Karissa Collins: Quiverfull Public Facebook, Instagram, and Blog

[anachronistic]

Although I was in no way abused by my parents, I didn't get blamed for all of my autistic behaviors which I could not control. Since my autism was undiagnosed then, there were a lot of assumptions that I was acting out for attention, and with the exception of my mother, this was the narrative that my family followed. So I really relate to Karissa’s poor kids, and I wonder if in 30 years they'll be in therapy and have a total revelation like I did that they did not have to be treated this way. That what happened was not their fault, they were doing the best they could in an environment that was not at all made for them. 30 years from now Karissa will still not understand what she did wrong. I know this because just this past Easter my father accused me of putting on a show when I was literally sobbing in pain.

I grew up. I choose to have very little contact with my father, and I suspect that many of Karissa’s kids will do the same. But if I, very educated person who has been in very good therapy for a decade and a half, cannot help but blame myself still for my meltdowns, what hope do her kids ever have being able to stop blaming themselves for their illnesses? The guilt runs deep. It leave scars. Someday a doctor will look at an x-ray and tell a Collins kid, wow, you sure broke a lot of bones as a kid. And that doctor will have no idea of how broken bones are the least of Karissa’s horrific legacy.

[anachronistic]

Darnit. My first sentence above should be, ‘DID get blamed for all of my autistic behaviors‘. I'm using speech to text now and it is kind of horrible.

[JermajestyDuggar]

Karissa is visiting with a new friend so I looked at her public instagram. She’s a white woman with long dreads and two adopted black children. She is also a Christian free birther like Karissa. The family of 6 live in an RV of course. The mom just had a free birth in a field on dirty towels. She had no midwife. Claims she was in labor for 6 days and pushed for two. Cord was wrapped around his neck 2 times. She was 43 weeks pregnant. She sucked out the meconium from his mouth with her mouth. And it was a VBAC. This woman is even more reckless than Karissa. Her name on Instagram is kreativekay_wilson. 

[EmiSue]

5 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Karissa is visiting with a new friend so I looked at her public instagram. She’s a white woman with long dreads and two adopted black children. She is also a Christian free birther like Karissa. The family of 6 live in an RV of course. The mom just had a free birth in a field on dirty towels. She had no midwife. Claims she was in labor for 6 days and pushed for two. Cord was wrapped around his neck 2 times. She was 43 weeks pregnant. She sucked out the meconium from his mouth with her mouth. And it was a VBAC. This woman is even more reckless than Karissa. Her name on Instagram is kreativekay_wilson. 

My reaction emoji was a hard choice between wtf and disgust. What is WRONG with these women?!?

[JermajestyDuggar]

Here is her YouTube and some of the recent uploads. 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

Kaylee Wilson is lucky to be alive, and so is her baby. I would be very surprised if she and her husband weren't against abortion. The hypocrisy of it is just insane. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

I almost feel like this woman deserves her own thread. She is out there. 

[4boysmum]

Whoa.  Does she know how serious meconium aspiration can be?  That was incredibly risky.

My last birth was a "precipitous labor" and we barely made it to the hospital on time.  Like, it moved so fast we actually did (briefly) consider whether we should stay home if we couldn't make it.  And I am so glad we did make it, because a few minutes later that baby came flying out with the cord around his neck and meconium in his nose.  (He was fine.  But he did need suctioning and I still get emotional wondering what would have happened if I couldn't wait and had him in the breakdown lane on the highway.)

My husband is a respiratory therapist and I told him I felt better knowing I was with someone who knew how to handle situations like that.  To which he responded that he wouldn't have had any of the equipment he needed on the road.  He is very relieved that he did not have to suction his own son immediately after birth. It's very hard to imagine someone voluntarily putting themself in that situation!

[JermajestyDuggar]

18 minutes ago, 4boysmum said:

Whoa.  Does she know how serious meconium aspiration can be?  That was incredibly risky.

My last birth was a "precipitous labor" and we barely made it to the hospital on time.  Like, it moved so fast we actually did (briefly) consider whether we should stay home if we couldn't make it.  And I am so glad we did make it, because a few minutes later that baby came flying out with the cord around his neck and meconium in his nose.  (He was fine.  But he did need suctioning and I still get emotional wondering what would have happened if I couldn't wait and had him in the breakdown lane on the highway.)

My husband is a respiratory therapist and I told him I felt better knowing I was with someone who knew how to handle situations like that.  To which he responded that he wouldn't have had any of the equipment he needed on the road.  He is very relieved that he did not have to suction his own son immediately after birth. It's very hard to imagine someone voluntarily putting themself in that situation!

