Mike Pence: Almost as bad as Trump but he might not get us killed

[Cartmann99]

4 hours ago, fraurosena said:

Uhm... you do know that gays and lesbians don't really exist, don't you? There are only heterosexuals who choose that lifestyle!
So Pencey-poo won't have a thing to worry about on that score!

>end sarcasm<

To be on the safe side, Pence should resign as VP, never leave or have visitors to his home ever again, and get rid of his internet, television, and all reading material. Otherwise, he may be tempted to sin or may tempt others to sin. 

 

 

[Childless]

20 hours ago, louisa05 said:

 

I just had an ugly FB conversation with a sexist jackass about it, too.

He explained that the experiences I had with men using these rules didn't happen the way I think they did and that all women they are not married to are threats to men and their marriages and children. Also that attitude is not sexist and does not mean he views women as sex objects. And those rules never exclude women in professional settings nor is it demeaning to always assume a woman will be sexually attracted to every man she is alone in a room with.

Mansplaining asshole.

 

I had a conversation with my husband about this post.  He said the FB guy was a moron with no self control and a degrading view of women.  He's currently a college student involved in a group project with two other women.  He said that at no time did he have to restrain himself from leaping across the table and groping either one of them and at no point did he think they would do the same or in any way threaten his marriage (which he claims is impossible without his consent or participation).  I'm glad most men are normal human beings and don't buy into this garbage mindset that degrades both sexes.

[louisa05]

I had a conversation with my husband about this post.  He said the FB guy was a moron with no self control and a degrading view of women.  He's currently a college student involved in a group project with two other women.  He said that at no time did he have to restrain himself from leaping across the table and groping either one of them and at no point did he think they would do the same or in any way threaten his marriage (which he claims is impossible without his consent or participation).  I'm glad most men are normal human beings and don't buy into this garbage mindset that degrades both sexes.

My husband thinks it is ridiculous as well. He pointed out that he is not actually attracted to every female person he meets and was not when he was single either.

The mindset this comes from is the same mindset that makes them chaperone courtships. They seem to believe people are animals lacking self control when it comes to sexuality.

[Childless]

59 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

 

 

My husband thinks it is ridiculous as well. He pointed out that he is not actually attracted to every female person he meets and was not when he was single either.

The mindset this comes from is the same mindset that makes them chaperone courtships. They seem to believe people are animals lacking self control when it comes to sexuality.

 

 

And yet they refuse to believe in evolution, in part because they insist we are not merely animals, but a species of higher intelligence and awareness. 

[fraurosena]

On 5-4-2017 at 0:32 PM, Childless said:

which he claims is impossible without his consent or participation

So much this! 

It is such a gaping hole in this stupidly mysoginistic theory. As if men have abolutely no responsibility or liability or personal constraints. Don't they realize it's actually quite demeaning to men ?

[ADoyle90815]

On 4/6/2017 at 3:54 AM, fraurosena said:

So much this! 

It is such a gaping hole in this stupidly mysoginistic theory. As if men have abolutely no responsibility or liability or personal constraints. Don't they realize it's actually quite demeaning to men ?

Exactly. They don't realize that they're demeaning men when they imply that they're all animals when around women who aren't their wives. Even most single men are able to control themselves around women they're not dating or interested in.

[GreyhoundFan]

"In service to Trump, Pence keeps saying things that aren’t true"

Quote

Once again, Vice President Pence was out on a limb.

A day after President Trump fired FBI Director James B. Comey, his vice president stared into a television camera, surrounded by a gaggle of reporters on Capitol Hill, and cited the president’s decision to rely on the counsel of his advisers as proof of his “strong” leadership.

“President Trump made the right decision at the right time to accept the recommendation of the deputy attorney general and the attorney general to ask for the termination” of Comey, Pence said.

But that wasn’t true.

Trump told NBC News in an interview the next day that he had not relied on the lengthy letter written by Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein to make his decision, but rather that his mind had been made up before the letter existed.

Pence also had insisted that Trump’s decision was not influenced by his disapproval of the ongoing investigation into the Trump campaign’s ties to Russia — another statement contradicted by Trump in the NBC interview.

