Duggars by the Dozen 35: Five Months with no Pregnant Duggars. How much longer will it last?

[Mama Mia]

4 hours ago, Iamtheway said:

I am the same age as Kendra’s mom but look older then her. I have a 4 year old. It’s really weird to think that I could be Kendras mom and a grandma right now. I don’t feel almost 40 and am still surprised when people born in the 1990’s are adults.

That photo of Jer does look like he and the girl in the middle brought two cheperones each on their date. But if that was the case I don’t think they would let anyone share the photo before it was announced so probably just friends. 

My mom became a Grandma at 38 when I had my 1st child. Her best friend since childhood had her 1st baby a year later.Her two children and my mom’s two oldest grandchildren were cLose in age, So my mom would bring her grandchildren and her best friend would bring her kids and they would go on outings. They had a lot of fun. Interestingly, all of those kids are now in their 30’s.  and my mom is a great-grandma of school age children, and her friend doesn’t have grandchildren yet.

[nausicaa]

3 hours ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

I hope their kids have babies NOW and get them raised and out of the house so they'll still be young enough to go places and do things.

OR we could hope they do what they would like and have kids when they are emotionally, financially, and intellectually ready? 

And just to put in a word for the people who wait to have kids-- all of those traveling, career, and relationship experiences can help to inform their parenting. 

The "you have to have kids young" theme on FJ is so weird to me. (And the OP didn't say anything about where any of her friends' adult kids are in life. They could be nineteen and battling a drug addiction and bankruptcy for all we know. But they still have to have their babies "NOW," I guess.) And if someone is in such a rush to be done raising kids and getting them out of the house, why not skip having kids altogether? It's not a requirement. 

[Rachel333]

I hate the secret adoption stories where supposedly everyone knows except the adoptee, even well into adulthood. I think the adoptees deserve to know the truth about their origins, but I also wonder why other family members are spreading the story at all if they're not going to tell the person the secret is actually about. Sometimes I also wonder if the adoption story is really true or if people are just spreading rumors.

[Rachel333]

1 hour ago, nausicaa said:

The "you have to have kids young" theme on FJ is so weird to me. (And the OP didn't say anything about where any of her friends' adult kids are in life. They could be nineteen and battling a drug addiction and bankruptcy for all we know. But they still have to have their babies "NOW," I guess.) And if someone is in such a rush to be done raising kids and getting them out of the house, why not skip having kids altogether? It's not a requirement. 

Plus things don't always go to plan. You might have kids that will continue to need care into adulthood, or you might end up having to raise your grandchildren like an unfortunately large number of grandparents.

Then there are all the people who think they're done having kids but decide to have more after all, often because they're with a new partner. Or who get pregnant accidentally.

(My "aunt Susie" story: my mom had a friend who had two children fairly young and thought she was done, then divorced and remarried and had two more children with her second husband when she was in her late 30s. Then in her very late 40s she accidentally got pregnant again. She took a while to warm up to that pregnancy as she definitely didn't want to be starting over with a baby when she was nearing 50!)

That's not to say you shouldn't make plans, I just don't like it when people think others should have the same plan.

I don't like the pressure put on young couples to have children right away. It's not just FJ by any means. Let people do things on their own timelines! Or not at all, for that matter. It's amazing how some people will get downright offended at the idea of others choosing not to have children.

[ihaveanexamintwodays]

gah, some of these stories are just wild, haha. i would love to have a house full of zillions of children except.... 1) i don't think i could stand being pregnant that many times 2) i don't think i could stand labor that many times 3) kids are expensive as shit, lol. i won't be in a good situation to spawn until i'm 30, anyways xD and many of my friends from college will be done having kids by the time i start! 

[sleepy_doggos]

I'll throw my Catholic grandma in the mix. She was 1 of 14 kids and only the 2nd girl! Unfortunately a badly burst appendicitis when she was a teenager left her unable to bear children. She and my grandpa adopted 4 kids and I believe my mom was one of almost 50 first cousins from her side alone.

[grandmadugger]

I have always said I could write a book about one side of the family and everyone would think it was fiction. 

