Jinjer 40: Still Waiting for the Baby

[LilMissMetaphor]

Certain names do have a propensity for sounding overblown in certain combinations or when combined with certain cultures.  You and your partner might think it's unfair that you want to name your son Achilles Constantine even though you're a middle-class, monolingual couple living in Tennessee neither of whom has ever seen a Roman column or a Grecian urn (snerk), but you should probably accept it's going to confer a certain je ne sais quoi on the child growing up, and not necessarily the good kind.

(Not that Giovanna or Elisabetta are on the same level as Constantine, but still.)    

[laPapessaGiovanna]

18 minutes ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

@laPapessaGiovanna - OK, Sorry. I don't know how else to say it. I apologize for offending you.

I know no offense was meant and I am not offended. It's just that I would like to understand how a normal Italian name sounds pretentious to American ears. It's because Italian names tend to be longer, more difficult to pronounce, foreign sounding? it's because we are talking about the Duggars and they can't choose a name without it becoming kryptonite if it's not overly common enough? It's because it wouldn't reflect our ideas about them?

What if, let's make an absurd example, a Duggarling married a person of Native American heritage and the hypothetical happy couple decided to bestow on the hypothetical baby a Native American name. Would it be tacky, would it be pretentious?

[Daisy0322]

48 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

I would like to understand how a normal Italian name sounds pretentious to American ears. 

I think pretentious while being accurate could also be replaced with fancy or exotic sounding. I think pretentious may have a harsher connotation but the idea is the same. It's just not the standard biblical John, Sarah, Hannah, Mathew, Rebecca type names that are very common in the US. Names outside the norm tend to get categories for better of worse. Like my husband and I both have very Trendy names you can tell we were born in the 90s. My son has a name that many people consider to be preppy sounding. It's just a description and an opinion.  In my family (we are very middle class as a whole) if I named my child Valentina (which I live by the way) I know it would be out if what's normal in my family and they would probably think I was trying to be fancy. 

The reba song Fancy actually kind of explains this well. They were poor her mom names her fancy and sent her out to become (well first a hooker) but then something "more". The idea in me using this as an example is that her mom tried to name her "up a social class" because like it or not names hold connotations to people. 

I hope that helps. 

[VelociRapture]

10 hours ago, nastyhobbitses said:

I'm a Yank living in the UK, and even though I'm from the Northeast (CT/NYC, but they bleed into one another, to be honest), I am absolutely psyched to be making what I will call, to reduce confusion for my British guests at my 4th of July party, Actual Goddamn Biscuits. Also on the menu: giant M&M chipwich cake, popcorn chicken, a crudite plate to maintain the illusion of health, and Kraft mac-n-cheese, since I saw that in the "American imports" aisle and figure that's a sign. 

In general I like Southern cooking, but if I were at a buffet where you could get any cuisine you wanted and it would be all of equal quality, it's honestly not the first thing I'd reach for. I'd probably go for Chinese or Southeast Asian (Burmese or Thai) first. 

Woah, woah, woah... slow your roll Hobbit. The only part of my state that bleeds into New York is Fairfield County. They don’t count as real New England.

(And before anyone gets offended, I spent the first 25 years of my life in Fairfield County and I still live in CT. So, like Seth McFarland, I’m allowed to make fun of it.  )

[PennySycamore]

Would a little Vuolo girl named Serafina be allowed to read the Serafina books?  My oldest granddaughter loves them and a new one is about to be published.  My daughter posted about the release party in Asheville (the books are set at Biltmore House) yesterday.

and @VelociRapture's mention of Seth MacFarlane reminds me of this which is for you @onekidanddone:

ETA:  Seth graduated from RISD although he was born in Kent, CT.

[onekidanddone]

7 minutes ago, PennySycamore said:

Would a little Vuolo girl named Serafina be allowed to read the Serafina books?  My oldest granddaughter loves them and a new one is about to be published.  My daughter posted about the release party in Asheville (the books are set at Biltmore House) yesterday.

and @VelociRapture's mention of Seth MacFarlane reminds me of this which is for you @onekidanddone:

ETA:  Seth graduated from RISD although he was born in Kent, CT.

I want to live vicariously through my daughter. She needes to go to RISD, Brown or URI. She must buy the house I grew up in and let me live there with her 3.5 kids

The skyline they show on Family Guy is a Province. And for unless trivia the building they showed in the original Superman tv show was a bank in providence 

18 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

I like Seraphina. Useless trivia: that was Nala’s mother’s name

Seraphina was a witch in the Pullman trilogy 

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

4 hours ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

I know no offense was meant and I am not offended. It's just that I would like to understand how a normal Italian name sounds pretentious to American ears. It's because Italian names tend to be longer, more difficult to pronounce, foreign sounding? it's because we are talking about the Duggars and they can't choose a name without it becoming kryptonite if it's not overly common enough? It's because it wouldn't reflect our ideas about them?

