Has anyone else seen fundie types or MLMs using this fake Dave Ramsey quote?

[lilwriter85]

A friend of mine has a step mother-in-law and father-in-law who have become quite religious in past few years. I have been around this couple about a dozens of times over the years.  Back in December, my friend's step MIL friended me on Facebook.  The step-MIL hasn't worked in years due to health problems. My friend had told me last summer that her step MIL was getting involved in various MLM companies likes Jewelry in Candles, Young Living, Youinque makeup and other ones. Earlier I was going through Facebook and the step MIL posted this pic of quote about home based businesses by Dave Ramsey. I didn't believe it and did some searching and found out that Dave never said that. He was questioned on twitter and said that it wasn't his quote.

From other research, Dave has addressed home based businesses and has given advice on pricing and business models. But, he doesn't seem to heavily push them. Of course, I began to wonder if some of the fundies like Tonya F. and others have floated the fake quote around.

Twitter response

 

Interesting discussion on the fake quote on Dave public's FB page.

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/daveramsey/posts/10150511657295886

[GenerationCedarchip]

Interesting.  I have seen this quote floating around but not specifically in fundie circles.  I've seen it more with folks I know who are conservative but not particularly religious.  MLMs seem to be heavily into the inspirational (and sometimes fake) quotes lately. I used to post the occasional quote that I personally found uplifting on my Facebook but last time I did that, I got a PM from someone asking who I sold for.

[lilwriter85]

14 hours ago, GenerationCedarchip said:

Interesting.  I have seen this quote floating around but not specifically in fundie circles.  I've seen it more with folks I know who are conservative but not particularly religious.  MLMs seem to be heavily into the inspirational (and sometimes fake) quotes lately. I used to post the occasional quote that I personally found uplifting on my Facebook but last time I did that, I got a PM from someone asking who I sold for.

I have also seen non fundie MLM types who are/were into posting inspriational quotes. I had a friend years back that was heavily into selling ViSalus stuff and she posted various quotes in between her FB shill posts. I don't think she ever posted the fake Dave Ramsey quote.

[VVV]

Dave Ramsey could and should do a lot more to discourage desperate people from buying into MLMs than he does...he may not push them, but he does put a more positive spin on them than statistics would support. Whether he is friends with the top people, I don't know, but some of his most desperate callers do not come across as very bright, and they need to hear him say directly, "Don't try this; it's a scam and you're going to lose thousands of dollars," instead of the lukewarm, "most people don't succeed in these but I have known a few who did" mealymouthed advice he doles out.

[EmiGirl]

The thingredients about direct selling companies is that you have to put for effort and lots of it. It's great for those of us willing to, but if you don't work, you're not going to do well. I'm involved with norwex just for the discount and tax write offs. If I make a few bucks in the process, great. When I worked my 31 business I made some decent pocket cash. These things aren't get rich quick companies like people seem to think they're going to be.  Its like starting any business, home or otherwise. You have to put in blood, sweat, and tears to make it work. Are they schemes? Most arent, but I think that some aren't upfront about the hard work that you have to put I not it.

[VVV]

4 hours ago, EmiGirl said:

The thingredients about direct selling companies is that you have to put for effort and lots of it. It's great for those of us willing to, but if you don't work, you're not going to do well. I'm involved with norwex just for the discount and tax write offs. If I make a few bucks in the process, great. When I worked my 31 business I made some decent pocket cash. These things aren't get rich quick companies like people seem to think they're going to be.  Its like starting any business, home or otherwise. You have to put in blood, sweat, and tears to make it work. Are they schemes? Most arent, but I think that some aren't upfront about the hard work that you have to put I not it.

If most of the money to be made comes from recruiting other people to form your downline rather than from actual sales of the product...it's a scheme. It is mathematically impossible for everyone involved to make money no matter how hard they work. There just are not enough people in the world to support an infinite number of downlines.

I don't have a problem with people signing up with a company in order to get a discount on products they like. I do have a problem when people start saying that the only reason others fail is because they weren't willing to put in the hard work. No, they may be failing because despite their best efforts, there just aren't enough suckers potential downline people, or they may be failing because they are fundamentally decent people and can't bring themselves to strong arm friends and family into signing up under them.

[EmiGirl]

5 hours ago, VVV said:

If most of the money to be made comes from recruiting other people to form your downline rather than from actual sales of the product...it's a scheme. It is mathematically impossible for everyone involved to make money no matter how hard they work. There just are not enough people in the world to support an infinite number of downlines.

I don't have a problem with people signing up with a company in order to get a discount on products they like. I do have a problem when people start saying that the only reason others fail is because they weren't willing to put in the hard work. No, they may be failing because despite their best efforts, there just aren't enough suckers potential downline people, or they may be failing because they are fundamentally decent people and can't bring themselves to strong arm friends and family into signing up under them.

