Christian Forum Thread About Spanking Kids

[debrand]

christianforums.com/t2967252/

I found this thread on Christian forums asking parents if they spank on the bare bottom. Thankfully, most do not but some of the answers are troubling. I have mixed feelings about spanking. It was not a type of punishment that worked with my kids but it took me a while to catch on to its ineffectiveness. Yes, I am ashamed about that.

I give a bare bottom swat for direct defiance. One swat per occurance (immediately prior) or, if they repeat the offense within a day or two, they compound until the behavior stops (we've never had to do this, but have told our daughter it will happen and mean it). Our daughter is the only one who's needed this so far (she'll be turning six soon and her brother is 3). We do not use it as a last resort (when we're frustrated or angry), but for direct defiance to a direction. We use a bare hand.

We do spank, with a paddle and yes it is on the bare bottom. It's how DH and I were both spanked as kids.

It's not illegal, and above all it's not "sexual abuse" or sexual anything else. It's a spanking. Spanking with pants on makes about as much sense as taking a bath with pants on.

As I was growing up, whenever we were defiant, we got a slightly different kind of spanking. For instance, if we were mouthing off, we would get a quick, light smack across the mouth...which actually didn't hurt very much, was just more of a schocking thing to get us to stop giving lip. And if we were sneaking food, or taking toys from others, our hands would be spanked. The bottom spanking, was reserved for "bigger" offenses. Sometimes it was with clothes on, sometimes without, sometimes with just a hand, other times with a plastic spatula. I was a very willfull, defiant child, and sometimes, a bare bottom spanking with the spatula was all that worked.

I have found that a similar approach is working with my first son, age 5. He is also very willfull and defiant (probably gets it from me.) Second son, 18 months, hasn't yet had to deal with too much of that, just an occassional swat to the back of the hand for safety reasons (like trying to grab breakables at Grandma's)

I don't feel that I am worse off because of the way I was disciplined, and I don't feel we are harming my son either.

[maybeizfundie]

I'm not opposed to spanking in general, but I cannot fathom the purpose or the need for bare-bottom spanking.

[debrand]

More quotes. The later pages seem to draw the more extreme defenders of spanking on children's bare bottoms

Because it hurts more, the point of disapline is to inflict pain. Everyone on here says how cruel and inhumane it is yet the unsaved will be punished by God by going to hell, how is that not right living through fear?

Hi guys,

I only spank on the bare bottom at home (not in public). I also was very calm when administering spanks and didn't spank in anger or out of frustration. I calmly explained to my child the reason why he was being spanked, would lay him on my lap and spank with bare hand about two times. It was important that he understood what he did wrong and that I still loved him despite his behavior.

Because my son can verbalize just about anything he feels and understands he would even tell me later that a spanking for something I may have been too lenient on would have made him stop certain negative behavior right away.

Each child is different. Some will be corrected by only a firm look or threat of punishment. But I know that what I did for my son through spanking earlier on worked for him. His behavior and attitude today reflects that toward me and others. And we must not forget that equally important is the amount of positive praise, hugs and kisses that we must give to our children when they do what is right and even out of the blue if for no other reason than we just love them.

Yes I am very disturbed by a child's punishment being discussed as sexual. Whatever happened to training up the child in the way he should go?

We never saw the point of spanking over pants. When it's time for the first spanking we apply a few light swats with the wooden spoon just to get the child's attention. The child does stay in diaper, for this scenario. When they are out of diapers then yes it is always on the bare bottom and at that point we move to the paddle. This is easier on all parties. The few times we tried it over clothes we had to apply more force to make the punishment effective. Also the difference would confuse the child as it is not what they were accustom to.