What if, let's make an absurd example, a Duggarling married a person of Native American heritage and the hypothetical happy couple decided to bestow on the hypothetical baby a Native American name. Would it be tacky, would it be pretentious?

I think, at least for me, they are long, exotic and beautiful names.  I used Italian names because those are ones I know off the top of my head (I know girls with all those names, girls in my daughters grade and 2 of them are little bitches because their parents are pretentious assholes so...) I could have just as easily used, French, Spanish or Persian names. As I said in another post, I think that just about anything Jinjer pick will sound pretentious because they ARE pretentious, not because the name is. 

As for you example about Indigenous peoples names, it would be more cultural appropriation coming from bigots like the Duggar's. 

I hope this helps, 

[Shadoewolf]

Back on food for a second, the meat vendors my husband uses for his tiny little hole in the wall place are all local, no growth hormone, no antibiotic, good diet, kind of vendors. It's not froo froo or elitist, but it does cost more because he can call said vendors on any given day and know exactly what cow his beef came from, when it was dispatched, etc. A burger and duck fat fries will run you about $17.99. But you taste the difference. Living not too far from Dearborn, Michigan (largest concentrated Muslim population in the US) I can tell you that halal meat is outrageously expensive compared to what you buy at Walmart. But it's in the sourcing and the slaughtering process. You pay to know it's done right.

Btw, you actually want a little fat in your meats, it adds flavor when its rendered!

[cascarones]

As far as chain comfort food, I'm surprised Perkins hasn't made it into the discussion. Massive muffins, off highways, decent healthy eats that get ruined by bakery temptations.

With names, it cycles back to the same discussions we've had before of low class, high class, rich nouveau trends.  I personally find long Italian names lovely (short ones as well), pretty featured on my baby name lists. I do understand where some posters are coming from, having quite a few friends with traditional names that in other parts of the country people wrinkle their nose at or assume it's a stage name. Soleil and Marisol are the first that pop to mind. I know Marisols and Mercedes who go by Mary professionally to avoid the issue.

 

[SapphireSlytherin]

Perkins is VERY regionally localized (does that make sense?). We don't have any here, although there's one in my dad's (tiny) town. 

[ShadowCat]

Myself and my two teenage girls, are heading to Oklahoma for a wedding, in October. I am just dying to try all these chain restaurants. I want to sample big (compared to here) American portions, I'm particularly excited for southern, comfort food and my first ever biscuits with gravy. 

I going full on tourist for this trip, so any recommendations would be greatly appreciated

( I'm also secretly hoping to spot a Duggar )

 

[SapphireSlytherin]

Where in OK?

Fair warning - although I was raised on biscuits and gravy, my Brit hubby finds both to be vile. He thinks biscuits are "sour scones" and gravy tastes like paste.  Oh - and the gravy is white (milk-based), not brown. lol

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

13 minutes ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

Where in OK?

Fair warning - although I was raised on biscuits and gravy, my Brit hubby finds both to be vile. He thinks biscuits are "sour scones" and gravy tastes like paste.  Oh - and the gravy is white (milk-based), not brown. lol

MMMMM biscuits and gravy.  I make a killer B&G.  

I've been wanting to go down to AR & OK for a while now, I was born in Lawton, OK and lived in the Fayetteville area for 2 years while my dad finished his degree at UofA, I don't remember any of this as I was 3 when we moved away and I haven't been back to AR since my grandfather died in 1984 when I was 13. 

[tabitha2]

18 minutes ago, ShadowCat said:

Myself and my two teenage girls, are heading to Oklahoma for a wedding, in October. I am just dying to try all these chain restaurants. I want to sample big (compared to here) American portions, I'm particularly excited for southern, comfort food and my first ever biscuits with gravy. 

I going full on tourist for this trip, so any recommendations would be greatly appreciated

( I'm also secretly hoping to spot a Duggar )

 

 

Chain places  are fine but the best, most authentic food is going to be in small mom and pop places if you can locate them. Ask the locals . I will recommend Golden Coral though;The buffet chain that can be found most every where. Great food. 

[ihaveanexamintwodays]

I think if JinJer want to use an Italian name for their daughter, that's fine. Jeremy does have Italian heritage, even if it is total BS how much CO tries to over-emphasize that for diversity points on their dumb show, lol.

What *would* be pretentious is if JillDill decided to name her daughter "Alessandra", or if the Smugs named their next M "Marcello". Because in the US there are many cultures/nationalities with many lovely names associated, and I think it's pretentious less because of how the names sound and moreso if parents are using names from other cultures for no reason other than it's tryndy to do so. 

[ShadowCat]

@SapphireSlytherin We'll be in Claremore OK. I'd probably be of the same opinion as your British husband but at least I can say I've tried it and lived  I've seen your version of gravy and to be honest, it does look a bit vommity. My father had grits and biscuits years ago and although he declared it to be "diabolical shite" he ate the whole lot, because the gods forbid he'd waste his food 

@tabitha2 Thanks for the recommendation, I'll be sure to stop by and try it. I'm pretty sure our staples will be mom and pop places, and my sister is also an amazing home cook. I just want to see what it's all about, and my girls are excited about IHOP/B. 

