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So sorry, Ellie!


Granwych

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SPHASH

Now that God has closed Ellie's womb let's close this thread.  It would be symbolic.

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So, apparently Ellie is gestating her first litter.  I had so fervently hoped  that the Maxwell Backyard Bad Breeders would never become a reality.   In the meantime, Grampwych and I are anxiousl

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ricky_ticky

Does anyone else think it ironic and sad that Sarah, who her family presumes will never be pregnant, had to subject her dog to what amounts to an abortion procedure? Could there be a more definitive message from above that Sarah is not chosen to mother? 

IMO Sarah chose her Ellie to be her surrogate with the financial benefits a justification acceptable to Steve.

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SolomonFundy
On 7/12/2019 at 7:10 AM, ricky_ticky said:

Does anyone else think it ironic and sad that Sarah, who her family presumes will never be pregnant, had to subject her dog to what amounts to an abortion procedure? Could there be a more definitive message from above that Sarah is not chosen to mother? 

IMO Sarah chose her Ellie to be her surrogate with the financial benefits a justification acceptable to Steve.

Sarah has already raised a family. Every one of her siblings born after the reversal would have turned to her for daily care. While I have no doubt that she is disappointed by the lack of options open to her in life due to Steve, I wouldn't be shocked if she harbored secret relief over being spared another round of incessant child-rearing.

I completely agree with you on Steve approving of Ellie in order to supply the family coffers. It's one of the many reasons I am thrilled that she will be able to enjoy her life as a beloved pet without other expectations. Breeding considerations aside, I'm against any living thing, dog or human, being used to line Steve's pockets. There's nothing we can do for the captives of the Maxwell Bride Vault, but at least Ellie's uterus is free.

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Palimpsest
On 7/11/2019 at 8:25 AM, Rosie said:

But did she know for sure that Ellie was in fact pregnant?  I don't think she did.

On 7/11/2019 at 4:35 PM, meee said:

I don't think they can reverse it. I did some reading because I didn't know anything about this kind of infection (don't really know much about animals in general) and apparently the way to treat it is with a total hysterectomy. 

But honestly, I too am surprised they took away her fertility to save her life. And I'm kind of expecting (but hoping I'm wrong) that Sarah will get another dog ASAP "a friend for Ellie" and then try to breed her.

On 7/12/2019 at 7:10 AM, ricky_ticky said:

Does anyone else think it ironic and sad that Sarah, who her family presumes will never be pregnant, had to subject her dog to what amounts to an abortion procedure? Could there be a more definitive message from above that Sarah is not chosen to mother? 

IMO Sarah chose her Ellie to be her surrogate with the financial benefits a justification acceptable to Steve.

I posted about this on another thread, but let's be clear.  There were no puppies.  No puppies were aborted.  But she did indeed have a complete hysterectomy to save her life.

Ellie had pyometra.  https://www.vets-now.com/pet-care-advice/pyometra-in-dogs/

Ellie was at high risk for this very common illness in unspayed bitches, due to her breed (Golden), age, and the fact that Sarah waited until Ellie's 4th or 5th estrus to try to breed her.  Every time Ellie went into heat without being bred increased the risk.

Uninformed back yard breeder Sarah assumed Ellie was pregnant because she "wasn't herself."  Luckily she took Ellie in for an ultrasound to count the non-existent puppies.  If she had waited much longer Ellie's uterus might well have ruptured from the infection.

I'm just glad that Sarah (and Steve) agreed to the surgery to save Ellie's life.  Removing a pus filled uterus is far more expensive and carries more risks than spaying a puppy, even if you wait until after their first heat.

Spay or neuter your pets, folk.

 

 

 

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Curious
3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

I posted about this on another thread, but let's be clear.  There were no puppies.  No puppies were aborted.  But she did indeed have a complete hysterectomy to save her life.

