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Seewalds 33: Schroedinger’s Uterus


Jellybean

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I'm another one that wouldn't be here if my mom hadn't had an abortion (if she hadn't aborted, that pregnancy would have killed her). Also wouldn't be here if she hadn't had the birth control pill to help regulate her reproductive system. 

There are a million reasons a person couldn't exist. My grandfather was preparing for the invasion of Japan that was to happen if the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki hadn't happened. An invasion that probably wouldn't have killed many Americans, including my grandfather, all before he fathered my father.

So, I suppose I should be thankful for the deaths of thousands and the suffering of countless people? 

Because that's the same logic as being grateful that my mom didn't abort me. 

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There is a lot of talk about situations in which women get abortions, but I don’t see the relevancy between the why of it and the action. 

My mother was a great mom, married early, and had three children by the time she was 25 and she loved us all. But that’s just the surface. The first born child, my eldest sister who  was born to my mother when my mom was age 18, was born with a terminal illness and given only years to live. My second eldest sister, born when my mother was 20, had a 25% chance of inheriting that disease. Luckily, she did not. The same was true of me, born when my mother was 25. 

My eldest sister died at age 17, when I was only eleven. I held her hand as she died. Both my surviving sister and I are carriers of the gene that killed our sister. 

My father was and is also an opiate addict. He functioned as a father, but it all went downhill as time went on, even stealing pills from my sick sister. 

Well, if you’ve seen in previous posts, you’d know that I have multiple mental illnesses inherited from my fathers side and have had a suicide attempt, hospitalizations, and relatively constant suicide ideation. 

Despite the fact that my mother loved me and shielded me from a lot growing up, I feel that her having me was a mistake and relatively irresponsible. She had to deal with the death of her firstborn, meaning that my illnesses came secondary and she was not committed fully to helping with my continued care once I became an adult. AGAIN she loved me and did her best and I’m thankful for that, but I wish she would have realized that another daughter of hers, for different reasons, would need continued help and care for much longer than she was willing to give. 

Because of my mental illnesses, I look back and wish to god she would have just aborted me and saved all of us the trouble. So I wouldn’t see my sister die, my dad fall further and further into his addiction, have to carry the same gene that killed my sister. They wouldn’t have had to seen me in a coma for days after a stroke on dialysis because I was born into a life that I couldn’t handle. I blame my mental illness way more than my mother for these feelings, but like I said, I wish I never had to deal with any of this. 

This story is just to say that situations and decisions are complicated. They aren’t just one thing that makes an abortion “okay” or “not okay,” they are decisions made (or not made) for multitudes of reasons and most people will never know the whole story of why. 

 

And yes, I fully expect to be called ungrateful. I am mildly ungrateful for my life. That’s my bipolar and depression and anxiety and agoraphobia speaking #sorrynotsorry but also thank you mom for doing your damned best. 

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10 hours ago, RainbowSky said:

 

@pandora Where can a 16 yo drive without permission? That's a new one.

Hah! Good catch, that probably violates a lot of households' rules. I meant legally, a 16 yo can get a driver's license and then doesn't require parental permission to drive.

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55 minutes ago, RubyRei said:

@SorenaJ “Apologies in advance for sounding extremely judgemental.” -> Says something unapologetically judgemental. 

 Wat?

Well if I had said it apologetically judgmental, the first apology would have been redundant. 

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1 hour ago, SorenaJ said:

Well if I had said it apologetically judgmental, the first apology would have been redundant. 

@SorenaJ

While that’s techniclly accurate, just saying “apologies for...” doesn’t automatically make it apologetic in any sense of the word. 

admin:  Just out of curiosity, do upvotes/downvotes etc. get taken off posts that can be inflamatory towards other members? I’ve seen it before but never had it happen to my post. Just wanted to know and apologies for any problems caused. Thanks! (Eta I’m just now realizing this may not be the case at all. I’m a confused lady sometimes...)

@SapphireSlytherin Thank you!