“In fact, when I decided to just do it, I said to myself, I said, ‘You know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story, it’s an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should have won,’ ” the president said.

Aides declined to comment about when the vice president learned that Trump had decided to fire Comey.

Since his selection as vice president, Pence has been unflagging in his loyalty and deference to Trump. But in return, the president and White House aides have repeatedly set Pence up to be the public face of official narratives that turn out to be misleading or false.

It is a risk that comes with this high-wire presidency, where talking points and game plans nearly always have an unknown expiration date and where missing meetings can mean being out of the loop when critical decisions are made. The greatest disrupter of all is the president himself, who regularly — and without warning — throws out the communications playbook in favor of his own approach.

“He’s obviously been playing a ‘Mike Pence, cleanup on Aisle 5’ role quite a bit,” said Doug Heye, a Republican strategist. “When Trump won, we had a sense that things like this might happen, and we have now had 111 days of crises du jour.”

On Capitol Hill, Pence — a former House member — is still viewed as a steady hand in an unstable situation. He regularly attends the weekly Senate Republican lunch and can often be seen coming and going from his office in the Capitol.

...

In the lead-up to Trump’s inauguration, Pence likewise became something of an ambassador to skittish Capitol Hill Republicans who had apprehensions about Trump’s management and governing style.

But Friday, Trump essentially acknowledged in a series of tweets that his surrogates had at times gone public with false information — in part because he is “a very active President with lots of things happening.”

“Where that leaves the No. 2 guy is, he’s following the talking points, and the No. 1 guy is using his own talking points,” said a Republican strategist who has worked with Pence for more than a decade. “His understanding of how they were going to explain the background leading up to the decision was different from how Donald Trump decided to explain it.”

“In the end, the president knows what’s in his head, and not everyone else does,” the strategist added.

Like most White House aides who flock to meetings and photo-ops with the president so they won’t miss out when critical decisions are made, Pence has made a habit of having a regular presence in the West Wing. Being physically absent from meetings in the Trump White House can mean being locked out of key decisions.

“I have spent a fair amount of time in the West Wing in the last three-plus months — I have never seen a vice president who was in the West Wing going in and out of meetings as much as I’ve seen Mike Pence,” said a prominent conservative who works closely with Pence and who spoke on the condition of anonymity to candidly discuss Pence’s role.

Pence communications director Jarrod Agen said the vice president was simply applauding Trump’s decisive action and highlighting how the decision aligned with the recommendations of senior Justice Department officials.

“The Vice President values his close relationship with the President and considers it the greatest privilege of his life to have such a strong working relationship with President Trump,” Agen said in a statement.

But this is the second high-profile instance in which Pence has found himself out front with comments that don’t stand up to scrutiny.

In January, Pence repeatedly denied that then-national security adviser Michael Flynn had spoken to Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak, statements that turned out to be false.

After White House counsel Donald McGahn and Trump learned that Flynn had misled the vice president, Pence was kept in the dark for weeks, until just before media reports about the misrepresentations were published.

People close to Pence say he has developed a relationship of trust with Trump in part because he has used his proximity and influence sparingly. He has learned to avoid agitating the president with public stories about his influence and has maintained an unflappable attitude when Trump leaves him exposed.

“The thing that Pence has figured out is, the thing that gives him the influence is the fact that we don’t know it,” said the conservative with close ties to the White House. “This guy is discreet in a town where everybody promotes themselves. . . . He’s playing to an audience of one.”

I don't buy that he's so innocent. I think he's just more shrewd than the tangerine toddler, biding his time.

[formergothardite]

8 hours ago, GreyhoundFan said:

I think he's just more shrewd than the tangerine toddler, biding his time.

It really wouldn't be that hard to be more shrewd than our Orange Wanna Be Dictator, but he is very good at looking like a normal politician in all the chaos. No matter what awful thing Trump does, we can all rest assured that Pence will be a steady bland, boring politician. He will act exactly how a president should act and, even though I doubt his hands are clean, after Trump falls from grace Pence will come off as a breath of fresh air. Which is scary since he will then help the GOP get all their awful shit done. 

