Dillards 31: Grifting, Lying, and Allergies

[sawasdee]

@Jug Band Baby To me, that's unreal. As a Brit , the very idea of paying when giving birth is WTF?

So if I've understood correctly, taking a morning after pill - which would cost, what, a $100 or so? - is absolutely anathema - but if you can't afford a safe birth - well, that's your problem....

And interesting re the cheapest option is scheduled C-section. There has been, over the years, a lot of press about how the US has such a high C-section rate. Most British commentators put it down to  OB/GYNs wanting births to be in working hours - don't want to disrupt the golf!

I'm not saying the NHS is perfect - it's not. But C-sections are for cause, and birth is at the baby's convenience!

[Jug Band Baby]

22 minutes ago, sawasdee said:

@Jug Band Baby To me, that's unreal. As a Brit , the very idea of paying when giving birth is WTF?

So if I've understood correctly, taking a morning after pill - which would cost, what, a $100 or so? - is absolutely anathema - but if you can't afford a safe birth - well, that's your problem....

And interesting re the cheapest option is scheduled C-section. There has been, over the years, a lot of press about how the US has such a high C-section rate. Most British commentators put it down to  OB/GYNs wanting births to be in working hours - don't want to disrupt the golf!

I'm not saying the NHS is perfect - it's not. But C-sections are for cause, and birth is at the baby's convenience!

Oh no, in the US, we're expected to respect c-sections even when scheduled for the convenience of them.  I think probably all Americans know at least a couple women who scheduled them because it's more convenient to plan ahead even without any medical indication at all, and they're always called the safest option.  Our maternal and neonatal death rates are on the rise, and nobody really wants to give any reasons in case a person is offended or doesn't feel supported for her choice.  And something fucked is that some women schedule elective sections because they can't afford to have childcare on call, and so have to schedule ahead of time when to have a babysitter or daycare.

As an American, I still can't wrap my head around not having to pay through the nose for care.  I need a crown on a tooth, but can't afford over $1,000.  I have a scar healing very gnarly, but can't afford the $3,000 I'd have to pay out of pocket to get it revised to not cause pain.  I have to pay $500 every couple months for my Botox for migraines because after the 2 years it took to get my insurance to cover it at all, which required trying at least 4 different medications for at least 6 months each to prove they didn't work, which disabled me, after my 3rd treatment, my insurance declared my disabling migraines to not be a current issue anymore, and without being a current issue, they wouldn't cover.  You can see the problem with not covering something because that something is actually under control

The US is barbaric.  And now we have a p-word (I can't call Trump my that title) who favors cutting maternity services from the list of vital medical services so that insurance can stop covering maternal care, and that will consider having had a baby to be a pre-existing condition.  A lot of Americans on this forum might not have medical coverage at all at the end of the year.  Our pricy co-payments are going to look affordable when we lost all coverage.

[xlurker]

On 6/13/2017 at 8:03 PM, SapphireSlytherin said:

Health insurance is required by law, per Obamacare. Not sure if the Duggars can claim a religious exemption

It may be required by law, but there are still many folks that fall in that grey area where the cost is prohibitive.  The cost of Obamacare for lots of could mean not being able to pay for food/heat etc.  The fine isnt fun to pay, but can mean a week to week life is still possible.  Not saying the Duggars fit into this group...just that those folks do exist.

[GracieLou Free Duggar]

4 hours ago, sawasdee said:

 

So if I've understood correctly, taking a morning after pill - which would cost, what, a $100 or so? - is absolutely anathema - but if you can't afford a safe birth - well, that's your problem....

I think the pill is maybe $30, but I don't know how long that will be for, considering the state of health and female health in the US.

[Jug Band Baby]

9 hours ago, xlurker said:

It may be required by law, but there are still many folks that fall in that grey area where the cost is prohibitive.  The cost of Obamacare for lots of could mean not being able to pay for food/heat etc.  The fine isnt fun to pay, but can mean a week to week life is still possible.  Not saying the Duggars fit into this group...just that those folks do exist.

That's not the fault of the ACA.  That's the fault of the states whose governors decided to refuse federal funding to expand Medicaid to cover low-income families who can't afford coverage.

[Divemaster01]

42 minutes ago, Jug Band Baby said:

That's not the fault of the ACA.  That's the fault of the states whose governors decided to refuse federal funding to expand Medicaid to cover low-income families who can't afford coverage.

My gov in Wisconsin is one of them. 

[jerkit]

I am 99% certain Jill is going to try to home birth VBAC every single baby from now until menopause. And I think it could potentially be disastrous.

