Dillards 65: Standard Cringe, New Atrocious Signage

[PennySycamore]

@Flossie,  I don't even recall what thread it was in.  Maybe the Rods thread about the time that they lost poor Snuggles in Spokane?  Anyone remember?  

Genuine service animals and real emotional support animals are wonderful, but the fake ones hurt the people that really need them.  A few months ago, a young woman was about to board a plane with her "Emotional Support" hamster only to be told by a Spirit Airlines employee that she could not have her hamster on the plane.  She flushed it down the toilet in the airport. 

Here's The Guardian's story on the incident:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/feb/08/spirit-airlines-emotional-support-hamster-flush-toilet-florida

[HerNameIsBuffy]

2 hours ago, PennySycamore said:

How much of an emotional support animal can a hamster be when you are willing to flush the poor hammy down the airplane toilet?

It's official.  People are monsters.

[justodd]

20 hours ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

It would be soothing to me too, as well as highly distracting.

As someone who loves animals far more than people in my perfect world they would be allowed everywhere safe for them.  But in that perfect world allergies wouldn't exist nor would fear of dogs - in this world both of those are very real things.

Slight derail, but I am one of those people with a severe dog phobia. I get that dog lovers can’t wrap their heads around the idea that someone might see their beloved as something to fear, but that’s the thing about phobias - they are, pretty much by definition, not rational. The person with the phobia has likely been dealing with it for YEARS before they met you/your pup, and it’s not something they’ll be able to ignore/get over/hit the pause button on just because they’ve met *your* pet. No matter how strong the urge to defend your pet may be, never - and I mean NEVER - respond to their admission of fear by insisting that yours is safe/harmless/nothing to fear/etc., and ESPECIALLY never move the animal closer to the phobic person. It is incredibly cruel from that person’s position, because you are literally thrusting something terrifying at them while dismissing what is, to them, a very real emotional response that they can not control. Ignoring/dismissing someone’s fear can have tragic consequences in the worst of situations, and in the best, you’ll still leave someone with the understanding that their emotional needs mean absolutely nothing to you, and you are not someone to be trusted. If that sounds unduly harsh, imagine telling someone holding a butcher knife that you’re afraid of knives. Instead of removing the knife from the situation, they start stabbing the air around your face while insisting there’s nothing to be afraid of because this knife never hurt anyone and it’s just so pretty and shiny. That’s exactly how it feels to me every time someone responds to my admission of fear by urging their dog toward me. 

I may not always understand other people’s fears (I will go to my grave thinking clowns are delightful), but I do my best to respect them and not place extra emotional labor on anyone who’s dealing with one. It’s nothing short of exhausting to constantly reassure someone else that no, it’s not personal; no, I don’t understand why I feel the way I do or where it comes from; no, I can’t make exceptions for Fluffy/Bowser/Clyde because they’re just so cute...so just don’t, okay? Trust me, most people with phobias have already heard everything you’re going to say, and if it hasn’t helped before, it won’t be any different now. 

Someone in the midst of a phobic encounter has little control over how they respond. You have a lot more control over how you respond to them. Please, try to see things from their perspective and show the kindness and compassion you’d want someone to offer you. 

[Lurky]

In a usual family, I think kids being taken to see university campuses is brilliant, to give them a real idea of what it's like - especially when their parents are mature students, and/or the first person in their family to go to uni etc etc.  It's not saying that all kids should go to uni, but it shows them that they have a choice. 

But it this case it just highlights the weird discrepancy in what Derick is allowed (on his 3rd course of post-school study, at least), what Jill was allowed ("training" with a dangerous "midwife") and what will happen to their children, if they will only be taught by Jill, whose education was prioritised way below her raising her siblings, keeping the house clean and appearing on TV. 

I can't bash Jill wanting to hang around campus, because what I'm getting from these posts is she would really love to be a student herself - and in an ideal world, once Derick has finished this round, her two kids would be in school and she'd be able to do some courses to get her to the level to be able to go to university, and to do a degree too.  But Derick's the last of the Duggar in-laws who'd support his wife in something like that.  I guess at least he's not telling her she's not allowed to come to campus, so she feels involved in his life.

[zee_four]

3 hours ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Your whole post was great - just snipped for space.  I completely agree...when you have a service animal (and you can't get them without training) and someone with major allergies then the school should deal on a case to case basis to make sure both student's needs are met.

I was responding to why anyone might complain about a dog...there are some valid reasons one might have an issue with a dog in the classroom (or workplace or where ever.)  

I am always teamrescue and teamservice dogs. 

