Andrea Mills of YouTube infamy Had Cancer and Died

[SecularMusic]

1 hour ago, HeadshipRegent said:

I don’t want to judge anyone for the way they deal with death (minus showing the kids grieving because that feels like invading their private moment). We in the West have a really messed up relationship with death that borders on unhealthy a lot of the times from how we want to hide it away. It’s a part of life, and everyone should handle it as they see fit - and that includes if they wish to film it or not, maybe sharing with their subscribers makes Tom feels less alone at the time, who knows. 

In some countries, the deceased are kept in the home for years after they die and are cared for by family members. Now, I’m not saying we should all do that by any means, but maybe reconsider calling how people deal with a situation like this “attention seeking”. I sure wish I could have held onto my Grandma for a few hours after she died, and help get her ready for her wake.  

I highly recommend Caitlin doughty’s youtube videos and her two books for more perspective on this and being “death positive”, as she says. Her videos are excellent and very funny too. 

 

I work in a nursing home where everyone o care for will eventually die; no one ever recovers enough to go home. I agree with you.

americans have an uncomfortable relationship with death. I've seen residents in agony and unable to make their own decisions kept alive bc of the wishes of their children. I've also seen families abandon a resident close o death bc they are uncomfortable with the process. And then there's the awkward way society greats people who are grieving.

[Dandruff]

2 hours ago, sableduck said:

To be fair(and I loathe people who don’t seek medical treatment for serious medical issues and I can’t stand homeopathy), biliary duct cancer isn’t something they regularly screen for. Even if she had seen a mainstream doctor early on, it would probably have not been caught.  The symptoms are vague and mimic many other things.  It’s a cancer that is often caught only when it has metastasized and is in its late stages. 

I agree, and hope I was clear about that, but I think screenings would be good for the kids.  Reassuring.  They might be worried that something terrible could suddenly happen to them like it did to their mom.  Of course terrible things sometimes do happen to kids, but not that often...and medical professionals can usually help with the routine not-so-bad things and provide some perspective.

I think Tom said in one of the videos that he intends to continue homeschooling the kids.  Doubt how much of it he could do himself so I guess older kids and who know who else will be involved.

[luv2laugh]

I really hope Tom is at least open to putting the kids in a homeschool co-op if not public school. I don’t think Tom is thinking rationally nor logistically because he, understandably, hasn’t exactly been in a right frame of mind. He also hasn’t been sleeping in the last 48-72(?) hours.

Hopefully, someone will step in and tell him that he and the older boys can’t do it all.

I want the best for this family. I’ve subscribed and will be closely following them.

Edited August 20, 2019 by luv2laugh

[Caroline]

1 hour ago, moreorlessnu said:

Random thoughts...

It was clear from the "Visit" video that Andrea was going to pass away sometime today. It made me sad all day, and I couldn't stop thinking about it. It also made me think how strange (is that the right word?) it would be if someone asked me if anything was wrong. The answer, "Someone I follow on Youtube is hours away from dying.." would just seem...odd.

I'll miss her videos; her calming and friendly personality. I especially liked her trips to Walmart videos (weird, I know...). It was interesting to see her choosing items she would use for craft projects and games for her kids' parties, and then see how she used those items to create her crafts and pull together her children's birthday parties. (Hannah's first birthday music themed party is a great example of Andrea's creativity.)  

I liked the editing of her Walmart videos; she would show the deserted drive on a snowy 2 lane highway in Wyoming (they don't live near a Costco or Target; the nearest Walmart is 20-30 minutes away, I believe), pulling into a near empty Walmart parking lot on December 23rd (where else in the USA does that happen?), and how she and Tom would work together to buy all the items on her list and fit them into one cart. She did a great job putting together videos of how she made things. Examples include a video of how she sewed backpacks for her kids (she made backpacks for her girls last Christmas, and a backpack for Solomon's birthday a few months back). She has a video of how she sewed the blouses she always wore. The video is not just a how-to of sewing the blouse, but an explanation of why that blouse pattern and how she chose it based on the shape of her figure.

