Lori Alexander 58: A Family Holiday on the Toilet

[The Mother Dust]

2 minutes ago, feministxtian said:

Out of curiosity, how old is your mom? There's quite a few women in my age range that are still trying to be the "traditional housewife"...I tried it, didn't like it, quit (well, got divorced) and have been significantly happier ever since. 

She is 63.  Married to my step dad since 94.  Believe me, I'm not mad just because of typical "step" issues.  He has all the negative traits of a man from that era too, "mad men'ish" without the smarts.  Anyway, she has ALWAYS caved to him, from small stuff to big stuff.  And he is apparently incapable of making his own meals.  You know the type.  He isn't physically abusive, but he is controlling of where she goes.  This was actually a topic of conversation between me and her sister during a private moment at thanksgiving, and my aunt suggested something I had never thought of before.....  that my mom's anti-anxiety/anti-depressant medication might be one of the reasons she dosen't push back....that the medication might dull any irritation she might feel.  That really gave me something to think about the past few days, as I had never thought of that possibility before.  Hmm. Anyway, i'm happy to hear that you, another woman, has pro-actively gotten herself into a better situation.  

[feministxtian]

3 minutes ago, The Mother Dust said:

that my mom's anti-anxiety/anti-depressant medication might be one of the reasons she dosen't push back....that the medication might dull any irritation she might feel.

Ummm....nope! I'm on both anti-anxiety and anti-depressants and lemme tell you, I have no problems getting irritated. She might feel disempowered, or he's an overbearing jerk and she's decided it's useless to fight back. OR she just hasn't earned her "bitch" card. 

She's 9 years older than I am, so she's sort of a product of that late 50's, early 60's post-war June Cleaver sort of shit. I was 33 when my X kicked us out and I really had to find my inner bitch...20 years later...well, the inner bitch is alive and well. 

[delphinium65]

1 hour ago, Sarah92 said:

Why is she getting bent out of shape for a woman using her time wisely? Maybe the husband was perfectly fine with polyester shirts? Ironing isn't fun to me so why would I buy stuff I have to iron? I can be using the time for other shit. She didn't want to spend all her time doing housework so she used her mind to create less work. Maybe she was a painter or enjoyed cooking instead? Maybe she was a writer? It doesn't matter but a woman making less work for herself isn't Lori's business. 

Because Lori can't stand a woman making her own decisions about anything.  Painting? Writing?  Cooking  (other than for family)? Any hobby takes away from 'God's Perfect Plan' AKA bitch Lori's command. 

[Coconut Flan]

Eh, I'm older than she is and it really isn't indicative of women in their 60s overall.  I know very few who are June Cleaver types.  In fact it's maybe two or three.  I never was.  We were tiny tots or in elementary school in the 50s and I didn't find that defining at all.  The 60s were where a lot of the change set in.  

17 minutes ago, feministxtian said:

She's 9 years older than I am, so she's sort of a product of that late 50's, early 60's post-war June Cleaver sort of shit. I was 33 when my X kicked us out and I really had to find my inner bitch...20 years later...well, the inner bitch is alive and well. 

 

[feministxtian]

1 minute ago, Coconut Flan said:

Eh, I'm older than she is and it really isn't indicative of women in their 60s overall.  I know very few who are June Cleaver types.  In fact it's maybe two or three.  I never was.  We were tiny tots or in elementary school in the 50s and I didn't find that defining at all.  The 60s were where a lot of the change set in.  

 

I know...but...hell, the mother was all fucking June Cleaver and shit. My grandmother (b. 1906) was not. I don't really think there's a real definition of who would and wouldn't be the June Cleaver type...some are and some aren't. I wonder how much of that would depend on family of origin and what was expected in that particular family. The mother pushed the mom thing, her idea for me was finish college, go live in NYC for awhile, get married, live in the 'burbs, pop out a few kids. 

Live in NYC....bwahahahahahaha...not me yo! I'm a bit of a redneck bumpkin and I like it that way. NYC is my idea of HELL. 

