Joy and Austin 13: Another Duggar Pregnancy Grandbaby 10

[Bad Wolf]

30 minutes ago, mango_fandango said:

They do have the anatomy scan at 18 weeks. That's how they found out that Jubilee had died. I remember watching it on YouTube and Jim Bob was telling the kids that they were going to get the ultrasound done to find out if it was a girl or a boy. How else do you think they can do all those gender reveals? 

Wel!, they could always hold the wedding band on a string over the stomach and see which way it rotates like we had to do. 50% chance of being right.

[Carm_88]

9 minutes ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

I'm not body-shaming. Body-shaming would be my picking on her because of her weight or making fun of her or saying she was disgusting/gross because she's heavy. I was simply stating that she is round where her sisters are not, other than the one younger sister. I didn't say she looked awful or ugly or whatever--I was stating a fact that's visible to anyone who looks at her. 

I have NO PROBLEM with her body and weight so....

 

Well my rule of thumb is don't say anything that you wouldn't say to a person's face. I don't go around calling people pudgy and round, if I did, I would hope they'd take a piece out of me for being extremely rude. 

[SapphireSlytherin]

Lol. Ok.

 

[cascarones]

2 hours ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

One of the younger girls is also pudgy. 

I thought we left children alone on here. I'm slow to take offense and get riled up, but that statement could have been completely left out and the point about varying body types amongst the adult Duggar women still made. 

[Snarkle Motion]

1 hour ago, acheronbeach said:

<snip>

That's why inventing a dramatic story that Joy had premarital sex is so dangerous.  People are stupid enough to believe baseless rumours (just look at how many tabloids picked up this story), particularly when it aligns with their own worldview.  

In some fundamentalist patriarchal cultures, this kind of speculation leads to honour killings.  That's the extreme result of this sort of lie.  

This has been the best argument so far against the premarital sex speculation. 

But I'm not sure why you find it "gross" or "ignorant"? Those are strong words. I'm not sure why speculating premarital sex among consenting adults, who also put their lives on display for public consumption, is "gross" or "ignorant."

We should not speculate because their culture values them based on purity and it harms their "dignity"? I understand not wanting to put them in physical or emotional danger. But to me, the idea that "we better not discuss this possibility lest we expose her to shame" is a subtly condoning and perpetuating their belief system. It implies that we agree there is potential shame or indignity relating to premarital sex.

While I agree that these rumors potentially expose private individuals to physical danger and being ostracized by their community, I do not think that's applicable to people profiting from a reality show who actively try to convert others and shape public policies to fit with their belief system.

[singsingsing]

56 minutes ago, Snarkle Motion said:

You are absolutely allowed to disagree! But your earlier comment seems somewhat inconsistent with it being "totally cool" with this discussion and speculation.

Did you read the comment you quoted? I was saying that perpetuating tabloid rumours has the potential to be incredibly harmful to her. Tabloid rumours are different than legitimate speculation. Do you really not see the difference? Speculation is like, "Hey guys, I actually think Joy may have had sex before marriage because of x, y and z. I wonder how she reconciles that with her beliefs?" Tabloid rumour is, "An anonymous source close to the Duggar family spills shocking details about Joy's steamy premarital sexcapades with rebel Austin Forsyth. Joy six months pregnant! Jim Bob and Michelle furious!"

[AtlanticTug]

1 hour ago, Rachel333 said:

Michelle did get more medical care with her later pregnancies than Jill and Jessa seem to have been getting, so I wouldn't necessarily use Michelle as an example of what her daughters do, but yeah, they do at least have some ultrasounds.

When we've seen Jill and Jessa going for ultrasounds all they were raving about was the jinder reveal. At no point did they say oh we are here to see that the baby is growing as it should and make sure everything is well and we'll also get to find out the jinder (sex, girls). That's why I assumed they maybe weren't getting actual anatomy scans but going to one of those elective places just to find out the jinder and maybe get some 3D photos.

[acheronbeach]

@Snarkle Motion

No, it's not condoning to prioritize an individual's safety over a flight of fancy.  It's not condoning to say "I will condemn this behaviour based on evidence and well-reasoned arguments, not speculation."  Speculation and invention about a vulnerable individual is not a form of resistance.   Another person's actions and words - that's fair game.  

[VelociRapture]

7 minutes ago, AtlanticTug said:

When we've seen Jill and Jessa going for ultrasounds all they were raving about was the jinder reveal. At no point did they say oh we are here to see that the baby is growing as it should and make sure everything is well and we'll also get to find out the jinder (sex, girls). That's why I assumed they maybe weren't getting actual anatomy scans but going to one of those elective places just to find out the jinder and maybe get some 3D photos.

I'm pretty sure that's what they do. I've never seen anyone claim they've had actual anatomy scans  - which are in-depth looks at physical growth and development - done. I've used the term "anatomy scan" in the past to refer to the mid-point SEX reveal scans they have done, but I probably shouldn't so people don't get confused. 

33 minutes ago, cascarones said:

I thought we left children alone on here. I'm slow to take offense and get riled up, but that statement could have been completely left out and the point about varying body types amongst the adult Duggar women still made. 

I couldn't figure out exactly what bugged me about that comment, but you nailed it. I personally find it weird to comment on anyone's body, even those adults who choose to live public lives. But it's just wrong to comment about a minor's body, whether they're a public figure or not.