It struck me that I kept thinking, "now may the kids will go to a public school, maybe be tested to see if they need additional services, like speech therapy, etc." while Tom kept mentioning on his videos that he would keep the channel alive. Then it occurred to me that maybe his mind kept going to keeping the channel alive because the Youtube videos were her important to her. That might be one of the reasons why he posted the live videos of taking Andrea home and the visit with the children. I do find it odd that he started the videos once she was largely out of it, and there weren't too many videos when she was alert. Then again, maybe he needed to busy himself with "doing something" once he knew she was not going to live. I trust he acted as she would have wanted; he seems like a husband who respected her wishes.

She has videos where she cries as she recounts her bad experiences with giving birth in a hospital when she wanted a home birth. Oddly enough, in broadcasting the live video of the transport to the plane and the hospice facility, Tom is unwittingly countering those videos by showing how well she was cared for in a hospital, and a hospice facility. I hope in her final days, Andrea felt cared for by the medical community and not disrespected by it. 

Strange that, as religious as they are, there was none of the "we should be happy for her; she is meeting Jesus face to face" sentiment...I would have expected that from Tom.

I wonder if it occurs to other homeschooling parents (or other families that center everything on the home, as Tom described it; home school, home church, etc.) that Andrea's death forces so many changes for her kids' schooling whereas if they were in public school, at least their school, teacher, curriculum, etc. would be something familiar that stayed the same in the event of a parent's tragic death. 

I agree with you and especially with your last paragraph.  Everything will remind them of their mother because they were with her all the time with little individual experiences beyond their home.  School was a refuge for me in many difficult childhood situations (and nothing as awful as Andrea's death happened to me), and it was a place to have a little of my own life under my own control.   Teachers can be such caring and kind people in children's lives - I loved the safety of school and my teachers so much that I knew I would become one one day.  Teachers don't take the place of parents, but they can provide continuity and another point of view in a child's life.  I've been sad about this since I first heard she was sick and can't imagine what a new normal looks like for that family.

[sixcatatty]

5 hours ago, apandaaries said:

Are people really being whisked away from their deceased loved ones, or having them whisked away after passing in many American hospitals? That hasn’t been my experience.

  Hide contents

I’m coming up on the 20th anniversary of the loss of my father this September. I got to the hospital late from college and he had passed. But they kept his body out for me to say goodbye to, without any pressure about time. This was in CA, so maybe it’s different elsewhere.

i also know of a Muslim woman who passed a few years ago whose sister was able to wash and prepare her body before burial. Have my experiences been that unique? ETA: genuinely curious, no snark, in case that needs to be stated.

With my dad, by the time we got there an hour after he died around 8:30 a.m. on February 4, 2000, my mother and the Hospice nurse had given him a bath. I remember standing, rubbing his arm and crying.

My brother called around 2:30 a.m. on June 17, 2003 to tell me he had found my grandmother (she had a stroke) and that he, husband and I walked behind the undertakers and the stretcher, as we did with our mother and father. I must have seen her but I have no memory of it.

My brother also found my mother dead on October 9, 2003. He called my husband and told him to get home, he was about to call me. I was on the phone with my boss when my husband walked in. Again, we drove the hour; the Coroner was still there, along with what seemed half the neighborhood. He wanted to ask me some questions (she had COPD; her O2 sats got too low and she never woke up). i remember telling him I would talk to him after I said goodbye to my mother and sitting at the kitchen table telling him why she was on low-dose Prednisone.

[Jana814]

I feel so bad for their children. It will be interesting to see what the future holds for their schooling. 

[NurseNell]

1 hour ago, Jana814 said:

I feel so bad for their children. It will be interesting to see what the future holds for their schooling. 

I had a friend who died of uveal melanoma, she didn't go as quickly as Andrea but she did die only a few months after diagnosis. She homeschooled her 4 children. Her husband quickly realized he couldn't work and homeschool so he enrolled them in a local Christian school. I hope Andrea's children get enrolled in a school, it would certainly be to their advantage.

[louannems]

2 hours ago, Jana814 said:

I feel so bad for their children. It will be interesting to see what the future holds for their schooling. 

Kitty, Tom's mother, is a retired public school teacher.  At least I think she taught public schools.  Hopefully she can nudge Tom into getting the kids enrolled in the local schools so he can continue to go on his on site work jobs.