Ellie had pyometra.  https://www.vets-now.com/pet-care-advice/pyometra-in-dogs/

Ellie was at high risk for this very common illness in unspayed bitches, due to her breed (Golden), age, and the fact that Sarah waited until Ellie's 4th or 5th estrus to try to breed her.  Every time Ellie went into heat without being bred increased the risk.

Uninformed back yard breeder Sarah assumed Ellie was pregnant because she "wasn't herself."  Luckily she took Ellie in for an ultrasound to count the non-existent puppies.  If she had waited much longer Ellie's uterus might well have ruptured from the infection.

I'm just glad that Sarah (and Steve) agreed to the surgery to save Ellie's life.  Removing a pus filled uterus is far more expensive and carries more risks than spaying a puppy, even if you wait until after their first heat.

Spay or neuter your pets, folk.

 

 

 

I'm glad they did the surgery to save Ellie.  I also hope this teaches them a lesson that breeding is expensive and doesn't always turn out well so they give up this venture.  Ellie looks like a lovely dog and I'm sure she is a wonderful family pet and that is what she should always have been.  They are not properly educated about (dog) breeding and should leave it to others.

Pyometra is no joke.  When I was going through my divorce, my husband had "custody" of my dogs.  After the divorce was final he was required to return my bitch to me because she was registered in my name.

When I got her back from him finally, she had pyometra (she would have been spayed earlier if I'd had her) and was SO very sick.   My ex ended up having to pay for her to be spayed to save her life.  She had complications (a near fatal bladder infection) and she was never the same after that.  It broke my heart.

We had a papillon bitch from a breeder that I kept intact so she could be shown if the breeder wanted.  When she turned 3 I said that was enough and had her spayed because I was not going to go through another episode of pyometra.

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WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?
4 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Spay or neuter your pets, folk.

And if you are never going to breed your female dog, get her spayed before her first heat. There was at least one study (back when I worked for a vet for a couple of years) that showed that the risk of mammary tumors later in life could be drastically reduced by spaying before a bitch's first heat cycle. 

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catlady

My sister has a female Mini American Eskimo; they didn’t get her spayed right away, and the dog had a false pregnancy when she was about 2.  The vet said that once she had one false pregnancy, she’d have more, and could ultimately develop tumors akin to breast cancer.  The dog got spayed not long after.

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Wolf in Sheeples’ Clothing

One of my dogs went into her first heat five days after we’d gotten her. Which was followed by a false pregnancy. It was a nightmare. We were so glad when we could finally get her spayed. 

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smittykins

My husband and I almost lost one of our cats to pyrometra(totally our fault for not having her spayed right away); the vet said that if we had waited even a few more hours to bring her in, she might not have survived.  Fortunately, with surgery and antibiotics, she made a full recovery, and we had her for nine more years.

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scoutsadie

Just met an "English cream" golden at an indoor dog park/social club - beautiful dog, but yeah, still not an official designation. And of course I thought of Maxhell.

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mango_fandango

I remember reading a story about a dog with pyometra in a James Herriot book, I believe it was called pyometritis in that book. That dog was 12 years old and had a problematic heart too. Thank God Ellie is OK. 
 

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PennySycamore

@mango_fandango,  the BBC is making a new James Herriot series.  I hope they'll do a good job of it. Callam Woodhouse, currently Leslie in The Durrels, plays Tristan.  Peter Davison will always be Tristan to me though; Robert Hardy, Siegfried; and Christopher Timothy, James.

As RuPaul would say "Don't fuck it up!"

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mango_fandango

I saw that too. I was/am a fan of the original series. I was sad to hear about Robert Harry’s death. Most people my age probably know him as Cornelius Fudge from the Harry Potter films. 

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PennySycamore

@mango_fandango,  I read on Wikipedia that Robert Hardy, Peter Davison, Christopher Timothy,  and Carol Drinkwater had all gotten together in Thirsk in 2016 to commemorate the centenary of Alf Wight's (James Herriot's) birth.  

I do hope the new BBC version will not update the stories.  There are many things about the original stories (both the books and the classic TV series) that are specific to that time.