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1 minute ago, RubyRei said:

@SorenaJ

While that’s techniclly accurate, just saying “apologies for...” doesn’t automatically make it apologetic in any sense of the word. 

Would seem a bit harsh without an apology. I can apologise if I have upset people. 

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On 6/3/2018 at 8:56 AM, sansan said:

Thank ya Mamas for not thinking like you.

No, I wish my mother did think like I do. I would never have wanted her to have had a child she didn't want, but I'm afraid she would have done so and have been miserable if that had happened. As it is, she had a bunch of kids, but they were all planned. Why would I wish an unwanted pregnancy on my mother? 

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1 hour ago, RubyRei said:

There is a lot of talk about situations in which women get abortions, but I don’t see the relevancy between the why of it and the action. 

My mother was a great mom, married early, and had three children by the time she was 25 and she loved us all. But that’s just the surface. The first born child, my eldest sister who  was born to my mother when my mom was age 18, was born with a terminal illness and given only years to live. My second eldest sister, born when my mother was 20, had a 25% chance of inheriting that disease. Luckily, she did not. The same was true of me, born when my mother was 25. 

My eldest sister died at age 17, when I was only eleven. I held her hand as she died. Both my surviving sister and I are carriers of the gene that killed our sister. 

My father was and is also an opiate addict. He functioned as a father, but it all went downhill as time went on, even stealing pills from my sick sister. 

Well, if you’ve seen in previous posts, you’d know that I have multiple mental illnesses inherited from my fathers side and have had a suicide attempt, hospitalizations, and relatively constant suicide ideation. 

Despite the fact that my mother loved me and shielded me from a lot growing up, I feel that her having me was a mistake and relatively irresponsible. She had to deal with the death of her firstborn, meaning that my illnesses came secondary and she was not committed fully to helping with my continued care once I became an adult. AGAIN she loved me and did her best and I’m thankful for that, but I wish she would have realized that another daughter of hers, for different reasons, would need continued help and care for much longer than she was willing to give. 

Because of my mental illnesses, I look back and wish to god she would have just aborted me and saved all of us the trouble. So I wouldn’t see my sister die, my dad fall further and further into his addiction, have to carry the same gene that killed my sister. They wouldn’t have had to seen me in a coma for days after a stroke on dialysis because I was born into a life that I couldn’t handle. I blame my mental illness way more than my mother for these feelings, but like I said, I wish I never had to deal with any of this. 

This story is just to say that situations and decisions are complicated. They aren’t just one thing that makes an abortion “okay” or “not okay,” they are decisions made (or not made) for multitudes of reasons and most people will never know the whole story of why. 

 

And yes, I fully expect to be called ungrateful. I am mildly ungrateful for my life. That’s my bipolar and depression and anxiety and agoraphobia speaking #sorrynotsorry but also thank you mom for doing your damned best. 

Mental illness is fucking bitch! Hugs lady, I understand completely what you are conveying here. :hug:

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@RubyRei I'm so sorry that you're struggling! Nothing else to say but lots and lots of hugs! :hug:

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3 hours ago, pandora said:

Hah! Good catch, that probably violates a lot of households' rules. I meant legally, a 16 yo can get a driver's license and then doesn't require parental permission to drive.

If they don’t own their own car then they’ll definitely still require permission to drive. :pb_lol:

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2 minutes ago, VelociRapture said:

If they don’t own their own car then they’ll definitely still require permission to drive. :pb_lol:

Oh very much so  :pb_lol: I didn't get my license until I was a couple years out of high school and bought myself a car, so I guess it's something I never had to think about navigating. This reminds me that my prom group rolled into junior prom crowded into someone's parents' minivan, which we decorated ridiculously (it was what everybody did at our school). I'm hoping we had permission? lol

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3 hours ago, pandora said:

Hah! Good catch, that probably violates a lot of households' rules. I meant legally, a 16 yo can get a driver's license and then doesn't require parental permission to drive.