[nelliebelle1197]

23 hours ago, formergothardite said:

 

I don't think this thread needs to turn into all the terrible things about this family, but I also don't think it does any good to pretend she was a better person than she actually was. Andrea, as tragic as it is that she is dying, was not exactly a nice person. She spouted nasty things about the Sandy Hook parents. She was all into all the conspiracy theories about Obama faking mass shootings to take guns.  She was a 9/11 denier. One of her videos we discussed initially was removed from YouTube because it was so vile it violated the terms of services.  Her husband made things more private after we started discussing things but his FB page initially showed they were die-hard Trumpers who despised everyone who didn't fit into their narrow box of beliefs. 

What is happening to her is awful and no family should go through this, but she wasn't some kind, harmless person who was all live and let live. 

It does not sound like she was much more than a more palatable Zsucifer. I guess I am cold and weird. I don't find this touching or triggering, and I think the dying/death videos are just bizarre. I am very sorry so many of my FJ sisters have been affected by this but my only thought on this is about the kids - hopefully, they are not pulled more deeply into a toxic culture by their mother's death and hopefully they have the support the need to properly mourn.

[formergothardite]

38 minutes ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

It does not sound like she was much more than a more palatable Zsucifer.

She really wasn't. We found that out when we first found her. She was hardly a nice person, but much likes the Bates, was able to project an image of being harmless. 

I worry about the children. They were getting a pretty shitty education before her death and the parents kept them so isolated. What is going to happen now? Ideally the kids would be put in school and get therapy to help them deal with this trauma. Realistically the older kids will have to raise and educate their siblings all while trying to handle the grief of losing their mother on their own. 

[church_of_dog]

20 hours ago, apandaaries said:

Are people really being whisked away from their deceased loved ones, or having them whisked away after passing in many American hospitals? That hasn’t been my experience.

  Reveal hidden contents

I’m coming up on the 20th anniversary of the loss of my father this September. I got to the hospital late from college and he had passed. But they kept his body out for me to say goodbye to, without any pressure about time. This was in CA, so maybe it’s different elsewhere.

i also know of a Muslim woman who passed a few years ago whose sister was able to wash and prepare her body before burial. Have my experiences been that unique? ETA: genuinely curious, no snark, in case that needs to be stated.

About 5 years ago I rented a vacant home to the elderly parents of a friend.  A year or so after they moved in, the husband/dad died after a quick decline (I don't actually know how much was specific illness vs general age).

They called the Sheriff/Coroner to certify the death but were allowed to keep his body at the house, dress him, etc.  

My friend's husband (the deceased's son-in-law) was doing some remodel construction at my residence at the time and he took a few days off my job to build the casket right there in my back yard where his equipment was all set up.  (I donated a batt of shredded-denim insulation for the padding).  Grandkids applied the varnish and decorations, and wrote messages on the inside to grandpa.

They made personal arrangements at the cemetery for grave digging, carried the casket there in their own vehicles, etc.

This is in California only about 3.5 years ago but perhaps only possible in a super-rural place such as ours.

It was of course sad but also very satisfying -- the emphasis was on the family choosing their grief and ritual, rather than on cold-hearted bureaucracy and paperwork.

Edited August 20, 2019 by church_of_dog
has it only been 3.5 years ago? I thought longer.

[Koala]

1 hour ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

I think the dying/death videos are just bizarre. I am very sorry so many of my FJ sisters have been affected by this but my only thought on this is about the kids - hopefully, they are not pulled more deeply into a toxic culture by their mother's death and hopefully they have the support the need to properly mourn.

I am going to have to agree.  I am deeply bothered by the idea that when these children were seeing their mother for the final time, and then sitting with her after her passing, their father got out his phone to make a Youtube video.  Those babies need support, not a phone in their face.  I know you can't judge the way another person grieves, but to do that to children is wrong, to me.  The "Youtube people" simply don't matter right now, and quite frankly his mention of monetizing her channel amidst all of this struck me as off too.  
 

