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Lawson Bates 3


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The IBLP board members (and especially the Bates, who have the biggest media platform) are very very invested in pushing the narrative that Gothard was a bad apple, IBLP was essentially good, and now that he's gone everything is lovely. They really want people to believe this so that they can continue selling IBLP and benefiting from the power structures it upholds.

34 minutes ago, TatiFish9 said:

I have watched a documentary on Gothard, how he rose to power and what his motivations were for starting IBLP. I have also seen youtube clips from ex-members. Outside of that, I do not know everything about IBLP.

If you're interested in going down the rabbit hole of what IBLP and ATI are about and why people here are convinced that shit's fucked, I recommend reading through Homeschoolers Anonymous' series on ATI (and their site's ATI and IBLP tags) plus visiting Recovering Grace, which is Gothard-centric but gives you an idea of how abuse is diffused all throughout IBLP's system.

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For me, the one who comes closest to changing believes would be Zach. He kissed before marriage and has made comments in the past that challenged Gil and Kelly on their believes in courtship vs. dating. Also Whitney is having a career outside of the home, even with two kids. 

If he did not come from the Bates family I would not consider them fundie but 'just' conservative.

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Zach kissed before marriage and then went to his parents and confessed and repented and told everyone that they made a mistake and regretted it. Sorry, I just always feel the need to point that out when people talk about Zach kissing before marriage. Hopefully that was just them succumbing to the pressure, and they truly don't think anything is wrong with kissing before marriage and won't try to pressure their kids in that direction.

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15 hours ago, TatiFish9 said:

Anyhow, from now on I will leave my comments about the Bates and IBLP to a minimum because I see both represent something deeper, more symbolic to others than they do to me. I think that is more important to respect than posting my speculations. 

Honestly, I wish the deeper discussions were the ones people would stick with instead of the fluffy stuff. If you feel like there are aspects of IBLP that can be saved, then state what they are. If you don't know enough about the cult to say what needs saying, then educate yourself or realize that maybe the Bates family isn't as nice as you seem to think. IBLP doesn't have a symbolic meaning to me, it is actually a very, very dangerous organization. It is disheartening to see that even at FJ the Bates have done such a good job of sugar coating their bad side that members here don't want to accept that the family is part of something, not just bad, but evil. 

One of the sponsors of the IBLP family conference is the Bates Family, all of them. They are all still a part of pushing promoting something terrible. 

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@TatiFish9 Please educate yourself before you jump into these things. Otherwise, you are simply outing yourself as a troll. Here is the board of IBLP. Note two of the four members are the fathers of Erin Bates, who had a birthday cake for Gothard at her wedding, and her husband, Chad Paine.

https://iblp.org/about-iblp/corporate-information/board-directors

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3 hours ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

@TatiFish9 Please educate yourself before you jump into these things. Otherwise, you are simply outing yourself as a troll. Here is the board of IBLP. Note two of the four members are the fathers of Erin Bates, who had a birthday cake for Gothard at her wedding, and her husband, Chad Paine.

https://iblp.org/about-iblp/corporate-information/board-directors

What is quite striking about that page is that 3 of 4 board members are highly educated from mostly secular universities yet they work for an organisation that seeks to deny their children those educational opportunities 

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17 hours ago, singsingsing said:

Zach kissed before marriage and then went to his parents and confessed and repented and told everyone that they made a mistake and regretted it. Sorry, I just always feel the need to point that out when people talk about Zach kissing before marriage. Hopefully that was just them succumbing to the pressure, and they truly don't think anything is wrong with kissing before marriage and won't try to pressure their kids in that direction.

I think it was a combination of pressure as well as still being young. Just the way he reacts lately to his parents view of courting makes me think that he would not be as strict for their own kids. I don't know the exact words but he made a snappy comment a while back about how Gil and Kelly did more of a 'normal' dating than the Bates kids. 

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4 hours ago, BlessaYourHeart said:

What is quite striking about that page is that 3 of 4 board members are highly educated from mostly secular universities yet they work for an organisation that seeks to deny their children those educational opportunities 

Yes, it is amazing isn’t it?

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Gil and Kelly got an education and look what they did to their kids! Mid-evil? Alyssa is going to end up being a Jill Rod. where her kids are even more uneducated than she. 

