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Dillards 32: To VBAC or not to VBAC


Coconut Flan

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6 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

. I had big babies,

Me too!  First was 9 pounds 38.5 weeks.  Second 10 pounds 41.5 weeks.  Both were healthy, both were easy hospital deliveries. By easy I mean no drugs (I am not a hero, just didn't have a lot of pain) and I was up and walking within a half hour of having them.  No GD. Number 2 was "sunny side up", so not one, but TWO episiotomies!  The healing from that was the worst!  Aside from that I am a baby making machine! :)

 

 

 

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I think some people are being too optimistic about Duggars.

Do you really think the question "would you leave it up to God to plan how many kids you will have?" was not in Jim Bob's questionnaire for Jeremy? What will he say, "Babe, I lied because I love you too much"?

In a few months, when Jinger gets pregnant, they will open up about 'their struggle to conceive'. They are not waiting or using birth control. 

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20 minutes ago, Edhelfin said:

Do you really think the question "would you leave it up to God to plan how many kids you will have?" was not in Jim Bob's questionnaire for Jeremy? What will he say, "Babe, I lied because I love you too much"?

I would answer that question as yes and it wouldn't be a lie. We're not planning on having a 3rd kid but if God decides to cause a vasectomy to fail we'd be having one. 

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4 minutes ago, subsaharanafrica said:

I would answer that question as yes and it wouldn't be a lie. We're not planning on having a 3rd kid but if God decides to cause a vasectomy to fail we'd be having one. 

Yes, exactly! If God is all powerful than he can overcome a vasectomy, tubal ligation, birth control, etc....You may think you only want/need two kids but if God thinks differently it will happen! If you believe that way. The Duggar's way of thinking is actually false by their own Bible! 

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7 hours ago, Jug Band Baby said:

Even in an emergency in a hospital, you don't go into a c-section on 2 seconds notice

How can you possibly state this as fact?  I assume 2 seconds is hyperbole, but emergency c-sections are just that; an emergency.  I only had 7 minutes from the time I was told my baby's heart was slow and getting slower each moment until I was being cut open.  Had I not already had an epidural I would have been given general anesthesia.  I think we all can agree that a scenario like that would have been less than ideal.  

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8 hours ago, klabourdeth said:

In relation to the Dillard's and their large babies there has been studies looking at historical trends about how mothers are having larger children because of evolution in relation to the increases of C-sections. Since c-sections has started be more in use it does not weed out the lines of those with poor birth canals because the mother & child aren't dying in labor as much these days.

It's a Huffington post article talking about the trend. I would look for a more legit source but I don't have the mind power to do so at the moment.

https://www.google.com/amp/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_584b13d3e4b0bd9c3dfcd215/amp

That's interesting, but I have two counters:

1. Regular access to c sections is relatively recent to the human population and so it will need several more generations to "evolve" us 

2. Although modern c sections are now common and "new", forms of c sections have always existed. Humans have been doing surgeries forever. Now...the success of those surgeries is another story lol

but yes, I would imagine in another few hundred years modern obgyn practices will definitely start affecting our evolution

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1 hour ago, Edhelfin said:

I think some people are being too optimistic about Duggars.

Do you really think the question "would you leave it up to God to plan how many kids you will have?" was not in Jim Bob's questionnaire for Jeremy? What will he say, "Babe, I lied because I love you too much"?

In a few months, when Jinger gets pregnant, they will open up about 'their struggle to conceive'. They are not waiting or using birth control. 

 I don't nessecarily think that Jim Bob approved to Jeremy marrying Jinger. Yes, Jeremy is a christian and share some of the fundie thoughts, but he is not a fundie. Jinger's sudden change of style, moving far away and breaking some of the courtship-rules proves that. 

I think that JB only gave his blessing because he knew that Jinger was too old and strong-willed to accept a refusal. The alternative being Jinger becoming an "old maid" and eventually marrying someone even worse or refusing to obey her parents and marrying him either way.

To give his blessing to a guy he doesn't trust to be a "real" fundie might be the easiest way to remain somewhat in control of the couple. 

I also think that this is why he approved of Joy marrying at such a young age - the younger the couple, the easier it will be to control and influence them, economically and otherwise; just look at Jessa and Ben. 

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It's taken me  long time to catch up with this thread. We were helping at the Death Ride (129 mile bicycle ride over 4 summits) with no internet. I missed the announcement. I looked like crap after my c section, so I can't blame Jill for wanting to rest up before the photographers. I do think their baby fixation is insane, but I wouldn't wish harm on any of them.

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OMG. I said she was going to have a c-section after 48 hours of labor. I missed by 8 hours:pb_lol:

I blame Rufus. 

Seriously, congrats to the Dillards. Healthy mom, healthy baby is always the most important. 

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Well, if Jill can only have c sections than that's less children being raised in a cult by Dullards. Always a plus somewhere ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

 

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10 hours ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

This is true Jilly will be home alone now with two small children when Derelict is preaching and saving souls. What to say. 