Thanks! Sorry if it came across like I was calling you out, I actually agree there's a lot of dog owners who are disrespectful and or inappropriate with their pets in public spaces. Nowadays there's also sooooo many people abusing the exception for service animals. They either claim an emotional support animal or even worse a pet theyve labeled as one by themselves, are actual service animals. They're not trained and almost always act out, barking, jumping on people, running around, ie. acting like an untrained pet. It's really hurtful to people with actual service animals.

 

My dogs legit training has been impacted by people like this. While wearing a vest, on a short leash, sitting right beside me one day at a clinic I go to regularly, a guys dog, not on a leash, ran into the room right at us barking. My dog is being trained to alert me about things like this, that I might not hear, especially beside or behind me. My dog defended me, a little too aggressively. I immediately took him in the hall to 1) get away from the other dog and 2) do corrective training. The other guy still didn't leash his dog and started screaming about bulls*** service dogs and people with bulls**** fake disabilities. Yeah hard of hearing is a pretry established legit disability. Anyway he said his dog likes to play so he shouldn't have to leash him and that he just wanted to play with my dog. Umm my dog was working and yours should be too. His dog had bit me multiple times prior when he came up to me to be petted, before I ever brought my dog. to this day every morning when he shows up his dog comes straight to me and he goes on about how he's checking to make sure my dog's not there to attack him. >.> The guy lost his leg in Iraq supposedly so he is disabled his dogs just not a proper service dog, he's not trained and he's not kept until control.

 

Similar situations happened at my last clinic except with women with little yippy rat dogs that are no more than ESA, one even is pushed around in a stroller. when my dog came in with me there the little dogs started yipping non stop making my dog bark back. They'd freak out about his bark and claim he was going to attack their precious little furballs. They'd go straight to an employee and demand my dog leave because their dogs were "registered "service" animals". Since I was being honest and said my dog is in training to be an actual hearing assistance dog, which is classified under CO state law as a form of legitimate service animals, I was told he wasn't allowed inside or even outside the building with me.

 

Argh, sorry this is an issue that really gets me going.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

2 hours ago, justodd said:

Someone in the midst of a phobic encounter has little control over how they respond. You have a lot more control over how you respond to them. Please, try to see things from their perspective and show the kindness and compassion you’d want someone to offer you. 

I am not sure why this is a response to me.  I was saying this, that fear and allergies are legit reasons that dogs can't be everywhere.  

I have an irrational aversion / phobia that is far stranger to people than fear of dogs so I don't discuss it...but will remove myself from the situation.  I would never push my dogs on anyone who doesn't enjoy their company...I wouldn't do that to other people, and I wouldn't do that to my dogs.

That said, I'd hope you would understand that if you were in a place with a legitimate service dog that they have a right to be in the space as well and it would be up to you to get accommodations to avoid them if need be.  (I.e. a classmate with a seeing-eye or other service dog.)

[HarryPotterFan]

Growing up I had a horrible phobia of dogs. When going to my aunt and uncle’s house they’d have to put their dog in the crate before I’d go in. But my uncle’s mom and sister would always bring their dog, because it had issues and would tear up their house if left alone (allegedly). That dog wasn’t trained at all. That dog passed away and they got a new dog (and the mom also passed away). But the sister doesn’t bring around the dog because my cousin’s in-laws are afraid of dogs. Where was that consideration for me when I was little?? That kind of pisses me off a kid’s fears weren’t taken seriously, or that kids don’t deserve the same consideration as adults. 

People would also do the trite try to force their dog on me. I hated it. And when the dog would jump on or lick me it just made things worse. Like yes have a dog that’s bigger than me jump on me to show I have nothing to fear. @HerNameIsBuffy, I’m really glad you don’t do this!

I still don’t like dogs, but I’m able to be around them. I don’t mind actual service dogs at all. A classmate in grad school had one, and it would just nap under a table during class.

Having an aversion to dogs dating hard since so many guys put dog photos in their profile...

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 hour ago, HarryPotterFan said:

That kind of pisses me off a kid’s fears weren’t taken seriously, or that kids don’t deserve the same consideration as adults. 

It should.  They should have been.  And they definitely are.

I'm sorry that happened to you.  I'm still not happy about things I was forced to suck up as a kid when my feelings should have been considered...it sucks.

[mollysmom]

1 hour ago, HarryPotterFan said:

 

Having an aversion to dogs dating hard since so many guys put dog photos in their profile...

You can send those guys my way!  Guys with dogs are automatically more attractive to me! lol

[Bad Wolf]

There was a guide dog in my master's classes. In the middle of a very boring lecture he let out a big yawn and sigh. It was perfect.

