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fundiefollower

Andrea Mills of YouTube infamy Had Cancer and Died

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Happy
ven

Maybe a bit off topic here , and maybe i should make  another thread , but what happens in this sort of community when a mother passes ? I only have some experience with the extremely orthodox chassidim. When a mother passes , father gets remarried in no time with a preferably older "single". i am talking weeks here , not months. Is this also common in the christian society ? 

 

* not native english speaking , sorry for my language faults*

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meee

Yeah, I'm also wondering if he'll remarry. He'll have to, to continue the lifestyle to which he and his children have become accustomed. And aren't all the older kids boys? Would he really have his sons do "women's work" like teaching the other kids? 

We keep saying in the Maxwell threads that maybe Sarah will marry an older widower. I'm annoyed at myself that my mind even went there, this soon after Andrea's death, but it did. Are the beliefs remotely compatible?

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FecundFundieFundus

My husband and I are watching "Gentleman Jack" and I paused it to yell and say that you can't put a timeline on grief, but I'm gonna damn well start and my first decree is NOT one week to dating again. I would have threatened to come back as a ghost but that really isn't enough time to be a GHOST. He'd end up with a fresh ex-FFF body standing there and saying, "REALLY? Really? No." (Exceptions: I die after having had dementia or some other debilitating disease where I have not been able to function as a full partner for a while. Then I hope he dates before I'm actually gone so he can have some happiness and support while going through that stress. I'm morbid for having this planned out, I know)

If Tom does remarry, I hope for the children's sakes he takes a bit of time and makes sure they're comfortable with the idea. I don't think he's sensitive enough to make it clear any new wife would not be a replacement for Andrea (especially if that's largely why he's remarrying- for the household running, childcare and Tom pampering). 

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Palimpsest
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, ven said:

Maybe a bit off topic here , and maybe i should make  another thread , but what happens in this sort of community when a mother passes ? I only have some experience with the extremely orthodox chassidim. When a mother passes , father gets remarried in no time with a preferably older "single". i am talking weeks here , not months. Is this also common in the christian society ? 

 

* not native english speaking , sorry for my language faults*

Tom may well remarry eventually but I doubt it will be in a few weeks.  I expect their family  and church community will help out.  But taking on this family and the memories of Andrea will be a big challenge for any woman.  

I'm sure many of these Fundies have matchmaking going on in their communities if they are widowed, but marrying again in a few weeks wouldn't be common or thought proper.  

Unless you are the repulsive Dale Sabin.  He shipped in a submissive mail order bride licketty-split when his wife died.  He also scrapped a lot of the religion.  The children were horrified and repudiated Dad and his new young pants-wearing wife.  They were a lot older than the Mills kids.  The oldest married daughter took in the younger siblings, including the feral little boys, but the whole family fell apart.

Who else?

Daniel Brooker remarried a couple of years after Lyndsie died.  He married a widow who also had small children.  It seemed to work out well for everyone.

This is ages ago, but church elders absolutely did some matchmaking when Heather of Simple and Deliberate lost her husband suddenly.  They matched her up with a shy young bachelor quite fast and it seemed to work.  I followed her for quite a long time because I thought she wrote thoughtfully and well about grief.  https://lazydranch8.blogspot.com/search/label/Dealing with Grief

 

3 hours ago, meee said:

Yeah, I'm also wondering if he'll remarry. He'll have to, to continue the lifestyle to which he and his children have become accustomed. And aren't all the older kids boys? Would he really have his sons do "women's work" like teaching the other kids? 

Why not?  The older boys seem to do a lot of the child care, teaching, and house work already.  They are seldom seen on video when they are not helping or holding a younger sibling or doing chores.  Although the oldest son has a job working in a grocery store, so the burden will probably fall mostly on Asher.  That poor kid has what I can only call resting miserable face already.  He seems a really sweet boy.

3 hours ago, meee said:

We keep saying in the Maxwell threads that maybe Sarah will marry an older widower. I'm annoyed at myself that my mind even went there, this soon after Andrea's death, but it did. Are the beliefs remotely compatible?

Nope.  I don't know what Steve Maxwell really thinks about rabid Preterists like the Millses.  I don't think he agrees with them.   But he would never allow Sarah to marry into a family who celebrate Halloween and don't think it is Satanic!

