The Botkinettes Take Umbrage!

[Columbia]

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/nolongerquivering/2019/02/that-botkin-sisters-letter/

And an appearance by AS & E. 

[danvillebelle]

And the scripture reference for the day for the Botkinettes is:  Galatians 6:7.  

[Howl]

A comparison of the life trajectory of the wonderful Katie Botkin with the Botkinettis is the perfect example of how patriarchy, and particularly the Geoff "Duck Biologist" Botkin brand, stunts the lives of otherwise intelligent women. 

When the Elizabeth and A-S claim that their father never treated them differently, never thought women were less than, encouraged them to follow their passions anywhere it might lead them ---- bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit. 

It was incredibly hard to get  past the verbal agitprop tsunami that is their letter.  But this is a crux sentence in their thinly veiled threat of future legal action: And please demonstrate your concern for truth by removing all libelous “information” and speculative accusations from your website.

Also, Botkinettis, if you want to know if a letter has been picked up, you send it USPS Certified *Freaking* Mail with electronic notification when it's been delivered or picked up, rather than harassing USPS personnel. 

[danvillebelle]

Have AS and E ever publicly denounced DPIART and asked for forgiveness for their blindness to his predatory behavior?  

No?

Then they need to STFU.  

[Lisafer]

13 hours ago, Columbia said:

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/nolongerquivering/2019/02/that-botkin-sisters-letter/

And an appearance by AS & E. 

The graciousness of Cindy Kunsman's response to that letter is astounding. Unfortunately I don't think the Botkins will understand and appreciate exactly how gracious and compassionate it was. 

And ffs, how do they have NO idea of the appropriate way to handle letter delivery? Leave the poor mail carrier out of it! They obviously agitated and insulted the guy!

[DomWackTroll]

AS & E: "And while we girls have been willing to live with abuse for the last ten years..."

Still calling themselves "girls"! 

[Columbia]

3 hours ago, Howl said:

When the Elizabeth and A-S claim that their father never treated them differently, never thought women were less than, encouraged them to follow their passions anywhere it might lead them ---- bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit. 

Riiiiiiight. 

“Hey dad, I’d like to go to medical school, become an OB/GYN and work in the Congo doing surgical repair on women with obstetric fistula.”

That would go over in the Botkin house like the proverbial lead balloon. 

[browngrl]

13 minutes ago, Columbia said:

3 hours ago, Howl said:

When the Elizabeth and A-S claim that their father never treated them differently, never thought women were less than, encouraged them to follow their passions anywhere it might lead them ---- bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit. 

Riiiiiiight. 

“Hey dad, I’d like to go to medical school, become an OB/GYN and work in the Congo doing surgical repair on women with obstetric fistula.”

That would go over in the Botkin house like the proverbial lead balloon. 

Isn't it every young woman's dream to sit at home "researching" while her brothers go off on adventures? 

/s

[Lisafer]

1 hour ago, DomWackTroll said:

AS & E: "And while we girls have been willing to live with abuse for the last ten years..."

Still calling themselves "girls"! 

Well, in this particular case, I think "girls" is more accurate than "women." They certainly refuse to take on adult responsibilities!

[nokidsmom]

3 hours ago, Howl said:

It was incredibly hard to get  past the verbal agitprop tsunami that is their letter.

I tried to read it but good grief it was difficult.

One of my takeaways was that it appears that things are not going well with the Botkinettes or the family.   It's been years since the DPIAT's fall and it seems that they have not recovered, both economically and socially.  Quite the opposite.   Seems that the chickens have come home to roost.   They want to blame this woman but seem to forget that they gladly associated with DPIAT and spewed forth their own toxicity for public consumption. 

[Columbia]

4 hours ago, danvillebelle said:

Have AS and E ever publicly denounced DPIART and asked for forgiveness for their blindness to his predatory behavior?  

 No?

 Then they need to STFU.  

Now, now, they did remove their reference to him and Beall in the acknowledgements section of the second edition of their latest book. 

[formergothardite]

Quote

And after reading the disgusting mischaracterizations (sic) of who we “really” are, we don’t blame anyone who has decided over the last ten years to drop our friendship, cut us off, refuse to do business with us, shun us as people, or warn our neighbors, our community, and the rest of the internet about us.

If people who knew them dropped their friendship over that article then it is because the article finally confirmed to them what they already knew. the Duck Biologist family has some issues. It seems like life is going bad for them and they are looking for someone, anyone to blame. To accept that their business has failed and their community is giving them the side eye because their model for godly maidenhood hasn't exactly been a success is not a place their probably want to go right now. It is easier to lash out at someone else. 

Quote

Did you  know there are people who call for boycotts on our brothers’ businesses on the grounds that they sexually use their sisters? And that they link back  to overcomingbotkinsyndrome.com as their source for this lie? 

So I guess the gun business isn't going well. 

My guess from the fact that they wouldn't even pay for certified mail is that the whole family is doing poorly when it comes to finances. This whole thing just makes them look desperate. Li

[Lisafer]

9 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

If people who knew them dropped their friendship over that article then it is because the article finally confirmed to them what they already knew. the Duck Biologist family has some issues. It seems like life is going bad for them and they are looking for someone, anyone to blame. To accept that their business has failed and their community is giving them the side eye because their model for godly maidenhood hasn't exactly been a success is not a place their probably want to go right now. It is easier to lash out at someone else. 

So I guess the gun business isn't going well. 

