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Seewalds 40 - Threewald is Here! Ivy Jane


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5 hours ago, SassyPants said:

I have a question for those in the US and still birthing babies. The last 3 Duggar and assoc. babies have all been born early (maybe even Gideon too...). IIRC, Jinger mentioned that she went to her MW with the concern of having a big baby based on the sizes of her sisters’  babies, and the MW ok’d an early induction. Is this a new practice? I have been out of nicu work for nearly 5 years and this practice at that time was very much frowned upon, as some of the sickest babies are those born near term 36-39 weeks, particularly in that 37-38 week range. I’m just wondering if this is a recent change in standard practice? If you go to your doctor or MW at 37 or 38 weeks because you are concerned about fetal size or your own comfort level while otherwise having a healthy pregnancy, would your HCP induce or strip membranes to initiate labor?

37-38 weeks *is* term. I believe the precarious time seems to be the "late preterm" 35-36weekers, who technically should have all the important embryologic bits in place, but may not be matured enough to support the outside world, and can be super unpredictable. I've seen 36ers in the NICU and in the regular post-partum floor. As recently as last week, in fact. The nursery team at my hospital keeps all babies for 24h, to draw the first (TX state) newborn screen + check 4-extremity vitals as a congenital heart disease screen, but likes to keep the late-preterm ones a little longer even if they're perfectly stable. I'm on an OB rotation now, and the vibe I get is none of our docs would induce a health pregnancy before 38wk, and will of course prolong delivering any high-risk pregnancy for as long as possible until they *must* deliver.

There have been studies suggesting that "term" 39-40ers do have lesser incidence of developmental delays than "early term" 37-38ers...though I myself haven't looked at the studies, and I'm sure there's not nearly enough or strong enough data to say anything definite. Ivy Jane was >38wk anyways (Felicity was induced on her due date as a precaution for size I believe, Gideon was a day ish early, and Garrett about 1 week early if I recall correctly), so absolutely nothing not-standard about any of that. 

Edited by ihaveanexamintwodays
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1 minute ago, ihaveanexamintwodays said:

37-38 weeks *is* term. I believe the precarious time seems to be the 35-36 weekers, who technically should have all the important embryologic bits in place, but may not be matured enough to support the outside world, and can be super unpredictable. I've seen 36ers in the NICU and in the regular post-partum floor. As recently as last week, in fact. The nursery team at my hospital keeps all babies for 24h, to draw the first (TX state) newborn screen + check 4-extremity vitals as a congenital heart disease screen, but likes to keep the late-preterm ones a little longer even if they're perfectly stable. 

There have been studies suggesting that "term" 39-40ers do have lesser incidence of developmental delays than "early term" 37-38ers...though I myself haven't looked at the studies, and I'm sure there's not nearly enough or strong enough data to say anything definite. Ivy Jane was >38wk anyways (Felicity was induced on her due date I believe, Gideon was a day ish early, and Garrett about 1 week early if I recall correctly), so absolutely nothing not-standard about any of that. 

But PFC/PHTN hits that 36-38 week gestation group hardest ( and also at times the more preterm). Is that no longer a concern? Like many have already mentioned, the standard here, at least when I was working in the nicu (35 years), inductions didn’t happen early for healthy moms or for non medical reasons. I thought Jinger was admitted and treated earlier than her due date.

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16 minutes ago, freethemall said:

When I hear the name Ivy I always think of one movie, which the Seewalds would consider wildly inappropriate:

79cd586c4825d5db354a2eefd3d9ac28.jpg

“Medium level sex scenes”?????

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18 minutes ago, freethemall said:

When I hear the name Ivy I always think of one movie, which the Seewalds would consider wildly inappropriate:

79cd586c4825d5db354a2eefd3d9ac28.jpg

“Medium level sex scenes.” I love it. What’s a medium level sex scene? So there’s mild, medium, and spicy?

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1 hour ago, CaptainFunderpants said:

I actually don't mind 'Wilberforce' as a first name.

I also don't hate that as a first name.  Preferable to Henry, IMO.  But I'd have gone Spurgeon over Eliot so what do I know?

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42 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

But didn’t the Duggar girls claim that they were only allowed to read limited books? IIRC the books referenced were the Bible and Waiting for Prince Charming. I wonder if any of the married women still have restrictions on literature in place? I know we have seen Jinger and Jill mention books they are currently reading. I wonder if Jana still has restrictions? Preventing children from reading age appropriate books is neglect, a form of abuse, IMO.

Here's an old list of their "favorite books" (lots of Christian biographies and US history.) You might be thinking about the bit in Growing Up Duggar about how they avoid "romance novels" that would awaken "sensual" feelings.