Grandma works as a caregiver for a man and his dying wife. Wife dies and the man marries the caregiver. My grandparents have six children. I am not sure if 6 was born when they divorced or if she was pregnant with 6. So now grandma is a single mother of 6 kids and she can’t afford all of them. The two oldest live with dad, middle two with mom, and the youngest two get adopted. Sometime later she remarried and had two more kids. Or at least that’s the story I had always been told. Years later we are reconnected with the two that were adopted. It was sad because by this time two full siblings and one half sibling had passed but it has been great to have them in our lives. Fast forward to grandma passing away. I am at the service and there’s a woman talking to an uncle. I have no idea who this woman is. I ask a cousin who doesn’t know either. We start asking around because she’s the only person we don’t know. Finally, we find someone who will tell us. The mystery woman is our aunt. Between marriages grandma had another child and put her up for adoption. How on earth she hid a pregnancy from 4 kids we will never know. The 4 kids were 16, 14, 11, and 9 so old enough to notice. 

[Mama Mia]

44 minutes ago, grandmadugger said:

I have always said I could write a book about one side of the family and everyone would think it was fiction. 

Grandma works as a caregiver for a man and his dying wife. Wife dies and the man marries the caregiver. My grandparents have six children. I am not sure if 6 was born when they divorced or if she was pregnant with 6. So now grandma is a single mother of 6 kids and she can’t afford all of them. The two oldest live with dad, middle two with mom, and the youngest two get adopted. Sometime later she remarried and had two more kids. Or at least that’s the story I had always been told. Years later we are reconnected with the two that were adopted. It was sad because by this time two full siblings and one half sibling had passed but it has been great to have them in our lives. Fast forward to grandma passing away. I am at the service and there’s a woman talking to an uncle. I have no idea who this woman is. I ask a cousin who doesn’t know either. We start asking around because she’s the only person we don’t know. Finally, we find someone who will tell us. The mystery woman is our aunt. Between marriages grandma had another child and put her up for adoption. How on earth she hid a pregnancy from 4 kids we will never know. The 4 kids were 16, 14, 11, and 9 so old enough to notice. 

That’s a really interesting family story! How did Mystery Aunt connect with the rest of the family? 

It’s really interesting now with social media how many people are connecting with family they didn’t know they had. I know several people who found siblings from their estranged mother or father’s side... they may have vaguely knew their parent had other kids, but never knew anything about each other, and are now talking,

[eveandadam]

3 hours ago, luv2laugh said:

People have babies after 35 all the time. They’re just more prepared to put money towards achieving their family through fertility treatments and are ok with a small family. God forbid if they can’t have a biological child, they’re fine with adopting.

If I need to focus on my career for awhile, I don’t see a huge deal in freezing my eggs. If I will become a parent whether it’s biological or through adoption but I want it to happen on my terms and fuck the Lori Alexanders who think differently and want to meddle in my business.

This happened in my family. I was born in East Germany and before 1990 people would become parents super young, usually late teens to early twenties when the first child was born. The consens in my family, to this day, is, that a woman should not get pregnant past 30 because that's apparently bad for the mother and the child or something. My own mother told me that I should not get pregnant after 30, I was 32 years old when she told me. So she would rather not become a grandma than seeing me have a child at older than 30. 10 or so years ago it was probagated in the media that women after 35 would have it super duper duper hard to get pregnant anyway, which would also be another confirmation for my family to pressure us (my cousin and myself) further. My cousin gave in and had all her children before turning 30. I do not have any children and I'm 34. At a recent family event the sister of my grandpa asked how old I am, I said 34, and she was looking at me sad and told my grandma that it could be too late.

A cousin of my mother became pregnant at 39 because of all the false information. She genuinely thought she could not get pregnant anymore even though she is highly educated and has access to the internet, obviously. She was so surprised to find out that women can have babies fairly easily after 35.

[luv2laugh]

These people are so ridiculous and messed up. Many people get pregnant after 35 especially with the help of (expensive) fertility treatments. Also, there is absolutely nothing wrong with adopting. In fact, more people need to be adopting. I may adopt regardless if I have biological children or not. My aunt adopted and I cannot imagine life without my cousins.

[Melissa1977]

3 hours ago, luv2laugh said:

People have babies after 35 all the time. They’re just more prepared to put money towards achieving their family through fertility treatments and are ok with a small family. God forbid if they can’t have a biological child, they’re fine with adopting.