[Million Children For Jesus]

11 hours ago, sawasdee said:

There has been, over the years, a lot of press about how the US has such a high C-section rate. Most British commentators put it down to  OB/GYNs wanting births to be in working hours - don't want to disrupt the golf!

My first C-section was exactly for this reason. My doctor yelled at me that I took too long and he missed his tee time. Then, during the c-section, he pouted and sulked and everyone talked about how long I took, and how the doctor missed his tee time. He was basically having a tantrum while cutting me open. I switched doctors, and the next doctor was even worse! The third one was okay, but the anesthesiologist was an A-grade bastard. Then the doctor retired. 4 c-sections, 4 different doctors. The fourth one was the nicest, but she accidentally cut my son's head open. That was the best doctor of the four, and she cut my son's head open!! When safe, I support home births because hospital births in the US are a shit show. I've attended three home births and they were like rainbows and unicorns compared to my experiences. 

[FundieCentral]

Yes, because the Republicans wanted to implode it, as they are still doing. Watched a lecture by Jonathan Gruber (one of the ACA's designers) in 2014 and he was saying that exact same thing - "I it in committees with these people. Believe me when I say that the republicans don't want this to be a success because otherwise they'd lose the 2016 election, and they know that." 

So they systematically cut out and changed parts of it between when they got Congress, and since Trump of course it's all up for grabs. 

Not a Democrat here or anything, and I am quite conflicted on what "ideal" healthcare would look like, but this "if we can't have it you can't have it either" sandbox mentality with the Republicans and ACA is ridiculous. And now they're reluctantly putting in the AHCA despite not actually wanting to, and have no idea what they are doing. Sad. Meanwhile, all is unravelling, people are dying, and medical tourism to other countries is on the rise. 

And I just find it sad that citizens of the richest country in the world have to leave their country because they can't access leukaemia treatment for their children. I bet more people die of wrong or nonexistent medical care than all wars combined. But veterans get the VA as compensation. If you die from years of untreated illness, you get nothing at all, despite the obvious misdeeds by everyone involved. *slow clap* 

 

[subsaharanafrica]

Medicaid expansion is touted as being a lot bigger than it actually was. You still have to make 133% of the federal poverty line or below to qualify. The chart for what that means in real numbers can be found here but spoiler alert: they're ridiculously low.

Just as an example, a single person making $48k a year isn't going to qualify for expanded Medicaid or even subsidized premiums.

The cheapest plan you'll be able to get in state A is $8k a year/ $667 a month. $48k/ year works out to $4k a month gross. The premium takes you down to $3,333, and Federal taxes (forgetting about state and local) further reduce your take home pay to $2,659 a month. 

You're an older millennial with $100k in student loan debt and the minimum payment for those is $900 a month. So you've got $1,759 a month left and we haven't even gotten to rent. Doable? Yes, but you're likely not going to be able to save much of anything.

But let's say you get sick be you need a $15k MRI.  Guess what? That cheapest plan you bought only covers 60% of that and you still need to come up with $6k that you sure as Hell don't have. A better plan that would have made your out of pocket costs more manageable was truly cost prohibitive if you wanted to do friviolous things like eat and sleep under a roof. 

And that's someone making $48k a year. You can't tell me that someone making $25k a year (and doesn't qualify for the expanded Medicaid) has an extra $400 lying around every month to buy the subsidized insurance. 

ETA: Thus ends the rant of a salty millennial. 

[MadeItOut]

I'm a Brit living in Europe, so I've done both - paid healthcare invisibly through my stamp and paid at point of sale.

Having spent approx 1 week of my life in labour (4.5 days, 50 hrs, 37.5hrs), I strongly feel if any bugger's getting paid for a birth, it ought to be the mother.

[xlurker]

3 hours ago, Jug Band Baby said:

That's not the fault of the ACA.  That's the fault of the states whose governors decided to refuse federal funding to expand Medicaid to cover low-income families who can't afford coverage.

NY state here--I do ok, not rich, not poor..however, if I had $1000 a month for crappy insurance I would have already had crappy insurance.  Even $500 a month, which by the way was not the case, would send me for a tail spin.  And just for the record--I dont carry debt, except for student loans for the xlurklings...to satisfy my legal requirement I left a job I was very good at and loved (was there 10+ years) for a job that steals a bit of my soul each time I walk in the door.  I may have health insurance, but the quality of my life has diminished

[SapphireSlytherin]

4 hours ago, Million Children For Jesus said:

My doctor yelled at me that I took too long and he missed his tee time.