Technically they do.

If I say my 16yo can't drive, I can take their permit or license away. I do have to give permission that they can get it to begin with.  

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15 minutes ago, RainbowSky said:

Technically they do.

If I say my 16yo can't drive, I can take their permit or license away. I do have to give permission that they can get it to begin with.  

My daughter got her license at 16, but I didn't have to sign anything at the DMV, plus I was VERY happy for her to be able to go places without my having to haul her here-and-there. We also bought her a car (because her having her own car meant our insurance wouldn't go up as much as if she were driving our -- higher-end -- cars). 

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59 minutes ago, RainbowSky said:

Technically they do.

If I say my 16yo can't drive, I can take their permit or license away. I do have to give permission that they can get it to begin with.  

I had a teacher in high school who told me when his parents would take away his license as a punishment, he would go to the DMV claiming he lost his license. 

In a way I guess you have permission because licenses cost money, and you need a bunch of ID when getting it (at least in my state), but my parents weren't around at all when I got mine. My permit was mailed to me after I took the written test, and I had a driving instructor take me to the DMV to get my license while my mom was at work. I didn't actually need their permission. My friend could have driven me there and it wouldn't have made a difference. 

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I've lurked for ages but just signed up to post. 

I know this was pages ago, so I hope it's okay to bring it up again - but I'm in the UK and thought it was worth explaining that our abortion rates are slightly higher per thousand because we have a really bad history with adoption and it's VERY socially unacceptable to willingly go through with pregnancy in order to give up a baby for adoption these days. In fact, it almost never happens any more. We do have babies in care that need fostering or adoption, but they almost all come from families who are unable to care for them despite support from Social Services. 

So, if you get pregnant unexpectedly for most women the only options they will really consider are having and keeping a baby/child/teenager all the way through or abortion. It's one of those hidden culture clash things.

Our rates are also slightly higher because around ten women a day are still travelling from Ireland to the UK to access legal abortion and will continue to do so until the new legal abortion set up is sorted. I wouldn't be surprised if this is true for other countries in Europe that neighbour countries where abortion is illegal. 

It's totally feasible that we're also a bit crap at contraception! 

 

I also just wanted to say thank you to everyone for sharing their stories, women's real experiences are so, so powerful. I know I am related to people who would have had much better lives in they had been able to access abortion and decent contraception. 

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21 minutes ago, Gillyweed said:

In a way I guess you have permission because licenses cost money, and you need a bunch of ID when getting it (at least in my state), but my parents weren't around at all when I got mine. My permit was mailed to me after I took the written test, and I had a driving instructor take me to the DMV to get my license while my mom was at work. I didn't actually need their permission. My friend could have driven me there and it wouldn't have made a difference. 

That seems weird to me. Of course, where I grew up, we had to go to court to pick up our licenses. They handed our licenses to our parents instead of to us and a judge told them that it was really theirs and they could give it to us or take it away as they saw fit. I don't think I would have been able to get a new one without parental permission until I turned 18, though I never tried. 

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1 hour ago, RainbowSky said:

Technically they do.

If I say my 16yo can't drive, I can take their permit or license away. I do have to give permission that they can get it to begin with.  

Yes, I don't really think we're disagreeing here. In the state where I grew up, a parent has to give consent for a teen to get a permit or license, and the signing parent can revoke their license legally if they provide valid reasons. And of course no kid can just borrow their parent's car without asking, they could report the kid for theft. What I originally wrote was "we understand teens are taking on new responsibilities. At 16 your minor child can drive without your supervision or permission", and I think that point is still valid. You get to parent as you like, but you couldn't get a kid's license legally cancelled because they didn't tell you they were stopping to get a Frosty on the way home from school. My post was exploring that teens aren't completely independent, but taking important steps toward independence.

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*shrug*

It even says on the application that a parent or guardian can revoke driving privileges at any time before 18 and they have to check and sign off on it saying that they understand.