I don't think Sarah Maxwell will marry an older widower.  I think she is too heavily imprinted on Steve and enmeshed.  I think she will stay single forever caring for her parents as they age.  And then be a worry for her nephews and nieces in her 90s.

Edited by Palimpsest

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Depressed
formergothardite
26 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Who else?

One of the Bringing Home Rebecca sisters married a man who had a bunch of kids and his wife died. But a couple years had passed between the wife dying and him remarrying. 

I won't be surprised if Tom eventually remarries but I don't think it will any time soon. I don't think he will be a Dale Sabin. 

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fundiefollower

There has been frequent mention that their "church family" will step up and help out Tom and the kids.  In reality their church consists of the Mills family and one other family that comes to the Mills home for services.  I can't recall their name but the have two sons, one currently in the military and the other still at home.  They were frequently seen videos.  But there is no other church family.  Over the years they apparently had a few other families come and go.  I don't doubt that they have a big support network from Andrea's sisters, brother, and dad, as well as from Tom's mom and all of the business contacts he has formed relationships with.  It seems is well liked in the area.  Andrea also had friendships with other moms in town who she would meet up at the library with and things like that.  But there is no church family.

I don't see Tom remarrying anytime real soon.

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Palimpsest
10 minutes ago, fundiefollower said:

There has been frequent mention that their "church family" will step up and help out Tom and the kids.  In reality their church consists of the Mills family and one other family that comes to the Mills home for services. 

This is true.  We are using church family loosely.

However, in the Church video Andrea points out that although they left their original church for doctrinal reasons, the SBC church, and school, in that town was practically run by her family.   Both Tom and Andrea used to work there.  Her uncle and aunt (and possibly other family) are still involved there.  Tom also does computer work for a lot of the pastors in town.

Andrea and Tom, her sister, and her parents left, but that church community will undoubtedly help out in a crisis. 

Spoiler

 

 

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Giraffe
3 hours ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

(Exceptions: I die after having had dementia or some other debilitating disease where I have not been able to function as a full partner for a while. Then I hope he dates before I'm actually gone so he can have some happiness and support while going through that stress. I'm morbid for having this planned out, I know)

YES!!! Even while I was at my fundyest, most judgy times, I was completely accepting of someone who did just this. She still made sure she got him the best care possible but had her long-time* bf for support AND she had the support of all three extended families! 

In the last six months l so I saw an article about a celebrity living this very life. I felt so sad for the hate the husband & gf were getting over it.

* I don’t recall the nature of her husband’s disability but he had been incapacitated for a number of years before she built another life with her bf. 

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Howl

Many many years ago, I was doing field work and our crew stayed in a house in a teeny tiny town way the heck in the Middle of Nowhere, Texas.  There was a guy whose wife had been incapacitated (metal illness? dementia?) for many years.  She lived in her own little house, he checked in on her a few times a day, but lived permanently nearby with a very long time gf.  This arrangement was explained to us so we knew what was going on,* and was accepted as a positive and functional  arrangement by the community.  I think these folks were in their 40s or 50s at the time. 

*too much time has passed for me to remember why anybody thought this had to be clarified to total strangers from faraway Austin, but that's how it was

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Happy
OyHiOh
59 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

YES!!! Even while I was at my fundyest, most judgy times, I was completely accepting of someone who did just this. She still made sure she got him the best care possible but had her long-time* bf for support AND she had the support of all three extended families! 

In the last six months l so I saw an article about a celebrity living this very life. I felt so sad for the hate the husband & gf were getting over it.

* I don’t recall the nature of her husband’s disability but he had been incapacitated for a number of years before she built another life with her bf. 

This is essentially the arrangement developing between me and the man I've mentioned here and there ("Neptune").  He's cared for/about his long partner for going on 2 decades.  At this point, she has a slow but terminal cancer, memory loss, several chronic conditions, depression, and dependence on pain killers (several of her conditions are ligitimately and truly painful and given her cancer, dependency on drugs is the least of her med team's concern).  He was a casual friend who became a crucial part of my support system when my husband passed last winter and as friendship has deepened, I've become part of his support system as well.  We both got blindsided by the romance, that's not what either of us expected!  I've found that I'm a much better single parent because of him.  He'd become isolated over the past 3 or 4 years and  so focused on caregiving that he told a mutual friend last summer he expected to be lonely and miserable the rest of his life; but is finding more reasons to get out and do stuff because of me.