[The Mother Dust]

1 minute ago, feministxtian said:

Ummm....nope! I'm on both anti-anxiety and anti-depressants and lemme tell you, I have no problems getting irritated. She might feel disempowered, or he's an overbearing jerk and she's decided it's useless to fight back. OR she just hasn't earned her "bitch" card. 

She's 9 years older than I am, so she's sort of a product of that late 50's, early 60's post-war June Cleaver sort of shit. I was 33 when my X kicked us out and I really had to find my inner bitch...20 years later...well, the inner bitch is alive and well. 

Ok, you actually just made me feel alot better, thank you.  In a way it was good to think my aunt had hit on a concrete reason, but on the other hand it distressed me too, because I know those medications help correct brain chemistry, so I was thinking, well, if what my aunt said is true, what can be done, because she can't just come off those meds...   Aggghh.   I think your theories are much more likely. 

Re: your second paragraph, Mom has told me a few times that when she graduated highschool, if women didn't get married right away as SAHM, they became nurses or teachers. No other options. And this was in librul New York State!  Her mother was a dairy farmers wife, but she ran the farm as much as my grandpa did, and grandma actually handled the finances.  So as i'm thinking out loud, perhaps mom was more affected by the culture of the time, as you say, that June Cleaver B.S., rather than any influence from her mother.

Your X seems like a piece of work all right....seems to me you were better off without him, although what he did was shitty.  You maintained your strength though, and that is inspiring.  I love my mom but god.....it's nice to see other women roughly of her generation who didn't wilt.

 

[Carol]

7 hours ago, Koala said:

Today Lori uses her blog to gossip about a woman she knows (yes, the Bible has a thing or two to say about gossip, but Lori HATES God and His perfect ways):

Lori mentions ironing, which reminds me of a woman I once read about.  I believe her husband's name was KEN ALEXANDER.

Ken writes:

That's right.  Righteous Lori didn't cook or iron for Ken.

Ken later requested that Lori iron some clothes for him:

Lori's response:

That's right.  The Godly Gossip found 10 mins of ironing to be "awfully tiring".  Funny how she has the gall to gossip about "a women she used to know".

 

More from today's post:

She's right.  Housekeepers AND nannies "sent from heaven".  Not the Lori would know ANYTHING about nannies and housekeepers.  She's a godly woman!

A reader asks:

Lori lies by omission:

Yes, her mom helped her.  But so did her employees- a maid and a nanny (who Lori claimed held her baby for hours a day, since Lori herself just left her to cry).

Golly, Koala, you are really mean to Lori!  You know full well she had those parasites and couldn't iron.  I mean, they were probably falling out of her nose, mouth, eyes and ears right onto to Ken's shirts where she'd accidentally ironed them right into the fabric.  Then he probably took them to the dry cleaners and the dry cleaner owner said, "Don't be bringin any more parasitic shirts in, Ken.  None of want to look like Lori".

So that's how Ken started ironing his own shirts.

The end.

[The Mother Dust]

14 minutes ago, Coconut Flan said:

Eh, I'm older than she is and it really isn't indicative of women in their 60s overall.  I know very few who are June Cleaver types.  In fact it's maybe two or three.  I never was.  We were tiny tots or in elementary school in the 50s and I didn't find that defining at all.  The 60s were where a lot of the change set in.  

 

I think this another reason why I love FJ so much......so many inspiring women here. I wish I had this board when I was a teenager, sigh.

[feministxtian]

3 minutes ago, The Mother Dust said:

Your X seems like a piece of work all right....seems to me you were better off without him, although what he did was shitty.  You maintained your strength though, and that is inspiring.  I love my mom but god.....it's nice to see other women roughly of her generation who didn't wilt.

I had a lot of bottled up anger that helped. I also felt the need for a big FUCK YOU to the mother. In the end, you could say I won. Went thru some serious shit without being bitter or nasty or ugly. The meds help but...the rest comes from inside. All the meds do for me is keep me from letting the little demons who like to run loose in my head get too loud. The mother and the X both swore I'd end up some whore in a gutter...isn't that just fucking lovely...