Their mom was presumably up and about mere days before her death.  The shock must be unlike anything they've ever experienced.  Seeing the one son run his hand across his mother's hair as she lay dying...it just broke my heart for him.  I've been there, but as a grown woman-not a child facing an uncertain future.  I can't imagine how chilling it would have been to have someone film that moment.  He needed his Dad, not a phone in his face.  Even in his post today (announcing her funeral arrangements) he just talks about the Youtube channel...not a word about the kids.  Just, "the Andrea Mills channel is not dead", and something about his plans to continue it.

I've also noticed that the kids seem to supporting each other, and the father almost comes across like he's at a loss for what to do with them.  I worry that the boys (who seem to be caring for the little ones) are about to have to fill their mom's shoes, and they are just babies themselves.  They can't be expected to raise and school 7 children.

Tom now has 9 children he has to be a mother and father to.  Her Youtube channel is the least of his worries.

This is an awful situation.

[church_of_dog]

Found two posts on fj, including a photo, I made about my friend's experience at the time.

 

 

[Lisamc7]

25 minutes ago, church_of_dog said:

Found two posts on fj, including a photo, I made about my friend's experience at the time.

 

 

Someone stole the story and made it their own?

[browngrl]

"I think screenings would be good for the kids." (I am not naming the person who said this only because this is not directed to them - it is just a general comment on screening Andrea's children.

While there are some cancers for which there is a good, science backed screen,  there really is no good screening test for a bile duct cancer . When you take an uncommon cancer and add no good screening test and  a low pre test probability of disease the result you will most often get is a false one. False positives will then need to be chased down and with every test comes an increasing risk of an adverse event (which could be severe) due to a false positive. A false negative does you no good. Additionally screening assumes that there is a period of time when the cancer is treatable . Some cancers are just so aggressive that window might be vanishingly small - I suspect Andrea had a particularly aggressive cancer. There are good screening tests (much of my job is screening tests) but whether or not to use screening should be based on science not fear. 

TL:DR A test done merely to reassure often does not end up being reassuring at all. Better for a counsellor  to deal with the children's anxiety than to do an ultrasound to reassure. 

 

[ViolaSebastian]

I may be entirely wrong, but I also have to question that she would have been tested for this particular issue, even if she would have gone in. I think most primary care providers, when presented with a grand multipara middle-aged woman complaining of fatigue and abdominal pain, wouldn't straight-away test for aggressive biliary tract cancer with (apparently) no family history of it. I admit I may be bitter because I'm going through something right now that probably could have been caught quite awhile back, but it just doesn't seem as though it necessarily would have been caught even she had routine check-ups, sadly. 

[luv2laugh]

I think that Tom was in such a bizarre state of grief and shock that he was unable to comfort the kids and decide what was in the best interest of the kids.

I hope someone will tell him that this was inappropriate. The children did seem to be the only ones comforting themselves and Tom seemed to lack rational thought.

I will be very angry if Tom forces the older sons to homeschool the rest of the kids. That’s not their job. Tom needs to put them in some form of school.

I hope someone tells Tom to make the videos of Andrea’s death private. It was triggering but most importantly, the children shouldn’t be featured publicly.

Edited August 20, 2019 by luv2laugh

[church_of_dog]

49 minutes ago, Lisamc7 said:

Someone stole the story and made it their own?

Not sure what you mean.  I posted about my friend's father's death when it happened in 2016, then told the story again today in this thread, then remembered I had told it earlier and linked to my earlier posts.  Sorry for any confusion!

Edited August 20, 2019 by church_of_dog

[Koala]

14 minutes ago, luv2laugh said:

I think that Tom was in such a bizarre state of grief and shock that he was unable to comfort the kids and decide what was in the best interest of the kids.

I could see that, honestly, I could.  But he does seem to have focus- on the Youtube channel.  It's been mentioned over, and over, and over again.  It's like he's fixated on it.

I get that it was special to her, so now it's special to him, but even when she was passing, he seemed oddly zeroed in on reassuring followers that various things were being recorded (like the kids being told their mom was dying), and that the show would go on (for lack of a better term).

I may be totally off on this one, but something's not sitting right.  On her last full day, during one of his live videos he mentioned that he was toying with the idea of monetizing her channel.   Blew my mind.  When the mother of your 9 children, and your spouse of 20+ years is suddenly dying (and in absolute agony), you don't sit back and ponder whether you should put adds on her Youtube channel. 