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Queen Of Hearts

A lot has been said about Tom's desire to keep filming.  I've been thinking about this topic, and the more I ponder on it the more I think it may not be so bad.  The family has been used to the filming and seemed to enjoy it and Tom seems to be using the outreach as a way for him to cope.  Tom actually could provide an interesting and useful perspective as 1.) a single dad of many, 2.) a widower raising young kids.  He could monetize the content and help pay for any extra help the family may need.  

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adidas

I hadn’t heard of this family before I read this thread.

I can’t predict how I would react if I had to deal with the sudden death of my spouse. I hope people wouldn’t judge me because I’d probably be highly irrational.

I can’t imagine - in the space of less than a week - finding out that my ‘feeling unwell for a while but pregnant, so probably nothing too serious’ wife had cancer, then very quickly losing the baby and then losing her as well :( 

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ViolaSebastian

Tom did a short live that made the following points:

1. He's glad that he showed Andrea's body, because it proves this YouTube channel is for more than just fun and making a little bit of money. It's about putting their story out there for the world to be helped by.

2. Tom's childhood friend from California is due to arrive soon.

3. Tom's mother is a retired school teacher who is going to help the little kids learn to read. His sister and some of Tom's friends have volunteered to help as well. 

4. The kids are okay. "Everything seems to be coming in waves" and there's a "million people" at the house. He knows when they all go away that'll be the "end game" and he'll be "left to figure things out."

5. Tom said he's going to make changes to his business (such as staying home an extra day a week), but he's not sure.

6. They're going to have a private funeral and then a public one. Anyone is welcome at the public funeral.

7. Someone offered to make Andrea's shirts into pillows. He tears up saying this. He's having a hard time with "little things," like seeing Andrea's shampoo in the shower. He says it's a balance between wanting to get rid of everything because it reminds him of her and wanting to keep everything.

8. He's glad for the donations. He's going to be able to get some things redone (he mentions floors and adding onto the house) and make a family table. 

9. He says the house won't be nearly as feminine and says he's going to have a hard time with little girls. Eden thankfully knows a lot. (That poor, poor child. I dearly hope that she's not expected to fill her mother's shoes). He plans to watch Andrea's old videos to learn how she did things.

10. He's closer with his boys as a result of this. His stepbrother, who he hadn't spoken with in a long time, is coming out.

11. They still have the audio Bible playing, but it "sounds dry." He says that the Bible verse he wrote on the window brought him such hope.

12. The reasons things so unfair is because we're generally too attached to this world. We're here for a short time to prepare for heaven. 

 

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FecundFundieFundus
33 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

 

3. Tom's mother is a retired school teacher who is going to help the little kids learn to read. His sister and some of Tom's friends have volunteered to help as well. 

8. He's glad for the donations. He's going to be able to get some things redone (he mentions floors and adding onto the house) and make a family table. 

9. He says the house won't be nearly as feminine and says he's going to have a hard time with little girls. Eden thankfully knows a lot. (That poor, poor child. I dearly hope that she's not expected to fill her mother's shoes). He plans to watch Andrea's old videos to learn how she did things.

"Helping" is sufficient for homework, not for teaching. I hope their curriculum involves online classes or they switch to an online school this upcoming year. 

I hope he follows through. That house is too small for so many people. 

#9 scares the shit out of me. You need your wife's YouTube videos to teach you about your own household?? Tom, you're a grown man. What the fuck, dude? 

Also making the experience of shared grief gender segregated is some fundie weirdness. 

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ViolaSebastian
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

"Helping" is sufficient for homework, not for teaching. I hope their curriculum involves online classes or they switch to an online school this upcoming year. 

I hope he follows through. That house is too small for so many people. 

#9 scares the shit out of me. You need your wife's YouTube videos to teach you about your own household?? Tom, you're a grown man. What the fuck, dude? 

Also making the experience of shared grief gender segregated is some fundie weirdness. 

I went and double-checked, just to be sure of myself--and yep, "help" is the verb he used in describing this. I'm hoping that maybe former-teacher Grandma will realize it takes a little more than "help," but I guess only time will tell. 

This situation illustrates really well why strict gender separation when it comes to labor can be problematic, but I imagine that's what happened. They just both had their wheelhouses and stuck with them, and now Tom (and, it sounds like to me, Eden) are going to have to go through all that to figure it out. It is a cold comfort that she's outlined exactly what she did and how she did it on the videos, though. 

