Captain Bret Alan Smith Part 5: Still No Trial Update: He Plead Guilty

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Mudgie said:

I just read that disgusting piece of self righteous psycho babble he spews. Talk about justifying your own actions. That man doesn't embody the idea of Christ, he wields it like a weapon to beat other people with.  I'd be really interested to know what kind of psychological evaluation would show about the Captain.

I can only imagine the level of emotional and mental abuse Katie and her children suffered at the hands of this man and his son for all of those years. If she doesn't have PTSD I'd be stunned.

Those men are both walking wastes of human flesh.

I hope she never has to to have any contact with either of them ever again in her or her children's lifetimes.

I’m just really sad that he has two daughters still living at home. How horrible it must be to live in a house like that. Where it’s completely obvious that Alan’s feelings are more important to your parents than your sisters and the victim he abused. I can’t even imagine living with them in that environment. Plus it’s obvious your oldest adopted brothers agree with dear old dad too. 

Edited November 19, 2018 by JermajestyDuggar

[Lurky]

On 11/14/2018 at 1:56 PM, usedbicycle said:

As someone else mentioned earlier, I wonder how both families would have dealt with the situation had the roles been reversed and one of the Morton men been the abuser. Part of me feels like Brett would NOT be advocating for reconciliation but I don't know to what extent the Morton clan would turn against one of their own. 

I would bet cash money that if a non-Smith had committed the sexual abuse, Captain Brett would have been screaming for the death penalty, with all the Bible verses to back him up.  He's such a disgusting excuse of a human being - the only thing he cares about is his older son and his own pride. 

48 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I’m just really sad that he has two daughters still living at home. How horrible it must be to live in a house like that. Where it’s completely obvious that Alan’s feelings are more important to your parents than your sisters and the victim he abused

Yeah, and it puts them at all sorts of risk, because they must know that if anything like abuse ever happened to them, they couldn't possibly tell their father because he would automatically side their their abuser.

[ophelia]

11 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

 Plus it’s obvious your oldest adopted brothers agree with dear old dad too. 

While I totally agree with you, I have my doubts that the older boys really have a chance wether they agree with the Captain or not. There must be so much brainwashing going on that the boys probably don't have a chance. It's good that they are in public school now so that there is at least a little bit of outside influence to their thinking. 

 

[JermajestyDuggar]

6 hours ago, ophelia said:

While I totally agree with you, I have my doubts that the older boys really have a chance wether they agree with the Captain or not. There must be so much brainwashing going on that the boys probably don't have a chance. It's good that they are in public school now so that there is at least a little bit of outside influence to their thinking. 

 

I think the two oldest boys aren’t in school. I think Wally, Arman, and Madara are all adults and have “graduated” homeschool. I think just the youngest 5 are in school. Although I believe Wally has learned a trade. So they can have outside schooling at trade school. But it seems that the Capn has taken the two oldest to the prison with him to minister to the inmates. 

[ophelia]

Thank you, @JermajestyDuggar for clarifying that.

It is a good thing that Wally has learned a trade. That means he had at least some exposure to the outside world and maybe even made non-fundie friends. There are still some supporters of the Captain out there, but overall the family seems to be pretty much isolated. Especially compared to the times when the Sanders, Mortons, Campanas, Thomases, etc. seemed to spend all their free time together.

[JermajestyDuggar]

2 minutes ago, ophelia said:

Thank you, @JermajestyDuggar for clarifying that.

It is a good thing that Wally has learned a trade. That means he had at least some exposure to the outside world and maybe even made non-fundie friends. There are still some supporters of the Captain out there, but overall the family seems to be pretty much isolated. Especially compared to the times when the Sanders, Mortons, Campanas, Thomases, etc. seemed to spend all their free time together.

It’s disturbing to think about but if Alan had committed almost any other crime, the fundie friends would have forgiven him pretty quickly and all would be well in fundieland. I’m glad these people are being shunned but it’s crazy to think that not much would have changed if he had been convicted of almost any other crime. We’ve seen so many fundies be welcomed back into their community after doing heinous things. I’m glad that isn’t the case here. 

[ophelia]

Exactly. And the longer they keep telling the tale of their golden boy they will isolate themselves even more. I don't care about the Captain or Jackie, but the damage that they are doing to their remaining kids is really heartbreaking.

[bea]

So we’ve got people who are blindly accepting of a sexual predator doing “prison ministry.”
THAT’S going to end well.