This is an interesting look at some of the many, many issues in IBLP and makes it pretty clear why there is no saving this organization. It also shows how absolutely corrupt Gil and the rest of the BoD are. They did a half-assed investigation, but even that must have turned up something because they won't show anyone the results. 

http://heresyintheheartland.blogspot.com/2014/06/a-real-investigation-into-iblp.html

I actually learned something reading this. I had no idea Gothard and Gwen were connected but it looks like he got involved with Weigh Down at some point. 

Quote

also mandatory weight checks (Weigh Down) for staff women, involuntary diets, forced exercise

 

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After lurking for over 4 years, I joined a few months ago, and now I can say I'm pretty much fully vested in FJ. Last night when Lawson pronounced epitome as 'EPuh-tome' (toam?) I thought I couldn't wait to see what FJ had to say. Here I am this morning and I'm disappointed in you all. Really, we can make fun of 'mid-evil' but we leave EPuh-tome alone? Or perhaps you are at work... still sleeping... haven't yet watched the show from last night. If you haven't watched it, it is not worth watching, except for Lawson saying that one word.

I've heard similar mispronunciations over the decades, and it happens. For some reason it is funny when it comes from SOTDRT.

And early on I promised myself I would add to discussions only about stuff associated with their belief dangers. Obviously THAT hasn't happened.

Edited by Bobology
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54 minutes ago, Bobology said:

After lurking for over 4 years, I joined a few months ago, and now I can say I'm pretty much fully vested in FJ. Last night when Lawson pronounced epitome as 'EPuh-tome' (toam?) I thought I couldn't wait to see what FJ had to say

I gasped!  It was really funny, I love that they didn’t edit it out.

That was an annoying episode. They spent so much time blathering on about the questions vs. just answering the questions. 

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It says to me that he's probably read the word but has never heard it pronounced.  Something I've had happen to me.  Fortunately, I had people who kindly corrected my pronunciation.  Sadly, Lawson is a victim of SRODRT

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1 hour ago, clueliss said:

It says to me that he's probably read the word but has never heard it pronounced. 

 

2 hours ago, Bobology said:

epitome

 

2 hours ago, Bobology said:

EPuh-tome'

He probably hasn't heard it pronounced, but it is odd that he would say it that way. Even sounding it out it wouldn't be pronounced like that!

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3 hours ago, Bobology said:

After lurking for over 4 years, I joined a few months ago, and now I can say I'm pretty much fully vested in FJ. Last night when Lawson pronounced epitome as 'EPuh-tome' (toam?) I thought I couldn't wait to see what FJ had to say. Here I am this morning and I'm disappointed in you all. Really, we can make fun of 'mid-evil' but we leave EPuh-tome alone? Or perhaps you are at work... still sleeping... haven't yet watched the show from last night. If you haven't watched it, it is not worth watching, except for Lawson saying that one word.

I've heard similar mispronunciations over the decades, and it happens. For some reason it is funny when it comes from SOTDRT.

And early on I promised myself I would add to discussions only about stuff associated with their belief dangers. Obviously THAT hasn't happened.

Sadly i have not been able to watch the show this year, the youtube channel that had been uploading it in private stoped doing it, so i kind of depend on the recaps of batesfamilyblog now.

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I pronounced epitome like “EH-pi-tohm” the first time I said it out loud. It was one of those words that I had read a lot but never heard before. I still sometimes pronounce it that way in my head when I’m not paying attention. 

I thought it was silly to hear Lawson say it that way, but I don’t blame him. At least he tried using a word that may not be as frequently used by those around him. ?‍♀️

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I was just coming on to say that he say Epi-tome.  I mispronounce things all the time but I did catch that one. 

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18 hours ago, Bobology said:

After lurking for over 4 years, I joined a few months ago, and now I can say I'm pretty much fully vested in FJ. Last night when Lawson pronounced epitome as 'EPuh-tome' (toam?) I thought I couldn't wait to see what FJ had to say. Here I am this morning and I'm disappointed in you all. Really, we can make fun of 'mid-evil' but we leave EPuh-tome alone? Or perhaps you are at work... still sleeping... haven't yet watched the show from last night. If you haven't watched it, it is not worth watching, except for Lawson saying that one word.