Today we received a wonderful reminder of WHY we train by applying Biblical discipline as we do. You see last night two of my young men were tempted by Satan and were Very bad. Direct defiance, lying, taking the Lords name in vein. They had gotten involved with some very rough neighborhood children and this was the result. Each child received on bare behind and then spent some time in prayer with the Word. I suppose this is our vision of "corner time" which we do not do. They woke up with much better attitudes this morning, as if you could see the holy spirit walking beside them. Guiding them. It was a real site to see. This morning as we prayed as a family we discussed that Satan has tried to warp physical discipline into perversion and evil, leading Christian parents off the right track and into the arms of evil. Please people do not deliver your young warriors into the arms of the Devil! Our children are our greatest resource.

[MrsYoungie]

I'm not opposed to spanking in general, but I cannot fathom the purpose or the need for bare-bottom spanking.

Nothing like making an already scary and shameful punishment even more scary and shameful.

[FuManchu]

I can understand smacking a child in the heat of the moment, but having rules set in stone about the precise time and place to pull down a child's underwear is just disturbing. It's the cold, calculating premeditation that seems so worrying.

[snarkykitty]

I don't know how people can actually believe that they are not harming their children.

In many cases, this is just not true. The physical pain might heal, but the sense of vulnerability in a place you are supposed to feel safe, the sense that everything is out of your control, the feeling that your parents hate you, the fear that any misstep (like spilling milk or not feeling well at dinner time) will result in physical and verbal bashings, the humiliation of the method and place of the spankings - these don't go away.

My "parent" is my mother simply because she gave birth to me. She never played with us, read us a bedtime story. She never comforted us. Never wanted to know what we were thinking or feeling. She only cared about how our lives affected her. Always was, and still is, the martyr.

I never felt safe in her presence, never felt that her arms were a safe haven. I grew to realize that my thoughts/dreams/beliefs/concerns just didn't matter. I was a "rotten, spoiled brat." We were parasites to her. I remember, at seven years old (I was very sick growing up, due to genetic disease), after a night of coughing and her yelling at me that I was "making myself cough," crying and telling her that she should never have had me. At seven years old, I wished that I had never been born. She made me believe that I was the cause of all of her problems. Years later, when my parents finally divorced, she told me that I was the biggest reason, that most of their fights were over me, because I was sick (despite the incidences of my father's infidelity and starting a new family). What a great thing to tell your young teenager. What a great thing to put upon your child's shoulders.

I learned that a parent is a bully. They demand "love" and respect yet don't ever return it. Thirty years later, I still cringe when I am around her. I feel vulnerable, uneasy. Afraid of what I might say or do to set her off. How can anyone believe that there is no harm done, when you elicit a fight or flight response in your child?

All because of the severity, frequency, methodology and cruelty of punishments that you endured at the hands and mouths of a parent.

There is no such thing as harmless "spanking."

[margiebargie]

((snarkykitty)) I'm so sorry. No kid should have to go through that.

[margiebargie]

I can understand smacking a child in the heat of the moment, but having rules set in stone about the precise time and place to pull down a child's underwear is just disturbing. It's the cold, calculating premeditation that seems so worrying.

Yep. That creeps me out, too. There's no mention of trying to teach kids by talking to them or showing them by example. It's straight to hitting. I shudder to think what qualifies as "back talk" or "willfullness" - probably just asking questions and being a regular kid.

[slickcat79]

I also was very calm when administering spanks and didn't spank in anger or out of frustration. I calmly explained to my child the reason why he was being spanked, would lay him on my lap and spank with bare hand about two times. It was important that he understood what he did wrong and that I still loved him despite his behavior.

That just seems so much worse to me. I was spanked a handful of times as a kid, I don't really remember it. It was always done when my mother was at the end of her rope with our acting up. I've seen many parents spank when their kids do something dangerous and it scares the parent. Fear/frustration shouldn't be used as excuses, but spanking in those instances is so much more understandable to me. To think that a parent can calm down, wait until their child is not engaging in bad behavior anymore, then pull their pants down and hit them doesn't really compute for me.

Basically, what FuManchu said.

[Rosa]

The one saying the whole point of discipline is pain (not teaching) and that it's nothing compared to the fires of Hell, that lays it out at its bare bones, to me: some of those posters believe in an unreasonable, unmerciful, vindictive God, and we are acting like Him. End of story. Damaging/causing pain is the WHOLE POINT.