[GreyhoundFan]

2 hours ago, formergothardite said:

It really wouldn't be that hard to be more shrewd than our Orange Wanna Be Dictator, but he is very good at looking like a normal politician in all the chaos. No matter what awful thing Trump does, we can all rest assured that Pence will be a steady bland, boring politician. He will act exactly how a president should act and, even though I doubt his hands are clean, after Trump falls from grace Pence will come off as a breath of fresh air. Which is scary since he will then help the GOP get all their awful shit done. 

That's my fear too. With the toddler in the Oval Office, there is too much disruption for much to really get done. Pence will happily shepherd gutting healthcare and cutting taxes to the .1% while decimating services for everyone else. I did have to laugh -- last night, Bill Maher called Pence, "Igor". What a great nickname for him. I'd been thinking "Lurch", but I don't think Pence is all that tall.

[GreyhoundFan]

Understatement of the day: "Vice President Pence has a growing credibility problem"

Spoiler

There are more than a few people who look at Vice President Pence and see President Pence — possibly sooner than later. For wistful Democrats, it would be the end result of President Trump stepping aside or being impeached; for wistful Republicans, some dream of a more serious, less error-prone Republican president actually succeeding at passing a conservative agenda.

But as The Post's Abby Phillip began documenting last week, Pence has hardly been immune from Trump's foibles and from saying untrue things about them. And now twice in the past week, his defenses of the White House he serves in have been pretty directly contradicted in ways that seriously call into question his credibility.

Below are three big instances in which Pence said something that turned out to be highly misleading at best and clearly false at worst, starting with the newest one.

1) Michael Flynn's status as a foreign agent for Turkey

In early March, it was reported that former national security adviser Michael Flynn had filed as a foreign agent for Turkey after failing to do so when he should have. Asked about it by Fox News's Bret Baier on March 9, Pence said twice that it was the “first I heard of it”:

BAIER: The story today that former national security adviser Michael Flynn has filed with the Department of Justice as a foreign agent for making more than $500,000 as a lobbyist, essentially, for Turkey. Your reaction to that, given that, doesn’t that mean, Mr. Vice President, that even if he didn’t lie to you about what the Russian ambassador said or didn’t say, that you would have had to fire him anyway?

PENCE: Well, let me say, hearing that story today was the first I'd heard of it. And I fully support the decision that President Trump made to ask for General Flynn’s resignation.

BAIER: You’re disappointed by the story?

PENCE: The first I heard of it, and I think it is, uh, it is an affirmation of the president’s decision to ask General Flynn to resign.

...

But just a day later, The Washington Post and others reported that Flynn had informed Trump's legal team that he might need to register as a foreign agent even before Trump was inaugurated. And late Wednesday, the New York Times reported that Flynn also had disclosed that he was under federal investigation for it. That's what he told soon-to-be White House chief counsel Don McGahn on Jan. 4, per the Times.

There are two possible defenses for Pence here. The first is that maybe McGahn didn't pass this information along to Pence. This doesn't make much sense, though, given that Pence was leading the transition effort. That would be gross negligence on McGahn's behalf.

The second is that, even if Pence knew about it, perhaps he was referring strictly to the reports about Flynn having just filed as a foreign agent when he said it was the first he'd heard of it. But that would be highly, highly misleading — at best. And Pence went on to pretend that this was all new information that bolstered Trump's decision to ask for Flynn's resignation.

Update: Pence's office has issued a statement on this. It seems to suggest that Pence was indeed never told of Flynn's ties to Turkey back in January: "The vice president stands by his comments in March upon first hearing the news regarding General Flynn's ties to Turkey and fully supports the president's decision to ask for General Flynn's resignation."

It's not totally clear, though. "The news" could also refer specifically to reports that Flynn had just registered as a foreign agent. So is this saying it was the first Pence was hearing of that specific news or the first Pence had heard of Flynn's ties to Turkey? I am seeking clarification.

2) The explanation of James Comey's firing

While defending Trump's firing of FBI Director James B. Comey last week, Pence asserted that the president had acted upon the recommendation of the Justice Department and said the decision wasn't about the FBI's Russia investigation:

• “Let me be very clear that the president’s decision to accept the recommendation of the deputy attorney general and the attorney general to remove Director Comey as the head of the FBI was based solely and exclusively on his commitment to the best interests of the American people and to ensuring that the FBI has the trust and confidence of the people [of] this nation.”
• “There is no evidence of collusion between our campaign and any Russian officials. That's not what — let me be clear with you — that was not what this is about. That's not what this is about.”