I know I am rambling, but this is just so troubling....

[formergothardite]

21 minutes ago, Koala said:

On her last full day, during one of his live videos he mentioned that he was toying with the idea of monetizing her channel.   

Oh wow. I couldn't watch much of those videos, and I know people react to grief differently, but a husband spending his wife's last days making videos and talking about making money out of his Youtube channel is off. 

I hope they are taken down soon. It seems almost exploitative to video her and make it public. Even if she had said, "Oh, make videos" her illness was so fast there is no way she could have truly understood what shape she would be in. There is no way she could have really consented to having her suffering put on display for the world to see. She was obviously in a great deal of pain and I find it shocking that he was making videos to put on Youtube. If Jill Rod did this she would be raked over the coals. The more I think about it the more disturbed I came that he watched his wife suffer in agony knowing these were her last moments and his focus was Youtube and making sure strangers on the internet knew he would keep on filming. 

[SilverBeach]

4 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

The more I think about it the more disturbed I came that he watched his wife suffer in agony knowing these were her last moments and his focus was Youtube and making sure strangers on the internet knew he would keep on filming. 

Yeah, this was some JRod level shit. Terrible. I have no interest in watching any of it , I'm not a death voyeur.

Edited August 20, 2019 by SilverBeach

[Palimpsest]

24 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

Oh wow. I couldn't watch much of those videos, and I know people react to grief differently, but a husband spending his wife's last days making videos and talking about making money out of his Youtube channel is off. 

I hope they are taken down soon. It seems almost exploitative to video her and make it public. Even if she had said, "Oh, make videos" her illness was so fast there is no way she could have truly understood what shape she would be in. There is no way she could have really consented to having her suffering put on display for the world to see. She was obviously in a great deal of pain and I find it shocking that he was making videos to put on Youtube. If Jill Rod did this she would be raked over the coals. The more I think about it the more disturbed I came that he watched his wife suffer in agony knowing these were her last moments and his focus was Youtube and making sure strangers on the internet knew he would keep on filming. 

Andrea aside, I comfort myself with the thought  the children are so used to being filmed in their private moments, that filming their last visit with Mom did not seem so invasive.  And that, in and of itself, is terrible.  

As it stands now.  Let us not promote Andrea to sainthood just because she had an early and tragic death.  She and her preaching were definitely of the Zsusanna variety, even if she had a "calming" tone of voice.

Let us try to give Tom his due, having been blindsided by his wife's illness and death, and perhaps not thinking straight.  

Let us focus on the children.  Because they are the people suffering most in all of this.  Yes, the children even more than Tom.  

It will be interesting to see how all this plays out.  Perhaps Tom filmed all this because he was in shock and wanted to continue Andrea's "legacy."  Perhaps he will re-think.  Apparently he has already deleted the shots of Andrea's body because he has had death threats.  And that is awful.  I'm sort of with him on the death is a part of life stuff even though I don't understand him filming.

Perhaps he did film it for money.  I hope he checked the small print on his Scamaritan (or other Christian health care sharing contract) because they might dump Andrea's costs because he put up a GoFundMe.

Perhaps a lot of the home schooling, alternative healthcare, and other weirdness was Andrea-driven and not Tom-driven.  We don't often discuss on here what happens when the Homeschooling Mom, and the glue that holds the family together dies.  We focus more on the loss of the wage earner.  But this is a huge loss, and I hope Tom does not force the older boys to try to fill her place.

Time will tell.  

The last time I remember this happening was when Colleen (Lydia of Purple) died from a brain tumor.  And the results of that were not pretty.  I hope Tom is not as big an arsehole as Dale Sabin.  Admittedly, that would be hard.

 

 

 

[Dandruff]

1 hour ago, browngrl said:

"I think screenings would be good for the kids." (I am not naming the person who said this only because this is not directed to them - it is just a general comment on screening Andrea's children.

That was probably me and I may have been unclear.  I think Andrea's kids should be screened for "normal" child development and illnesses, like most other children are.  Not for cancer.  My concern was that one of them might catch a cold and think they're dying.  A relationship with a competent doctor, along with some reassurances that they're essentially healthy and that cancer is unlikely, might do them a lot of good.  I can't imagine they're not afraid.

