphans and widows, while some of you cheer for our failure. Well, like I said, I bear you no ill will, but you are badly misinformed and the few facts that are true have been grossly misconstrued. Y'all have a good evening, thanks. - JS

 

Edited by ViolaSebastian

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Gobsmacked

John is a master of spin. 

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apandaaries
32 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

"The vast majority of us find the beliefs you espouse repugnant. Furthermore, this is a snark subreddit."

His comments are still accessible through Reddit. I don't know what they're replying to, but....

John's reply: "Really wish you wouldn't make light of my gorgeous and amazing wife. I agree there are crazies and kooks in cults that are as you described. We're not. I highly value my wife's input, concerns, counsel and advice. Ask her, she has a FB page too, through which she can be contacted.as well."

Is he so daft that he read "the beliefs you espouse repugnant" as referring to Esther? I could actually see his narcissism preventing him from reading what was written. 

I think that's the key to his "spin," @Gobsmacked He refuses to really listen/read, and responds to what he wants to discuss. He must be something to see in person, since he's remarkably twisted online.

Here's hoping someone on Reddit brings up the accusations discussed by @TenYearOldJezzie I'm curious about how he'd try to weasel out of that.

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ViolaSebastian
2 minutes ago, apandaaries said:

Here's hoping someone on Reddit brings up the accusations discussed by @TenYearOldJezzie I'm curious about how he'd try to weasel out of that.

It seems as though R/FundieSnark isn't going to be giving him a platform to do an AMA. But, uh, FJ could do that. Just saying. (wink nudge wink nudge winky wink nudge).

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Tim-Tom Biblethumper

Interesting that he wants people to message him on FB, but he has so many of us blocked.  

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Waffle Time
DarkAnts
34 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

It seems as though R/FundieSnark isn't going to be giving him a platform to do an AMA. But, uh, FJ could do that. Just saying. (wink nudge wink nudge winky wink nudge).

Looks like someone asked that that message get passed on to him. I hope he comes here. 

 

I was facebook blocked for being friends with one of his ex converts. I never posted anything on his page. He literally had nothing better to do one day then to block all the people who were friends with this person. 

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Waffle Time
Palimpsest
56 minutes ago, Gobsmacked said:

John is a master of spin. 

I was actually counting the lies and not the spin.  Perhaps he doesn't know how much he lies.  It is almost Trumpian.  If I had the energy tonight I'd find a lot of direct Shrader quotes to refute a lot of that.  Perhaps tomorrow.  But total bullshit on the so-called "Bible College"  as a beginning.

I'm really quite impressed that Reddit is refusing to give him a platform on principle.

Come over here, Johnny.  Come on.   We will give you a platform! 

If you have the guts and fortitude that is.  Because with a bit of effort we can dig up exact quotes from things you have made public on Facebook.

Selah.

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Ozlsn

"My Facebook page is public, and I can be easily and readily contacted through it and Messenger"

Well for now it is, sure. Give it five minutes...

Edited by Ozlsn
Correcting John's typo because it bugged me
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Tim-Tom Biblethumper
11 minutes ago, DarkAnts said:

I was facebook blocked for being friends with one of his ex converts. I never posted anything on his page. He literally had nothing better to do one day then to block all the people who were friends with this person. 

I never posted anything to his page either.  But I was blocked years ago for liking a post that someone made calling him out on something (I don't even remember what).

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Gobsmacked

Ha! Say one 'wrong' word or call him out/disagree with and Bingo you're banned!!!! A few of us are. Readily available indeed. 

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thoughtful
Quote

we paid for his wedding

John, if you come here , define "we." You don't have any money that you actually, honestly earned, so you are saying that your sending/contributing/whatever churches, made up of people who probably all work for their money, paid for it.

Quote

We NEVER asked ove single church for financial support.

Quote

I NEVER mention needs or ask for ANYTHING! That's probably the most laughable slander

John, you are a missionary. If you declare yourself a missionary, and go to churches to talk about your mission, you are asking for money to support your mission.

Money does not just magically appear. It may all be obliquely expressed as "coveting prayers," but prayers don't get you a plane ticket or back surgery or sunflower seeds and beef jerky.