My guess from the fact that they wouldn't even pay for certified mail is that the whole family is doing poorly when it comes to finances. This whole thing just makes them look desperate. Li

OH MY GOD, apparently AS and E based their accusations on reddit comments! I'm linking it here. Some reddit users are commenting on T-Rex Arms (someone didn't like their holsters, and someone else points out that Lucas used a homophobic slur on Instagram and brings up "Botkin Syndrome." Then another user, 99% probability of being a Botkin, jumps in to defend the family. Good times. https://www.reddit.com/r/CCW/comments/848n7k/negative_review_of_trex_arms_aiwb_holster/

 

[Marian the Librarian]

(With many thanks to @Columbia for posting this link in the Bradrick! Divorce Part 4 thread: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/nolongerquivering/2019/02/that-botkin-sisters-letter/)

It took them 10 years, but the Botkin "girls" (their term) have lodged a predictably long-winded and convoluted protest wrt Cindy Kunsman's "Botkin Syndrome" blog post. 

Mods - any chance this could be a new topic (including the relevant posts following @Columbia's in the Bradrick! thread)? This is the first Botkin news in some time. Thanks!

[Lisafer]

If the mods could merge my post from Bradrick! to this thread, it would be lovely. I'm rather proud of myself for finding that Reddit sub link. 

[Palimpsest]

20 hours ago, Columbia said:

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/nolongerquivering/2019/02/that-botkin-sisters-letter/

And an appearance by AS & E. 

Among the many things they don't seem to understand is that they condemn themselves by their own writings, and the Duck Diologist's numerous ruminations about praying over their ovaries and wombs.   How's that going, Geoffie-poo?   Are AS & E's wombs still unoccupied because they have never married?

Cindy Kunsman's label of "Botkin Syndrome" would be meaningless without the proof of how they are living their lives.

And I had no idea that anyone other than FJ's most devoted members read Cindy's very verbose and prolix posts.  If Reddit has found Under Much Grace too, much power to them. 

AS & E need a reality check in more ways than one.  

 

[Howl]

The Botkins are trying to re-mainstream themselves when in reality they are fringe and will stay fringe.  It's true, their "brand" is damaged, but that's because what they are trying to sell is outdated and irrelevant.   

Geoff hasn't posted on his blog for a year and a half; there's no new content for any of their things. 

The heyday  of VF and the like is over; it will never return.  The only person out that whole group to survive and thrive is that Machiavellian and all around evil turd, Doug Wilson up in Moscow, ID. 

[The Mother Dust]

12 minutes ago, Lisafer said:

If the mods could merge my post from Bradrick! to this thread, it would be lovely. I'm rather proud of myself for finding that Reddit sub link. 

Oooh, could you post the reddit link for us please?  

[Marian the Librarian]

Thank you, mods! 

[formergothardite]

1 hour ago, Lisafer said:

OH MY GOD, apparently AS and E based their accusations on reddit comments! I'm linking it here. Some reddit users are commenting on T-Rex Arms (someone didn't like their holsters, and someone else points out that Lucas used a homophobic slur on Instagram and brings up "Botkin Syndrome." Then another user, 99% probability of being a Botkin, jumps in to defend the family. Good times. https://www.reddit.com/r/CCW/comments/848n7k/negative_review_of_trex_arms_aiwb_holster/

 

That is interesting. It looks like their holsters aren't super popular and using a slur didn't do anything to endear themselves to the community. This was 10 months ago, I'm going to go out on a limb and say guess that business is down and they want to find someone to blame so they latched onto this. From the reddit thread about it it looks like the gun community really tore into them when the slur was used. That combined with complaints about the holsters and just being all around weird people, it really isn't any wonder that they aren't doing well. 

[The Mother Dust]

7 hours ago, Lisafer said:

The graciousness of Cindy Kunsman's response to that letter is astounding. Unfortunately I don't think the Botkins will understand and appreciate exactly how gracious and compassionate it was. 

And ffs, how do they have NO idea of the appropriate way to handle letter delivery? Leave the poor mail carrier out of it! They obviously agitated and insulted the guy!

Ugh, Cindy was way nicer than I would been about it. I would not have changed a single word in that Botkin Syndrome blog.  In only taking a quick scan, it does look like she is going to make some of the edits they requested, but not all of them.  Botkins, you know most people who want to do research on you, know about the Way Back Machine right?  Maybe we should get a "Botkin Synrome" tradition going, like we did with "Doug Phillips is a Tool."

And also Botkins, good luck with getting your mentions taken off from Reddit and Patheos.  The Internet Remembers.  

Do you think the Botkins will show up here in another 10 years? ?

P.S., sorry for all the edits, I have so much to say about this. ?

Edited February 20, 2019 by The Mother Dust

[Lisafer]

@The Mother Dust, @formergothardite quoted my post and included the link. Thank you, formergothardite, I have not figured out how to quote from one thread to another. I really should learn how to do that!

[The Mother Dust]

1 minute ago, Lisafer said:

@The Mother Dust, @formergothardite quoted my post and included the link. Thank you, formergothardite, I have not figured out how to quote from one thread to another. I really should learn how to do that!

I found it, thank you for providing that.

[Coconut Flan]

5 minutes ago, Lisafer said:

@The Mother Dust, @formergothardite quoted my post and included the link. Thank you, formergothardite, I have not figured out how to quote from one thread to another. I really should learn how to do that!

It's pretty tricky to quote from thread to thread.  However, I moved the posts to this thread per Marian the Librarian's request so it's all in one spot for people.  

[Marian the Librarian]

24 minutes ago, The Mother Dust said:

Do you think the Botkins will show up here in another 10 years? ?

Oh please...oh please...