And the ones who say the point is learning and spanking is the most effective at teaching, they are not seeing the disconnect between their viewpoint and the hellfire people's view.

[Austin]

There is no such thing as harmless "spanking."

Co-sign.

Beyond the issue of the immorality of inflicting violence on a child, there are just much better, more effective ways to discipline. Why would people hold on to a method that has been shown time and time again not to be effective in the long run? Beyond the fundies and their warped issues, people spank out of frustration or ignorance or laziness. Frustration is something I get, but that's our (the parents') stuff and we should not take out our inability to control our emotions on a child. Some people just don't know any better and are just continuing the same kind of childrearing that they received, but are open to better methods. But for the lazy? Implementing a non-violent, effective method of discipline just seems like too much work to this group, which is why they should have thought twice before having kids in the first place.

[liltwinstar]

I was spanked like this as a kid. I think what was most frustrating to me was that spank-able offenses were really subject to my parents' interpretation of events. In theory, I was only spanked for "disobedience" or "disrespect" - well, disobedience can be easy to explain to a kid (sometimes) - like, "I asked you to clean your room and you played a game instead; you disobeyed me." That's pretty clear. The "disrespect" thing was a lot more murky (as I suspect "willfulness" and "backtalking" are as well) - what do those things even mean to a kid? In my case, "disrespect" could mean not using the "proper" tone of voice or...really anything.

I don't have kids, but I do work in HR - and with adult employees, when you write someone up or do a termination, you have to explain really clearly what someone did wrong and what the expectations were/are- like "Your manager asked you to report to work by 8am daily and to call his cell phone if you are going to be late or absent. You were absent on Tuesday and didn't call your manager; thus you get a formal written warning for your file." It seems like kids would be no different - obviously, you have to have kid-sized expectations, but you need to be clear about what the behavioral expectations are and how the child's behavior violated those expectations. Otherwise, kids grow up on edge, thinking that any innocent comment could be perceived as "disrespect" and get them a beating.

[myanimus]

Quote:

Because it hurts more, the point of disapline is to inflict pain. Everyone on here says how cruel and inhumane it is yet the unsaved will be punished by God by going to hell, how is that not right living through fear?

I love it how salvation is brought up while discussing beating your kids ass, God of course is used to justify "discipline" but the parents behavior is really no different then a dictatorship. And, if this jackwagon wants to bring God into it how bout this tidbit from the Bible

"But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea."

I can't believe my God would agree with using Him to justify child abuse.

[AnnoDomini]

I can understand smacking a child in the heat of the moment, but having rules set in stone about the precise time and place to pull down a child's underwear is just disturbing. It's the cold, calculating premeditation that seems so worrying.

That was exactly how my parents dealt with me and all their children (at least until my mother got depression and pretty much stopped functioning for a while. She's better now but she never quite got around to regular spanking. She still supports it, just can't emotionally take it anymore).

[let-them-eat-cake]

I was never spanked on the bottom as a kid but I got TONS of smacks across the mouth and sometimes my head.

My half-sister is the one who got it bad...leather belt across her bare bottom or bare legs.

[FireIsCatching89]

Yes I am very disturbed by a child's punishment being discussed as sexual. Whatever happened to training up the child in the way he should go?

We never saw the point of spanking over pants. When it's time for the first spanking we apply a few light swats with the wooden spoon just to get the child's attention. The child does stay in diaper, for this scenario. When they are out of diapers then yes it is always on the bare bottom and at that point we move to the paddle. This is easier on all parties. The few times we tried it over clothes we had to apply more force to make the punishment effective. Also the difference would confuse the child as it is not what they were accustom to.

This quote is the one that really got me. Hitting a child in DIAPERS???? Good Lord, that's twisted.

I occasionally got a quick swat on the arse as a small child when my parents were at the end of their ropes, but that didn't ever do much...it just made me angry. I also know my parents usually felt terrible about it after. Telling me I couldn't have dessert was a much more efficient punishment (what can I say? Baby has a sweet tooth!).