[tabitha2]

Seewald is German so would be fine for them to name a kid Helga or Otto then? 

[Nargus]

5 minutes ago, tabitha2 said:

Seewald is German so would be fine for them to name a kid Helga or Otto then? 

They named their first Spurgeon so I really don’t think they’re a good example 

[feministxtian]

Biscuits & sausage gravy!!! I don't like most restaurant editions...I prefer my own. They're easy to make. 

Get some sausage (I buy the stuff that comes in a tube). Throw it in a cast iron frying pan, break it apart, cook until brown. Put some flour in the pan and make sure the sausage is well coated with it. Pour in milk and let it simmer until it thickens up. Use LOTS of black pepper to season. 

I don't make scratch biscuits though...I buy a tube of Grands buttermilk. Bake by directions. Split a couple apart, spoon sausage gravy on top...OH FUCK YEAH BABY!!!

[SapphireSlytherin]

Eh - I make my own biscuits, but I can't make gravy to save my life. My granddaddy tried and tried to teach me - his gravy was sooo good.

Whomp biscuits are ok, but NEVER for gravy. lol

 

[nausicaa]

4 hours ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

I know no offense was meant and I am not offended. It's just that I would like to understand how a normal Italian name sounds pretentious to American ears. It's because Italian names tend to be longer, more difficult to pronounce, foreign sounding? 

I think it's actually because a lot of Americans do like the sound of Italian names, especially for girls. They sound soft and pretty and sort of "exotic" in a way.  There are plenty of Italian names that have become really popular, so I think nothing of an "Isabella Roberts" or "Liliana Johnson."

However, there is a trend for some Americans of non-Italian heritage to give their daughters several very long Italian names, like "Serafina Francesca Siena Smith," which can sound a bit overblown and like the parents are trying too hard to sound important and refined. Sometimes they'll even throw in a nobility title like "Comtessa." There's also people who give their daughters "made up" Italian names like "Gionvanella" or "Oliviettina."

It's not my biggest pet peeve, but  it can be a bit eye roll inducing and I get what the other Americans are trying to say here. It is less annoying when the parents are actually of Italian descent and there is a family reason for all of the names. I think it's one of those cultural things that's hard to convey. (Probably like the German reaction to "Kevin.")

[Knight of Ni]

I know baby Vuolo definitely won’t be allowed to read the Pullman trilogy. I’m pretty sure it’s right up there with Harry Potter in how evil it’s considered. I remember the uproar over the movie and the calls for everyone to refuse to watch it. I guess if someone has a problem with Harry Potter they would have a problem with His Dark Materials. Telling me that certain groups have banned a book is the fastest way to convince me it’s worth reading. 

[ViolaSebastian]

You guys keep making this thread hot and getting me excited. 

15 minutes ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

Eh - I make my own biscuits, but I can't make gravy to save my life. My granddaddy tried and tried to teach me - his gravy was sooo good.

Whomp biscuits are ok, but NEVER for gravy. lol

 

I had to look this up--I'd never heard the term used. I love it! 

My family has a tradition of making "beaten biscuits," which are a lot like hard tack. They require a special machine and are a labor intensive pain in the ass to make, but hey...tradition. Here's an article on them from the hilariously named Garden and Gun Magazine: https://gardenandgun.com/recipe/the-art-of-the-beaten-biscuit/

ETA: When a relative dies, the beaten biscuit kneader is almost always hotly contested when settling the estate. It's serious business. 

[LegHumperBibleThumper]

1 hour ago, ShadowCat said:

Myself and my two teenage girls, are heading to Oklahoma for a wedding, in October. I am just dying to try all these chain restaurants. I want to sample big (compared to here) American portions, I'm particularly excited for southern, comfort food and my first ever biscuits with gravy. 

I going full on tourist for this trip, so any recommendations would be greatly appreciated

( I'm also secretly hoping to spot a Duggar )

 

I’m not from Oklahoma so I can’t offer any suggestions but PLEASE, I am literally begging you, do not base your judgement of American food on shitty chain restaurants like Cracker Barrel, Applebee’s, ihop, buffets, etc. Its all frozen, processed, microwaved garbage. Obviously the degree of quality/freshness varies by restaurant and some are better than others but Please do your best to find a local place. 

[SapphireSlytherin]

+1 on @LegHumperBibleThumper's advice. The buffet restaurants here are overloaded with unhealthy food, and they're just (in general) NASTY. I actually guffawed at the Golden Corral mention. I ate there exactly once because GryffindorDisappointment got a "free meal" for getting all As on her report card. She was so excited. She thought it was excellent. She was 10. Now she knows better - lol. She actually lives across the street from a strip mall that has a Golden Corral and she's never darkened its door. hahah

@ShadowCat - if you don't already use the TripAdvisor site, I'd suggest doing so. It has only steered us wrong one time.