Good grief! And I thought it was bad that I was "handed off" to the "on-call" doctor because I was "taking too long" for my regular doc (family practice - US Army) to deliver me. Yeah, the GryffDisapp baby was delivered by an on-call doctor I never met until I actually was wheeled into the delivery room. Actually, she was delivered by a PA TRAINEE while on-call dude stood by and watched. He did stitch me up, though. I still don't remember his name.

ARMY BIRTHING FOR THE WIN!

[OyToTheVey]

11 hours ago, GracieLou Free Duggar said:

I think the pill is maybe $30, but I don't know how long that will be for, considering the state of health and female health in the US.

It's $56. I sell Plan B. In my store, not on the street. 

[Million Children For Jesus]

@SapphireSlytherin I have heard "hand off" stories quite a bit. At least with a home birth, the mother's feelings are considered and you know who is going to be there.

[Daisy0322]

1 hour ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

ARMY BIRTHING FOR THE WIN!

 my husband went to 1 OB visit with me on post and was like hell no. We changed insurance policies and he talked me into going civilian. Your story makes me thankful though. I love my doc I picked, I just hate that fact we have a copay now.

(Ironically my doctor is retired military and won't touch military hospitals with a 10 foot pole, only delivers civilian). 

[Fluffy14]

Our system in Canada is not ideal at times but everytime is sit in a Dr.s waiting room or ER I don't complain. How can i? All I have to do is think about my neighbors to the south of me paying insane amounts of money.  People here complain about wait times for surgery or MRI or CT scans. Well my daughter went to get a heart stress test done this week and was scheduled for a CT scan ASAP. Less than a week.  I think just like the ER or walk ins it is a priority care thing. I read about your monthly costs, co pays, nasty insurance people and it baffles my mind. Jeez the stress alone is enough to send me to the Dr. 

[melon]

6 hours ago, Million Children For Jesus said:

My first C-section was exactly for this reason. My doctor yelled at me that I took too long and he missed his tee time. Then, during the c-section, he pouted and sulked and everyone talked about how long I took, and how the doctor missed his tee time. He was basically having a tantrum while cutting me open. I switched doctors, and the next doctor was even worse! The third one was okay, but the anesthesiologist was an A-grade bastard. Then the doctor retired. 4 c-sections, 4 different doctors. The fourth one was the nicest, but she accidentally cut my son's head open. That was the best doctor of the four, and she cut my son's head open!! When safe, I support home births because hospital births in the US are a shit show. I've attended three home births and they were like rainbows and unicorns compared to my experiences. 

I'm so sorry you had a doctor like that.I had vaginal births,but my third son was born on a Saturday.I had to call the doctor on call,and he acted like I ruined his day,at first,but then his mood changed,but seriously??He tried to talk me out of my tubal ligation.So did some of the nurses.My labor was about 7 hours.Oh,he made a comment...I had a natural birth...I had to push a 10lb 4oz baby in the labor room,he,the doctor is like,Melon,this should be a cinch for you....Yeah,right...I felt like slapping him,at the time.My cousin's first child was born in September,so was her third child..12 years later...her daughter told her she could not have this new baby on HER birthday.My cousin's reply was; She would tell God and her body her request but don't count on it...lol.She got her wish,he was born the day before...lol.

[moriah]

I'm in the "wouldn't be alive if born at home" camp.  They couldn't detect vasa previa back then.  When Mom's water broke at the hospital, the poorly attached cord that had been anchored to the placenta only by the vessels and amniotic membrane at the insertion point broke and prolapsed into the vaginal vault. The placenta tore some too (marginal placenta previa) so when Mom felt a gush of fluid and rang for the nurse... well, Mom says she screamed.  

They used instruments to try to hold the cord attached to me compressed shut and did an emergency Cesarean.  We both had blood transfusions.  They weren't sure exactly how long I'd been without oxygen so that was scary at first for them, but later my parents joked that they were grateful for any any dain bramage that might have occurred, because I was walking and talking by nine months and almost able to make toast all by myself before 3.  If I'd only put the butter on *after* it was toasted....

They can detect vasa previa now with a specialized ultrasound, if they look for it.  Even if the placenta migrates to a higher position in the uterus, women with a low-lying placenta noted at any point in pregnancy should ask their doctors about a transvaginal color doppler ultrasound to check for vasa previa.

[VelociRapture]

7 hours ago, Million Children For Jesus said:

When safe, I support home births because hospital births in the US are a shit show. I've attended three home births and they were like rainbows and unicorns compared to my experiences. 

I'm really sorry you had bad experiences, but I don't think we should be generalizing about any type of birth. I had a hospital birth six months ago and it went flawlessly - no pressuring, no angry doctor, no abusive Nurses. And it was a really good thing I was in the hospital because my baby was premature and needed NICU - she briefly forgot how to breathe after she was born. Had I been stupid and gone with a homebirth, then we could be having a different conversation.