I've heard similar mispronunciations over the decades, and it happens. For some reason it is funny when it comes from SOTDRT.

And early on I promised myself I would add to discussions only about stuff associated with their belief dangers. Obviously THAT hasn't happened.

This actually happens a lot if you're someone who learns a lot of vocabulary through reading!

English and its inconsistent pronunciation rules, lol

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I just heard it too. ? I have a bad habit of doing this too though. The most embarrassing one was when I used the word cacophony.  I pronounced it kak-oh-phony. I like @seraaa 's take on it. It's from being an avid reader. ?

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I pronounced epitome like ep-i-tome for ages, because it was a word I'd read, but never heard said.  I got mocked for this, and the way I said execrable, by an ex, and it really hurt - I felt so stupid.  And just a few weeks ago, I got laughed at by friends for how I said cephalopod.  My heart is always with people who read books, and loved words, but are using them self-taught, and I hope that if I ever correct someone's pronunciation, I do it with grace and kindness - I don't see what the problem is, as long as the meaning is understood.

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1 hour ago, Lurky said:

My heart is always with people who read books, and loved words, but are using them self-taught

Is 'epitome' in the bible anywhere? If not, at least we have proof Lawson reads other stuff. It makes me wonder how many of the Bates pronounce it the way he did. I also wonder how many of them know the cardinal directions... Alyssa may not be the only one who can't do that.

FWIW, I just learned a new word, palaver, in one of the Duggar threads. I headed out to find out how it is pronounced and my head was saying it incorrectly. 

Edited by Bobology
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It messed with me when he said it like that. I'm guilty of reading words and then not knowing how to correctly say them because I've never heard them spoken. So then I wasn't sure if I was right about epitome or if he was saying it right. I had to google so he gets a pass from me. He used it correctly so he knows what it means. 

I'm trying so hard to remember the couple of words I did that with and my dad made fun of me (Better than doing it on television or accidentally spelling medieval wrong on social media and getting roasted). Dang, I wish I could remember. 

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I said “in memorandum “ outfucking loud in front of my family instead of saying “in memoriam.” I felt stupid for about a minute and then proceeded to laugh about it pretty hard. I still start laughing when I think about it.

 I was unsure how it was pronounced but I went ahead and said it instead of asking like a normal person. If you can’t laugh at your own mistakes life gets too stressful. 

I can’t help but laugh now during the sad part of award ceremonies.

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On 2/20/2019 at 3:07 AM, BlessaYourHeart said:

What is quite striking about that page is that 3 of 4 board members are highly educated from mostly secular universities yet they work for an organisation that seeks to deny their children those educational opportunities 

Gil doesn't even mention his education in his description.

Did he or Kelly actually graduate with degrees?

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15 hours ago, TeaELSee said:

I said “in memorandum “ outfucking loud in front of my family instead of saying “in memoriam.” I felt stupid for about a minute and then proceeded to laugh about it pretty hard. I still start laughing when I think about it.

 I was unsure how it was pronounced but I went ahead and said it instead of asking like a normal person. If you can’t laugh at your own mistakes life gets too stressful. 

I can’t help but laugh now during the sad part of award ceremonies.

For the longest time I had such difficulty saying municipal. One day I sat and repeated it to myself probably around 50 times until I stopped stumbling over it. Not sure what my problem was, but it was a struggle. 

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On 2/20/2019 at 3:07 AM, BlessaYourHeart said:

What is quite striking about that page is that 3 of 4 board members are highly educated from mostly secular universities yet they work for an organisation that seeks to deny their children those educational opportunities 

 

On 2/20/2019 at 8:20 AM, formergothardite said:

Gil and Kelly got an education and look what they did to their kids! Mid-evil? Alyssa is going to end up being a Jill Rod. where her kids are even more uneducated than she. 

 

On 2/20/2019 at 7:34 AM, nelliebelle1197 said:

Yes, it is amazing isn’t it?

It is striking, but it makes sense if you think about it. Ignorance , or rather, keeping "the flock" ignorant, is IMO one of the most powerful mass control tools out there. Education brings critical thinking, which brings questioning, which brings "rebellion" to the tyrant of the day. 

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