If I need to focus on my career for awhile, I don’t see a huge deal in freezing my eggs. If I will become a parent whether it’s biological or through adoption but I want it to happen on my terms and fuck the Lori Alexanders who think differently and want to meddle in my business.

Most of my friends became parents in their late 30 or even 40 something. Some with fertility treatments, other naturally, other adopting. It's a common situation in my country, caused by financial insecurity and extremelly expensive rents/houses. But in my opinion, bodies are really not the same at 25-30 that at 40-45. Pregnancies are more risky, waking up at night is harder, and I can't imagine *fighting* with a teenager at 60 years old.

If there is no option, and you cannot have kids at a young age (for your career, for lack of money or lack of a right partner) it's ok to wait, of course. But when people say having kids at 40 years old is the same than having them younger, usually it is not.

I'm saying this based on my experience (a big gap between my pregnancies) and comparing the young parents I know to the *older* ones. I know it's not a scientific comparison, just ordinary live observation.

 

[luv2laugh]

People that complain about women becoming older moms whether it be through natural means, fertility treatments, or adoption, are trying to hold women back. The scare tactics and guilt that people throw on a woman for her choices amaze me!!! Many love to scare women with the risks of autism and Downes Syndrome (even twins) of a later pregnancy.

Women are smart enough to understand and read the studies of the facts and the risks of a pregnancy.  Pregnancy -at any age- will always come with risks. I trust the published medical research on Pubmed as well as the opinions of doctors that have done fellowships in fertility based endocrinology and practice as fertility doctors. Many women can get pregnant after 35 and many will need help with fertility treatments. Some women can get pregnant in their 40s but some are using eggs that they’ve had frozen. Women that choose to delay their pregnancies are usually ok with either a natural pregnancy, spending money on fertility treatments & freezing their eggs, or adopting. Adoption is a beautiful thing.

I trust the decision a woman makes on timing her family and let’s not judge women for making the decision of when and how they go about having a family.

If I know I’m not going to have babies until after 35, I will freeze my eggs and plan to pursue IVF (and budget accordingly) along with not being opposed to adopting.

I’d like to have two kids and I can see myself adopting as well. 

[Melissa1977]

@luv2laugh pregnancy is a women issue, but parenthood is (usually) for men and women and it gets harder for both as they got older. You think parenting is the same no matter your age and downvoted me for saying that in my experience (me and my acquitances, already parents) isn't. I'm not against having kids in your forties, I'm only saying energy (even health) is not the same, and it gots worse as they kids approach teen ages. Not for women, but for both men and women.

I'll be 50 when my youngest will be 13. I chose that. And I'm happy with that. But by any means I expect it to be easy. I have also a teenager now and I know I won't be as energetic and focused in a decade, with my menopause and my husband's andropause.

 

[luv2laugh]

I haven’t said anything about energy. I trust that women making this decision know the pros and cons of having children at each age. It’s not merely age that dictates how exhausted you’ll feel either...

Women are smart and they do their research. It’s a decision between them, their partner, and their doctor. I can’t stand fucking Lori and her ilk ranting about when women choose to become a mother and how. 

Perhaps it’s exhausting physically but I’ve heard from many women that it’s much easier financially to wait to have children in your mid- late thirties and that’s what I plan to do. 

My friend had a baby at 20 and she ended up getting divorced. She thought she’d be a stay at home Mom her entire life. She has two kids now, is 26, and and works extremely long hours. She is very exhausted and is struggling. I feel so bad for her and babysit whenever I can to help.

I also can’t stand younger moms that rip on women for being an older mom.

[SweetJuly]

6 hours ago, ihaveanexamintwodays said:

gah, some of these stories are just wild, haha. i would love to have a house full of zillions of children except.... 1) i don't think i could stand being pregnant that many times 2) i don't think i could stand labor that many times 3) kids are expensive as shit, lol. i won't be in a good situation to spawn until i'm 30, anyways xD and many of my friends from college will be done having kids by the time i start! 

I've had some minor complaints during pregnancy, but all in all pregnancy, labour and delivery were smooth sailing for me. I actually enjoyed it, and although my body didn't do a Catherine Duchess of Cambridge it looks exactly as it did before 4 months after LittleJuly's birth without me putting in any effort. What a shame I'm not fundie, I can totally picture myself popping one out every year! Of course it's different for everyone, but don't be deterred by some of the horror stories you hear. It doesn't have to be terrible.