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mango_fandango

@PennySycamore I agree. So many of the stories were about how primitive the treatments were compared to today. It also mentions things like James’s veterinary education being mainly centred around horses, even though by then the importance of the horse in farming (as opposed to tractors etc) was waning. 

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PennySycamore

@mango_fandango, one story that springs immediately to mind is the one where there is a cow at farm with severe mastitis.  The cow was in danger of death unless someone stripped the udder continuously for hours.  The farmer's daughter knew how valuable this cow was.  (I think it was a purebred Jersey and it had cost them a lot of money.)  She stayed up all night stripping the udder of this cow who was completely cured in the morning to the point of gustily getting hay out of the rack.  James remarked that that degree of mastitis was unusual in a cow that did not have tuberculosis and was rarely seen in recent times.  James also talked about he and Helen had spent their honeymoon tuberculin testing.  I don't know if they still test cows for TB, but they can't leave that out.

Btw, stripping the breast is still sometimes recommended for mothers with mastitis.  

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22 hours ago, PennySycamore said:

James also talked about he and Helen had spent their honeymoon tuberculin testing.  I don't know if they still test cows for TB, but they can't leave that out.

Yes, they still do testing for TB. I had a look at the Northern Ireland bovine TB testing page and all herds there are tested annually at minimum. I would assume similar regulations apply across the UK and EU as cattle movement could lead to TB spread quite easily.

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MamaJunebug
On 10/27/2019 at 5:12 PM, PennySycamore said:

@mango_fandango, one story that springs immediately to mind is the one where there is a cow at farm with severe mastitis.  The cow was in danger of death unless someone stripped the udder continuously for hours.  The farmer's daughter knew how valuable this cow was.  (I think it was a purebred Jersey and it had cost them a lot of money.)  She stayed up all night stripping the udder of this cow who was completely cured in the morning to the point of gustily getting hay out of the rack.  James remarked that that degree of mastitis was unusual in a cow that did not have tuberculosis and was rarely seen in recent times.  James also talked about he and Helen had spent their honeymoon tuberculin testing.  I don't know if they still test cows for TB, but they can't leave that out.

Btw, stripping the breast is still sometimes recommended for mothers with mastitis.  

Yup! I had it with Junior JB #2 and was astounded to find out that the remedy was “nurse some more!”  Thank heaven, it worked. Love the story about the all-night milkingvsession.  

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PennySycamore

@MamaJunebug, lots of nursing helps mastitis (especially if you point the baby's nose or chin towards the most sore area) but sometimes the mom needs to have her breasts manually stripped by a nurse or midwife or even her husband.  It needs to be someone other than the mother as the procedure is pretty painful and the mother may not put herself in that much pain.  

Mastitis especially it is allowed to develop into an abscess, can totally destroy a breast or a quarter of an udder.  The most memorable post I've read on Lactnet in the over 20 years I've been a member was when a nurse/IBCLC wrote about this one mom in the clinic who presented with some symptoms of mastitis with possible abscess.  The mother got better but still had a lump in her breast that did not improve.  Finally, they decided to do exploratory surgery to see what was going on.  The surgeon called Becky the IBCLC down to the OR and had her scrub in.  He had her insert her fingers into the incision.  The infection had completely destroyed the milk ducts and alveoli in this mother's breast.  It was just an empty shell.

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The Mother Dust
On 10/28/2019 at 5:13 PM, Ozlsn said:

Yes, they still do testing for TB. I had a look at the Northern Ireland bovine TB testing page and all herds there are tested annually at minimum. I would assume similar regulations apply across the UK and EU as cattle movement could lead to TB spread quite easily.

My dad (born in 1939) tested positive for tb when he was an adult.  He never got sick and never needed medication for it. He only found out when he had to get tested for tb as part of a job application process.  Docs think he contracted it from cows when he worked on the small family farm as a kid. He passed away a few years ago, nothing tb related though. 

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