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56 minutes ago, Satan'sFortress said:

Actually, the Fundies do read Jane Austen.  I was dismayed to find this out---was it at a shower for Lauren?  They had a tea party and referenced Jane Austen.  I guess they like the morals in the novels?  I forget why.  Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

The high Victorian stuff has been popular with the homeschool crowd for a long time. The vision forum-y influence had lot of influence over that. However, that also tends to be a trend among the more “intellectual”  and pretentious Calvinist fundie brigade. They consider themselves rather high-brow. Not sure where they hath moored themselves with the dissolution of VF.

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I have to admit I think Wilberforce and Spurgeon are atrocious names. But at least Wilberforce is a middle name. Ivy is super sweet though, I'd consider it for my own kid only there was a very prominent (well okay, prominent in the Border Collie world...) Border Collie that I wasn't particularly fond of with that name. I like botanical names though and would easily have a Willow, Iris, ect. 

And to the person here named Chrysanthemum that's an awesome name! I'd completely use that on my own kid.  

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3 minutes ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

The high Victorian stuff has been popular with the homeschool crowd for a long time. The vision forum-y influence had lot of influence over that. However, that also tends to be a trend among the more “intellectual”  and pretentious Calvinist fundie brigade. They consider themselves rather high-brow. Not sure where they hath moored themselves with the dissolution of VF.

Austen is not Victorian. Not of the era--she died a year before Victoria became Queen--and not at all in terms of the themes, archetypes, or style in literature. 

My paternal grandfather had siblings named Henry and Ivy. So, Jessa, to help you out, here are more of his siblings's names for your future use: Lewis, Thomas, Wesley, Jennie, Ivan, Margaret.

There was not one named Spurgeon, though. Go figure. 

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Welcome to the world Ivy, pity that you are a girl. I hope you have a better life then you mum.

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14 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

Austen is not Victorian. Not of the era--she died a year before Victoria became Queen--and not at all in terms of the themes, archetypes, or style in literature. 

My paternal grandfather had siblings named Henry and Ivy. So, Jessa, to help you out, here are more of his siblings's names for your future use: Lewis, Thomas, Wesley, Jennie, Ivan, Margaret.

There was not one named Spurgeon, though. Go figure. 

I’m guessing you mean Austen died a year before Victoria was born. Austen died in 1817 and Victoria was Born in 1819. She wasn’t expected to be queen at birth since she had so many uncles older than her own father that could produce an heir. But they didn’t produce any! And she became queen.

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I hope that Ivy (or will she always be Ivy Jane like Kaci Lynn) gets to run around in mud and play with dump trucks like her older brothers, if she wants to. I hope a lot of things for her, but at least that.

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1 hour ago, SassyPants said:

But PFC/PHTN hits that 36-38 week gestation group hardest ( and also at times the more preterm). Is that no longer a concern? Like many have already mentioned, the standard here, at least when I was working in the nicu (35 years), inductions didn’t happen early for healthy moms or for non medical reasons. I thought Jinger was admitted and treated earlier than her due date.

I don't remember where you're from (sorry lol) but what does PFC stand for for you? Google isn't giving me anything haha. I'm assuming PHTN is pulmonary hypertension.... PPHN (persistent pulmonary hypertension of the newborn) is more common in term babies, yes, but it doesn't seem to me that whether mom delivers spontaneous at 38 vs induced at 38 would make that much difference. A quick search for me finds the biggest risk factors for PPHN are intrauterine asphyxia (ie cord wrapped in laymans terms), PPROM (water break prior to labor for >18h), meconium aspiration which is more common in post-term babies, neonatal RDS which is of course most notable in premies, and specifically moms who were on SSRIs during the 2nd-3rd tri. 

Most doctors I know (OBGYN or otherwise) try not to do shit that's not indicated - and oftentimes insurance won't pay for it if there's not a bill-able indication anyways. Concern for fetal size, given that there's no greatly reliable way to measure that, probably wouldn't cut it in most people's eyes. But I don't know that there's a glaring *contraindication* to inducing an otherwise-healthy pregnancy at 38 or 39 weeks. 

Edited by ihaveanexamintwodays
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My prediction: Jessa is going to dress that Girl up In very cute little  dresses, ribbons  and bows but not overly ruffled impractical outfits.  I am sure we will get pictures of her playing outside with her baby dolls(they don’t do barbie IIRC) and playing blocks/puzzles/house with her brothers but not allowed to play in mud, get filthy or roughhouse. 