It's true that kids are expensive, though.

And the first weeks/months of being a first time parent are tough. People don't often talk about it (they will come out of the woodwork if you make the first step of mentioning that you struggle with this or that), but the first 2-3 months tend to be rather difficult even with the sweetest, most easygoing baby who sleeps reasonably well (aka LittleJuly).

 

TL;DR: Have kids when you feel ready. And when you do, don't be afraid. You got this

[SassyPants]

I think deciding when to have a family is an individual couple’s decision. Personally, I had mine at 28 and 31, and for us it was perfect. Old enough to be educated and with established careers and many experiences under our belts, yet now,  that I am older and my kids are launched, I am happy that college tuition did not collide with my retirement plans, like it has for many of my friends who started their families at a later age. 

[Mama Mia]

1 hour ago, luv2laugh said:

I haven’t said anything about energy. I trust that women making this decision know the pros and cons of having children at each age. It’s not merely age that dictates how exhausted you’ll feel either...

Women are smart and they do their research. It’s a decision between them, their partner, and their doctor. I can’t stand fucking Lori and her ilk ranting about when women choose to become a mother and how. 

Perhaps it’s exhausting physically but I’ve heard from many women that it’s much easier financially to wait to have children in your mid- late thirties and that’s what I plan to do. 

My friend had a baby at 20 and she ended up getting divorced. She thought she’d be a stay at home Mom her entire life. She has two kids now, is 26, and and works extremely long hours. She is very exhausted and is struggling. I feel so bad for her and babysit whenever I can to help.

I also can’t stand younger moms that rip on women for being an older mom.

So why do you feel it’s ok to act like being a younger mom is worse? You sound awfully judgemental about choices other than yours.

There are benefits and drawbacks to EVERY age and configuration of parenting and childbearing. I know many young couples who have broken up after having children - I also know many couples who intentionally waited who broke up after having children. The change in lifestyle and expectation was too extreme. 

If you want to wait until you’re 40, good for you, but, frankly, acting like healthy  babies are just there for the adopting ( hint, they aren’t ) , or that IVF and related fertility treatments are just a sure fire breeze - because apparently $$$ solves everything - comes across as both naive and insulting. 

eta: That came out harsher than I intended. I apologize. In my area the pressure is more on women to wait as long as possible to have children, largely due to cost. 

[SweetJuly]

4 hours ago, luv2laugh said:

If I know I’m not going to have babies until after 35, I will freeze my eggs and plan to pursue IVF (and budget accordingly) along with not being opposed to adopting.

I agree with a lot of what you said, but egg freezing is unfortunately a lot trickier than many people believe (myself included before I looked it up)

Apparently oocytes don't take freezing very well - many of them don't survive being thawed, and I think there is also limitations on how long they can be stored. Also, you may want to consider freezing them quite young, such as in your early 20s (when you perhaps don't have the financial means to do so) as the quantity and quality of available oocytes decreases with age, i.e. it may be a bad idea to start looking into this in your 30s. The technology surrounding egg freezing might improve in the future, but from what I understand currently it's a bit of a rip-off.

[SweetJuly]

As always, women just can't do it right - they're judged if they have children too young, they're judged if they have children too old.

Frankly, do what feels right for you. Don't give in to social pressure. It's never an objectively "good" time to have kids - children will completely shake up and change your life, no matter in what situation you have them. Want to have kids while studying? Go ahead! Want to establish your career and travel the world first? Go ahead! Want to have kids young? Go ahead! Want to have kids when you're a bit older? Go ahead!

Personally it was important for me to be prepared and well-established financially before starting a family, but other people manage on a much lower budget or in much more difficult situations, and that's fine with me as long as they are happy with this.

My only advice would be to select the person with whom you intend to have or raise children with care. You will forever be connected to this person in one way or another, even if you break up. The more love, respect, and trust there is between you the better.

[AliceInFundyland]

Really, it’s just never easy. I feel compelled to insert my own perspective again. From the time I was 11 I was, “No babies.” Sometime in my twenties I changed that to, maybe I would adopt an older child later on. Then I got cysts at 30 and was told I needed a hysterectomy at 40. Now I am 39. Having just cleared out medical debt I am thinking about more impending surgery and hormonal changes.

