Thai boys stuck in cave

[nausicaa]

6 hours ago, Rachel333 said:

Wow, Elon Musk is pathetic. He called the British diver who criticized him "pedo guy."

Is he going to stage a cave rescue of his own?

What is wrong with him?

 

Good God, Grimes needs to tell that dude to log off. 

I always thought he was arrogant, but now see he's a full blown petulant douche bag.

I'm not surprised he donated to a lot of Republican PACs, and I don't even think it necessarily means he's a Republican. It's common for wealthy people to donate to both parties so that no matter who wins, they have some influence. 

[Howl]

9 hours ago, LiterallyBananas said:

Those caves aren't far from where I'm located. I wonder why they have such a high occurance of histoplasmosis. Also, any theories as to why you and fellow cavers tested positive to exposure but never became symptomatic, but the boy scouts did? (Other than it sounds like you didn't go to the Histo Cave.)

  There were hundreds of people tromping through the Thai cave entrance, disturbing the ground and stirring up fungal spores.  Histoplasmosis thrives in bird and bat droppings and likely both are present in the cave entrance area. 

I suspect that I developed immunity over time, with numerous, but very limited, exposures.   I'm trying to remember what they told us about lifetime immunity.  I think with histoplasmosis, one can become ill again with sufficient exposure, but likely to not become as ill. 

The Boy Scouts likely had no immunity from any previous exposure, and probably got in there and stirred up a bunch of bat guano and dust and inhaled massive amounts of histo  spores.  As a side note, I came across some research that pointed to the possibility of histoplasmosis being present in the guano of certain species of bats and not with other species. 

 

 

[ViolaSebastian]

[Howl]

I wish we could get more information about the local impact of thousands of people suddenly showing up in the area around the cave as well as other unintended consequences.   One of the most recent articles that I posted noted that the incredible volume of water pumped out of the cave flooded many rice fields downstream, destroying this years rice crops for many farmers. 

Change of topic: Elon Musk may well feel that his wealth and power will insulate him from blowback resulting from his ugly tweets.  But no one who read one of those tweets will ever, ever forget.  You can hire all the PR damage control firms in the world, and it still won't help.  This will follow him forever. 

[mango_fandango]

Ugh. Elon Musk is a right twat. As soon as I saw that he was there with a submarine I thought it sounded like a PR stunt. These über-rich types are so used to being told how they’re God’s gift to mankind that as soon as anyone criticises them, they get all whiny and defensive. See: Orange Twat.

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by mango_fandango
duplicate post

[Rachel333]

[HarryPotterFan]

4 hours ago, Howl said:

Change of topic: Elon Musk may well feel that his wealth and power will insulate him from blowback resulting from his ugly tweets.  But no one who read one of those tweets will ever, ever forget.  You can hire all the PR damage control firms in the world, and it still won't help.  This will follow him forever. 

True, but I doubt he learned anything. He’s still a billionaire with multiple companies and knows he’s a genius. I can’t imagine this would affect him financially, and he can still pretty much hire all the brilliant minds he wants.

Heck, the owner of Papa John’s said worse and wasn’t ousted until he actually used the n-word. Everyone knew he was an asshole before that. Even now he’s still a partial owner of the franchise. If Elon Musk somehow got kicked off the board of his companies he’d just create new ones. He’s a genius billionaire. I’m not sure what the Papa John’s dude will do since he can’t even make pizza. 

Musk also said he’d resolve the Flint water crisis, so I wonder how he’ll do on that. This whole thing makes me doubt he’ll actually talk to the Flint experts and people on the ground. He probably figures his own knowledge and employee knowledge on water contamination is enough, so why bother learning about particular challenges of replacing an entire city’s plumbing and how it’s affected people’s lives...

He’s like Iron Man, if Iron Man had a bigger ego and used his suit just to fly around and show off instead of saving the world. Or if when the aliens invaded, Iron Man took off the suit, handed it to someone else, and hopped on a private jet to get away while tweeting about the bravery of th Avengers. And then tried to invent a robot to clean up the city after the Avengers accidentally destroyed it in battle, rather than giving a large donation to help pay for the damages and paying wages of city workers. (I think the anaology got off track here...)

[Howl]

17 hours ago, HarryPotterFan said:

(I think the anaology got off track here...)

Analogy drift.....I like it! 

[AliceInFundyland]

 @ViolaSebastian I love Kumail Nanjiani! I actually am acquainted with him but would be doxxing to say how. So funny.