[The Mother Dust]

12 minutes ago, feministxtian said:

I know...but...hell, the mother was all fucking June Cleaver and shit. My grandmother (b. 1906) was not. I don't really think there's a real definition of who would and wouldn't be the June Cleaver type...some are and some aren't. I wonder how much of that would depend on family of origin and what was expected in that particular family. The mother pushed the mom thing, her idea for me was finish college, go live in NYC for awhile, get married, live in the 'burbs, pop out a few kids. 

Live in NYC....bwahahahahahaha...not me yo! I'm a bit of a redneck bumpkin and I like it that way. NYC is my idea of HELL. 

Ahhh, did you see what I just posted about how my moms mom was not like that?? She and my grandpa ran their dairy farm as equals.   Anyway....I am a widow, (my husband died at 28) and my mom has bugged me a bit about dating and getting married again, but I dont think i'd get as lucky as I did with my first husband, and NO WAY am I taking a chance on ending up in my moms situation. *shudder*

4 minutes ago, feministxtian said:

I had a lot of bottled up anger that helped. I also felt the need for a big FUCK YOU to the mother. In the end, you could say I won. Went thru some serious shit without being bitter or nasty or ugly. The meds help but...the rest comes from inside. All the meds do for me is keep me from letting the little demons who like to run loose in my head get too loud. The mother and the X both swore I'd end up some whore in a gutter...isn't that just fucking lovely...

Sounds (in the end) like you "kicked ass and took names" as my (bio) dad used to say.  ?

[feministxtian]

Just now, The Mother Dust said:

Ahhh, did you see what I just posted about how my moms mom was not like that?? She and my grandpa ran their dairy farm as equals.  

yup! The mother came from a long line of utterly useless females. My grandmother on that side would embroider, play piano, all that shit but was SO not a "housewife". She had maids and nannies. The mother tried I guess...but she sucked at it too. I suck at it mostly because I don't give a shit about the whole "picture perfect" house thing. Our home is messy, a little disorganized, but you're welcome to kick off your shoes, snuggle a cat (if they permit it), put your feet up and chill. You can leave a glass in the sink w/o me flipping out, as long as the cat hair everywhere doesn't bother you (brown furniture, cats that have white fur). I keep saying that maybe if I had a bigger house it wouldn't be so messy, but I know me...just more room for more messes! 

[FullOfGravy]

25 minutes ago, delphinium65 said:

Because Lori can't stand a woman making her own decisions about anything.  Painting? Writing?  Cooking  (other than for family)? Any hobby takes away from 'God's Perfect Plan' AKA bitch Lori's command. 

I bet Lori also can't stand the thought of any woman being better at something than she is, or knowing something she doesn't.  Solution: Make up her own rules whereby women aren't allowed to do anything Lori doesn't tell them to do.  And then scream herself blue in the face when the world doesn't bow to her nonsensical demands.

4 minutes ago, The Mother Dust said:

Ok, you actually just made me feel alot better, thank you.  In a way it was good to think my aunt had hit on a concrete reason, but on the other hand it distressed me too, because I know those medications help correct brain chemistry, so I was thinking, well, if what my aunt said is true, what can be done, because she can't just come off those meds...   Aggghh.   I think your theories are much more likely. 

Three things about this:

- Everyone's experience with antidepressants is different, and there are a bunch of different kinds out there now, that work on different bits of brain chemistry.

- Not caring about anything enough to get irritated about it can be a symptom of depression, too, and can be a sign that the meds aren't working as well as they should.

- No, it's not a good idea to just come off antidepressants, but it's possible to talk to a doctor about switching to a different kind, or changing the dose.

Obviously, I don't know your mom, and if you feel @feministxtian's theories make sense for her, you probably know best.  Just wanted to add that even if there is something about her meds that's making her a bit off, her doctor may have options beyond just living with it.

[The Mother Dust]

2 minutes ago, FullOfGravy said:

I bet Lori also can't stand the thought of any woman being better at something than she is, or knowing something she doesn't.  Solution: Make up her own rules whereby women aren't allowed to do anything Lori doesn't tell them to do.  And then scream herself blue in the face when the world doesn't bow to her nonsensical demands.