I honestly don't know anyone personally who has had a home birth. Everyone I know has had a hospital birth. I also don't know anyone who has had a bad experience with hospital births either. Obviously, that's not to say bad hospital births don't happen - you're experiences are proof of that - but it's not entirely fair to claim all US hospital births are shit shows when compared to home births either. It all depends on the people involved.

[Rachel333]

There have been two instances involving people I knew where a home birth went really, really wrong. One resulted in the baby severely brain damaged and the other in the 23-year-old mother dying. Both would have probably turned out fine if they had been in a hospital.

That's not to say that home births are always bad, but after what I've seen I personally would feel scared if someone I cared about decided to do a home birth.

[HarleyQuinn]

I respect people's decisons to do a home birth, but I'm way too paranoid about it personally.

I don't have a birth horror story but for my last my doc ended up being on vacation in Jamaica when I went into labor. She came back the day i discharged with a horrid sunburn and basically only said "don't have sex for 6 weeks." I don't blame her for wanting to go back home.

[Million Children For Jesus]

4 hours ago, melon said:

her daughter told her she could not have this new baby on HER birthday.

My nephew said the same thing when his sibling was due on his birthday. He got his wish. My sister delivered the day before. My kids want all the babies born on their birthdays, so they can have a birthday twin. 

1 hour ago, HarleyQuinn said:

I respect people's decisons to do a home birth, but I'm way too paranoid about it personally.

I don't have a birth horror story but for my last my doc ended up being on vacation in Jamaica when I went into labor. She came back the day i discharged with a horrid sunburn and basically only said "don't have sex for 6 weeks." I don't blame her for wanting to go back home.

I'm sorry I laughed at the sunburn. My second doctor scheduled my c-section 9 days before my due date so he could go on vacation. He told me that was the only day the hospital had available, but he didn't tell his staff to tell me that, so his NP told me about the vacation. I totally respect vacation, but not lying about it.

[Million Children For Jesus]

3 hours ago, VelociRapture said:

I'm really sorry you had bad experiences, but I don't think we should be generalizing about any type of birth. I had a hospital birth six months ago and it went flawlessly - no pressuring, no angry doctor, no abusive Nurses. And it was a really good thing I was in the hospital because my baby was premature and needed NICU - she briefly forgot how to breathe after she was born. Had I been stupid and gone with a homebirth, then we could be having a different conversation.

I honestly don't know anyone personally who has had a home birth. Everyone I know has had a hospital birth. I also don't know anyone who has had a bad experience with hospital births either. Obviously, that's not to say bad hospital births don't happen - you're experiences are proof of that - but it's not entirely fair to claim all US hospital births are shit shows when compared to home births either. It all depends on the people involved.

Agreed, a premature delivery is not an appropriate time to choose a home birth. Just want to clarify that when you say, "been stupid and gone with a home birth," that you are referring to premature labor, and not calling all women who deliver at home, "stupid."

Home births weren't even on my radar when I had my first one. I had witnessed one by the time of my second child, but if I had chosen a home birth after a long labor and c-section, that would have been stupid. Really stupid. Like Jill, if she chooses that option. Fair use of the word stupid. No way around it.

I guess because I have had horrible hospital births, (which were still better for me than attempting a VBAC or especially an at-home VBAC), people with horrible birth stories come out of the woodwork. I've met well over 100 women over 20 years with horrible stories. 

[Henk12]

3 hours ago, VelociRapture said:

I'm really sorry you had bad experiences, but I don't think we should be generalizing about any type of birth. I had a hospital birth six months ago and it went flawlessly - no pressuring, no angry doctor, no abusive Nurses. And it was a really good thing I was in the hospital because my baby was premature and needed NICU - she briefly forgot how to breathe after she was born. Had I been stupid and gone with a homebirth, then we could be having a different conversation.

I honestly don't know anyone personally who has had a home birth. Everyone I know has had a hospital birth. I also don't know anyone who has had a bad experience with hospital births either. Obviously, that's not to say bad hospital births don't happen - you're experiences are proof of that - but it's not entirely fair to claim all US hospital births are shit shows when compared to home births either. It all depends on the people involved.

You had your baby at 33 or 34 weeks, right? I know you mentioned it before but I've got mom brain so I can't remember. Either way, if you had been planning a home birth and then gone into labor before 35 weeks then you would have had to transfer to a hospital. The home birth midwives in my area won't attend births before 35 weeks because of situations like your daughter's. So I understand that a home birth would not have been a good choice for you but home birth is very safe with a real midwife because they plan for emergencies like yours.