IBLP Calls Cops on Bill Gothard for Trespass

[formergothardite]

I wonder what their justification for kicking him out was because they "investigated" and found nothing, so it isn't like they can say they kicked him out for being a creep who preyed on teen girls. 

52 minutes ago, Curious said:

My guess is that it's the only time they get to have their eligible kids see and be seen.  Since these people are so isolationist, they don't have much chance of marrying adults children off unless they go to these things year after year.

Yes, it very much was a social event and a time to hang out with families that share the same values. 

[Marionette]

10 hours ago, CyborgKin said:

Anyhow, back to IBLP stuff.  I have come across a few people in Australia who've been involved in some ATI stuff here but I don't have any details and don't really know how much of a relationship there is between this branch and the USA.  Though I do remember something about them selling off some big conference facility several months ago.  I don't know how that turned out though.  But it did have a thread on FJ at the time.

I know quite a few IBLPers go to Australia often... They still host JTTH & family conferences there. And the IBLP Aussies are really involved in the new RiseUp Discipleship program. I haven't heard anything about if they actually sold the AU facilities.

3 hours ago, Curious said:

My guess is that it's the only time they get to have their eligible kids see and be seen.  Since these people are so isolationist, they don't have much chance of marrying adults children off unless they go to these things year after year.

Plus, the "lower class" get to mingle with the "royals" like the Duggars/Bateseseseses

It's true that its one of the only times a year these families get to "fellowship" with a ton of other like-mindeds. I think that is the only reason they go back... And yes, of course, to find potential spouses for their older kids. 

Also true. People used to come solely for that purpose.

[refugee]

5 hours ago, Curious said:

My guess is that it's the only time they get to have their eligible kids see and be seen.  Since these people are so isolationist, they don't have much chance of marrying adults children off unless they go to these things year after year.

Plus, the "lower class" get to mingle with the "royals" like the Duggars/Bateseseseses

It's kind of silly to pretend you aren't there if you are teaching classes.  Do they really think people are that stupid?

From an ex-fundie (not ATI) standpoint, it might also have been the closest thing to a vacation the families (especially the mothers) get. When we were homeschooling and living on one income and shamed into tithing 10+% and brainwashed against worldly pleasures, my only “breaks” were church family camp and homeschool science camp. It was a lot of work to get ready, but relative relaxation while there (sitting in seminars and doing activities are a far cry from housework, and shared chores meant adult conversation, at least, and there was time to sit and soak in the woodsy atmosphere and meditate on the Word or latest sermon while the kids played on the playground or splashed in shallow water).

So I can imagine the ATI family camp having a similar effect.

4 hours ago, formergothardite said:

I wonder what their justification for kicking him out was because they "investigated" and found nothing, so it isn't like they can say they kicked him out for being a creep who preyed on teen girls. 

Yes, it very much was a social event and a time to hang out with families that share the same values. 

“families that share the same values”—yes! I can imagine! In our rather large homeschool support group, I think 3 of the families were ATI. They would come to group events (moms’ breakfasts, field trips, for example) but outside the group events, they only socialized with each other. My interactions with them were cordial, but they felt standoffish. I suppose Gothard discouraged friendship with non-ATI families?

[Marionette]

Even though I, like the rest of you all, find P*ckles utterly annoying, idiotic, and hypocritical... She has screenshots of comments made by Gothard-worshipers on Embassy Media's page about his appearance at the conference and how he should be forgiven, and how the board is being hypocritical because they are not reconciling with him.

[refugee]

20 minutes ago, Marionette said:

Even though I, like the rest of you all, find P*ckles utterly annoying, idiotic, and hypocritical... She has screenshots of comments made by Gothard-worshipers on Embassy Media's page about his appearance at the conference and how he should be forgiven, and how the board is being hypocritical because they are not reconciling with him.

Yes, let’s welcome him back and show our love and trust for him by giving him unrestricted private access to our teen daughters!

The accusations were all lies and gossip, anyway.

/s

[Themanda Duggar]

Maybe Gothard is trying to create a division in the ATI/IBLP world, with the intentions of drawing a large number of people away from it and toward the cult he’s trying to start now.  Divide and conquer is one of the world’s oldest strategies because it often works.

[AliceInFundyland]

@Marionette So then is Gothard still talked about or discussed? or has he become like Voldemort and is now He-who-shall-not-be-named?

[CyborgKin]

Fear not, I'm all booked in to attend the Creation SuperConference.

Hopefully this one doesn't give me cancer

[Palimpsest]

On 4/27/2018 at 8:30 AM, formergothardite said:

I wonder what their justification for kicking him out was because they "investigated" and found nothing, so it isn't like they can say they kicked him out for being a creep who preyed on teen girls.

Of course not.  But even according to Alfred they did decide that his "conduct had been unworthy of a leader."