[Kangaroo]

I keep reading "Anatomy Scan" as "Autonomy Scan". I was very confused what that would entail.

[Kaylo]

When I was pregnant with my first I totally stuck my belly out as far as I could...I was excited! So is she! I think she got pregnant within a week or two of the wedding and that's that! When you are young and fertile and have sex when you ovulate the chances of getting pregnant are pretty damn high!

[Beermeet]

Pregnancy is a wonderful time IMHO.  Even the rough parts.  Part of being pregnant like it or not, are the comments and speculation.   Especially if you were a virgin ( or in some cases supposed to be) and get pregnant stat and show early.  I'd bet her circle is wondering the same about the due date.  They would matter more to J & A than us or any other forum that discusses the Duggars.  As usual, the fact remains that we don't know.  We will when the baby is born, that's for sure!  I highly doubt it.  Then I think of my HS bf and I.  At both our homes we not allowed behind closed doors.  Didn't stop us at all from doing it in our homes or going for a  "walk" and really back tracted right quick to get it on in the tool shed.  I know way to many with similar stories.  When there is a will, there is away and nothing is hotter then forbidden sex.  Watched or not, it happens.  I think not in their case only because of their convictions and lack of messing around.  Not even so much as kissing but he got it in ( Jersey Shore ref.) during a brief moment alone?  Not likely.  

Newlyweds  have been questioned or given funny looks about things like this since forever!

[Destiny]

JFC, Joy is not fucking fat. She just has fucking boobs for two and and hips, and doesn't dress her body right because of "modesty". Gross. 

1 hour ago, Carm_88 said:

Well my rule of thumb is don't say anything that you wouldn't say to a person's face. I don't go around calling people pudgy and round, if I did, I would hope they'd take a piece out of me for being extremely rude. 

This. I can't believe I'm seriously reading this conversation. 

[Palimpsest]

45 minutes ago, Snarkle Motion said:

But I'm not sure why you find it "gross" or "ignorant"? Those are strong words. I'm not sure why speculating premarital sex among consenting adults, who also put their lives on display for public consumption, is "gross" or "ignorant."

I'll go with distasteful.  Very distasteful.  And gross.  And ignorant too.  

I see the excuse all too often that we can behave like animals because "these people have put their lives on TV."  These young people's parents put them on TV.  They are trapped - and getting off TV will be hard.

That excuse demonstrates a lack of understanding of the pressures these young adults have been dealing with - before they were "consenting adults."  They are trapped 

The young people who are being speculated about lived lives that were put on UNReality TV before they were consenting adults.  That goes for both Joy and Austin (yes, Austin's Daddy also pimped him out to UnReality TV.) 

They were marketed out and their lives were put "on display for public consumption"  before they reached the age of consent.

They have very little education and few resources.  They have been forced to sell their private lives because they know nothing else.  And they apparently think the public gravy train is normal life.

I'm not sure why you (general you) do not get that it has to do with trying to understand the pressures these kids young adults are under.  And will continue to be under.  And why people do not get a vague understanding of the religious strictures and how dangerous idle (and vicious) speculation can be for these young people ...

It has to do with compassion, caring, and a modicum of good sense and good taste.

We should be better than that.  We should be able to understand the pressures the younger UNReality TV generation face and show them some understanding and compassion.

I'll still rake every single one of them over the coals when they preach poison.  (See Dillard).

 But not when they are just muddling their way through adolescent marriage and quickie pregnancies  in public - because they don't know anything else.

[Snarkle Motion]

22 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

I'll go with distasteful.  Very distasteful.  And gross.  And ignorant too.  

I see the excuse all too often that we can behave like animals because "these people have put their lives on TV."  These young people's parents put them on TV.  They are trapped - and getting off TV will be hard.

That excuse demonstrates a lack of understanding of the pressures these young adults have been dealing with - before they were "consenting adults."  They are trapped 

I can agree that discussing anyone's sex life is potentially distasteful.

But Joy and Austin are trapped? They are forced to do People magazine spreads because they spent time on TV and have no other resources? I thought Austin was able to support himself with house flipping? I get that it's hard to leave their lifestyle and not participate at all in he show, but they absolutely have power to limit participation and not be in magazines.

Speculating that a reality star may have had sex before marriage because she's supporting a large bump soon after marriage is dangerous and vicious? Maybe I just don't understand. 

 

[Carm_88]

24 minutes ago, Snarkle Motion said:

Speculating that a reality star may have had sex before marriage because she's supporting a large bump soon after marriage is dangerous and vicious? Maybe I just don't understand. 

 

Joy isn't just a reality star, she's a 19 year old girl. I may not agree with the family nor their hateful beliefs, but the point of the matter is that kissing is off limit until marriage. So yeah, it's crude to suggest that they were having premarital sex. 

They have the power but Joy has been on tv since she was 6-7 years old? That's life as she knows it. So yes they have the resources but they see this as a ministry and as a way to spread their message. Joy is proud f her belly because it shows that she was godly and right in her ways. So it's vicious because it's attacking all that she stands for. If you want to attack Derick for being a dickhead, go right on ahead. He's showing his ass every single day. He well deserves it. Joy and Austin have not done anything wrong. 

Also can I say that I don't want people speculating on my sex life. Consenting adult or not that is no one's business. 

[Destiny]

Continued here!