I've never seen or been involved with a company where one's perks out earns personal sales. Yes, there are usually bonuses involved, but it's always contingent on the person working their own business. You don't *have* to sign people up. I never did and I did pretty decent. I've just never wanted to be in leadership. there are those who don't operate within ethics codes, b ut it really pisses me off when people lump all of us into the same basket. No one gets pissed off when someone opens up a franchised store, so what the hell is wrong with having a home based direct selling business.? 

[SilverBeach]

9 hours ago, EmiGirl said:

The thingredients about direct selling companies is that you have to put for effort and lots of it. It's great for those of us willing to, but if you don't work, you're not going to do well. I'm involved with norwex just for the discount and tax write offs. If I make a few bucks in the process, great. When I worked my 31 business I made some decent pocket cash. These things aren't get rich quick companies like people seem to think they're going to be.  Its like starting any business, home or otherwise. You have to put in blood, sweat, and tears to make it work. Are they schemes? Most arent, but I think that some aren't upfront about the hard work that you have to put I not it.

People can get jobs and without blood, sweat, or tears, make more money than in any MLM scam. These things are actually marketed as requiring little effort, perfect for busy mothers with just a few hours to spare. Now you are saying people have to put forth lots of effort. Which is it? Most, if not all MLMs are indeed schemes designed to separate you from what resources you already have, to enrich the creators of the scheme. BTW, its not a business, you are an independent contractor who has no control over the product or how the "business" is run. Horrible what these companies do to desperate and gullible people. Selling hope of easy riches. Evil.

Oh, nothing is wrong with a home based direct selling business, but MLMs are not direct sales. Another misrepresentation.

[VVV]

This is a useful site: http://mlmwatch.org/

If there's a particular company of interest that isn't covered at mlmwatch, oftentimes just googling that company's name along with mlm will turn up interesting discussions on sites like reddit. I just looked up a few mentioned in this thread.

[EowynW]

I can't stand MLM. A friend of my husband keeps pushing me to join up with her and sell DoTerra and while I love my essential oils. NO JUST NO I don't want to become a pushy essential oil saleslady lol 

 

[FundieFarmer]

I haven't noticed that MLM-ers post more motivational quotes than the average Joe, but that would certainly be an interesting study 

I loathe the principle of MLMs as a whole. Those I know who participate in them are rather obnoxious- and of the three I know who are diehard, I've had to unfollow two of them (the third I love enough to put up with the MLM crap to see her other family photos). One added me to a private sales group on top of her public posts, posts constantly in the group, created a group message thread for the group, created a fundraiser event, and messaged me privately to ask if I could attend the group event. Enough is enough!

[nausicaa]

15 hours ago, EmiGirl said:

I've never seen or been involved with a company where one's perks out earns personal sales. Yes, there are usually bonuses involved, but it's always contingent on the person working their own business. You don't *have* to sign people up. I never did and I did pretty decent. I've just never wanted to be in leadership. there are those who don't operate within ethics codes, b ut it really pisses me off when people lump all of us into the same basket. No one gets pissed off when someone opens up a franchised store, so what the hell is wrong with having a home based direct selling business.? 

They might tell you you don't have to sign people up, but I have yet to have a friend begin to sell Mary Kay or Rodan and Fields or BeachBody who only stuck with selling the products and didn't immediately try to convert other people into selling. To me that's the biggest red flag with these "businesses."

[Anonymousguest]

I haven't seen that particular misattributed quote, but I've seen plenty of others. And not necessarily from people in MLM. And often they don't even care that it's been miss quoted. When it's pointed out they'll say "oh, I don't care who said it, I just liked the quote." :/

[lilwriter85]

7 hours ago, Anonymousguest said:

I haven't seen that particular misattributed quote, but I've seen plenty of others. And not necessarily from people in MLM. And often they don't even care that it's been miss quoted. When it's pointed out they'll say "oh, I don't care who said it, I just liked the quote." :/

I don't think my friend's step-MIL would care if I pointed it out to her. Today on FB, she was shilling out for some company called Juice Plus and her friend is involved with it. My friend has said that her in-laws are quite bad with money and the step-MIL is desperate to make money off MLMs/home based stuff.

[Mercer]

I always initially read MLM as meaning men who love men, and I get really confused when I see it in this context.

I know, this is not a helpful contribution to the thread, but I just had to express myself.

[lilwriter85]

9 hours ago, Mercer said:

I always initially read MLM as meaning men who love men, and I get really confused when I see it in this context.

I know, this is not a helpful contribution to the thread, but I just had to express myself.

Thanks for the laugh Mercer.

[FormerlyFundyLite]

John Oliver did a segment on MLMs:

Spoiler

 

They make me super ragey and I refuse to participate because I feel so manipulated. "Oh, just come and hang out! You don't have to buy anything! No pressure." Sure, the host will say that, but the last one I went to, I answered a stupid trivia question right and the seller thought I was really passionate about the business and tried to talk me into calling in for the recruitment spiel. When I told her that I wasn't interested, she forced a card with the dial-in info into my hand. I decided that was the last one I'd go to, but I spent the week worried the host would give her my number so she could check-in with me.