I'm still waiting for the fuller account of what went down, Alfie.  

Quote

April 27, 2018    

We will be posting a fuller account, hopefully tonight. But, no, that was the end of the session. The policeman cited him with a warning that explicitly threatened him with a hefty fine and up to a year if he set foot on the premises again. He was told to leave immediately, not even allowed to drive his own car. The one he had just driven 14 hours to be there.

It has been two days.  And did they make poor old BG leg it out there, then?  He wasn't allowed to drive his own car?  What happened to the car?

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

And did they make poor old BG leg it out there, then?  He wasn't allowed to drive his own car?  What happened to the car?

Sorry to quote myself, but I just double checked to see whether Alfred had posted the fuller account yet. He hasn't.

However, he took the time to clarify about the car today.  Someone expressed doubt that BG, at 83, would have driven 14 hours all by himself.

Quote

 

Moderator

April 29, 2018    

In answer to your implied doubt, I specifically asked the young man that went with him, and he confirmed: His hands never touched the wheel of Bill’s car, other than when he had to drive Bill back to the hotel after the policemen forbade him from driving. Again, sounds like they made one stop along the way.

 

So BG had a young humper to accompany him but wouldn't let him share the driving.  And one wonders why the policeman forbade him to drive back to his hotel.

[Dandruff]

4 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

And one wonders why the policeman forbade him to drive back to his hotel.

Maybe he was so agitated that the policeman thought driving would be unsafe?

[BullyJBG]

http://www.discoveringgrace.com/2018/04/29/bill-gothard-went-down-to-texas/

 Here it is. Read it and weep.

[refugee]

17 minutes ago, BullyJBG said:

http://www.discoveringgrace.com/2018/04/29/bill-gothard-went-down-to-texas/

 Here it is. Read it and weep.

Reading that made me feel sick inside. Ever the master manipulator. He trained them well; they were on guard against his manipulation techniques, even as they were employing their own, many of which I’m sure they learned from him and his teachings.

Sick. Sick. Sick.

[Howl]

Quote

Bill is 83, he founded the ministry, he has been unjustly accused as evidenced by the the spectacular failure of a major lawsuit backed by 3 respected law firms to even get a single charge of “negligence” from one plaintiff through to depositions, let alone trial.

 So. damned. infuriating.  These men just don't get it and never will. 

[Beermeet]

On 4/18/2018 at 8:57 AM, Palimpsest said:

Wasn't it last year they posted on Instagram they were in Niagara Falls?   And they definitely hide from the cameras these days.

 

 

I'm not sure this can be answered but, why do you all think that is?  They believe all that shit mentioned above in the classes and love them some IBLP.  Why hide?  It implies shame or deceit to me.  When I truly believe in something I talk about it.  Popular or not, I own it.  

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, BullyJBG said:

http://www.discoveringgrace.com/2018/04/29/bill-gothard-went-down-to-texas/

 Here it is. Read it and weep.

I read it and thought that dear Alfred probably couldn't have made dear Bill look worse if he tried.  Dear Alfred fucks up every single time he tries to defend Billy-boy.  He just does not get it and is so transparent! 

Not that I have an iota of respect for the current board and leadership of IBLP.  They performed a coup, dumped Gothard as a liability, grabbed a shit-load of money and real estate, and have not reformed the sick message.  At all.  They have just tried to rebrand and attempt to soften the destructive message, and to distance themselves from BG's sexual assaults.  Including the rapes and sexual assaults that happened under the BoD's watch that were not perpetuated by Gothard himself.  The rapes and assaults Bates and Paine (especially Paine) have repeatedly denied and dismissed.

But let's look at Alfie's paeon to Gothard:

Quote

This week he took a young man who had been helping him, climbed into his car and drove the two of them 14 hours down to Big Sandy.  When they arrived he registered them as participants, paid the several hundred dollars for them to attend, and walked into the main venue.  As folks recognized him they gathered around for a joyful reunion.  Many came up to thank him for being the instrument of a saved marriage, saved finances, saved family, and coming to know Jesus in salvation.  

Oh, seriously?  Photographic evidence needed here.  But darn, it would have been funny if that had actually happened.  And all the stuff about people worrying that Gil Bates and co. were going to hurt their beloved leader.  Pft.  I have not yet seen outrage by attendees on social media about how badly their beloved pervert and foot fetishist was treated.

Quote

When they arrived Mr. Bates and Dr. Paine were there to meet him – Bill asked where Dr. Levendusky was, as he wished to address the entire board, but was just told that he was “unavailable”. 

Well, if Billy-boy wanted to address the "entire board" he should have asked about the whereabouts of the mysterious Pastor David York too. 

Yeah, reading between the lines, BG crashed Big Sandy armed with leaflets aimed at trying to get attendees to reinstate him to the presidency of IBLP.  They stopped him from distributing them.  And law enforcement supported them.