[Pecansforeveryone]

I don't think a dog phobia is even all that irrational. Dogs bite and even fatally maul people every year. Even otherwise healthy, so-called friendly dogs. I think we greatly romanticize animal people interactions, especially human canine interactions. My mom has two dogs that I am very fond of. I absolutely get dogs can do great things and can make wonderful pets. I just as a society we have rose colored glasses on the subjec t of dogs. 

[HarryPotterFan]

1 hour ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

It should.  They should have been.  And they definitely are.

I'm sorry that happened to you.  I'm still not happy about things I was forced to suck up as a kid when my feelings should have been considered...it sucks.

Thanks, I appreciate that.

1 hour ago, mollysmom said:

You can send those guys my way!  Guys with dogs are automatically more attractive to me! lol

Will do!! I’m like that with guys and cats. And guys in Harry Potter glasses 

[Satan'sFortress]

18 hours ago, squiddysquid said:

I need to pin a sign onto the front of my shirt that says "I am aggressive;  A little."

[justodd]

3 hours ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

I am not sure why this is a response to me.  I was saying this, that fear and allergies are legit reasons that dogs can't be everywhere.  

I have an irrational aversion / phobia that is far stranger to people than fear of dogs so I don't discuss it...but will remove myself from the situation.  I would never push my dogs on anyone who doesn't enjoy their company...I wouldn't do that to other people, and I wouldn't do that to my dogs.

That said, I'd hope you would understand that if you were in a place with a legitimate service dog that they have a right to be in the space as well and it would be up to you to get accommodations to avoid them if need be.  (I.e. a classmate with a seeing-eye or other service dog.)

It was a response to your post because you brought up phobias as a legitimate reason why someone may be uncomfortable with a dog being present. That’s it, and it’s why I said it was a side note. The “you” in my post was a general “you,” not a targeted one. 

 

As for legitimate service animals...I admit that it can be a complicated issue for me. I understand their purpose, and I don’t want someone who genuinely needs assistance to be without, but that still doesn’t make it any easier to magically flip the switch on what I’ve already said is an irrational response over which I have little control. I do my best to keep distance between us, cross the street, use a different checkout lane, what have you, but sometimes people are oblivious, or try to press the matter if creating space isn’t an option, and that’s...frustrating and exhausting seem too simple to describe the immense strain it can put on me when I can’t get away. I once had to get off a bus in a completely unfamiliar location late at night because someone got on with an “emotional assistance” animal, sat near me even though I was clearly uncomfortable, refused to restrain the animal in any way (even as it was sniffing and pawing at me and my things), and basically told me to go fuck myself when I tried explaining that yo, serious phobia over here and could they maaaaybe move to a different area so we could all be a little more at ease? (We were right by the doors, so even if I’d moved, I’d still have to deal with them when I left.) I have doubts that anyone with a legitimate service animal would have behaved quite that badly, but that’s part of the problem - there are so many people abusing the system now that it’s difficult to know which are and aren’t real, and every one of them (legitimate or not) is going to trigger the same sort of response. I do my best to get myself through it, but to be perfectly blunt, I don’t think it’s fair that I should always be expected to sacrifice my own emotional comfort for the sake of someone else’s, especially in situations where it could be lessened if the other were willing to do something simple to meet me halfway.

There’s a real irony in someone with an emotional assistance animal (real or fake) telling someone experiencing a panic attack to get the fuck over it, but it’s also something I’ve had to deal with more times than I care to count. 

Its like I said before, phobias aren’t rational, and even if someone is reacting in a way you (again, general you, not targeted) don’t understand, or think is over dramatic, they’re likely doing their very best. I try really hard to be compassionate when service animals are involved, and I do a lot to try and make those situations work for all involved. It isn’t easy, though, and it would be really great if I could get a little of that same compassion in return on more than just rare occasions. 

[justoneoftwo]

The idea that service animals are always a priority over some of the phobias is not accurate. In most circumstances a company would have to try and accommodate both parties. Both are considered legitimate disabilities it's harder to explain a phobia than blindness and that is often why phobias are dismissed. But they shouldn't be.

[ViolaSebastian]

The university I went to for undergraduate school had a class/program that paired students with puppies or rescue dogs to train them for emotional support service or service as a guide dog, depending on the dog. It wasn't unusual to hop on the campus bus and have three golden retrievers sitting in the aisle, and everyone saw the students and their dogs walking between classes. I only had one class with a student in the program, but the dog was extremely well-behaved and basically took a snooze while we learned about 19th century Imperial German history.