And doing a bare bottom spanking seriously just squicks me out. I'm sorry, that's just never ok. It's violating a child's bodily privacy, and even small children have rights. I would never DREAM of doing such a thing (ok, there's only been one time I've ever been tempted to hit a child, and this was a preschooler I was working with who snuck up behind me and CUT MY HAIR. agh).

[Ava]

I can understand smacking a child in the heat of the moment, but having rules set in stone about the precise time and place to pull down a child's underwear is just disturbing. It's the cold, calculating premeditation that seems so worrying.

See, I think I would have preferred this. To be pulled aside and told, in a factual manner, this is exactly what you did wrong and this is why it was wrong and this shall be your punishment, based on the severity of your crime. Then you know exactly what the rules are and how exactly you have broken them (or can break them in the future), and you know what to expect.

My parents only spanked me when they were were angry, and who knows what they were angry about and why? Certainly not me. I was never knew what exactly I had done wrong in their eyes, I only knew that I was somewhere near them when they were angry about something and I learned that being somewhere near my parents when they were angry about something meant that I might be physically hurt in some way as a result. I still have a sort of instinctual urge to go hide under something every time I hear people raising their voices in anger, regardless of what the situation has to do with me. And I hide many, many things about myself from my parents (and have done so for a long time) because I didn't know what my parents would think was "wrong" and punish me for, so it was safer to assume that everything was probably wrong and hide it from them.

[Terrie]

Ugh. My parents "spanked" on occasion once we were big enough to start walking. It was one open-handed swat on our diapered butts to get our attention when we were out of control. Once we were out of diapers, we were too old to spank. Honestly, the way these parents use it, I can't help but think it's using a chainsaw to cut ice cubes for a drink. Serious overkill and not going to give you the results you want.

[snarkykitty]

See, I think I would have preferred this. To be pulled aside and told, in a factual manner, this is exactly what you did wrong and this is why it was wrong and this shall be your punishment, based on the severity of your crime. Then you know exactly what the rules are and how exactly you have broken them (or can break them in the future), and you know what to expect.

My parents only spanked me when they were were angry, and who knows what they were angry about and why? Certainly not me. I was never knew what exactly I had done wrong in their eyes, I only knew that I was somewhere near them when they were angry about something and I learned that being somewhere near my parents when they were angry about something meant that I might be physically hurt in some way as a result. I still have a sort of instinctual urge to go hide under something every time I hear people raising their voices in anger, regardless of what the situation has to do with me. And I hide many, many things about myself from my parents (and have done so for a long time) because I didn't know what my parents would think was "wrong" and punish me for, so it was safer to assume that everything was probably wrong and hide it from them.

Do you not understand that is it inherently wrong on SO many levels to strip a child down to beat them? What purpose does it serve, other than it's more painful and humiliating (especially around other people)? It's so violating. (And yes, I have had therapy to deal with this. But people trying to justify this behavior makes my skin crawl!)

[dianapavelovna]

More quotes. The later pages seem to draw the more extreme defenders of spanking on children's bare bottoms

This is a serious thread and people are making a lot of good points and I have serious thoughts on it I SWEAR but omg, they were shooting up JESUS?!?

:dance:

[pomology]

Same here, except that I also felt terrible about behaving like brat. Because my parents only spanked me or slapped me when I was really, really, really asking for it. And that was very rarely.

It wasn't exactly an effective, logical way to stop me from misbehaving, but I don't think my parents were particularly wrong to do it, nor did it harm me.

Everyone loses their temper. I have incredibly short temper and I lose it really easily. My parents are just human and lost their temper, too. They didn't want to hit me and they knew it wasn't an effective mode of discipline. But as I said, everyone acts in illogical ways sometimes.

But anybody who calmly and purposely metes out corporal punishment is doing very harmful, in my opinion.