He only had one "supporter" with him,  That supporter saw the writing on the wall and managed to persuade the old pervert (and turkey) to get out of the oven.

Again, ousting Gothard from IBLP (and Big Sandy) does not make the present board look good.  It just means that they want the obvious liability out of there while they continue to promote his fucked up "Christian" Patriarchal message.

[Dandruff]

I think all that's missing are some of Derick Dillard's creepy need help, ask me t-shirts for Bill G and the rest of the jerk offs.

[formergothardite]

Aww. Did Bill not actually pay attention to the Pineapple Story he forced everyone to study? If he had he would have learned to stop fighting to get back into IBLP because it all belongs to God. 

[formergothardite]

I should explain for all the people who never heard of the Pineapple Story. It is supposedly the true story of a missionary who planted a  pineapple garden. The ebil natives kept stealing his pineapples. He put up a fence, he chased them off, he denied them medical care, he tried all sorts of ways to stop them from stealing his pineapples. He was so mad because he was doing all this work to raise the pineapples yet didn't get to enjoy the fruits of his labor. There is a whole lot of blah, blah, blah, and then he was convicted by God that he was in the wrong because while he may have planted and cared for the pineapples, they were actually God's. He was getting angry over something that never really belonged to him. So he told the oh so ebil natives that the pineapples were God's and they all stopped stealing and became Christians. The actually story takes an hour to tell. There is a book too. 

Anyway, it seems like Gothard is a bit in the same situation. His evil life's work has been stolen from him, someone needs to mail him a copy of the Pineapple Story. 

2 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

mysterious Pastor David York

Is there proof this person actually exists? 

[Palimpsest]

14 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

Is there proof this person actually exists? 

I think he is probably this guy:  http://crossroadswi.com/Sermon Archive/preacher/pastor-david-york/

But his IBLP cred is impeccable.  And he has Reversals!

Quote

Pastor David York

David York first attended a Basic Seminar in Chicago in 1969. This gave him a foundation for further training, which he received at the University of Michigan and at Dallas Theological Seminary and Trinity Divinity School. In 1984 his family was one of the original 102 families of the Advanced Training Institute. At that time, he was associate pastor of a church in Wisconsin. 

He is married to his high school sweetheart, Brenda, and they have eight children and fourteen grandchildren. Their last four children are reversal babies. Pastor York has been faithfully serving his church (now as the lead pastor) since 1992. The success in the marriages of his older children and his success in ministry bring to the Board an important aspect of counsel and guidance. 

And he is almost certainly a rubber stamp for the present BoD.  Unless he has kicked the bucket - but I haven't found an obituary yet.

 

[formergothardite]

OOhhh! One of the original ATI folks! That does make him special.

I wonder who these young men are who are still hanging onto Gothard. It sounds like Gothard is poor, bored, and tired of not living in the spotlight. Seems like his plan was to waltz in there, "humbly" attract a lot of attention and make people beg him to get up and say something. He has underestimated the people he is up against. Gil and Co. aren't giving up this empire. 

 

[FloraKitty35]

On 4/18/2018 at 10:57 AM, formergothardite said:

~preparing your family for persecution

~being ready for death

~the rewards you will get in heaven

~not being for sale at any price

~real science confirms the Bible is true

 

I have some critiques to offer on points 1, 2, 4, & 5:

1. These people confuse persecution with not getting ones own way.

2. What?  Steve Maxwell isn't available for this one.

4. Pot meet kettle

5,  No, it does not.  

[Evangeline]

OMG @formergothardite the Pineapple Story!!!! I had forgotten about that. Was that an ATI book? What a horrible story. Even when I was in grade school, it made me uncomfortable. The missionary was such as asshole. And, OMG, I just realized something. John Shrader is totally that missionary! 

[formergothardite]

22 minutes ago, Evangeline said:

OMG @formergothardite the Pineapple Story!!!! I had forgotten about that. Was that an ATI book? What a horrible story. Even when I was in grade school, it made me uncomfortable. The missionary was such as asshole. And, OMG, I just realized something. John Shrader is totally that missionary! 

I saw it as a video. They played it at conferences and we watched it at EXCEL. I think it was also used in a Wisdom Book. I do remember thinking, "wait, he wouldn't give them the medication they needed because they took pineapples? That isn't very nice." The whole story was pretty damn racist but people loved it. 

John Shrader was raised in ATI and I bet he adored the parts about punishing the natives. 

ETA: Here is the first part of it. 

Spoiler

 

 

[Marionette]

On 4/27/2018 at 9:59 PM, AliceInFundyland said:

@Marionette So then is Gothard still talked about or discussed? or has he become like Voldemort and is now He-who-shall-not-be-named?

IIRC, the only mentions I've really heard of him is just about how he founded this "wonderful ministry." Other than that, I've not heard people talk about him very often.