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Orson William Black, long-time fugitive polygamist, captured in Mexico


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Orson William Black Jr. was captured yesterday in the state of Chiuahua, Mexico, and is being held pending investigation of the September murder of two of his sons and a third young man from their small community. Four of his wives and about 20 other undocumented Americans are also being detained.

Black, who was raised in the FLDS, went off the rails (if the FLDS can be considered 'on the rails') and created his own little culty offshoot in the 80s/90s. He fled the United States 15 years ago after being charged with multiple felony counts of sexual conduct with a minor precipitated by his 'marriage' to two VERY underage girls, Beth and Roberta Stubbs, who were 12 and 13 year old sisters. He was featured on America's Most Wanted in 2003.

He is connected in some way to most FLDS families. His legal wife was/is a Barlow, he married Stubbs and Pledger girls, and I believe his mother was a Wyler, so he's related to the Chatwins as well. His younger sister, Shirley Karma Black, was one of Winston Blackmore's wives who has since left him (though she was not underage at the time of that marriage, as has sometimes been reported).

There is lots more info out there, but I think this is the best of the articles covering recent developments.

http://www.sltrib.com/news/polygamy/2017/11/06/mexico-detains-polygamist-with-utah-connections-his-4-wives-in-murder-investigation/

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It will be interesting what Mexico does with him and then what the US does to him, if we get him back. Also I find it funny that Mexico is deporting US citizens. I bet Trump never thought that Mexico would reject a US citizen. :D

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16 minutes ago, quiversR4hunting said:

It will be interesting what Mexico does with him and then what the US does to him, if we get him back. Also I find it funny that Mexico is deporting US citizens. I bet Trump never thought that Mexico would reject a US citizen.

Trump will probably take credit for this somehow... you know, because he scared the Mexicans straight and now their justice system is trying to curry favor, or something. 

I think it's interesting that there's this extra layer of the murder investigation, because he presumably has enough prior charges to stick him in a US prison for a long time without it. Will be interesting to see whether they hold on to him for these murder charges or they extradite. Are they obligated to extradite? Not familiar with how that relationship works.

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@withaj the US has an extradition treaty with Mexico. I believe they get to try him for the crime in their country first and then extradite him to US for trial. but I am not an attorney so I don't know for sure. Wiki is my source of info, I know bad source but I didn't feel like reading the actual treaty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

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5 hours ago, quiversR4hunting said:

@withaj the US has an extradition treaty with Mexico. I believe they get to try him for the crime in their country first and then extradite him to US for trial. but I am not an attorney so I don't know for sure. Wiki is my source of info, I know bad source but I didn't feel like reading the actual treaty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

Thanks. I knew we had an extradition treaty, I just am unclear on whether extradition or pending local charges take precedence. Will be interesting to see how it shakes out.

Also, I can't believe I spelled Chihuahua wrong in my original post. Ugh. Why does the internet have to be forever??

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Mike Watkiss, a reporter out of Arizona who has written about him (and polygamy) for the past 15 years, says there’s a chance he will be set free in Mexico. What a travesty if that happens.

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On 11/10/2017 at 5:04 PM, quiversR4hunting said:

@suglo Mexico has sent him back to the US. I bet the Mexicans are glad to get rid of the US violent criminal!

He was living with the Mennonite community, which seems weird to me.

Here is the updated article http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/10/us/fugitive-polygamist-orson-black-detained/

Hooray!!

My understanding is that he was residing with his followers in an area heavily populated by Mennonites, but was not living with them, per se.

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[mention=24551]suglo[/mention] Mexico has sent him back to the US. I bet the Mexicans are glad to get rid of the US violent criminal!
He was living with the Mennonite community, which seems weird to me.
Here is the updated article http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/10/us/fugitive-polygamist-orson-black-detained/

Great news! I’m glad justice finally caught up with him. Thanks for the update :)
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Well, this is just crazy: Charges were dropped months ago. 

Polygamist who fled to Mexico while facing molestation charges now free in U.S.  

Spoiler

 

PHOENIX -- A polygamist who fled to Mexico about 15 years ago with his wives and kids while facing child molestation charges in Arizona is now free after the charges were dropped months ago.

Orson William Black Jr. was arrested by Mexican authorities in the northern state of Chihuahua and handed over to U.S. officials in El Paso, Texas, last week. He was briefly held on an Arizona fugitive warrant before being released because no agency would extradite him, El Paso County sheriff's spokeswoman Chris Acosta said.

The Arizona attorney general's office charged Black in 2003 with molestation over allegations he persuaded two teenagers who later became his wives to impregnate themselves with his sperm. A review prompted by a federal inquiry led to a decision to drop the charges for lack of evidence, office spokeswoman Mia Garcia said.

The women were of legal age when they were interviewed by authorities in 2003 and said they had impregnated themselves, Garcia said. The women refused to cooperate, and because they had married Black and fled with him, state prosecutors decided in May that they didn't have enough evidence to pursue charges.

"We needed the girls to testify or in some way help us with the evidence," Garcia said. "That's really the only evidence..."

...Records from the 2003 case show Black had been estranged from the polygamous community since the 1980s but still followed its teachings. The case was the first in a series of efforts to crack down on men in the sect and the community's police, which refused to arrest Black, said former Arizona Attorney General Terry Goddard, who brought the charges.Goddard lamented that Black is apparently not going to face consequences.

"If somebody can just skip the country and then avoid what I believe was a very legitimate child molestation rap, that's a very sad development," he said Tuesday.

The prosecutors' office in Chihuahua, Mexico, says Black, 56, was captured in an area largely populated by Mennonites and was under investigation for the deaths of three Americans aged 15, 19 and 23 on Sept. 10. But they turned him over to U.S. authorities days later without announcing he had been cleared.

Prosecutors did not say why Black was a suspect in their deaths, but a Mexican official said Tuesday that the case remains under investigation.

Black's whereabouts are not known. He is not in federal custody, the U.S. Marshals Service said.  Mexican authorities also handed over to U.S. officials 26 others, including Black's wives, said Pennie Petersen, sister of the two women in the molestation case. The family is supposedly on the way to the Arizona-Utah border communities where the sect is based.

Petersen, who is estranged from her sisters, said the men who were killed were two of Black's sons and his stepson. She said she was told by members of her extended family that the deaths were a drug cartel hit, possibly because Black either stole money or drugs. He wasn't home and the cartel killed the others instead, she said.

"They told the family when they killed those boys, if William doesn't turn himself into us, we're going to come back, kill everybody over the age of 6 and we're going to take everyone under the age of 6," Petersen said.  Mexican prosecutors didn't immediately respond to questions about Petersen's story.

She has started a change.org petition to try to persuade Arizona prosecutors to file charges again.

Garcia, the Arizona prosecutor's spokeswoman, said they had not given up on the case.  "We've remained in contact with (Peterson) over the years. We just need more evidence," Garcia said. "We fully intend to speak to the victims again."

 

 

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