Seewalds 38: Waiting on Seaweed Three

[ViolaSebastian]

In addition to putting the parents in a shitty spot by insisting on a certain sex, it’s also a crappy thing to burden a kid with the idea that he or she was born the “right” or “wrong” sex. 

My grandmother had three brothers, three sons, and her three sons had three sons. She desperately and openly wanted a girl child/grandchild. I was that granddaughter, and to compound the situation, I was named after her. She had a lot of expectations about how my life would play out, my likes and dislikes, the hobbies and sports I’d pursue, etc. because she’d spent decades dreaming about being the mother/grandmother to a daughter. I was not into many stereotypically feminine pursuits, but I took ballet for years because I’d get the guilt trip about how she wanted to see me perform a solo that my dance studio required of graduating seniors. She’d never had the “girl experience” and in her mind, that meant, in part, that her granddaughter would dance. She truly meant well, but I was the type of kid who wanted to please adults and it affected my self-esteem that I wasn’t the person she’d imagined I’d be. It also created an unhealthy dynamic because she saw me as her only opportunity to buy “girl” clothing and toys, which meant I was spoiled. I know you’re thinking about the world’s smallest violin, but my cousins and brother grew to resent that, and when they were kids they didn’t differentiate between the person administering the unfairness and the kid receiving it. And I don’t blame them, but it did create an anomosity that sucked. 

[adidas]

I’ve guessed Hudson as a name for them the last two times and I’m not giving up. Third time lucky?  

[Glasgowghirl]

@ViolaSebastian My mum did have both my sister and I in dancing when we were younger, I started dancing later than all the other girls my age and they got moved up a class before me and after that I got bored and my mum told me that since she had to pay for classes even if I didn't show up that I either had to start going or quit, I chose to quit. My sister quit a few months later. We were tomboy's as we got older, I started following Celtic, my sister Rangers, that opened a whole other can of worms. My grand parents on both sides are still traditional and my papa did get annoyed when my cousin's son started playing with a doll and pram, my cousin has 7 children and he was always pushing a pram, so my cousins son was copying his dad and I explained that to him. My papa was accepting though of my cousin's oldest daughter coming out as gay.

[Skeptic]

5 hours ago, ViolaSebastian said:

In addition to putting the parents in a shitty spot by insisting on a certain sex, it’s also a crappy thing to burden a kid with the idea that he or she was born the “right” or “wrong” sex. 

My grandmother had three brothers, three sons, and her three sons had three sons. She desperately and openly wanted a girl child/grandchild. I was that granddaughter, and to compound the situation, I was named after her. She had a lot of expectations about how my life would play out, my likes and dislikes, the hobbies and sports I’d pursue, etc. because she’d spent decades dreaming about being the mother/grandmother to a daughter. I was not into many stereotypically feminine pursuits, but I took ballet for years because I’d get the guilt trip about how she wanted to see me perform a solo that my dance studio required of graduating seniors. She’d never had the “girl experience” and in her mind, that meant, in part, that her granddaughter would dance. She truly meant well, but I was the type of kid who wanted to please adults and it affected my self-esteem that I wasn’t the person she’d imagined I’d be. It also created an unhealthy dynamic because she saw me as her only opportunity to buy “girl” clothing and toys, which meant I was spoiled. I know you’re thinking about the world’s smallest violin, but my cousins and brother grew to resent that, and when they were kids they didn’t differentiate between the person administering the unfairness and the kid receiving it. And I don’t blame them, but it did create an anomosity that sucked. 

No “world’s smallest violin” from me at all. My grandmother placed similar expectations on me as “the favorite” during my early childhood and it was torture because I could see how it affected the rest of the family. She had never treated my mother well, so that was a slap in the face to her, and on top of that I had a twin sister and a female cousin born a month after us who didn’t get the same special treatment and could see the difference. It was hurtful all around and left me with a guilt complex until I distanced myself from my grandmother. 

[Melissa1977]

On 2/4/2019 at 9:10 AM, just_ordinary said:

It’s interesting that especially in Western countries people really want girls. Yes, one boy would be nice but if you just have one most people want girls. At least that is my experience. Female babies are the jackpot on Social Media (horrible to say but sadly true). Maybe that is why boy mums have all those hashtags (don’t know if we had the discussion in Benessa’s thread). 

This. I have two boys. Love them badly, they have very different personalities and both are amazing!. But people seemed so dissapointed or sad for me when I told them the ultrasound showed a boy.