"Derelict" omfg hilarious :pb_lol:

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19 minutes ago, shiverful said:

 I don't nessecarily think that Jim Bob approved to Jeremy marrying Jinger. Yes, Jeremy is a christian and share some of the fundie thoughts, but he is not a fundie. Jinger's sudden change of style, moving far away and breaking some of the courtship-rules proves that. 

Which court ship rules were broken?

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It is a little worrisome that in their official announcement they don't really mention Jill's health. That's usually pretty standard in birth announcements "mother and baby are healthy!" kind of thing to assuage worry

I'm sure she's "fine" but it sounds like another rough labor. I wonder if she's disappointed.

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15 hours ago, BadMammaJana said:

 I can't for the life of me get his deodorant/pit stains out of his military uniform and shirts. 

Try a combo of color fast bleach and ammonia.    It's worked for my husband's shirts. He had to wear dress shirts for work and the collars were always stained.   He'd scrub in the shower and put on a clean shirt -an hour at the office (he was an electronic engineer for the phone company - in an office filled with computers that generated heat ) and his collars were black. 

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53 minutes ago, shiverful said:

 I don't nessecarily think that Jim Bob approved to Jeremy marrying Jinger. Yes, Jeremy is a christian and share some of the fundie thoughts, but he is not a fundie. Jinger's sudden change of style, moving far away and breaking some of the courtship-rules proves that. 

I think that JB only gave his blessing because he knew that Jinger was too old and strong-willed to accept a refusal. The alternative being Jinger becoming an "old maid" and eventually marrying someone even worse or refusing to obey her parents and marrying him either way.

To give his blessing to a guy he doesn't trust to be a "real" fundie might be the easiest way to remain somewhat in control of the couple. 

I also think that this is why he approved of Joy marrying at such a young age - the younger the couple, the easier it will be to control and influence them, economically and otherwise; just look at Jessa and Ben. 

Jim Bob definitely approved Jeremy's marriage to Jinger. I think he loved having a "celebrity" around. Remember the videos he made with Jeremy that were posted before we knew who he was? Since when does moving away and wearing pants means you not fundie. Jinger was the first Duggar to do it, but many fundie women move after getting married and fundie style is changing. Derick was also not fundie and Jim Bob approved him.

How will he be able to control Joy and Austin? They have their own house and Austin works. Who knows why Derick and Ben turned out the way they did. My guess is the popularity of the show at the time. 

 

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I've been thinking of Jill and the c-sections.  

Maybe she can't have the 'sweet' birth experiences of a vaginal birth as her Jessa did - but she is soldiering on no matter what agony and dangers she is facing.  

After all, the bible does say that a woman will give birth in pain - and so not only does Jilly have the physical pain but the emotional pain of not having a vaginal birth - so, doesn't that make her more blessed?   Can't she have that to one up any sisters who had/have vaginal births?

 

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I'm having twins in late November. Because of the type of twins (mono-di), I was no longer able to continue with my mid wife- I believe the college prohibits them from attending this type of twin birth.

I now have a lovely doctor with the high risk unit at one of the nearby hospitals. She explained that, with twins, it's hospital policy that mum gets an epidural and, that while the majority of labour will take place in a regular birthing room, the delivery itself is done in the OR- just in case. She's confident that I won't need a C-section, but you never know.

This is pretty far from the birth experience that I was planning for, but the important thing is that all three of us are healthy in the end. Keeping my fingers crossed that these two are not 9 pounds each!!

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I am sorry, bit I am finding it hard to feel sorry for Jill about this particular issue --another c section (though I do feel bad for her about many other things)

I know having a vaginal delivery is a big, big deal for many women, and I also know that doctors can rush to c-sections that are not necessary and that can make mom feeling disappointed and scared. That said....

C-sections are MANY times medically necessary (and not a tantrum from the doctor who doesn´t want to come in on a Saturday) and I am really over people putting their own egos and romantic notions of childbirth before the health of their babies, which happens a lot, at least in the broader circle I live in. My good friend had a perfect pregnancy. she conceived in one cycle, didn´t have any pain, morning sickness, fatigue...nothing. She gained the exact amount of weight she needed to. I swear she was the poster child for an easy pregnancy. And then a couple of weeks before her due date they told her the baby was breech and she might need a cesarian and she was DEVASTATED. You would have though they had told her the baby had a serious medical condition. Her baby was fine, but I know women who have has serious issues for being so against a c-section.

Again, I know it´s a sensitive issue for many, and this is going to be an unpopular opinion. But doctors are not the enemy. And not all of them want to schedule a c-section so they can go on vacation. Find a good doctor and for the love of god, listen to him/ her. The way your baby arrives in to the world doesn´t make you a better or worse mother. And not having eleventy kids doesn´t make you less godly, Jill.

If she, indeed, attempted a home birth after her previous experience, I don´t feel sorry for her, at all. You know who I feel bad for? People with fertility issues that can´t have babies even though they are completely equipped to be wonderful parents, people who have hard pregnancies and no easy access to health care (like all the ungodly brown savages these idiots are trying to save in Central America), people who suffer miscarriages, stillbirths, premature labor, people who think everything is fine and then find out their baby has a medical condition, people who have to terminate very wanted pregnancies because of serious health issues. 