[Kitty]

Same here, except that I also felt terrible about behaving like brat. Because my parents only spanked me or slapped me when I was really, really, really asking for it. And that was very rarely.

It wasn't exactly an effective, logical way to stop me from misbehaving, but I don't think my parents were particularly wrong to do it, nor did it harm me.

Everyone loses their temper. I have incredibly short temper and I lose it really easily. My parents are just human and lost their temper, too. They didn't want to hit me and they knew it wasn't an effective mode of discipline. But as I said, everyone acts in illogical ways sometimes.

But anybody who calmly and purposely metes out corporal punishment is doing very harmful, in my opinion.

^This. totally this. Punishment should be used to educate, not humiliate. Making a ritual of it by pulling the kids' pants down and pretending to be calm and saying "this hurts me more than it hurts you" is humiliating the child, nothing more. Whenever I was spanked my parents didn't pretend they're weren't ABSOLUTELY PISSED, and never removed any clothing.

I think it's also telling that none of the folks in that thread ever mention any other form of discipline. I've stated in other posts and threads that parenting that is heavily based on physical punishment is ineffective, and backfires. Those kids don't have very good relationships with their parents. Once they got big enough, they fought back, and got kicked out regardless of whether or not they were adults. Those kids are not very bright, but they are quite aggressive, and rarely take responsibility for their actions, even as adults. They always blame it on someone else, usually the person they beat up. They get into drugs and alcohol. Their parents don't restrain them much at all until they're older- they have a lot of freedom as young kids, only kept in line by brief physical pain, but as teenagers pain doesn't work anymore so it's constant screaming, limited internet, limited TV, limited cell phone usage, early curfews, etc. I didn't really "rebel" once I became a teenager, since I didn't have much of a reason to. My friends' parents though, would be (or at least pretend to be) the sweet but restrictive and redneckish churchgoers, and their kids would be nearly out of control.

I think that my parents could have avoided spanking altogether. It really wasn't effective. All it did was scare me. The fear didn't last long, sure, but everyone in my family has a horrible temper so it was the screaming that led up to it that I hated more. At least after the spankings I'd be sent to my room and things would calm down. I don't mind calm, reasonable punishments, but a) the punishment must fit the crime; spanking a child for fussing while out shopping is retarded and b) Being perfectly calm while causing physical pain to a kid is terrifying- to the kid and to other adults. I don't fear my parents. I would if they had been perfectly calm when they spanked me. That's just psychopathic.

I knew some kids in conservative Christian families who were sometimes spanked for absolutely no reason. They'd done nothing wrong at all, their parents would simply call them over, lecture them on something or another, then spank them. WTF is that supposed to achieve?

[doe]

That is how I was spanked. The last time I got a bare bottom spanking I was a freshman in high school, who had had my period for two years. It was invasive and humiliating. Also, we were Christian by default, but there was no church going or anything like that.

I don't really resent getting spankings as a child, just how they were done or for some of the supposed offenses. I'm sensitive to other people's moods and when there is yelling I cower. Always have, probably always will. Spankings just weren't necessary for me.

It's worth noting I rather enjoy being spanked as an adult, right down to being taken over someone's knee and bare bottomed. I wonder where that came from...

[Letgo]

I always question the calm administration of a spanking that they recommend, especially when done over and over in a long session. How in the world does a parent remain calm when what he or she is doing is NOT working? I certainly could not keep calm if I had to keep whacking my kid until the will is broken. I am not advocating beating a child while in a fit of rage, of course, but I just don't get the ability to be so calm while they do this.

[AnnoDomini]

Hm. I was spanked as a child and while I'm not necessarily advocating it anymore, I don't think I fit the description of what happens to kids who were spanked when they get older. I wasn't afraid of my parents (and they had a 'only spank when you're calm' policy, and the only anger I have at them over spanking me is that one time when my father spanked me in public, out of anger) and I don't hit back or act out much. I do, however, like the idea of being spanked in sex play (actually, my fascination with corporal punishment as interesting thing goes way, way back to when I was a kid).