Edited by ViolaSebastian
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fundiefollower

I don't think he was gender segregating the grief, I took his comment to mean he didn't know how he'd handle the girls in terms of doing their hair, teaching them the things that Andrea used to cover like cooking, crafting, sewing, as well as hormones and all the teen girl stuff.  He's probably more confident in his ability to raise the boys (who are also older in general, just Solomon is a little kid yet out of the boys) where as all of the girls are on the younger side of the family.  I know many men cook, even Tom does some, but he may feel out of his element in the other girly things.  I only have a daughter and I raised her as a single mom for several years (currently remarried) I know I am confident in my ability to raise a girl and would be a little less confident in raising boys - just because I'd want them to have experiences I'm not familiar with - hunting, sports, male hormones.  Not that women can't raise successful me and men can certainly raise successful women.... it just isn't what Tom is used to.  Hope that makes sense.  The boys are older and probably able to give mores support to his grief at this point. They need him and he needs them.

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ViolaSebastian

Yeah, I imagine there are many men who aren't fundie who would feel out of their depth being a single father to young daughters. I don't think this is necessarily an issue created by their strict religious beliefs.

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FecundFundieFundus

I was talking about point ten, growing closer to his boys because of the situation. I haven't watched the video, I'm going off Viola's summary (needed a break from the heavy emotional videos). I'm sure he does feel awkward about having to do hair and have period talks, which is another kind of ingrained side effect of the patriarchy, just much more common. 

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Jana814

Can someone tell me the age range of the kids also are the 4 oldest kids all boys?  

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Nikedagain?

That was a real stream of consciousness video. Whew.

He seems to think that he has to figure all of this out RIGHT NOW. I wish someone would tell him that he doesn't.

So very sad. I thought they were super odd, but had genuine affection for each other and their kiddos. Shitty belief system for sure. I bet that just gets worse...

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Briefly
19 hours ago, Dandruff said:

I wonder if he'll remarry.

I would not be surprised that he does, and it might not be that long. For one thing, he has children that need care. I think that in a situation such as a fundy family, dad might not really be equipped to handle all the normal day-to-day details of childcare and also it's "women's work" after all - so he might need to find a willing woman.  Haven't we seen that before, I forget who, but I think it's been discussed on FJ before.

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Queen Of Hearts
1 hour ago, Briefly said:

I would not be surprised that he does, and it might not be that long. For one thing, he has children that need care. I think that in a situation such as a fundy family, dad might not really be equipped to handle all the normal day-to-day details of childcare and also it's "women's work" after all - so he might need to find a willing woman.  Haven't we seen that before, I forget who, but I think it's been discussed on FJ before.

You are probably thinking about Andrea Rein's husband who married Andrea pretty quickly after his wife died, leaving him with a large brood to raise.

If I were a betting person, I actually wouldn't put money on Tom remarrying anytime soon. He seems to have a lot of local support from friends and family and he and Andrea were so close I could see him having a hard time letting anyone take her place. They seemed to be truly partners and I can't picture him reducing her to a commodity that was easily replaceable, at least not in the near future. 

 

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louannems
3 hours ago, Giraffe said:

#9 from @ViolaSebastian post makes me so sad for Eden. Her childhood just ended. 

I really, really do worry about Eden.  She has always been so quiet.  In Andrea's dying and death room, Eden seemed especially pale and quiet, literally pressed against Grandma Kitty. Even while alive, out of all the kids, it seemed Andrea gave Eden the least amount of attention.  And when Eden did tell Andrea something, Andrea would so often only answer, "Oh, really".

Remember recently when a YouTube friend gifted Eden many birthday gifts?  I wonder if others have noticed how no one seems to ever notice Eden.  

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Curious
11 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

don't think Sarah Maxwell will marry an older widower.  I think she is too heavily imprinted on Steve and enmeshed.  I think she will stay single forever caring for her parents as they age.  And then be a worry for her nephews and nieces in her 90s

I agree with this.  When S and T pass I invision the family keeping the house and moving a few of the young adult unmarried nephews into the house for her to fuss after and keep an eye on or possibly all the unmarried girls will just stay there.  I don't see Steve marrying off any of the girls because he'd lose control to the son in law who might not be Keen to live in a 2 mile radius if "extended family"

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