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Newsweek article on the Bible hits the ball into high orbit


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Kurt Eichenwald just tweeted about this article on Newsweek...

http://www.newsweek.com/2015/01/02/thats-not-what-bible-says-294018.html

Quote

They wave their Bibles at passersby, screaming their condemnations of homosexuals. They fall on their knees, worshipping at the base of granite monuments to the Ten Commandments while demanding prayer in school. They appeal to God to save America from their political opponents, mostly Democrats. They gather in football stadiums by the thousands to pray for the country’s salvation.

They are God’s frauds, cafeteria Christians who pick and choose which Bible verses they heed with less care than they exercise in selecting side orders for lunch. They are joined by religious rationalizers—fundamentalists who, unable to find Scripture supporting their biases and beliefs, twist phrases and modify translations to prove they are honoring the Bible’s words.

 

The Bible is not the book many American fundamentalists and political opportunists think it is, or more precisely, what they want it to be. Their lack of knowledge about the Bible is well established. A Pew Research poll in 2010 found that evangelicals ranked only a smidgen higher than atheists in familiarity with the New Testament and Jesus’s teachings. “Americans revere the Bible—but, by and large, they don’t read it,’’ wrote George Gallup Jr. and Jim Castelli, pollsters and researchers whose work focused on religion in the United States. The Barna Group, a Christian polling firm, found in 2012 that evangelicals accepted the attitudes and beliefs of the Pharisees—religious leaders depicted throughout the New Testament as opposing Christ and his message—more than they accepted the teachings of Jesus.

Damn, Newsweek not only hit it out of the park here, but they put it into a high orbit.

Here's the tweet in question.

 

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That was a great article! Fundies would flip out. There are SO many little inconsistencies in the gospels. The fish and loaves story is another- it has different numbers in the same book (Mark) just different chapters. But point it out and you get accused of "taking things out of context". When things get examined that closely, you lose the spirit of the words in the details. 

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13 minutes ago, send*the*ferrets said:

That was a great article! Fundies would flip out. There are SO many little inconsistencies in the gospels. The fish and loaves story is another- it has different numbers in the same book (Mark) just different chapters. But point it out and you get accused of "taking things out of context". When things get examined that closely, you lose the spirit of the words in the details. 

Along with flat out ignoring most of the New T.  Especially all those pesky words in red.

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10 minutes ago, send*the*ferrets said:

That was a great article! Fundies would flip out. There are SO many little inconsistencies in the gospels. The fish and loaves story is another- it has different numbers in the same book (Mark) just different chapters. But point it out and you get accused of "taking things out of context". When things get examined that closely, you lose the spirit of the words in the details. 

The reference to 5000 or however many people simply meant a lot of people ate, not exactly 5000 or whatever. It helps to have some understanding of the language and culture of the time to meaningfully, not superficially, interpret scripture. Fundies excel at superficial and literal bible reading in a modern American context. Nope. 

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2 minutes ago, SilverBeach said:

The reference to 5000 or however many people simply meant a lot of people ate, not exactly 5000 or whatever. It helps to have some understanding of the language and culture of the time to meaningfully, not superficially, interpret scripture. Fundies excel at superficial and literal bible reading in a modern American context. Nope. 

I haven't looked it up in awhile but if I'm remembering correctly, the crowd size, the number of fish/loaves initially present and how many were left were different in the two chapters of Matthew and I think a version of the story is told in Luke as well. I've seen so many people cling to the holy KJV of the Bible and claim that every single word is LITERALLY true- when they have really no idea what it even says, and how often it has contradictions. I actually believe that for most of the SOTDRT graduates, the KJV is above their reading level and they aren't really able to internalize the verses anyway. They may be able to recite some of them, but they aren't comprehending. 

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1 minute ago, send*the*ferrets said:

I haven't looked it up in awhile but if I'm remembering correctly, the crowd size, the number of fish/loaves initially present and how many were left were different in the two chapters of Matthew and I think a version of the story is told in Luke as well. I've seen so many people cling to the holy KJV of the Bible and claim that every single word is LITERALLY true- when they have really no idea what it even says, and how often it has contradictions. I actually believe that for most of the SOTDRT graduates, the KJV is above their reading level and they aren't really able to internalize the verses anyway. They may be able to recite some of them, but they aren't comprehending. 

Those number differences were not so much contradictions as different observations. I say thousands were at an event, somebody else says tens of thousands, somebody else says a million. The point is, it was a whole lot of folks. In Hebrew culture it was common to use a large number when you meant a lot of something, not that the number was an actual count. I am not a bible literalist. It isn't a book, it's a library, with many authors and subject to translation and interpretation biases and errors.

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2 minutes ago, SilverBeach said:

Those number differences were not so much contradictions as different observations. I say thousands were at an event, somebody else says tens of thousands, somebody else says a million. The point is, it was a whole lot of folks. In Hebrew culture it was common to use a large number when you meant a lot of something, not that the number was an actual count. I am not a bible literalist. It isn't a book, it's a library, with many authors and subject to translation and interpretation biases and errors.

I agree with you, I don't think the exact numbers really matter. I've been told by "Bible believing" Christians that the God wrote the Bible through the Apostles and that the KJV is actually divinely inspired. I guess they think the Holy Spirit possessed the authors of the Bible or something. I don't think most of them study enough history to realize there are multiple versions from the same time period. 