And, no life partner (Not that it’s a requirement)

So an impending forced end to my fertility. What if I got pregnant? I have admitted to myselfI couldn’t end it at this point. But am I in shape for motherhood? Certainly not financially. Probably not mentally. You get to an older age and that can be the case. But  I have a harder time than I thought I would severing this path.

Not that I would go back and have a baby at 18 or 25 or 35. Just that having some intended “plan” about your fertility and what’s going to happen and how it will all work out for you and how it is going to feel is not always what does happen.

[luv2laugh]

@Mama Mia Yes, that was unusually harsh and you've been mistaken on the tone of my posts. My point is that women need to stop judging other women for when and how they decide to have a family. I'm 26 and I've actually already met with a doctor at a research hospital that specialized in fertility endocrinology. He said that my eggs are really healthy and that I shouldn't be worried about any of this right now. I met with him over some weird symptoms my birth control gave me and I went off of it. 

For me, it makes more sense to plan my family around my career and when I'll be better off financially (it's something a lot of my peers are doing as well here), which likely means I'm going to have children in my mid-late thirties. I find a lot of younger (fundie) moms, especially of the Lori A kind, are very judgmental around women that don't give birth in their 20s and like to throw scare tactics at women who wait as well as guilt trip them.

I'm very familiar with adoption as my aunt adopted two babies when she could not get pregnant and those cousins are my best friends today.

Honestly, family planning is a discussion a woman only needs to have with her spouse and doctor. I don't even understand why people debate it.

[VelociRapture]

I had a baby at 28 and I’m hoping to have another one before I’m 34 - preferably closer to 31 or 32. I have absolutely nothing against older moms (you do you!), but given my medical history and personal experience it definitely isn’t something I would want for myself or my family. My only advice for anyone is to consider your options, pick what feels right for you, understand things may not work out as you planned, and pick a partner carefully (if you even want a partner.) 

As for number of kids, I wanted four or five for a long time. Having gone through a miscarriage, experiencing very bad morning sickness, and having a premature birth (among many other factors like finances and environmental concerns) made me really reasses that though. We’re currently settled on having only two. If my next pregnancy goes well and ends with a healthy full term baby then we may consider a third child, but I doubt we’ll go for it. It definitely makes me sad at times, but life isn’t fair and I just mostly feel really lucky to even have the one kid I have. She’s pretty awesome.  

ETA: Also, don’t tell Velocipuppy I forgot to count her as one of my babies. 

[xenobia]

1 hour ago, SweetJuly said:

As always, women just can't do it right - they're judged if they have children too young, they're judged if they have children too old.

And just imagine if you don't want kids at all, but have been raised in a christian (no fundie) environment. That's me. I'm 48 now, and I've opted out on motherhood. It just isn't my thing. I don't hate kids. There are some kids I really can't stand, and others that are really fun to hang around. It's the same with adults. I don't like all of those either. But kids aren't for me. And I'm glad that my husband feels the same way. If he didn't, I don't think we would be married now. 

But I'm glad that there are so many of my friends and family members who wanted kids that were acually able to become parents. It's not always a straight and easy path. There are also some people around me who really wanted to be parents, but for different reasons, it never happened. They are not helped by the "Children are the meaning of Life"-crap. (Yes, I said crap). 

[SorenaJ]

1 hour ago, SweetJuly said:

It's true that kids are expensive, though.

I don't have any kids yet, so why are kids expensive? I can see nappies, and later on, after-school activities and a smart phone, but what else? 

[SapphireSlytherin]

9 hours ago, nausicaa said:

The "you have to have kids young" theme on FJ is so weird to me.

I was unaware that this was a theme on FJ.

My response was strictly in response to someone wishing a "fully, happy life" (paraphrased, not literal quotes) before having children. I am of the opinion that you can have children young, while still having a full, happy life - with even more fun/happiness after you've successfully launched your children. That's all.

27 minutes ago, SorenaJ said:

I don't have any kids yet, so why are kids expensive? I can see nappies, and later on, after-school activities and a smart phone, but what else? 

Clothes, shoes, music/dance/soccer lessons, healthcare, food, books, toys, larger house, bigger car, etc. Plus, in our case, private school - her senior year of high school cost us about $12,000.