[tabitha2]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/thai-boys-rescued-cave-ordained-buddhist-ceremony-114756535.html

[squiddysquid]

 

Elon Musk doesn't only come off as arrogant, he seems to be unraveling. Another "stable genius"? I mean for fucks sake, Dr. Richard Harris risked his life diving in there and then he stayed for 3 days and helped the Buddhist monk keep them safe. Seriously, I expect the guy to shave his head Britney-Spears-style any day now.

[PennySycamore]

I just read this article on Lion's Roar about the boys ordaining as novice monks.  They're dedicating the merit earned during their time as monks to the memory of the Thai Navy Seal who died in the rescue.

Thai boys rescued from cave consider ordaining as monks

[Beermeet]

Regular me loves this.  FJ me is concerned with the one boy who is not Buddhist and not joining all the others.  I hope that boy is content with what was hopefully his decision to not join and could if he wanted to.  Because religion. 

[candygirl200413]

ABC 20/20 did a special on the whole ordeal tonight and a few details that I"m remembering:

- The coach was actually second to last in terms of evacuation. I wonder if he was weaker than the last boy?

- The last boy was the smallest and the mask they were going to use was big which could have resulted in him drowning since it didn't create a suction on his face. They ended up using a mask that created at least somewhat of a suction.

- They gave the boys katamine to sedate them, but one of the boys was gaining consciousness halfway through, one of the divers had to give him 3 shots during the trip to get him knocked out again.

- Visibility got worst on the last day and one diver kept mentioning how he kept budding heads with the wall with the kid underneath, he ended up shifting the kid so that the diver's head would go first into whatever wall he hit.

- I thought the kids were tethered to the divers but it actually seemed like they were just secured with one of the arms of the divers.

- Once it was said and done, water was coming in quickly and there was about 7-10 divers/medics/etc left in the cave. They all got out with minutes to spare.

 

Just thought it was interesting/ forgetting if any of these were touched upon. Even though we knew how it ended it was still such a harrowing/stressful event to see how it went down in real time.

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

7 hours ago, candygirl200413 said:

They gave the boys katamine to sedate them, but one of the boys was gaining consciousness halfway through, one of the divers had to give him 3 shots during the trip to get him knocked out again.

Do you mean ketamine? Could you point me to an article that specifies which sedative was used? I tried a quick search, but the 2 articles I skimmed didn't mention the specific drug used. Please and thank you!

My only experience of ketamine was its use for anesthetizing cats. Cats tend to hallucinate and thrash around when they're waking up from ketamine. I imagine that would be very dangerous in a cave rescue if a person reacted the same way. Of course, I have no idea how humans respond and it could be very different.

[candygirl200413]

@WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo? Yes, Ketamine, sorry for my mistake!

This is the article I found regarding them using it: https://www.yahoo.com/gma/dropped-guideline-ill-fitting-face-mask-during-final-115104713--abc-news-topstories.html

I was trying to look on abc's own website regarding the video and see if I can find the clip where they explained to the boys how they all agreed to do this.

And you're not the only person who said that, my mom (a pharmacist) and sister (a nurse) were equally confused

[nvmbr02]

In the area we used to live Ketamine has been in the news a lot lately. From what I understand of the situation EMTs use it because it is a quick sedation and they don't have to worry about loss of airway. Apparently the police departments were pushing Ketamine use for "difficult arrests".

Anyway, my best guess is ketamine was chosen because it wasn't likely to cause issues with breathing, which was a known risk. They were probably hoping to get the boys through the cave before they woke up with the plan to administer more if they woke up. Risky for sure. 

[Rachel333]

3 of the boys and their coach were stateless and have now been given Thai citizenship.

[Howl]

Great news!  I wish the same for the other almost half million "stateless" Thai people. 

[Howl]

Bringing this thread back up to reference this article on cave exploration in the Oaxaca region of Mexico.  Several of the cave divers who helped with the Thai rescue are referenced in this article.  It's well written, has amazing photographs and graphics and clearly shows the challenges, dangers and complexities of deep cave exploration when dealing with flooded passages (sumps). These expeditions take place during the dry season, but even so, unexpected rain events can happen.  By the way, this story has a happy ending! 

Six Divers Trapped For Nearly Three Days With Four Granola Bars - Pushing The Limits In Cueva de La Peña Colorado

Edited October 25, 2018 by Howl

[Briefly]

That was a very interesting article, @Howl,  Thanks for posting it.

[Howl]

Sad news: Thai Navy SEAL who took part in cave rescue dies from infection contracted during mission