What’s crazy is that this woman planned all this. It wasn’t an accident she had him in a field unassisted.

[HermioneSparrow]

16 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Karissa is visiting with a new friend so I looked at her public instagram. She’s a white woman with long dreads and two adopted black children. She is also a Christian free birther like Karissa. The family of 6 live in an RV of course. The mom just had a free birth in a field on dirty towels. She had no midwife. Claims she was in labor for 6 days and pushed for two. Cord was wrapped around his neck 2 times. She was 43 weeks pregnant. She sucked out the meconium from his mouth with her mouth. And it was a VBAC. This woman is even more reckless than Karissa. Her name on Instagram is kreativekay_wilson. 

Here where I live there's a big movement of free birthers but they're mostly non christians (more like atheists nature hippies of some sort), like two months ago there was a viral case of a lady who got into it after two c-sections and died hemorrhaging on the way to the hospital. I honestly don't understand why it's so popular to risk your life and your baby's life like that.

[JermajestyDuggar]

25 minutes ago, HermioneSparrow said:

Here where I live there's a big movement of free birthers but they're mostly non christians (more like atheists nature hippies of some sort), like two months ago there was a viral case of a lady who got into it after two c-sections and died hemorrhaging on the way to the hospital. I honestly don't understand why it's so popular to risk your life and your baby's life like that.

From what I’ve seen, these women very often had bad experiences in hospitals. Not that hospitals did anything wrong. But that they wanted a certain kind of birth and ended up with a c-section. Birth can be traumatic and in that trauma and aftermath, they blame the hospital and the medical industry in general. They then want a homebirth. Which is an ok choice. However these women may not be good candidates for homebirth and can’t find a licensed midwife who will attend their birth. So they throw their hands up in the air and say, “looks like I have no choice but to have an unassisted homebirth. It’s not my fault. It’s the fault of the government and the medical industry.” They then find online groups that convince them that their best option is to birth unassisted. And they pump each other up. I’m sure it’s what happened to Karissa. She found Christian women online having unassisted births and was convinced it was best for her births. Karissa has changed so much since her first baby and I blame the internet. She went down rabbit hole after rabbit hole. She vaxed her older kids and then became anti vax. She believed in birth control with her first few kids and now is anti birth control. She had hospital births with her first kids and now goes unassisted. 
 

If you look at each case and talk to each woman who goes unassisted, I guarantee they were persuaded by an online group. I would bet a thousand dollars on it. 

[keen23]

Oh this is very vibes of Red Gypsy (sorry, I hate that this is her moniker) Lauren.

[KWLand]

There is a big group of believers that hospitals push for things that aren’t needed and each intervention leads to a greater chance of death for mom and baby.  They also know if they decline things for baby, there is a chance CPS will intervene.  In some hospitals, that only take low risk births, the csection rate is so high that the belief about intervention is probably true.  There is also a belief that the more in-depth a birth plan is, the higher the chance for csection because they will fight more and they may not have had all the prenatal testing and appointments.

all that said, a horrible hospital birth is still safer than a wild pregnancy and birth.  

[JermajestyDuggar]

I’ve found that in the IS, going to extremes in the opposite direction is more common than it should. I don’t know why America tends to think in extremes. Maybe it’s the individuality aspect of our culture? But anyway, you will find so many extremes in the US as some sort of resolution to a problem. You are house poor and inndebt because you bought a McMansion you couldn’t afford? The only answer is a tiny house! The answer couldn’t be to downsize from a 4,000 sq ft home to a cheaper 2,000 sq foot home. No no no! You must now live in a 400 sq ft home with your 2 kids and 8 dogs. It’s the only logical answer 🙄 

Edited May 15, 2023 by JermajestyDuggar

[KWLand]

30 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I’ve found that in the IS, going to extremes in the opposite direction is more common than it should. I don’t know why America tends to think in extremes. Maybe it’s the individuality aspect of our culture? But anyway, you will find so many extremes in the US as some sort of resolution to a problem. You are house poor and inndebt because you bought a McMansion you couldn’t afford? The only answer is a tiny house! The answer couldn’t be to downsize from a 4,000 sq ft home to a cheaper 2,000 sq foot home. No no no! You must now live in a 400 sq ft home with your 2 kids and 8 dogs. It’s the only logical answer 🙄 

I think we only see the extreme people because they are trying to show off .  The quiet majority don’t have an interest in showing off or being known so we see the extremists.  And extremists attract extremists.

the extremists groups also tend to kick out anyone whose experience is a warning.  The woman who had bad free birthing experiences, homeschoolers who learned it takes more than the minimum, etc.  

it’s a shame.  Extremists on either side are dangerous.  