Trump himself blew all of that up a day later, telling NBC News's Lester Holt that he had already decided to fire Comey and would have done it regardless of the DOJ's recommendation. Trump also said clearly that the Russia probe was on his mind. “When I decided to [fire Comey], I said to myself, you know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story,” he said.

Pence could argue that Trump technically did accept the recommendations of the Justice Department. But, again, that would be highly misleading, based on Trump's own comments that he had already made up his mind.

About the most charitable reading here is that Pence was delivering the White House's talking points before Trump lighted them on fire. But again, Pence is putting his credibility on the line when he offers X as the explanation rather than Y, and it turns out it was indeed Y. He signed up for this, and it's up to him to demand the truth from his boss before he goes out there to defend him.

Jan. 15: Flynn talking about sanctions with Russia

Going back a little further, the explanation for Flynn's forced resignation in February was that he has lied to Pence about his contacts with Russia — lies that Pence went on TV and promptly emphasized as the truth.

Pence assured CBS's “Face the Nation” that Flynn hadn't discussed U.S. sanctions with Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak — talks that could have run afoul of the law given that Flynn wasn't yet a White House official:

“They did not discuss anything having to do with the United States’ decision to expel diplomats or impose censure against Russia. … What I can confirm, having spoken to him about it, is that those conversations that happened to occur around the time that the United States took action to expel diplomats had nothing whatsoever to do with those sanctions.”

This turned out to be flat-out wrong. Again, it's quite possible that Pence was indeed given bad information by someone else — Flynn, in this case. But he's still going out there and making broad assertions about what went down.

In all three instances, Pence said something to defend the administration that in retrospect looks very suspect. Precisely what's happening here is up for debate, but none of it is good for Pence's political future.

 

[nvmbr02]

I like Joy Reid and wish I could have watched this interview. I hope people keep the pressure on Pence.  I do not buy for one second that his hands are clean on this. 

MSNBC host blasts her own network for not asking Mike Pence a single question about Russia 

Quote

REID: And, Sarah, you do have the sense of sort of presenting Mike — you know, presenting Mike Pence as Mr. Clean, the guy who didn’t know anything, the guy who they had to fire Flynn because he lied to Mike Pence, that Mike Pence was lied to and ill-treated by Flynn. But is that a viable story line going forward? He was on “Meet the press” this morning and he didn’t get asked about Russia. He doesn’t get asked about Russia. He winds up being the clean guy of the administration. But does that idea that he is Mr. Clean, in your view, hold up?

KENDZIOR: No, it doesn’t hold up at all. You can go all the way back to the vice presidential debate, in which he lied multiple things that Trump said and did, things that were provable through video, as if we had no access to this information on our own. I think what’s going on here is Americans aren’t used to a calm liar. We’re used to lies that are screamed by Trump, that are put forth in an obviously propagandistic way. And I think with Pence, the Republican Party put him out as this kind of alternative, but he’s just as complicit, and just as involved. He was part of the transition that put this together. He was warned through a letter. And I think he is just only different in disposition, and not in terms of intention as to what this administration wants to accomplish, which is to, you know, violate constitutional law.

 

[nvmbr02]

And here is why Pence is so dangerous. He is a smooth liar and a slick politician with hateful beliefs. And he is very politically motivated with his eye on the long game.

 

[GreyhoundFan]

55 minutes ago, nvmbr02 said:

And here is why Pence is so dangerous. He is a smooth liar and a slick politician with hateful beliefs. And he is very politically motivated with his eye on the long game.

 

The Repuds as a rule, play the long game.

[GreyhoundFan]

Ooooh, this is good. I hope it nips Pence in the ass: "Cummings: Either Pence is lying or was 'running a sloppy shop'"

Spoiler

Assertions from Vice President Mike Pence that he did not know of former national security adviser Michael Flynn’s work on behalf of foreign governments until he learned of them in media reports have just two explanations, Rep. Elijah Cummings said Friday. “Either he's not telling the truth, or he was running a sloppy shop.”