[SoybeanQueen]

It's possible to sell products and not recruit in direct sales. If it is not possible, and the focus/incentive is based on recruitment, that is a pyramid scheme.

I've sold for 2 different companies over the years. Never recruited anyone. Most recently I sold Norwex, because I loved the products, they made cleaning faster/easier for me, and I figured some of my friends would like them. I was right. Recruiting held no interest because this is a small town, and how many people selling the same thing are needed? I sold things to people who wanted them, made some money, and quit when I felt like it.

So, it's possible to not harass others or attempt to build a sales empire. Assholes are assholes, no matter where they work.

[Maxwell]

On 3/22/2017 at 10:46 PM, lilwriter85 said:

I don't think my friend's step-MIL would care if I pointed it out to her. Today on FB, she was shilling out for some company called Juice Plus and her friend is involved with it. My friend has said that her in-laws are quite bad with money and the step-MIL is desperate to make money off MLMs/home based stuff.

Juice Plus... It's a scam within a scam.  Makes my blood boil with every mention of the name.  Had friends that got into it and it almost cost us the friendship.

[Jilli]

i know it's a fake quote but I hate it. Second jobs are sometimes a necessity.

i dislike MLMs. I would much rather start a business with my own product. 

[lilah]

Biggest difference between mlm and a franchise is that a company invests a lot in the success of the franchise. A smart buisness is not going to oversaturate the market. Wheat as mlm don't care if the whole neighborhood is shilling their products because their profit cones from the mlm mark investing in the initial product

[louisa05]

3 hours ago, Maxwell said:

Juice Plus... It's a scam within a scam.  Makes my blood boil with every mention of the name.  Had friends that got into it and it almost cost us the friendship.

I have a friend who got into Equinox International in the mid-90s. It got busted by the feds in 2000. She had a cult like devotion to it and you couldn't have a normal conversation with her. They sold water filters and nutrition supplements. A bunch of us went out to lunch once while she was in the middle of it and when the server asked if we'd like waters, she launched into a sales pitch for their water bottle with a built in filter. That was pretty much the last time any of us did anything with her until the thing got busted and she was out of it.  Prior to that she had tricked people into going to their recruiting events ("I just need to stop in the office before we eat, come in with me"), given us products for gifts and other such nonsense. She spent $1000s on products, travel and conferences as well as expensive clothes and stuff she couldn't afford (part of their "fake it til you make it" teaching--"consultants" were supposed to look and act as if they were making tons of money which would supposedly help them strike it rich). She never made enough to break even and had credit card debt to pay off for years. 

And you all are thinking a person would learn from that disaster, right? 

Wrong. Sometime in the past six months, she got herself sucked into Isagenix (or as she calls it on social media, "our nutrition company" because apparently not saying the name is a thing with them). And she is once again losing all her friends. 

[nausicaa]

19 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

Prior to that she had tricked people into going to their recruiting events ("I just need to stop in the office before we eat, come in with me")

Ugh, I can't stand how dishonest the recruiting is! Don't these otherwise nice people feel like crap doing this to their friends? I had a friend start selling MaryKay; I bought a couple eyeshadows to be nice. She sent me a text asking me to call in at a certain time to fill in a survey about how she is as an MK rep. I thought "Sure, I can fill in some quick survey for a friend saying she's great." I call in expecting an automated survey; it's my friend and her upline on a conference call, they immediately start trying to get me to throw a MK party and asking why I wouldn't want to be a consultant.

C'mon people defending MLMs, this shit is okay to do to people?

3 hours ago, Jilli said:

i know it's a fake quote but I hate it. Second jobs are sometimes a necessity.

i dislike MLMs. I would much rather start a business with my own product. 

It's so clearly a fake quote for anyone who has ever listened to Dave Ramsey. He is always telling people with debt to treat it like their house is on fire, even if that means having two or three jobs, or cleaning toilets even if you have a PhD. I can't imagine him ever trashing the idea of a second job. 

And yeah, in the day of so many online opportunities, I don't understand why these moms in need of a flexible schedule and some extra income don't open an etsy store or do some ESL tutoring. It kind of makes me sad for them. Are they so unfulfilled and lacking in a sense of self that they need a sisterhood in the form of snappy hashtags?

[GeoBQn]

4 hours ago, lilah said:

Biggest difference between mlm and a franchise is that a company invests a lot in the success of the franchise. A smart buisness is not going to oversaturate the market. Wheat as mlm don't care if the whole neighborhood is shilling their products because their profit cones from the mlm mark investing in the initial product

Another difference--if I go to eat at a franchise restaurant, the owner doesn't try to convince me to open my own restaurant.

[EmiGirl]

4 hours ago, nausicaa said:

C'mon people defending MLMs, this shit is okay to do to people?

Not at all! I hate b it when people do crap like that because it gives us all a bad name. If someone was truly interested in selling sure I'd give them info, but lying is not ok and I wold report her and her sponsor to MK HQ.