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Fire at Paris's Notre Dame Cathedral


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3 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

What is this?

The Cathedral was supposed to have had the part of the cross on which Jesus was crucified, the nails that were used in the crucifixion, and the crown of thorns that were placed on his head.

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2 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

What is this?

The nails would be ok, says Mr Kool who knows about metals, but if the wood goes every thing falls apart.  

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Just now, tabitha2 said:

Are those Bell towers?

I think so, based on stuff the French fire service was saying. They said if the bells fell, the towers would too. 

Per Paris police chief, the structure has been saved, and they do think they managed to save the towers. 

(just heard on MSNBC)

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A cathedral that survived so many horrific wars was finally done in by construction. Imagine being the guy who is responsible...I can't imagine the guilt. I sincerely hope the reports of much of the artwork surviving are true. It's going to be gut-wrenching when the flames die down and we start to see the extent of the damage done.

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10 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

What is this?

Stored in Notre Dame are 3 relics:  fragment of the one true cross, His crown of thorns, and a nail from His crucifixion.

Were.  They were stored there.

1 minute ago, ViolaSebastian said:

A cathedral that survived so many horrific wars was finally done in by construction. Imagine being the guy who is responsible...I can't imagine the guilt. I sincerely hope the reports of much of the artwork surviving are true. It's going to be gut-wrenching when the flames die down and we start to see the extent of the damage done.

Have they determined the cause or is that still speculation?

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I agree with others who've said this:  I feel ill. Physically ill.  It is devastating to see.  Sickening. 

And then so moving to see the Parisians out singing hymns and bearing witness to the tragedy.  It is like they are not letting her go down alone, and there is something very beautiful in that.

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This article (yes, it's the Mail) has some incredible, but horrific photos. Just heartbreaking. The one of what's left of the outline of the Rose window backlit by flames--it's like a punch to the gut.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6925015/Fire-breaks-historic-Notre-Dame-cathedral-Paris.html

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@HerNameIsBuffy, MSNBC is showing pictures from the inside while it was on fire. There were fire friends in there getting stuff out. I'm certain someone got the most precious of the relics out. 

It looks like they were fighting the fire from the inside of the structure for as long as they could. 

The empty windows though. ? 

Quote

 

Rector of Notre-Dame, Patrick Jacquin, has reportedly told local media that the Crown of Thorns and the Tunic of St Louis have both been recovered.

However, fears remain for the many priceless artworks and artefacts still housed inside the cathedral.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2019/apr/15/notre-dame-cathedral-fire-paris-france-landmark-live-news

I'm not sure what the Tunic is, but other one is obvious. 

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This is how it's done:

ETA: A very good thread discussing some of the issues present in fighting a fire in Notre Dame written by a former police chief:

 

Edited by ViolaSebastian
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1 hour ago, Destiny said:

The last pictures that just came across ... Is it just me, or is the stained glass gone? Please tell me it's just me. ?

Before the station I was watching switched back to regular programming, they said something about the stained glass windows were lost.  

Wood burns at 1,112F until it turns to charcoal, at which point it burns at 2,012F.

The lead that holds the pieces of glass together melts at 621F.  At approximately 3092F (1700C) it vaporizes.

Glass melts at 1,112F (600C) and vaporizes at 2012F (1100 C).

So in a moderate fire the burning wood will heat up the lead and melt it, and the glass will fall and shatter.  Then at least some of the glass could melt.  In a hot fire the lead may or may not vaporize, the glass would take longer to melt, but vaporize at a lower temperature than the lead.

Either way, those beautiful, historic windows will not survive the fire.

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Unfortunately a firefighter has been seriously injured :( 

They believe the firs started accidentally in the attic.

St Louis’ tunic is safe. Jesus’ crown of thorns is confirmed to be safe as well. Fate of the windows is unknown.

Our news is reporting that the intensity of the flames has diminished. The structure itself will be ‘saved and preserved’. Bell towers will probably stand and so will the tower. Word from officials in Paris is ‘all is not lost’ (typing as they’re speaking, sorry it’s choppy). President Macron says the worst has been avoided and the city will rebuild.

I hope all of the above about the structure and relics is true

editing to add more as they continue speaking 

Edited by adidas
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1 minute ago, adidas said:

St Louis’ tunic is safe. Jesus’ crown of thorns is confirmed to be safe as well. Fate of the windows is unknown.

Our news is reporting that the intensity of the flames has diminished. The structure itself will be ‘saved and preserved’. Bell towers will probably stand and so will the tower. Word from officials in Paris is ‘all is not lost’ (typing as they’re speaking, sorry it’s choppy).

I hope all of the above is true

If there's one thing that's a comfort in all this, it's that Notre Dame is so iconic and beloved that no expense will be spared in its restoration. 

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1 hour ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but if the relics weren’t saved is there a chance the nail survived the fire?

I have no idea how they were forged or what temps they can withstand.

Iron melts at 2,800°F (1,538°C).  It's possible that the nail will survive the fire.  Even if it's warped, it's still an artifact of immense historical significance, and all measures should be taken to find it.

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1 hour ago, Satan'sFortress said:

 

And then so moving to see the Parisians out singing hymns and bearing witness to the tragedy.  It is like they are not letting her go down alone, and there is something very beautiful in that.

That made me cry. Beautifully stated.

It's a very sad day indeed. 

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1 hour ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Have they determined the cause or is that still speculation?

It's still speculation--I should have indicted that more in the language that I used. I apologize.

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https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/notre-dame-fire-live-updates-cathedral-paris-france-stream-video-latest-a8871471.html

There's pictures that purport to be from inside the cathedral. I want more information before I consider them accurate, but they say that the altar survived. 

There's several pictures on twitter that purport to be from the inside of the building, but I haven't been able to track down sourcing to see if they are bullshit or not. 

ETA: The reason I have questions about when they are from is, typically, when roofs start collapsing, fire friends are evacuated from the building for safety reasons. I can't imagine media would be any different. 

Edited by Destiny
more words
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@Destiny, the Tunic of St Louis was worn by Louis IX, King of France who was canonized.  I believe that the tunic was his hair shirt.  Louis reigned from 1226 to 1270 and was the ninth Capetian king.  There's a picture of his hairshirt and scourge on his Wikipedia page.

Louis IX of France

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I remember hearing about a nail from the crucifixion but not Jesus' crown of thorns.  These relics must have an asterisk denoting "we think it was his". Right? 

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16 minutes ago, Beermeet said:

I remember hearing about a nail from the crucifixion but not Jesus' crown of thorns.  These relics must have an asterisk denoting "we think it was his". Right? 

If you ask the Catholic Church, they were totally his, officially. Strictly historically speaking, the provenance is dubious.

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Reading French twitter is really testing my translation abilities (I’m not fluent but I can get by), but I just read one which says they are reporting that the stained glass windows have been saved. I’m trying to find an English article to make sure it’s true.

edit:

oh yeah. Google translate exists. Duh.

edit again ( not the confirmation I’m looking for but this one says all relics inside the Cathedral are believed to have been saved):

https://www.9news.com.au/world/notre-dam-fire-cathedral-paris-france-whats-inside/aa116f5a-d139-4228-b4be-81008f699c34

Edited by adidas
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We've seen some of them are gone on camera, so that sounds not completely accurate. I wonder if one side's windows survived, and that's what they are talking about. 

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