Three things about this:

- Everyone's experience with antidepressants is different, and there are a bunch of different kinds out there now, that work on different bits of brain chemistry.

- Not caring about anything enough to get irritated about it can be a symptom of depression, too, and can be a sign that the meds aren't working as well as they should.

- No, it's not a good idea to just come off antidepressants, but it's possible to talk to a doctor about switching to a different kind, or changing the dose.

Obviously, I don't know your mom, and if you feel @feministxtian's theories make sense for her, you probably know best.  Just wanted to add that even if there is something about her meds that's making her a bit off, her doctor may have options beyond just living with it.

Thank you @FullOfGravy as I consider your points, they do make sense to me.  Your first point, is especially striking. I will think on this, and perhaps make more specific inquiries to my mom about her meds.  She isn't shy about discussing them with family, I just never made many inquiries before as I hadn't considered the possibility it might be affecting her ability to care/not care.

[wild little fox]

1 hour ago, The Mother Dust said:

She is 63.  Married to my step dad since 94.  Believe me, I'm not mad just because of typical "step" issues.  He has all the negative traits of a man from that era too, "mad men'ish" without the smarts.  Anyway, she has ALWAYS caved to him, from small stuff to big stuff.  And he is apparently incapable of making his own meals.  You know the type.  He isn't physically abusive, but he is controlling of where she goes.  This was actually a topic of conversation between me and her sister during a private moment at thanksgiving, and my aunt suggested something I had neverWellbut thought of before.....  that my mom's anti-anxiety/anti-depressant medication might be one of the reasons she dosen't push back....that the medication might dull any irritation she might feel.  That really gave me something to think about the past few days, as I had never thought of that possibility before.  Hmm. Anyway, i'm happy to hear that you, another woman, has pro-actively gotten herself into a better situation.  

Maxed doses of Wellbutrin and Zoloft is the only way I survived living with my mother. Even then I felt completely hopeless and wanted to die every day. Without the meds and therapy I probably would have given up.  It blunted ALL my feelings. I think it could be a possibility your mother is blunted, too. 

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

I'm just going to put this out there. I dislike housework.  A lot. I mean really a lot.  Scrubbing a bathroom/ cleaning a toilet is not my idea of a good time, I do not find it fulfilling or sanctifying.  But I (we actually) do housework because we like a clean neat house and we both live here.

I don't clean house thinking that I'm serving the Lord.  I'm nearly positive God, Christ our Savior, The Blessed Virgin Mary and all the saints Do. Not. Care. if my kitchen floor is mopped. I know they do care if I was kind and compassionate today, gave love and understanding to all those who needed it, helped my fellow man, and tried to do good.

I will admit I like to iron (I'm really fast) and I like to cook, but not clean up afterward. Fortunately Mr. Dress does the kitchen clean up .  He says it's a small price to pay for home cooked from scratch meals every night.  And me a jezebel career woman. 

I'll admit that since it's only the 2 of us cleaning doesn't take that long and the house stays clean longer except for dust. Old houses exude dust.  I could do it twice a day and it still wouldn't be dust free. So...... I do it more often than I'd like and, unlike Lori, I have things around (books, pictures, interesting "things" etc that require dusting.  My house it not the spartan stripped down place Lori's is.

And speaking of cleaning, doesn't Lori have a carpet that never needs vacuuming thereby cutting down on the amount of housework her housekeeper she does?  For shame Lori, that you're not spending all your day being a keeper at home as you God commands.  You must hate His perfect ways,

I'm off now to check whether my kitchen floor can wait until the weekend to be mopped.

[The Mother Dust]

9 minutes ago, wild little fox said:

Maxed doses of Wellbutrin and Zoloft is the only way I survived living with my mother. Even then I felt completely hopeless and wanted to die every day. Without the meds and therapy I probably would have given up.  It blunted ALL my feelings. I think it could be a possibility your mother is blunted, too. 