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1 hour ago, ihaveanexamintwodays said:

I don't remember where you're from (sorry lol) but what does PFC stand for for you? Google isn't giving me anything haha. I'm assuming PHTN is pulmonary hypertension.... PPHN (persistent pulmonary hypertension of the newborn) is more common in term babies, yes, but it doesn't seem to me that whether mom delivers spontaneous at 38 vs induced at 38 would make that much difference. A quick search for me finds the biggest risk factors for PPHN are intrauterine asphyxia (ie cord wrapped in laymans terms), PPROM (water break prior to labor for >18h), meconium aspiration which is more common in post-term babies, neonatal RDS which is of course most notable in premies, and specifically moms who were on SSRIs during the 2nd-3rd tri. 

Most doctors I know (OBGYN or otherwise) try not to do shit that's not indicated - and oftentimes insurance won't pay for it if there's not a bill-able indication anyways. Concern for fetal size, given that there's no greatly reliable way to measure that, probably wouldn't cut it in most people's eyes. But I don't know that there's a glaring *contraindication* to inducing an otherwise-healthy pregnancy at 38 or 39 weeks. 

Persistent Fetal Circulation 

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So a girl. Here come another round of big bows. I like the name- actually considered Ivy for our first-born back in the mid-90's. I wonder why they transferred to what looks to be a hospital again? She had excessive bleeding the first time if I remember right? If that happened again I do hope they start having hospital births.

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Where is the photo where they appear to be in a hospital or birthing center?  Why do people seem to think Jessa needed more care?  I'm just not seeing it, sorry.  I also don't know why they would lie about her being born at home, they have admitted to the issues in the past.

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I wonder if the name Ivy is an allusion to the fecund, feminine vine in Psalm 128: 

Blessed is every one that feareth the Lord; that walketh in his ways.

For thou shalt eat the labour of thine hands: happy shalt thou be, and it shall be well with thee.

Thy wife shall be as a fruitful vine by the sides of thine house: thy children like olive plants round about thy table.

Behold, that thus shall the man be blessed that feareth the Lord.

The Lord shall bless thee out of Zion: and thou shalt see the good of Jerusalem all the days of thy life.

Yea, thou shalt see thy children's children, and peace upon Israel.

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24 minutes ago, justoneoftwo said:

Where is the photo where they appear to be in a hospital or birthing center?  Why do people seem to think Jessa needed more care?  I'm just not seeing it, sorry.  I also don't know why they would lie about her being born at home, they have admitted to the issues in the past.

I don’t think anyone is disputing that the baby was born at home. I saw photos on IG and somewhere else I can’t remember. The one I specifically remember was with Guin Seewald holding the baby. It was clearly an inpatient facility with medical equipment, monitors and IV hanging in the background of the photo.

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@ihaveanexamintwodays,  I heard at a meeting of the SC Breastfeeding Coalition several years ago that insurance companies in the state would no longer pay for inductions prior to 38 weeks , IIRC, unless there was medical indication for the induction.

@Dominionatrix,  wouldn't Olive be a more fitting name if they were referencing that psalm?  Ivy is a vine, but it's not fruitful.  Olives don't grow on vines though but on trees.  

I do like the name Ivy though.  I guess I'm like @Peaches-n-Beans that I like botanical names.   So apparently does my daughter.  She wanted to name their oldest daughter Willow, but their GSD was already named Willow.  They also have a dog named Iris.

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6 hours ago, viii said:

Girls are always lesser in their worlds, even down to being given a name. The boys get strong, masculine Biblical names they will grow into, and the girls receive very girly, flouncy names to ensure the world knows they are girly girls who want to be wives and mothers. 

Reminds me of the Wallers- Boys (Paul and Phillip), Girls (Davia and Destiny)

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I don’t know. Felicity is doesn’t scream girly girl who only wants to be a meek wife and mother  and Neither does Meredith. I picture older well dressed WASP ladies who lunch LoL. Mackenzie is a strong trendy name. Not traditionally girly. 

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5 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

My prediction: Jessa is going to dress that Girl up In very cute little  dresses, ribbons  and bows but not overly ruffled impractical outfits.  I am sure we will get pictures of her playing outside with her baby dolls(they don’t do barbie IIRC) and playing blocks/puzzles/house with her brothers but not allowed to play in mud, get filthy or roughhouse. 

Jessa Is so lazy it will look terrible because she won't iron any of it. 

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Aaaall the comments on instagram:

HMMM THE BABY LOOKS BLUE SUSPICIOUS THIS IS NOT A HEALTHY BABY.

 

I get the concern, but like, have people really seen what babies tend to look like when they come out?! There isn't just one Hollywood film baby way.

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4 hours ago, SassyPants said:

I don’t think anyone is disputing that the baby was born at home. I saw photos on IG and somewhere else I can’t remember. The one I specifically remember was with Guin Seewald holding the baby. It was clearly an inpatient facility with medical equipment, monitors and IV hanging in the background of the photo.

Thank you! I found it now:
https://www.instagram.com/p/ByBCZRWJiFZ/

 

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