[SMF007]

Fun fact that I wanted to join and jump in on here is ... my family was close friends with the Smith Family growing up. Extremely close. Captain Bret even started getting my parents into some of their fundamentalist beliefs- which made my life a living nightmare for years. Believe it or not, they were once pretty normal folks. They started slowly getting more fundamentalist as the years went on. My opinion about the "Captain" is that he is a narcissistic misogynist. He views his wife and his children as property belonging to him (He even had a special whistling sound he would make unique for every child...and his wife, and they were expected to come when called). He is very misguided about his ways of thinking and always has been. When I read his recent Facebook post (and no we aren't friends despite his many friend requests) my jaw dropped. An ear being cutoff is actually lot different than children being abused. But having known "Captain" Bret for years I know he lives in his own mind and does not talk well with others. He can't listen to other's opinions and absorb- he absolutely believes he is the mouthpiece of God. It's very sad for all of his children. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

9 minutes ago, SMF007 said:

Fun fact that I wanted to join and jump in on here is ... my family was close friends with the Smith Family growing up. Extremely close. Captain Bret even started getting my parents into some of their fundamentalist beliefs- which made my life a living nightmare for years. Believe it or not, they were once pretty normal folks. They started slowly getting more fundamentalist as the years went on. My opinion about the "Captain" is that he is a narcissistic misogynist. He views his wife and his children as property belonging to him (He even had a special whistling sound he would make unique for every child...and his wife, and they were expected to come when called). He is very misguided about his ways of thinking and always has been. When I read his recent Facebook post (and no we aren't friends despite his many friend requests) my jaw dropped. An ear being cutoff is actually lot different than children being abused. But having known "Captain" Bret for years I know he lives in his own mind and does not talk well with others. He can't listen to other's opinions and absorb- he absolutely believes he is the mouthpiece of God. It's very sad for all of his children. 

When did your parents stop their friendship with the Smiths? What was the reason? 

[SMF007]

Okay wow, long story so let me try to make this brief. My parents got divorced when I was 20ish years old (I'm a little older than Alan Smith).  The Smith's came running to my father's side (my father who was terribly abusive and controlling and loved that Bret basically gave him a belief system that supported,  you know, beating children). My mother was terribly hurt by their choosing my father's side. In The Smith's opinions my mother was not being the picture of a good housewife. They would have counseling sessions with my parents where Jackie would "teach" my mother how to be submissive to her husband. Surprise, surprise that counseling didn't work. My mother fell out with the Smith's during the time of the divorce and I know it really hurt her that they so blatantly took his side. Everything in my parents marriage that was bad, Bret & Jackie blamed on my mother. I haven't spoke with my father since I got out of his abusive house at 18 but I know (through family members) that he is still in contact  with The Smith Family. He lives a good distance from them now so I'm sure they don't see each other but I have been told that they do still talk occasionally. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

8 minutes ago, SMF007 said:

Okay wow, long story so let me try to make this brief. My parents got divorced when I was 20ish years old (I'm a little older than Alan Smith).  The Smith's came running to my father's side (my father who was terribly abusive and controlling and loved that Bret basically gave him a belief system that supported,  you know, beating children). My mother was terribly hurt by their choosing my father's side. In The Smith's opinions my mother was not being the picture of a good housewife. They would have counseling sessions with my parents where Jackie would "teach" my mother how to be submissive to her husband. Surprise, surprise that counseling didn't work. My mother fell out with the Smith's during the time of the divorce and I know it really hurt her that they so blatantly took his side. Everything in my parents marriage that was bad, Bret & Jackie blamed on my mother. I haven't spoke with my father since I got out of his abusive house at 18 but I know (through family members) that he is still in contact  with The Smith Family. He lives a good distance from them now so I'm sure they don't see each other but I have been told that they do still talk occasionally. 

I’m so sorry that happened to your family. What the capn did doesn’t surprise me in the least. That disgusting behavior sounds just like him. 

Did you ever meet the Morton’s? 

[fundiefan]

None of that surprises me in the least about Bret. It also kind of confirms what I've always thought to be true - Papa Morton is a follower, not a leader. In Bret, he found someone who had all the rules and he dragged his family into Bret's world for his own benefit. 

 

[SMF007]

Never met the Morton's. Alan and Kressant both got married after I was out of my household. I only saw the Smith's once after I moved out of my family home and that's because my sister was living with them for a summer. 