I always thought it was a great program, and I still do, but a relative of mine who worked in the administration at the same college and I had a conversation about the program after my graduation ceremony, where the dogs graduated alongside their students. She pointed out that the biggest issue they faced was that janitorial staff, who were already overworked and underpaid, had to clean up after the dogs. Puppies are puppies and sometimes they have accidents, and of course most dog breeds shed. She also told me that they had to deal with one instance of a training dog biting someone. I imagine, though I haven't asked, that students' allergies and/or fear of dogs have also come up. I still think it's a great and rewarding program, but I did see after our conversation that there are sides of it I hadn't thought about. 

 

[neurogirl]

Regarding service dogs, there was a student with a guide dog in a class I assist in teaching, and students tried to ask me what the dog was for, because nothing was immediately "wrong" with the dog's owner. I had to explain that I could not tell them (nor did I even know!!!), and that dogs do more than help guide people who are blind. I suspect that this dog was either with the student to detect low blood sugar or seizures. Service dogs are amazing and can sense when a person's blood sugar is dangerously low (through smell) or when a seizure is coming on (how?? dogs are amazing), and alert the person to get them to a safe place, or perhaps lay on them/protect them during a seizure. 

That being said, so many people just flat out now about having a service or ES dog. For all of you who are scared of dogs, or have legit service dogs affected by these untrained dogs, I'm so sorry. We should all be respectful of our fellow man, and canines!

[Carm_88]

Dogs can be good and dogs can be bad. I completely lost my shit at dog owners a few years back, I was running around twilight and a black lab chased me and knocked me down onto the sidewalk. The owners came laughing and asked me if I was alright, the dog was a puppy he didn't know better. They left the gate open by accident. No big deal, it happens. I was fine, there was no harm done. I told them if I saw the dog on the street alone again, I was calling someone whether it be the city or the SPCA. The dog was young, but it wasn't a tiny puppy, it was big enough to knock me over, and if it had decided to bite, there was really nothing I could do to get it off me. They weren't very happy about it, but the dog never did get out again. They moved, luckily. I was tempted to throw cat shit on their lawn.

[HarryPotterFan]

4 minutes ago, Carm_88 said:

I was tempted to throw cat shit on their lawn

Throwing cat shit at people is my solution to everything 

[cascarones]

I'm dog wary, saw a bad attack as a kid, met the guy I'm seeing when he apologized later over his massive dog scaring me so badly I ran across the street. I'm okay with very gentle introductions and just helped wash that scary Newfie, I hope to someday love something as much as this old dog loves bath time. I'm very cognizant that she outweighs me and can't turn that off in my brain, but there's a lump and he can't change his work this late, so I'm taking her tomorrow morning. It'll be stressful for all of us, but she's part of his family and needs to be seen quickly. 

As wary and scared as I am, I've never met a dog owner in their house who was anything but accommodating about it. I'm lucky leash laws where I am have been enforced strongly enough that I've not had to encounter off leash dogs. @Carm_88 that's awful and scary, I hope they listened to you and make changes.

[AliceInFundyland]

8 minutes ago, HarryPotterFan said:

Throwing cat shit at people is my solution to everything 

You once mentioned a website that would mail various types of animal crap to people. Ohhhh I am soooo tempted by this. It’s so reasonably priced.

[Kelsey]

It's my understanding that esa animals are not granted access to every public space. I have one- she stays home unless it's a dog friendly space.

I do not force her upon people but I would not lock her up (in a crate, another room, or outside) if someone afraid of dogs came to my house. This is her home. The scared person would need to make other plans. 

[MarblesMom]

On 9/29/2018 at 5:01 PM, Rachel333 said:

Phaedra is a great name. I love Greek mythology names.

https://youtu.be/Sb-SVPJM4L4

This song about Phaedra always creeped me out.

[AliceInFundyland]

25 minutes ago, Kelsey said:

It's my understanding that esa animals are not granted access to every public space. I have one- she stays home unless it's a dog friendly space.

I do not force her upon people but I would not lock her up (in a crate, another room, or outside) if someone afraid of dogs came to my house. This is her home. The scared person would need to make other plans. 

Really? If you had a little one in your family who was afraid of your dog you’d refuse to make any concessions to let the child visit you. 

 

[Kelsey]

5 hours ago, AliceInFundyland said:

Really? If you had a little one in your family who was afraid of your dog you’d refuse to make any concessions to let the child visit you. 

 

Little one I'm not sure....none of my littles are afraid of dogs and I live across the country from any family so it's not likely to be a scenario. 

If a phobic adult came over, I would not lock my dogs up. They would go lay down though pretty quickly after the person's arrival (by choice, they are older and pretty chill). I would make my dogs stay away from the person (and hold my youngest until she calmed down from their arrival) but other than that, the person would have to deal or not come over. I do tell people up front though so they can decide.