Hmm, so you did have a different experience with it than what @feministxtian had.  I will be seeing my mom in a couple of weeks (we live in different states) and I will definitely have a (capital C) Conversation with her about it.  Thank you for your input, this has been educational.  ETA, isn't it just amazing how moms can screw their daughters up?  I mean, I guess we see examples of it every day on this board, but even the non-fundies.....geezus.   But you came out the other side @wild little fox   You made it!

[Sarah92]

I've had kids come in on medication that is working wonders for them, a different kid might be taking the same medication but becomes more violent or depressed. Genetics, lifestyle, severity of problem can all impact medication in different ways. As a therapist, I say never be afraid to have medication looked at if something doesn't seem to be working.

When it comes to setting boundaries and not being walked all over I've found that self esteem plays a role. I had self esteem issues and I finally had to ask myself "do I believe I'm worth setting boundaries for and standing up for myself?" Yes? "So why am I allowing myself to almost have a panic attack about this issue?" If someone doesn't feel like they're worth it they may allow people to walk all over them. 

[feministxtian]

51 minutes ago, The Mother Dust said:

Hmm, so you did have a different experience with it than what @feministxtian had.  I will be seeing my mom in a couple of weeks (we live in different states) and I will definitely have a (capital C) Conversation with her about it.  Thank you for your input, this has been educational.  ETA, isn't it just amazing how moms can screw their daughters up?  I mean, I guess we see examples of it every day on this board, but even the non-fundies.....geezus.   But you came out the other side @wild little fox   You made it!

I didn't think of that. I'm on a med combo that works for me. It shuts up the little demons that like to run screaming through my head but doesn't really blunt anything. I still have to control my temper and still have a pretty sharp tongue when needed. It took years to find the combo that works for me. I've tried Zoloft (even at the max dose I could barely function), Paxil (made me do nothing but sleep) and a few others until my doctor here hit on the combo that works best. I don't take the anti-anxiety meds every day, they're mostly for when I'm really feeling it and a panic attack is on the horizon. As a result I can function pretty normally. The "cloud of doom" seems to stay away most of the time (it only shows back up if I'm feeling particularly stressed) and now I'm working with a therapist to try to peel away the layers of shit. I can't decide if the low energy is from the meds or from pain and my doctor doesn't want to change my meds. She and my therapist both seem to think the low energy is from pain, and I'm inclined to agree. It's no fun to start to do something and then the pain rears it's ugly-ass head and back on the couch I go. We're also dealing with the effect of not being able to do a lot of things i could do before my car accident (which in their opinion only added to the depression). 

I've been fortunate enough to manage to end up with a pretty good team as far as my psychiatric needs go, still looking for that perfect combo to deal with the pain...we'll see what happens in the new year. 

[SongRed7]

15 hours ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Kyle Smith needs a swift kick in the nuts. Patronizing jerk. 

I read the blog post he linked (Roosh V -- another quality man -- here's all about him: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roosh_V'

All i can say is WTF????!!!!

But of course, Lori leaves the link there.  she's allowed previously links to his work, so she must be in agreement with him. 

[Imrlgoddess]

14 hours ago, feministxtian said:

The mother and the X both swore I'd end up some whore in a gutter

Weeelllll you did end up a founding member of the FreeJinger Whore's Anonymous Official Meeting Group, otherwise known as:  FJWAOMG ( I just made that up, isn't it fabulous?? )

I'm the rebel product of a rebel.  I think my mom thought she wanted the June Cleaver deal but all that went sideways when my dad got sick.  They were pretty standard prior to that though:  he worked, had a temper, drank how he wanted, she stayed home, spotless house, dinner every night.  But she gave as good as she got.  If he threatened her or us, she'd hand it right back to him.  The night he was stupid enough to hit her, she threatened his everlasting rest.  She liked working.  I think if my dad had done more his part at home and not made it all hell for her, our house would have been far more peaceful.  

ETA:  i still have a bundle of anger balled up.  I got married the first time because my parents berated me about "living in sin."  After 11 years of relying on another person to make it, it was damn hard for me to do it alone and do it well.  I ended up moving in with husband no. 2 and living with him for 3 years before we formally committed.  I really hate being married.  I loved my ex, and I love my current fellow, but I hate feeling trapped. My poor therapist gets a kick out of me I'm sure.  