Even children know when someone is hinting about what they want.

Oh, and assuming you were answering someone who wrote whatever insulted you on Reddit, and didn't say it to you, the correct word is libel, not slander.

Remember -- libel starts with the same three letter as library (where the written stuff is), slander starts with an s, like "spoken."

 

Quote

We actually have a Siberian church supporting us, a church in the Caribbean the same, also a church in Singapore, our supporting church in China actually flew my wife and I there back when their economy was stronger, my mother came and helped watch the kids, and we also have five Hispanic congregations that support us, not counting our churches across the US.

So, you never ask for money, but all of these churches give you money. How does that happen? How do they know about you? What makes them think you are worthy of support?

Edited by thoughtful
I've decided the riffles just magically appear, like John's money, after I've posted.

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Aine
On 9/1/2019 at 12:12 AM, Curious said:

He said in that long post that @Palimpsest posted that he had it...or I guess he heavily implied that the surgeon said he had it.

I'd sue the surgeon that made me wait 7 weeks for emergency surgery, though.  I'm just a bitch that way I guess ;)

My first read of what John said about Cauda Equina was the surgeon saying he could be "at risk" of it. It's clearly an example of me putting personal experiences and knowledge into what John is saying (always a risky move) but my cousin was "at risk" of Cauda Equina Syndrome following a nasty rugby injury that became a reinjury and another reinjury and as a 19-yr-old muscular man who wanted to play professionally, he didn't want surgery but finally caved under the very very real risk he may lose a lot of function in his lower extremities if it got to the point of Cauda Equina. He is now a healthy and fit 34-yr-old and father of 3 active kiddos under 5 and I think he'd be the first to say that giving up rugby, having the surgery, and choosing his health and future at the expense of his "dream job" is the best decision he ever made.

Cauda Equina Syndrome isn't just 'sciatica' (which can be painful like hell and debilitating on its own)- it's a medical emergency because the nerve is DYING and being irreparably damaged for every minute it continues. The only plausible explanation, if any doctor mentioned Cauda Equina Syndrome to John, is being "at risk".

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Tim-Tom Biblethumper

As far as John asking for money...  When his sister died, didn't he set up a GFM and ask for donations?  Not for his sister's young daughter or family, but for himself?  Because Sarah would've wanted it to go to his ministry.  :pb_rollseyes:  

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thoughtful

At the time, it was youcaring.com (which was later acquired by GoFundMe).

Here's where it was discussed on FJ:

 

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apandaaries

Because the universe has a way of rewarding those who pay attention with a sense of humor, this article showed up on my fb feed just after John lamented his potential for cauda equine. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/health-49235474

Everything in this article suggests that time is of the absolute essence with such a potential diagnosis. The One True and Holy John with the Keys to the KJV wouldn’t have had time to head to islands staffed by doctors avoiding the FDA if CE had truly been a concern. 

Folks, what do we do to get John over here to do an AMA? I don’t have a stuffed deer head (with a significant rack) by which to light candles and pray, and fear even mentioning such things will drive JS further away from us. But please please please dear Rufus, bring us Christmas in September with a fresh fundie Friday. 🦌 

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formergothardite

John knows it will be impossible to provide lots of those screen shots because he deleted(or made private) the posts and we didn't save them all. I don't think we saved the one with him whining that he needed an ice maker. Or about how he was struggling to find chips he wanted. I wish we had saved the picture where he hung a fan from the ceiling of his van in front of a small child. 

John has lied so much I doubt he knows how to tell the truth. One of the reasons I'm pretty sure he won't show up here is because we have saved so much and if he tries we can dig through archives to find the information. Not all of it but a lot. 

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Waffle Time
Palimpsest

I took a short stroll back through the archives.  We don't have many screen shots.  We do have a lot of cut and pasted quotes directly from public Facebook posts.  We often linked back to his Facebook but most of the old posts are now unavailable or private.  So, Johnny, you could lie, and deny the things you said, but we will all know the truth.  It is on your conscience.

But we do have the "seal" from John's free "Bible College."