Cummings, the ranking member on the House Oversight Committee, noted during a Friday interview on CNN’s “New Day” that he had sent a letter to Pence, then chairman of President Donald Trump’s transition team, last November regarding Flynn’s ties to the Turkish government. Cummings received a receipt from the transition team’s office of legislative affairs, confirming they had received the letter and pledging to “review your letter carefully.”

“Either he's not telling the truth, or he was running a sloppy shop because we have a receipt, Chris, that says they received the letter. Now, I know things get mixed up in the mail. I got that,”the Maryland Democrat told CNN’s Chris Cuomo.

“But when you tell somebody — you send the letter, and it says the person that you are allowing to advise a campaign on security matters, that is getting access to briefings,” is also connected to a foreign government, Cummings continued, “and the same guy who eventually, by the way, became security adviser, the No. 1 guy, getting all of our secrets, somebody should be jumping up and down saying, 'Wait a minute, this is 17 or 20 red lights.' Chris, this is not rocket scientist stuff.”

Despite evidence that he, or at least his office, was alerted to Flynn’s work on behalf of the Turkish government, Pence has stood by his statement on March 9 to Fox News that media reports were the first he had heard of the former national security adviser’s foreign ties. The assertion puts the vice president in the awkward position of either being dishonest or having been kept in the dark about Flynn.

Flynn ended up being fired over a different issue, his misrepresentation to Pence and others about his conversations with Russia’s ambassador to the U.S., after serving just 24 days in office as national security adviser. He has since requested, through his lawyers, immunity from prosecution in exchange for any testimony he might offer.

Cummings said that with his November letter, “What we were trying to do was warn Pence,” but that ultimately, it appeared to him that Trump’s team was insistent on bringing Flynn aboard.

“My belief is they really wanted this guy to be a part of their operation, period,” Cummings said. “But we're a better country than that. That's why we have a vetting process. And so, we are going to have to look at vetting no matter what.”

 

[fraurosena]

1 hour ago, GreyhoundFan said:

Ooooh, this is good. I hope it nips Pence in the ass: "Cummings: Either Pence is lying or was 'running a sloppy shop'"

  Hide contents

Assertions from Vice President Mike Pence that he did not know of former national security adviser Michael Flynn’s work on behalf of foreign governments until he learned of them in media reports have just two explanations, Rep. Elijah Cummings said Friday. “Either he's not telling the truth, or he was running a sloppy shop.”

Cummings, the ranking member on the House Oversight Committee, noted during a Friday interview on CNN’s “New Day” that he had sent a letter to Pence, then chairman of President Donald Trump’s transition team, last November regarding Flynn’s ties to the Turkish government. Cummings received a receipt from the transition team’s office of legislative affairs, confirming they had received the letter and pledging to “review your letter carefully.”

“Either he's not telling the truth, or he was running a sloppy shop because we have a receipt, Chris, that says they received the letter. Now, I know things get mixed up in the mail. I got that,”the Maryland Democrat told CNN’s Chris Cuomo.

“But when you tell somebody — you send the letter, and it says the person that you are allowing to advise a campaign on security matters, that is getting access to briefings,” is also connected to a foreign government, Cummings continued, “and the same guy who eventually, by the way, became security adviser, the No. 1 guy, getting all of our secrets, somebody should be jumping up and down saying, 'Wait a minute, this is 17 or 20 red lights.' Chris, this is not rocket scientist stuff.”

Despite evidence that he, or at least his office, was alerted to Flynn’s work on behalf of the Turkish government, Pence has stood by his statement on March 9 to Fox News that media reports were the first he had heard of the former national security adviser’s foreign ties. The assertion puts the vice president in the awkward position of either being dishonest or having been kept in the dark about Flynn.

Flynn ended up being fired over a different issue, his misrepresentation to Pence and others about his conversations with Russia’s ambassador to the U.S., after serving just 24 days in office as national security adviser. He has since requested, through his lawyers, immunity from prosecution in exchange for any testimony he might offer.

Cummings said that with his November letter, “What we were trying to do was warn Pence,” but that ultimately, it appeared to him that Trump’s team was insistent on bringing Flynn aboard.