Sadly, I think a lot of people get into these Fundamentalist type religions looking for an acceptable way to control their children and wives. Interestingly, my father was never a follower or cared what anyone thought. Both my parents grew up in Catholic household but became Evangelical in their young adult lives before having children. I think he liked finding an acceptable way to control and reign.  And Bret isn't a great leader either, most of his ideas are pieced together from other's teachings. I never heard the Bill Gothard name growing up but I'm sure it had a huge influence of Bret's beliefs because a lot of what he preached was Gothard-like. Bret is also all over the place, he's had a bunch of different careers and businesses. I think the only way he's managed a small "following" is by collecting children from all over the world to force into his religion. 

[SMF007]

 Also, when my family met the Smith family they were attending The Assembly of God Church (and Capt. Bret's dad was a pastor of an Assembly of God Church). A few years later he started his own church at home and it spiraled out of control from there... 

[JermajestyDuggar]

28 minutes ago, SMF007 said:

 Also, when my family met the Smith family they were attending The Assembly of God Church (and Capt. Bret's dad was a pastor of an Assembly of God Church). A few years later he started his own church at home and it spiraled out of control from there... 

I’m curious what your sister thinks of them now since she lived with them for a short time. 

[SMF007]

Oh my sister thinks they (Bret & Jackie) are totally crazy. She is younger than me and was good friends with the girls and still keeps in contact with Kressant, Rachel, and Bethany. (Yerik & Arman were both adopted towards the end of our contact with the Smith's and we never met any of the other children)  We both feel bad for all the kids involved in that family. We were both shocked when the charges about Alan came out. She was even contacted by Smith family members asking if Alan had ever inappropriately touched her as a child (which thank God he hadn't). We spent so much time with the Smith's, taking vacations together, sleepovers, etc., that he would have had plenty of opportunity to and I'm so glad nothing like that happened! 

[JermajestyDuggar]

4 minutes ago, SMF007 said:

Oh my sister thinks they (Bret & Jackie) are totally crazy. She is younger than me and was good friends with the girls and still keeps in contact with Kressant, Rachel, and Bethany. (Yerik & Arman were both adopted towards the end of our contact with the Smith's and we never met any of the other children)  We both feel bad for all the kids involved in that family. We were both shocked when the charges about Alan came out. She was even contacted by Smith family members asking if Alan had ever inappropriately touched her as a child (which thank God he hadn't). We spent so much time with the Smith's, taking vacations together, sleepovers, etc., that he would have had plenty of opportunity to and I'm so glad nothing like that happened! 

I’m so glad your family was able to get away from the Smiths and I hope nowadays it’s very hard for Capn Bret to get any other families under his nasty influence. Jackie and Bret should be shunned by anyone with a conscience. 

[hoipolloi]

@SMF007 - thank you for being willing to talk about what must have been a horrendous time in your life. I'm glad you and your family were able to get away from the Smiths.

1 hour ago, fundiefan said:

None of that surprises me in the least about Bret. It also kind of confirms what I've always thought to be true - Papa Morton is a follower, not a leader. In Bret, he found someone who had all the rules and he dragged his family into Bret's world for his own benefit. 

 

ITA. Papa Morton bears significant responsibility for what happened. 

Then again, the lure of a rules system that guarantees raising your kids to be perfect adults is truly a siren call to many parents, both religious & secular.

[fundiefan]

10 minutes ago, hoipolloi said:

@SMF007 - thank you for being willing to talk about what must have been a horrendous time in your life. I'm glad you and your family were able to get away from the Smiths.

ITA. Papa Morton bears significant responsibility for what happened. 

Then again, the lure of a rules system that guarantees raising your kids to be perfect adults is truly a siren call to many parents, both religious & secular.

I agree. He absolutely chose to find someone to give him permission.  He was definitely a controlling ass hiding behind religion and using it to justify his choices; but when he hooked up with Bret, he found someone to write the rules for him. Giving him both the permission and absolve him of responsibility. 

[AmazonGrace]

2 hours ago, SMF007 said:

 Also, when my family met the Smith family they were attending The Assembly of God Church (and Capt. Bret's dad was a pastor of an Assembly of God Church). A few years later he started his own church at home and it spiraled out of control from there... 

Does home churching ever work? Not saying that established churches aren't pretty effed up sometimes but It seems like most of the time a home church is a warning sign that there may be controlling smug  abusive headship with questionable ideas  and personality traits that don't play well with others 

[SMF007]

AmazonGrace, I agree. I was thinking about this earlier as I was writing about Capt. Bret's home church. When they were in a mainstream church, while still conservative, they were still mostly normal. Bret even had a vasectomy (I know too much about this family...lol) which I know he no longer advocates for. When I was a teenager Jacqueline talked to me about how birth control is the same thing as abortion and she prays for all the babies she aborted when she took birth control earlier in her life. So at some point they were normal people doing normal people things. I think the home churching really kicked it off because then Bret saw himself as the head of the family, head of the church, head of the school, and the mouthpiece of God. He was strictly against children's church and youth groups. 