This was a college in name only.  John decided the Men needed a piece of paper to give them credibility for their preaching.  So, having a handy-dandy donated printer, he made a letterhead and diplomas to hand out to his Bible study group of 5 men..

And he got the chickens in August 2016 too.  I posted this gem a couple of pages later on that thread.

Quote

The Timothy House Self-Sustaining, Self-Supporting Chicken Raising Program

God has provided a beautiful large chicken house behind the Timothy House where the men are now raising chickens!

This is the first 300 chickens in the new house (Originally, the first chickens were raised in the back room of the house we were renting for the church! That's the house our family is now living in).

This is progress after less than three weeks (it will be three weeks on Friday).

We're all very excited, because now that the project is up and running, the men will soon be completely self-supporting, which is a key to our practical philosophy of ministry.

They are also gardening as well, raising vegetables for their food.

This chicken business gives them invaluable experience in learning practical "tent-making" business skills, learning how to run and manage a business, the confidence of supporting themselves instead of a dependency mindset, and even saving for the future.

This is how God is allowing us to "teach a man to fish," instead of just giving him a fish to eat.

The men are excited, and we covet your prayers for this self-sustaining project.

Our plan is to get a revolving system of 400 chickens each side (there are two rooms this size) alternating starting every three weeks, so the guys will only be selling 400 every three weeks instead of 800 every six!

What a joy to see the Lord touch hearts along the way without direct appeals for fundraising to get us to this point!

God is so good!

Bro. John and Esther Shrader
Zambia

with Arcade, Kapolo Jolisman, and Roderick

Also please be praying for Handia as he seeks God's plan and direction for his life. It looks like he might be starting Bible college classes with us as well as Bro. Eliud Phiri, bringing our first group to five!

The Bible "College" group with Arcade (the Burundian orphan), Jolis (the Burundian refuge who survived an attempted beheading), and Roderick.  

And an honorable mention of Handia (who called John out mightily and righteously a year later) and Bro. Phiri (who is either Midwife #1's husband or son.

All have left or been chucked out by John Shrader.  And the chicken enterprise perished after a few months.

And let us all remember that Roderick gave up a good job offer in Lusaka to follow John.  He was John's right hand man, chief translator, the designated new pastor of the church in Mulamba (Bro Phellion is his BIL), and chief bottlewasher and general dogsbody until December 2017.

John did indeed marry Roderick and Jacqueline.  We wondered whether the marriage was legal at the time because John is not an ordained minister.  John got some humpers to donate the money for their wedding rings, but "paying for the wedding" was a fellowship meal after church.  As for fixing up a derelict house for them -- perhaps John means letting them live in the Timothy House cum chicken coop.  

 

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Curious
8 hours ago, thoughtful said:

Remember -- libel starts with the same three letter as library (where the written stuff is), slander starts with an s, like "spoken."

ohhh thank you.  I always use the slander starts with s, like spoken, but never had a good reminder for libel.   I seem to teach this lesson a lot on FJ so that will come in handy!

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gustava

Has it been credibly verified that it is indeed "our John" on Reddit??  The language and syntax, even if he's on painkillers, don't sound like him. 

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ViolaSebastian
18 minutes ago, gustava said:

Has it been credibly verified that it is indeed "our John" on Reddit??  The language and syntax, even if he's on painkillers, don't sound like him. 

I'm on a fundie Facebook group. Someone on the group did, indeed message him and he confirmed it was legitimate. I hesitate to post the screenshots here because the group is private and the aforementioned screenshots have this individual's name and photograph associated with them, as it is on Facebook messenger. In any case, staggeringly, the reddit account was legitimately John Shrader. 

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Waffle Time
Palimpsest

While I am on a roll.  This is from one of the John quotes @ViolaSebastian brought over from Reddit.  He's answering the questions a poster there asked.  

Quote

Ok, here goes:

*Roderick was one of the first people we met in Kafue.

Roderick was a temporarily out of work 7th Day Adventist John picked up very early on (along with Handia who was just out of high school and waiting to go to university) and Bro. Phiri.