You know who i don´t feel sorry for? People that travel to places were there  is zika (for no actual work related, philanthropic or imponderable personal reasons other than to fulfill their white savior complex) when they know the chances off them being pregnant at any given time are pretty high. People that attempt home births putting their own selfish needs before their baby´s. People who post pictures of their baby in distress a couple of hours after birth because they have no actual job other than being semi famous.

Considering the levels of negligence and arrogance and overall stupidity these people show, they should be grateful, not disappointed, every time they manage to have a healthy child, and not care about it coming out of your vagina, your abdomen or your ear. 

I am ready for the down votes. I am, as usual, fed up with this people.

That said, I hope Samuel is a a healthy, happy kid. It´s not his fault he was born to this two. Also, I am glad he has such a lovely name.

PS: Derrick is a complete a**hole.

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@seasonsoflifeI can't agree with you more! If Jill so desperately wants a vbac, she needs to seek out proper prenatal care during her pregnancies. Otherwise, her subsequent pregnancies will be a crapshoot where the odds are stacked against her.

And I don't feel sorry for Jill much either. I feel sorry for the pain she went through, and I'm glad that she and the baby seem to be doing ok, but if she sought out proper care and went to a hospital, she might have gotten her vbac.

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1 hour ago, LadyPriss said:

Which court ship rules were broken?

When Jinger first visited Jeremy in Laredo he put his hand around her while sitting on the couch or something. Ha claimed that he didn't know it was a rule against that (better to ask for forgiveness than approval).

Something also happened off camera in NY after the proposal. Jim Bob asked Michelle if all the courtship rules were followed and in her answer she hinted that something had happened and that Jinger had been "caught off-guard). My guess is that they front hugged. 

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11 hours ago, calimojo said:

I have to back up my fellow nurse Sassy on this.  IDMs can be large and still behave like a premie, and many of the worst premies that I have cared for have been those right on the cusp of full term.  Often the babies that are several weeks premature are fiesty and strong because they have had their maturity hastened by stress hormones that are produced as a result of a hostile or suboptimal uterine environment. 

When I worked labor and delivery and nursery, I was often much more worried when I attended a birth of a 36-37 week baby boy, than I was a 33 week baby girl. 

And yes, armchair diagnosis aside, in that picture, we can conclude that Samuel had some difficulty adjusting to life outside the womb.  It is also safe to assume that at the time the picture was taken,  Samuel had great color, and his muscle tone looks good.  And based on how Derick is allowed to handle him,  he must have been stable at this point.

As to why he would have an IV?  It could simply be a 'just in case' situation or it could be that he needs antibiotics or needs IV access in case his blood sugar bottoms out quickly and he needs IV dextrose. 

The oxygen apparatus he has on looks to be what is either a high flow nasal cannula.  Babies born by c/s are at a higher risk for extra fluid in the lungs that might persist for a few hours after birth. 

I do feel for Jill.  Jill and Derick are not easy to feel empathy for as they seem to make so many poor decisions, but questionable judgment aside,  Jill is a product of how she was raised.  She hasn't been taught to really think things through, and to consider consequences.  When you are taught to trust in God in the very concrete way that the duggars believe, you never consider consequences.  I makes me angry when people misunderstand their faith so much that it leads to a complete lack of the ability to think critically.

Girl, I wish I could give you a high 5 and a microphone. O.M.G. She probabaly would have stitches from front to rear if she had her way. 

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1 minute ago, The Wanderer said:

@seasonsoflifeI can't agree with you more! If Jill so desperately wants a vbac, she needs to seek out proper prenatal care during her pregnancies. Otherwise, her subsequent pregnancies will be a crapshoot where the odds are stacked against her.

And I don't feel sorry for Jill much either. I feel sorry for the pain she went through, and I'm glad that she and the baby seem to be doing ok, but if she sought out proper care and went to a hospital, she might have gotten her vbac.

Well...maybe, just maybe...she´ll prove us wrong and we´ll learn that she labored for 40 hours in the hospital.I sure hope so.

(If that happens I will still think Derick is a**hole :evil-laugh:)

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@BadMammaJana,  to addd to what @MoonFace said make DAMN sure you use color-fast bleach (like OxyClean) and ammonia.  Whatever you do, DO NOT use ammonia and chlorine bleach (Chlorox).  Combining those two chemicals is dangerous and COULD KILL YOU!!   IIRC, you release toxic chlorine gas which you definitely do not want to do.  

@Jaedzia,  I don't know what test they did that diagnosed your nieces with RH problems prenatally, but it occurred to me late last night, that in the case of a baby with early onset jaundice, the doctors would order the baby's bilirubin level tested.  Knowing the bilirubin levels would help tell you how aggressive you need to be about treating the Rh incompatibility.

No downvotes from me on your post, @seasonsoflife!

 

 

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