[4boysmum]

@JermajestyDuggar I think you are right.  And I came pretty close to being one of those women, except for the fact that I could never get comfortable with the thought of homebirthing.  I had a planned c-section when we knew one of my older kids had a serious birth defect and needed immediate medical attention after delivery + surgery the next day.  I was assured that I was a perfect vbac candidate for future pregnancies... until the same doctors who said that changed their minds at the last minute and pushed me into 2 unwanted repeat surgeries that I genuinely do not believe were necessary (I now know of at least one other hospital in my area that would have induced me instead).

To make a long story short (too late...) by the time I had had 3 c sections I didn't think vaginal birth was an option for me anymore.  Had a surprise fifth pregnancy, agonized over the idea of another c-section, and finally had a meltdown and told everyone I was not doing that again.  I joined the private FB groups to learn how to advocate for myself.  Got a lot of advice to birth at home, to pretend I just couldn't get to the hospital in time, etc.  Tempting, but I could never be completely comfortable with the idea.  I knew I would never forgive myself if anything went wrong.  I did get some great advice and encouragement in those groups, and I wouldn't have gotten my desired outcome without them, but there are some crazies in there with their own agenda and they do give out advice that is downright dangerous.

What I did do was leave my OB at 38 weeks without a really firm backup plan.  I am lucky to live in a part of New England where there are lots of hospitals to choose from.  And I called around until I found an amazing high risk specialist who really took the time to listen to me, discuss pros and cons and relevant research studies, and explain how he would handle any complications that might arise.  And I have now had two vba3c births with his support.

I could never have gone through with a homebirth, and I absolutely could never even consider doing it unassisted or out in a field somewhere!  But I do know what it's like to feel talked down to, dismissed, and not given options.  To feel like my needs were less important than the doctor's convenience.  It did shake my trust in "the system," and it was only saved because I could balance that distrust with other, positive hospital experiences.  And I am very aware that I was privileged to be in a region with good hospitals and to find a doctor who is a standout as far as listening to patients and respecting their input.  Not all women have that, and that is a problem because they should.

 

[NotQuiteMotY]

On 5/15/2023 at 8:44 AM, 4boysmum said:

Whoa.  Does she know how serious meconium aspiration can be?  That was incredibly risky.

I'm stuck on VBAC on a field. Does she not know about the risk of uterine rupture?!?! I'm all for a woman advocating for a trial of labor after a c-section, but unattended with possibly no idea of the baby's lie? That's birthing Russian roulette.

[Bluebirdbluebell]

On 5/20/2023 at 1:58 PM, NotQuiteMotY said:

I'm stuck on VBAC on a field. Does she not know about the risk of uterine rupture?!?! I'm all for a woman advocating for a trial of labor after a c-section, but unattended with possibly no idea of the baby's lie? That's birthing Russian roulette.

Not to mention at 43 weeks. 

[KWLand]

6 hours ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

Not to mention at 43 weeks. 

I may have said this earlier in the thread, but unless they have had a first trimester dating ultrasound (so from a medical office and the person is medically trained to perform and read ultrasounds), I don’t trust free birthers due date calculations.   I think so many make their pregnancy length a competition and the longer a pregnancy the better in their eyes because “all turned out okay.”   Even with dating ultrasounds it’s known the dates can be off.  
karissa is a good example of fudging dates based on whatever she decided it was at the time.   In my experience, those who have low intervention pregnancies and are knowledgeable about pregnancy/birth give birth range and not a date because they know it’s not always accurate.

if one thinks giving birth in a mud field is a good idea, they probably aren’t educated on pregnancy calculations and what they say isn’t going to be accurate.

Edited May 26, 2023 by KWLand

[JermajestyDuggar]

2 minutes ago, KWLand said:

I may have said this earlier in the thread, but unless they have had a first trimester dating ultrasound (so from a medical office and the person is medically trained to perform and read ultrasounds), I don’t trust free birthers due date calculations.   I think so many make their pregnancy length a competition and the longer a pregnancy the better in their eyes because “all turned out okay.”   Even with dating ultrasounds it’s known the dates can be off.  
karissa is a good example of fudging dates based on whatever she decided it was at the time.   In my experience, those who have low intervention pregnancies and are knowledgeable about pregnancy/birth give birth range and not a date because they know it’s not always accurate.

if one thinks giving birth in a mud field is a good idea, they probably aren’t educated on pregnancy calculations and what they say isn’t going to be accurate.