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13 hours ago, Runningfromreality said:

That seems weird to me. Of course, where I grew up, we had to go to court to pick up our licenses. They handed our licenses to our parents instead of to us and a judge told them that it was really theirs and they could give it to us or take it away as they saw fit. I don't think I would have been able to get a new one without parental permission until I turned 18, though I never tried. 

Definitely not my experience! My dad went with me to the DMV, but I think he was just my ride. I don’t think my state would have been at all okay with parents taking away a state-issued document from a 16-17-year-old.

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Oldest is 17, and here in Michigan they have "levels" of permits/licensing. After taking her initial driver's ed course, we had to go down to the DMV and I had to sign for her to get her permit. She had to drive 50 hours (10 of which at night) with a parent then take the level 2 class. After that they drive another 20 hours then graduate to a full license. 

She was given a car for graduation (which was last night btw, no Duggary walk across the living room ceremony for my kiddos!) But the mechanic said it needs a LOT of work and they don't believe it's worth what's in her limited savings to dump into it. So now we're on the hunt for a different car. She'll be responsible for gas and the difference in my insurance, otherwise I think she'll do just fine. I get chauffeured everywhere cuz she loves my SUV!

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On 5/31/2018 at 6:38 PM, Snowless said:

I am absolutely in agreement with you on this: incest is rape.  The only difference between rape and incest is that incest is committed by a close family member, whereas in general terms a rapist does not have to have a familial relation to the victim.

A child born of incest does stand a higher risk of developing genetic abnormalities, which is why it’s so taboo.  One does not need to look any further than the Spanish branch of the Habsburg dynasty.  The Habsburgs were famous for their intermarriages and interbreeding to preserve their royal bloodline, which led to a prevalence of a protrusion of the lower jaw in that family that was nicknamed the “Habsburg Jaw”.  It affected the final Spanish ruler of the Habsburg line, Charles II of Spain, to the point that chewing and speaking were difficult.  (His parents were uncle and niece to each other.)  Charles II had numerous physical and mental disabilities as a result, in addition to being infertile.  He died at the age of 38 with no children, and Spain ended up in a war over who would assume the Spanish throne that lasted 13 years and resulted in a King of France being named the King of Spain (but he had to renounce his crown as King of France) and a whole bunch of land changing hands.

I don't think that anyone can say that incest is always rape when it is a case of two consenting adults. Socially its icky but that doesn't make it rape. There may be even more incest than we're aware of with adoption and anonymous sperm donors where people might not even know that they have siblings/cousins.

Just one generation of inbreeding is usually not going to result in serious genetic abnormalities unless both are affected. In many genetic diseases, each parent has two copies of the gene. These genes can be affected, carrier, or normal. If both parents are affected then both of their genes are affected and when they each pass one of those genes to a child, both are affected genes and the child then has two affected genes. But if one parent is a carrier (one normal and one affected gene), he may pass on the normal gene and then the resulting child would be a carrier but not affected. And the risk goes down from there. If both parents are carriers, they would both have to pass on their affected gene and not the normal one for the child to exhibit abnormalities. And those abnormalities may not even be visible or fatal deformities.

While EWWWW, it is continued inbreeding from a small gene pool that produces the genetic issues that are seen in the Habsburgs or the Colt Family in Australia not the occasional sibling or cousins producing children.

Not that I am saying that incest would be a good thing. It's just more of an ick factor than a practical one. 

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"Maybe. Even a minor in a loving home can feel fear or shame, or exercise poor judgement when faced with a pregnancy and possib le abortion decision. Teens are not always known for their good judgement."

 

Studies (no, I don't have them at my fingertips but I've worked in family planning clinics) show that those teens who feel they can confide in their parents do so. 

Second, in every state a minor can enter into a legally binding contract to surrender a living child for adoption without parental permission. If they can legally terminate their parental rights for the benefit of the adoption industry, then IMO they should be legally able to terminate their pregnancy for their own benefit.

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