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1 minute ago, send*the*ferrets said:

I agree with you, I don't think the exact numbers really matter. I've been told by "Bible believing" Christians that the God wrote the Bible through the Apostles and that the KJV is actually divinely inspired. I guess they think the Holy Spirit possessed the authors of the Bible or something. I don't think most of them study enough history to realize there are multiple versions from the same time period. 

The Apostles certainly didn't write the old testament! There is nothing special about the KJV either. The bible has its purpose (not to clobber people with I might add), but I don't make an idol of it. The Holy Spirit tells me more about God than any book ever could. Why not simply be a Christian, instead of a super speshul bible believing Christian? 

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So that's what I'm doing wrong!!! Those pesky words in red...I thought I was supposed to try to live my life in accordance with those...damn, now I'll have to confess my sin....

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Back in the 80s I was told by a catholic priest that Bible is not to believe literally. That it's like stories to make people understand God's creation. It was at religion class and he wasn't a revolutionary priest, he was an ordinary one. But any catholic that I know (except some old people) expects people believing Noah's story and similar ones because it's impossible if you've a rational mind. So to protect the Bible, they accept it's not naked truth and you have to get the inside meaning and moral. You need an interpretation.

 

Why evangelic keep so tied to the Bible? I surprises me. You can be fundie anyway, keeping a extremely conservative way of life, and no need to believe every single word.

Disclaimer: I know there are believers in FJ. I hope anybody feels bad for my post. Just telling my experience.

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21 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

Why evangelic keep so tied to the Bible? I surprises me. You can be fundie anyway, keeping a extremely conservative way of life, and no need to believe every single word.

The problem is not understanding the various literary devices used in scripture. Genesis is mostly a creation myth...a way that ancient peoples explained how they got where they are. Exodus-Deuteronomy are history books...however, ancient history is not written like modern history. The rest are a combination of history, poetry, allegory...I mean...fundie preachers don't exactly go to seminary (most of them) so they are teaching crap to people who are not discerning enough to study for themselves. 

There's more to it but...anyway...

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9 hours ago, feministxtian said:

So that's what I'm doing wrong!!! Those pesky words in red...I thought I was supposed to try to live my life in accordance with those...damn, now I'll have to confess my sin....

Of course you are. But a lot of folks are not talking about the words of Christ when they say "bible believing". As a Christ follower, his words mean more to me than anything.

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2 hours ago, SilverBeach said:

Of course you are. But a lot of folks are not talking about the words of Christ when they say "bible believing". As a Christ follower, his words mean more to me than anything.

There are three passages in the bible that I endeavor to live by...2 in the NT and 1 in the OT. For me, those three are what Christ followers should live by, believe and preach at all times. Those are Matthew 25:31-46, James 1:27  and Micah 6:8. 

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1 hour ago, feministxtian said:

There are three passages in the bible that I endeavor to live by...2 in the NT and 1 in the OT. For me, those three are what Christ followers should live by, believe and preach at all times. Those are Matthew 25:31-46, James 1:27  and Micah 6:8. 

Are you me?

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Just now, SilverBeach said:

Are you me?

maybe! Or maybe the sane Christians are all developing some sort of hive mind...hell, I don't know! 

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Their was some preacher (I think he was Southern Baptist) that said in the recent election, if Jesus were a politician running on a platform of the Sermon on the Mount, that he couldn't vote for Jesus.  I was completely flabbergasted by that statement.

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Bravo to Newsweek.  

One of my favorite Orthodox/Catholic memes is appropriate here:

 

 

heresy meme.jpg

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What a fascinating, well-written article. And the irony of this:

Quote

A Pew Research poll in 2010 found that evangelicals ranked only a smidgen higher than atheists in familiarity with the New Testament and Jesus’s teachings.

In my personal experience, I've known more than a few people who seemed unfamiliar with basic tenets of their denomination, as well as key events and figures in Christianity. But I've also known plenty of others who are very well-read and knowledgeable about the Bible and the history of their faith. The latter group tended to come off as more secure in their beliefs, and our conversations were always more engaging! They also gave me a much better appreciation of the Bible and impression of Christianity in general. :my_smile:

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4 hours ago, danvillebelle said:

One of my favorite Orthodox/Catholic memes is appropriate here:

Wonderful!!  I have saved that one. 

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On 3/25/2017 at 11:06 PM, send*the*ferrets said:

The fish and loaves story is another- it has different numbers in the same book (Mark) just different chapters.

It is commonly believed that these are two distinct miracles. Yes, you can make the argument that this is an inconsistency. This does not change the fact that many biblical scholars make the argument that these are two distinct miracles.

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I remember someone at one of the Episcopal churches I go to mentioned that she was once a member of a church - Baptist, I think - that considered the bible to be the be all and end all of Christiantiy.  She said she found it so nice to attend another church where the bible was important, but it was just a component of the church and not the entirety of the church's existence.

On 3/26/2017 at 2:27 PM, PennySycamore said:

Their was some preacher (I think he was Southern Baptist) that said in the recent election, if Jesus were a politician running on a platform of the Sermon on the Mount, that he couldn't vote for Jesus.  I was completely flabbergasted by that statement.

Many, many reich wingers do not worship Jesus I do.  They follow Jeeeezus, who shares their hatred of the poor, minorities, and members of other religions.

I remember this from The Pain about Jesus Christ v. Jeeezus the GOP follows.

http://www.thepaincomics.com/weekly050504.htm

 

 

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On 3/26/2017 at 10:53 AM, feministxtian said:

Matthew 25:31-46

Great, now I have this song stuck in my head.

 

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