 

Don't even get me started on the Smith's version of "Homeschooling", which they convinced my parents to do with me from 8th - 12th grade. Bret believed that teaching is based on Deuteronomy 11:19 which discusses teaching your children as you sit and walk. Most of what they did was informal education. Alan learned by working for his dad and the girls learned by working for their mother, doing all the household chores. The workload was definitely at an abusive level for children. Alan grew up pretty smart because he was naturally curious and read a lot. When my parents pulled me out of school there was no formal education. I never was bought textbooks past the 8th grade level (I had always been a A student in school). I read a lot because I was naturally curious but was only allowed to read "Christian" science and history books. I entered Community College at a deficit and had to take remedial math classes. I say all this to say that this was all based on Bret's model for Homeschooling Children "The Homeschool Advantage" was the name of his company to be exact. As I understand it, he has now developed some new method for doing math as well? 

 

I think keeping your family at home all the time not only gives you too much control but also doesn't allow them to expand their minds to even know any different. I don't know whether to feel like all these kids they've gone around and collected are going to have a better or a worse time being a part of this family. I'm sorry, I feel a bit rambley but I really do believe that Bret is cultivating and attempting to expand an abusive and destructive family...and I think his first attempt was directed at mine. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

7 minutes ago, SMF007 said:

AmazonGrace, I agree. I was thinking about this earlier as I was writing about Capt. Bret's home church. When they were in a mainstream church, while still conservative, they were still mostly normal. Bret even had a vasectomy (I know too much about this family...lol) which I know he no longer advocates for. When I was a teenager Jacqueline talked to me about how birth control is the same thing as abortion and she prays for all the babies she aborted when she took birth control earlier in her life. So at some point they were normal people doing normal people things. I think the home churching really kicked it off because then Bret saw himself as the head of the family, head of the church, head of the school, and the mouthpiece of God. He was strictly against children's church and youth groups. 

 

Don't even get me started on the Smith's version of "Homeschooling", which they convinced my parents to do with me from 8th - 12th grade. Bret believed that teaching is based on Deuteronomy 11:19 which discusses teaching your children as you sit and walk. Most of what they did was informal education. Alan learned by working for his dad and the girls learned by working for their mother, doing all the household chores. The workload was definitely at an abusive level for children. Alan grew up pretty smart because he was naturally curious and read a lot. When my parents pulled me out of school there was no formal education. I never was bought textbooks past the 8th grade level (I had always been a A student in school). I read a lot because I was naturally curious but was only allowed to read "Christian" science and history books. I entered Community College at a deficit and had to take remedial math classes. I say all this to say that this was all based on Bret's model for Homeschooling Children "The Homeschool Advantage" was the name of his company to be exact. As I understand it, he has now developed some new method for doing math as well? 

 

I think keeping your family at home all the time not only gives you too much control but also doesn't allow them to expand their minds to even know any different. I don't know whether to feel like all these kids they've gone around and collected are going to have a better or a worse time being a part of this family. I'm sorry, I feel a bit rambley but I really do believe that Bret is cultivating and attempting to expand an abusive and destructive family...and I think his first attempt was directed at mine. 

Are you surprised they put some of their kids in public school and extra cirricular activities? Do you think they might have been forced to do that?

[hoipolloi]

46 minutes ago, AmazonGrace said:

a home church is a warning sign that there may be controlling smug  abusive headship with questionable ideas  and personality traits that don't play well with others 

The Church of Daddy Said So.

[SMF007]

I'm actually super surprised they have put some of their children in school! I do wonder if maybe there has been investigation by the state? Maybe they learned they had all these children (I don't even know how many they have now) that they aren't properly educating. I specifically remember Jacqueline told me a story about how in school boys make fun of girls for menstruating (I think this may have been a personal story of hers). The oldest children never went to school and would know no difference but I went to school for the majority of my life. The Smith's definitely viewed public schooling as evil.  I have to wonder if there has been some sort of state involvement. 

 

Gosh, they even had an audio skit they did about how terrible school was. I'm trying to remember the whole thing but I know there was talk about guns and "prom is just a party". FUNNY, I just tried to find information on The Homeschool Advantage and couldn't find anything so maybe they aren't doing homeschool things at all anymore. How weird!