The saddest thing is that many people, if not most, prefer a girl just for the clothes and girly stuff. As if a baby was a toy. Others think that girls are better behaved, and I really wish them a naughty one! ? Hey people, girls can be warriors, too. And boys can be caring. Thinking that the gender impacts the personality is so wrong, specially in a secular society where gender roles are becoming less important.

I can't understand how women who fight for a career, who hate sexism, who want an equal partner, dream of having a girl "because they are sweeter, or easier, or are going to take care of their old parents".

So well, I live with 3 men, I'm the queen of the house and it rocks! If God opens my womb again ?? he can send me another boy, although a girl would be very much loved, too.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

@Melissa1977 I have one of each a boy & a girl I was happy to have a little boy the 1st go round in fact I was so happy that the 2nd time I hoped for another boy.  DS was such a chill little guy so easy going and even tempered. Of course now he is a 21 year old drama queen who thinks any small slight or issue is THE END OF THE WORLD. Dear Rufus, that boy is perpetually a 13 year old girl on her period.

DD on the other hand was a PITA as a baby, she had to be held a lot, she was cranky and fussy, refused to sleep, she was a total mama's girl and if mama wasn't there she would scream until I was. She was never one for self entertainment, we still call her "she who must be entertained" But she's so much like her mother, a no nonsense, doesn't suffer fools, stubborn, over achiever.  I love them both to death, Bubba is my sweat soul, he will literally help anyone at any time all you have to do is ask, he cares about everyone and everything, sometimes to his own detriment, he is emphatic, much like me and takes on others feelings when he doesn't need to.  I love my little Freckles too, she the epitome of the saying "though she be but little she is fierce" It is always so funny to see so much intelligence, determination and force coming out of a 5'4" freckle faced 18 year old young woman. I couldn't be more proud of both of them. 

I loved to dress DD up in fun girly cute clothes, but that didn't last long, she refused to wear anything I picked out around age 7, she's done her own hair since she was about 6. She is VERY independent, she wouldn't stand for being a dress-up doll. She would NOT have done well in the ATI/IBLP homes/churches, neither would my son, he is far to caring and kind and passive to be a "real man" according to their standards. She is too head strong, independent and opinionated to be a malleable wife. 

[Bobology]

10 minutes ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

 Dear Rufus, that boy is perpetually a 13 year old girl on her period.

This description is hilarious and I intend to use it some day. Does your son know he is this way?

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 minute ago, Bobology said:

This description is hilarious and I hope to use it in the future to describe someone. Does your son know he is this way?

Yes, because all his friends tease him endlessly to try to get him to lighten up, and most of the time once he's been called out he will roll his eyes and say sorry, I even annoy myself sometimes. 

[karen77]

I had disappointment on my second child (we found out at 20 weeks) I was SOOOO sure it was another girl, but nope, definitely a boy! I had to readjust my whole mental picture of our family.. but now it's great! (he's 6 now)  took me a week or so though.

[Meggo]

I had no preference in boy/girl - I just wanted a baby (and after years of infertility - adopting at all was just pure glee). 
I have two sisters - so this boy thing is newish to me. (and BAFFLES my mother - she just doesn't understand why he will not just sit quietly - ever - because we all did). But I love it. Wouldn't have it any other way. And I am not a girly girl myself so am not sure I'd be able to play with things other than trucks and blocks and hot wheels. (which is what we grew up playing with - I never got into dollies or barbies).

[SassyPants]

10 minutes ago, karen77 said:

I had disappointment on my second child (we found out at 20 weeks) I was SOOOO sure it was another girl, but nope, definitely a boy! I had to readjust my whole mental picture of our family.. but now it's great! (he's 6 now)  took me a week or so though.

This was us as well, although I found out at birth. I was certain I was having a second girl and envisioned a life with such. It took me an afternoon to adjust. My husband was very excited to have a boy. This was in 1990 before routine USs -

[JermajestyDuggar]

I also have a boy that I call a drama King instead of drama Queen. He’s more dramatic than many girls his age! But he’s social, friendly, caring and so fun to be around. When he’s not being the epitome of drama.

[nickelodeon]

Alyssa Webster has three girls and has posted about how she needs her next kid to be a boy because "girls are so dramatic" - because obviously her kids are stubborn and fuss because they're hysterical women and not because they're, y'know, toddlers. The whole gender = personality thing follows fundie kids throughout their whole lives. I bet that even if Alyssa had the most tantrum-prone, emotional son ever, she'd still be going on about girls and their drama.