[delphinium65]

16 minutes ago, SongRed7 said:

I read the blog post he linked (Roosh V -- another quality man -- here's all about him: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roosh_V'

All i can say is WTF????!!!!

But of course, Lori leaves the link there.  she's allowed previously links to his work, so she must be in agreement with him. 

With the hours and HOURS of research Lori does every day it's absolutely inconceivable that she doesn't know what kind of person Roosh is, in fact I believe the subject has come up before, or am I mistaken on that?  Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong, but I'm willing to admit when it happens, which is more than Lori can do...but I'm digressing here...anyway, since the all-knowing Godly Mentor allows links to Roosh's writings to remain we can only assume that she agrees with him.  After all, who is she to judge the poor, misunderstood man? (using the term 'man' very, very loosely)    

[feministxtian]

56 minutes ago, Imrlgoddess said:

The night he was stupid enough to hit her, she threatened his everlasting rest. 

aaahhhh...the night my hub got drunk enough to hit me, well...anyway...that's when he woke up in a jail cell. He hit his bottom. I'm happy to say he is 180 degrees off that now...he's a fabulous husband, and apologizes over and over for the first 16 years of our marriage that was rocky as hell. 

[AlwaysDiscerning]

Lori know full well all about Roosh. She quoted one his articles a few months ago but wouldn't link to it so her fan girls wouldn't see the crap she reads. Meanwhile over night. She deleted another women who posted Prov 31. Its all up at Things Godly Women Say page. 

[Lisafer]

14 hours ago, feministxtian said:

I didn't think of that. I'm on a med combo that works for me. It shuts up the little demons that like to run screaming through my head but doesn't really blunt anything. I still have to control my temper and still have a pretty sharp tongue when needed. It took years to find the combo that works for me. I've tried Zoloft (even at the max dose I could barely function), Paxil (made me do nothing but sleep) and a few others until my doctor here hit on the combo that works best. I don't take the anti-anxiety meds every day, they're mostly for when I'm really feeling it and a panic attack is on the horizon. As a result I can function pretty normally. The "cloud of doom" seems to stay away most of the time (it only shows back up if I'm feeling particularly stressed) and now I'm working with a therapist to try to peel away the layers of shit. I can't decide if the low energy is from the meds or from pain and my doctor doesn't want to change my meds. She and my therapist both seem to think the low energy is from pain, and I'm inclined to agree. It's no fun to start to do something and then the pain rears it's ugly-ass head and back on the couch I go. We're also dealing with the effect of not being able to do a lot of things i could do before my car accident (which in their opinion only added to the depression). 

I've been fortunate enough to manage to end up with a pretty good team as far as my psychiatric needs go, still looking for that perfect combo to deal with the pain...we'll see what happens in the new year. 

I can relate to what you're saying. My medication keeps the wild things down to a dull roar most of the time, but I'm snappy and irritable as hell (which seems to be partly due to physical issues). And by "dull roar" I mean that sometimes I go days at a time without suicidal ideation. Sometimes even weeks. I've never attempted anything, but pregnancy and postpartum bring me closer to the edge. My body hates pregnancy hormones! And I was medicated for both pregnancies--only had one nurse kind of question me about the safety of the SSRIs. Lady, medicated mama is better than psycho suicidal mama, thank you very much!

[ladyicantxplain]

15 minutes ago, AlwaysDiscerning said:

Lori know full well all about Roosh. She quoted one his articles a few months ago but wouldn't link to it so her fan girls wouldn't see the crap she reads. Meanwhile over night. She deleted another women who posted Prov 31. Its all up at Things Godly Women Say page. 

Yes, she is well aware of Roosh V.  I called her out on Roosh V. as well, on her public facebook blog in the comments, which she ignored but did not delete.  

Are you saying there is ANOTHER comment with a link to Roosh V. remaining on a recent post?  Where is it, please?  I am not seeing it...