My grandma was very overdue with her first baby. He was huge, got stuck, needed forceps, was injured, and eventually passed away. It boggles my mind to think these women would be proud of going so overdue. I have another relative that was overdue. I can’t remember how many days exactly. Maybe 9? But that baby passed meconium which is more likely when they are overdue. Then he aspirated it and was in the NICU for awhile. She’s very lucky that didn’t happen to her baby. She said she sucked the meconium out of his mouth. 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

1 hour ago, KWLand said:

I may have said this earlier in the thread, but unless they have had a first trimester dating ultrasound (so from a medical office and the person is medically trained to perform and read ultrasounds), I don’t trust free birthers due date calculations.   I think so many make their pregnancy length a competition and the longer a pregnancy the better in their eyes because “all turned out okay.”   Even with dating ultrasounds it’s known the dates can be off.  
karissa is a good example of fudging dates based on whatever she decided it was at the time.   In my experience, those who have low intervention pregnancies and are knowledgeable about pregnancy/birth give birth range and not a date because they know it’s not always accurate.

if one thinks giving birth in a mud field is a good idea, they probably aren’t educated on pregnancy calculations and what they say isn’t going to be accurate.

But it doesn't matter whether they're overdue or not in actuality. That they think they are that far over their due dates and yet that isn't a cause for concern is the problem. 

[anachronistic]

I got so excited about babies when they are overdue I for some reason take it as a personal insult. When my sibling was a deal with her first, she did not want to be induced but was told that they did it 10 what is after the babies today, and was not really given a choice. So sibling went online and looked up all of the folk remedies for bringing the baby on, and one of them was walking. She proceeded to walk up-and-down their city for miles and miles and miles, and on the day that she was supposed to be induced, she went into labor. 
 

Do these people not realize that before the advent of modern medicine, when a baby was too overdue, or got too big to come out, mother and child died? No, no they don't, because they actually have access good, government supported healthcare, which they use in a real emergency. (because if you are using scamaritan or similar ilk then you are also using government supported healthcare, the government is paying your medical bills when you do not pay them in full.)

[KWLand]

10 hours ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

But it doesn't matter whether they're overdue or not in actuality. That they think they are that far over their due dates and yet that isn't a cause for concern is the problem. 

Sorry I wasn’t clear.  I think they know they aren’t that far along, it just sounds more impressive in the free birth community.  The strangest ones to me are the ones who didn’t have a period between pregnancies, don’t receive an ultrasound, but somehow decide their due date.

the meconium could be a sign baby was overdue, but it could also be a sign of distress in a non-overdue baby, or it could be another one of those details that’s more impressive in the free birthing world.

I know it’s coming across that I’m (can’t think of the word) this lady’s birth and why I am, it’s the whole free birth/wild pregnancy stories that I question than just this lady.  Especially ones where other details of their pregnancy and birth are inaccurate with how pregnancy and labor work or they are uneducated (like Karissa saying with her miscarriage pregnancy she kept having her period, but she never actually miscarried.). 
 

the competition among free births would be laughable if it wasn’t putting a baby’s life at risk.  The longer the labor, the longer the pregnancy, the more meconium, the longer baby is stuck and mom had to do a crazy move to have baby shift, if baby is breech, if it’s a vbac, etc.  the riskier the more impressive.

[KWLand]

34 minutes ago, anachronistic said:

I got so excited about babies when they are overdue I for some reason take it as a personal insult. When my sibling was a deal with her first, she did not want to be induced but was told that they did it 10 what is after the babies today, and was not really given a choice. So sibling went online and looked up all of the folk remedies for bringing the baby on, and one of them was walking. She proceeded to walk up-and-down their city for miles and miles and miles, and on the day that she was supposed to be induced, she went into labor. 
 

Do these people not realize that before the advent of modern medicine, when a baby was too overdue, or got too big to come out, mother and child died? No, no they don't, because they actually have access good, government supported healthcare, which they use in a real emergency. (because if you are using scamaritan or similar ilk then you are also using government supported healthcare, the government is paying your medical bills when you do not pay them in full.)

I don’t think they care. I was pretty crunchy and loved the forum mothering.  Loved reading the home-birth stories that were low risk.  The high risk homebirth and freebirth stories were my guilty pleasure.  Many never updated on that thread, just posted when they were in labor and listed all the risk factors.  They were like high speed chases for me, I’d refresh over and over hoping for an update.  Occasionally, they would post an update on the grieving board, they would post an update if all turned out okay, but it was assumed if they never updated the outcome wasn’t what they wanted.  Eventually I had to stop reading them because I got so irritated at the advice from others or I got too emotionally invested.

[Hane]

Hey, I had what was a nearly drug-free labor and delivery (they gave me a little something to calm me down during transition), but I wanted all the help I could get! Epidurals weren’t available when I gave birth, or I might have jumped off the crunchy “natural childbirth” bandwagon.