[Screamapillar]

Seriously, gender is not a personality. I hate when people act like it is absolutely set in stone that girls are nothing but drama and boys are nothing but messy tornadoes. I have one of each and there is literally no difference between raising a girl baby and raising a boy baby other than diaper changes being a lot more hazardous with boys for the first couple of months. Pee everywhere.

 

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

12 minutes ago, Screamapillar said:

Seriously, gender is not a personality. I hate when people act like it is absolutely set in stone that girls are nothing but drama and boys are nothing but messy tornadoes. I have one of each and there is literally no difference between raising a girl baby and raising a boy baby other than diaper changes being a lot more hazardous with boys for the first couple of months. Pee everywhere.

I would say that raising boys and girls is different, but I would also say raising two girls is different or 2 boys (or any number or combination of each), because each child is so different. DH and I often marvel how two children who come from the same parents raised in the same home at the same time can be so different from each other. Most people never guess my kids are siblings, they look nothing a like, DS is all his father, and DD is all me so they look nothing alike, but their personalities are so different that teachers were often surprised to find out they were brother and sister. 

[karen77]

45 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I also have a boy that I call a drama King instead of drama Queen. He’s more dramatic than many girls his age! But he’s social, friendly, caring and so fun to be around. When he’s not being the epitome of drama.

This is true for my son too! so DRAMATIC!! I am hoping he grows out of it a bit.

[Jigsaw3]

I volunteer with a sport on occasion, and lord are the boys dramatic at the finish line. They're wailing and collapsing and carrying on (and this is 12 to 19 year olds!!) The girls are, in general, much more stoic; when they do break down, it's quiet tears with friends supporting them, not performative. I'm not here for drama being the particular province of any one gender: both boys and girls are emotional and dramatic, and the expression of their emotions is different for everyone.

Both boys and girls are really good at supporting their teammates and congratulating their opponents, so that's very impressive.

[viii]

5 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

Others think that girls are better behaved, and I really wish them a naughty one! ? Hey people, girls can be warriors, too. And boys can be caring. Thinking that the gender impacts the personality is so wrong, specially in a secular society where gender roles are becoming less important.

My sister has twins - a girl and a boy. My niece is a fierce little thing, and is full of attitude to the point where she gets worked with more because she is a big fan of the "hands-on" approach. My nephew, on the other hand, loves to sit and colour, or do puzzles, or snuggle next to you with a book. You have to be careful what cartoons he watches, because he's sensitive and will cry easily if the show is is even remotely sad. 

[Baxter]

I had a moment of disappointment when I found out I was having a boy. I have two sisters, mostly girl cousins and most of my friends growing up only had sisters too. I really had no clue what I would do with a boy. Of course, once I had him, he's the loveliest little person and I wouldn't change him for the world. I logically knew this would happen when I was feeling a bit sad after I found out but emotions aren't logical.

Now I am expecting my second child and before finding out, I knew either way there was going to be a little bit of sadness because my son is so lovely, I wouldn't mind having another boy. But I do really love all the cute little clothing and stuff for girls. We are having a girl and it took me a moment to adjust to that. Now I'm just having fun shopping! My husband now realizing all the shopping potential for girls jokingly has said perhaps another boy would have been better although he actually didn't care either way for our first or second child. I realize that the girl in my mind might not be the one that I have and that's ok too. I figure while she is a baby she won't have any opinions on how I dress her and I'll take it as long as I can get it. My son still doesn't have any real clothing preferences so I might get more time to buy his stuff without much input and he will be happy that the clothes just show up in his closet (much like my husband).

[Carm_88]

1 hour ago, Jigsaw3 said:

I volunteer with a sport on occasion, and lord are the boys dramatic at the finish line. They're wailing and collapsing and carrying on (and this is 12 to 19 year olds!!)

It's funny. When I had my appendix out at 21, the nurses were poking and prodding at me, lots of blood drawing and all that. They kept asking me if I was ok, I wasn't making a sound, it stung but I wasn't going to make a big deal out of it. One of the nurses said "It's how you know she's a girl. If we had a 21 year old young fella in here, he'd be screeching roaring and bawling. Women are tougher!" 

[karen77]

1 hour ago, Baxter said:

I had a moment of disappointment when I found out I was having a boy. I have two sisters, mostly girl cousins and most of my friends growing up only had sisters too. I really had no clue what I would do with a boy. Of course, once I had him, he's the loveliest little person and I wouldn't change him for the world. I logically knew this would happen when I was feeling a bit sad after I found out but emotions aren't logical.