John glommed on to the recently orphaned Roderick.  There is a long (and often changing) story about Roderick's family but the original iteration was that Roderick's father had been murdered by a family member.  Roderick was offered a good job back in Lusaka but John dissuaded him from taking it.  He needed to be discipled (AKA work for John Shrader for nothing) instead.

Quote

He asked to join our free Bible college, we paid for his wedding, refurbished an abandoned house for him, helped outfit it, etc

Dealt with in my other post.  Roderick was a founding member of John's Bible Study group of 3 - 5 people.  There was no Bible College.

Quote

He went sideways when I had to correct him on something (actually a minor matter, happens with students/teachers), so he resigned the school, left the church, and it went downhill from there.

Roderick started beginning to see through John around April 2017.  John said Roderick was being "attacked by Satan."  But the real shit did not hit the fan until August - December 2017 when Roderick and friends challenged John's leadership and pastoring.  That was when John kicked Roderick out, changed the locks on the Timothy House, and tried to have him arrested for "stealing."  Stealing a cell phone that John had given him.

Quote

He has recently apologised and is allowing his wife and children to attend services, but he mostly does not come. He's actually contacted me several times since I've been in the States. I still care deeply for him and he knows it. Don't believe me? Message him through FB and ask him!

So you say, Johnny.  I'd love to hear Roderick's side of all this, but why would I ask him?  I'll also point out that I remember Roderick's name and can find him on FB, but probably few people on Reddit can follow through with that.  By the way, Roderick and Jacqueline seem to be happily married and their children are beautiful.  I hope Jacqueline leaves John's church as well.

Quote

*I was willing to go anywhere in the world. Too much to go through here, but we basically heard about Zambia in 2011 or 2012. The rest is history. *I actually invited David to work together, and I coined "TeamZambia"

IIRC, David Rea remembers this differently.  He first thought of going, he coined the term "TeamZambia," and John came along for the ride.

Quote

He and his (originally also my) sending church changed their doctrinal view on repentance, something I discussed in-depth with both him and the church when we met each other, and when he recommended us going out of that church.

This is in direct contradiction to what others have told us about the split and the letter that went out from Valley Baptist dumping Shrader.

Quote

I didn't fight him over the name/website when we parted ways. I tried to take the high road.

The high road means dissing Rea and Valley Baptist every chance John can get.  Rea took the high road.

Quote

*We had been in the camper roughly 7 months before Sophia was born. We "were on the road" to visit churches that invited us to come and share about our burden for Africa. I, after "cold calling" churches for a couple days (the SOP for "deputation"), canned that and just waited for invites. We NEVER asked ove single church for financial support.  They were impressed by that, having been inundated with just such requests constantly.

The sole reason for IFB missionary "Deputation" is for families to travel around visiting churches to raise funds to become a missionary.  And while doing so John posted frequent updates on facebook about how close he was to his goal amount.  So perhaps he never actually said the words "Please give me cash" as he took it from people and thanked God.  Semantics.

Quote

*I have never claimed "local people" threatened us. It was one guy, joined by his friend, and he said to me, "I will make your wife and children to suffer."

Exact quote here: 

 

But there was more weeping and wailing and claims of threats in subsequent posts.  All now hidden.

What was really going on, according to Handia:

And I think Handia must be the one who was "threatening" John.

Quote

He is the same one who accused me of forging papers (Not Visa issues, lol).

Those "Bible College" papers probably.  The ones that got Arcade into deep doo-doo when he overstayed his visa thinking he could claim student status at a non-existent Bible college.

Or perhaps it was the legitimacy of and the ownership of his church.  He only recently got the right rubber stamp for that.  If John is to be believed at all.

Quote

You can believe whatever you want, but again, contact Roderick. He has first hand knowledge of these things. *The "legal issues" was a charge of forging paperwork, I was investigated, and was found innocent, obviously.

White man's privilege at work there.

 

31 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

I'm on a fundie Facebook group. Someone on the group did, indeed message him and he confirmed it was legitimate. I hesitate to post the screenshots here because the group is private and the aforementioned screenshots have this individual's name and photograph associated with them, as it is on Facebook messenger. In any case, staggeringly, the reddit account was legitimately John Shrader. 

And the content, the language, and the syntax sound exactly like Shrader to me.  

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