I have agreed, throughout, that I think it's unlikely Andrea's cancer could have been caught early enough to save her.  The same might or might not be true for her kids in the future, in the event that some form of cancer again rears its head in their family.  They should be alert to any real risk factors (e.g., family history) and any truly suggestive symptoms, and also be able to dismiss fears that are based in trauma/lack of knowledge.

4 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

Oh wow. I couldn't watch much of those videos, and I know people react to grief differently, but a husband spending his wife's last days making videos and talking about making money out of his Youtube channel is off.

I was able to watch his videos, and have some sympathy for him, but the more I think about what I saw the more disturbed I am.  I'm OK with him making videos for his children to potentially watch in the future, or to remind himself of details that he might forget later, or even to provide info to extended family and friends who may have been calling him nonstop otherwise.  I've been in a similar situation to Tom and, while I didn't video myself or even think of it, I can understand how overwhelming and surreal it might have been for him.  The live videos may have given him needed company and comfort.  I remember all the calls I was getting, and I knew far fewer people than the Mills family seems to.  It can get incredibly wearing when they just keep calling and you don't want to not answer because they're suffering too.

What's bothering me is what appears to be a lack of warmth toward his kids (but who knows), his remark in an earlier video that he wanted to spend some time outside Andrea's room because she was either out of it or in too much pain, that Andrea didn't like the name Cyrus but that's what they were naming the baby they lost, him not finding another shirt to wear after Andrea said she hated the one he was wearing (I know, ridiculous), him trying to wake Andrea up twice when she was obviously suffering in whatever state she was in, and what sounded to me like a few references to her in past tense while she was still alive.  The money talk seemed to be all over the place.  I did hear him say a couple of times that they would be all right financially, so I tend to give him a pass on it.

Time will tell what sort of father he'll turn out to be.

[Koala]

20 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Apparently he has already deleted the shots of Andrea's body because he has had death threats. 

Dear god, what a mess.  It's awful if people are threatening him- that's insane.  

I didn't realize there was ever more than the one shot of her after she passed.  It was at the very end of the Close to Home video (for anyone who wants to make sure not to see it).  Anyway, that one is still up, but maybe he had them posted elsewhere? 
 

10 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

What's bothering me is what appears to be a lack of warmth toward his kids (but who knows), his remark in an earlier video that he wanted to spend some time outside Andrea's room because she was either out of it or in too much pain, that Andrea didn't like the name Cyrus but that's what they were naming the baby they lost, him not finding another shirt to wear after Andrea said she hated the one he was wearing (I know, ridiculous), him trying to wake Andrea up twice when she was obviously suffering in whatever state she was in, and what sounded to me like a few references to her in past tense while she was still alive.  

That's what first got my attention.  The fact that he didn't want to be with her because it was too difficult for him.  All I could think was, what about her?  She's in pain and dying.  Sometimes you have to put what makes you feel good aside.  

Then there was the whole loading incident, when they were trying to transport her.  She was moaning and grimacing in pain, and he's following along with his phone, asking what she wants to say to "the Youtube people".  At that point, she only had hours left.  The final straw, though, was the "wake up, Andrea!".   She was in so very much pain.  She was moaning in her sleep.  How could you want to disturb someone in that condition?

I think I mentioned above, I lost my father back in 2016.  He was heavily sedated, but when I arrived, the sedation was removed so he could have a chance to see that I was there.  We hadn't seen each other in 25 years, and it was important to him.  Anyway, after a bit, he began to express discomfort, and I immediately asked the nurse to resedate him.  She questioned that decision, because she knew that we were down to just a couple of hours, but I insisted.  I couldn't let him hurt...not for anything.  Not even if it cost us the time we had left.  

Anyway, I think that's why it bothered me so much.  When you love someone, you'd do just about anything to keep them from hurting.

[unsafetydancer]

Gosh, I don't really have anything to say about this except that it's so sad. Poor woman, I hope her children can remember their mother fondly and that they get support from professionals to deal with this awful tragedy.