 

This was also something that I grappled with during my week or so of adjustment. 
I just didn't grow up around boys (living with them that is), so not sure what to do with them! I still am not sure how raising a teenage boy will be!! lol, but it's going ok so far!! 

[DillyDally]

Chiming in on the gender/name discussion: 

I'm currently 29 weeks pregnant and we did find out the sex. When I was a kid, I always imagined having a daughter as a firstborn (and I am an only child, so no idea what boys are like, I guess). The pregnancy was a big oopsie, so I kept telling myself I would be happy no matter the sex of the baby - I was still processing the fact that a tiny human was growing inside me then, I guess. Anyway, I was elated when we found out we are having a girl. We had talked about names even before then and my husband and I both found it much easier to find girls' names we BOTH like.

A couple weeks later I told a friend about some boys' names I would have considered. One of my favourites is quite old-fashioned but currently coming back big time in Germany. When my friend heard the name, she said it sounds like a dog's name. That seriously "tainted" (spoilt?) that name for me ?

We're almost set on a name for our daughter but not telling anyone. I don't want anybody to comment on it before the baby is here. It's driving my MIL crazy not to know

Anyway, we are planning to raise our daughter as gender-neutral as possible. Just buying baby clothes I realised how crazy it is out there with pink vs blue, kittens vs trucks etc. And all the comments from people about "Oh, so you won't be able to play soccer with your kid". Lots of wtf moments.

Last but not least, thanks to everybody who made me think of Ben and Jessa's baby as "Seaweed Threewald" from now on, lol. I have no prediction for the sex of the baby, just really curious about the name they will pick!

[twoandthrough]

This conversation is so interesting. I have two daughters and no sons. One of my daughters (she's about 3.5) is wild, rough and tumble, high-strung, stubborn, and what we like to call "spirited". She fits the bill of what most of my friends reserve for little boys. It's funny when she plays with the little boys because she is, by far, the roughest and toughest of them. She is the messiest. The sassiest. She takes zero shit. It's amazing to watch (but SO SO SO difficult to parent, if I'm being honest). My other daughter is one, and she is much more laid back, calm, snuggly, and traditionally "girlie". I hate those labels. And I try to fight the good fight every single time their sex is brought up as a means to define their personality. It just doesn't make any sense to me how people justify it. Two girls... same two parents... two VASTLY different personalities. Genetics and nature vs. nurture are so amazing to me!

[Satan'sFortress]

I grew up in a family with a bunch of girls and a gay brother. I fiercely wanted daughters, but the split second my son was born, I realized that I just wanted THAT baby.  When his brother was born several years later, I was thrilled.  I would have been happy to have a girl, too, but I realized it didn't matter.  I simply liked having kids. 

If I am lucky enough to have grandchildren some day, I couldn't give two shits what ginder they are!!

11 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

So well, I live with 3 men, I'm the queen of the house and it rocks!

Same here----I think it is fun.  I know some dads of just girls who feel the same way.

3 hours ago, karen77 said:

This was also something that I grappled with during my week or so of adjustment. 
I just didn't grow up around boys (living with them that is), so not sure what to do with them! I still am not sure how raising a teenage boy will be!! lol, but it's going ok so far!! 

FWIW, I have loved being mama to my teenage boys.  I admit that I feel some pangs when I see my sister with her teen+ girls, but it all ok.  My oldest left me a thank you letter when he went away to college.  And he's just invited me down to spend the day with him & see his new apartment. 

. 

[HarryPotterFan]

Re: Gender disappointment

Gender disappointment is a big storyline for Cate and Tyler on Teen Mom. At their “gender” reveal party (I like to call those sex reveals but that sounds potentially naughty) they were very obviously disappointed about having another girl. Tyler really wanted a boy, and Cate really wants to give him one. She recently said that they will try for a boy the soon as this one is born. Their baby isn’t even born yet and they are already thinking about the next one. It makes it seem like they aren’t even excited for this one. And since their disappointment is on TV, social media, gossip sites...that kid could easily find this stuff one day and see how disappointed her parents were, and that they didn’t get over that disappointment.

7 hours ago, nickelodeon said:

Alyssa Webster has three girls and has posted about how she needs her next kid to be a boy because "girls are so dramatic" - because obviously her kids are stubborn and fuss because they're hysterical women and not because they're, y'know, toddlers. The whole gender = personality thing follows fundie kids throughout their whole lives. I bet that even if Alyssa had the most tantrum-prone, emotional son ever, she'd still be going on about girls and their drama.

My co-worker’s 5-year-Old son is the sassiest, most dramatic child I’ve ever met. He’s hilarious though.