“My belief is they really wanted this guy to be a part of their operation, period,” Cummings said. “But we're a better country than that. That's why we have a vetting process. And so, we are going to have to look at vetting no matter what.”

 

"Nips him in the ass". How nice you are!

I hope it sinks its needle-sharp, pointy long canines in his butt all the way up to the gums and chomps down hard, giving a good shake of its head for good measure. 

 

[GreyhoundFan]

"Mike Pence's disappearing act"

Spoiler

It's hard for a vice president of the United States to disappear from sight. After all, you are the second most powerful person in the country and all that.

Despite those challenges, Vice President Mike Pence has been nearly invisible for the last 48 hours or so -- even as the Trump Administration has been buffeted by a slew of negative stories that have occasioned a special counsel to be named to oversee the ongoing Russia probe.

Pence was spotted Tuesday by the eagle-eyed Kate Benett at a working lunch meeting with Turkish President Erdogan. (The tweet containing that photo was deleted minutes after it went up and reposted hours later.)

On Wednesday, Pence was nowhere to be seen for most of the day. His staff said that he was working on a series of speeches; Pence is set to deliver the commencement address at Notre Dame on Sunday. Pence's one public event was to honor Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders late in the day.

Pence's schedule today is a bit more robust. He spoke at the US Chamber of Commerce in the noon hour. He was scheduled to give another speech at the Laffer Associates Washington conference this afternoon before attending a bilateral meeting with President Trump and Colombian President Juan Manuel Santos.

Still, Pence has spoken nary a word about the blockbuster news that Trump divulged classified information in an Oval Office meeting with two top Russian officials or the bombshell that Trump reportedly asked then FBI Director James Comey to leave off an investigation into the Russia ties of former national security adviser Michael Flynn. Pence has also said nothing publicly about the fact that Trump directly contradicted his version of events surrounding Comey's firing 9 days ago.

What we did hear from Pence on Thursday was via a statement, reacting to a New York Times report that Flynn had warned transition officials that he was under federal investigation for secretly working as a paid lobbyist for Turkey.

"The vice president stands by his comments in March upon first hearing the news regarding General Flynn's ties to Turkey and fully supports the President's decision to ask for General Flynn's resignation," an unnamed Pence aide told CNN.

The issue with that statement, of course, is that Pence was the head of the transition team. In that capacity, it seems somewhat hard to believe that Flynn's warning to White House counsel Don McGahn that he was under investigation never made it to Pence's ears.

Even as he has remained largely silent regarding Trump's current troubles, Pence began laying the groundwork for his own political future. On Wednesday, Pence filed paperwork with the Federal Election Commission to establish the Great America Committee, a leadership political action committee that will allow him to raise money for his political interests and make donations to downballot candidates. Nick Ayers, who ran former Minnesota Gov. Tim Pawlenty's 2012 presidential campaign, will run Pence's PAC. (An email to Ayers seeking more information on how Pence plans to use the PAC was not returned.)

The last 48 hours, however, have highlighted Pence's political problem: He is serving under a deeply unpredictable president who he will likely be latched to -- in the public's mind -- no matter what happens over these next four or eight years. Pence has, to date, benefited politically from his willingness to embrace the Trump enigma. (He is vice president, after all.) But Trump is a double-edged sword and Pence has been feeling the sharp end of it since Monday.

Nah, Pence isn't the second most powerful person in the country, Kushner is.

[fraurosena]

1 hour ago, GreyhoundFan said:

"Mike Pence's disappearing act"

  Reveal hidden contents

It's hard for a vice president of the United States to disappear from sight. After all, you are the second most powerful person in the country and all that.

Despite those challenges, Vice President Mike Pence has been nearly invisible for the last 48 hours or so -- even as the Trump Administration has been buffeted by a slew of negative stories that have occasioned a special counsel to be named to oversee the ongoing Russia probe.

Pence was spotted Tuesday by the eagle-eyed Kate Benett at a working lunch meeting with Turkish President Erdogan. (The tweet containing that photo was deleted minutes after it went up and reposted hours later.)

On Wednesday, Pence was nowhere to be seen for most of the day. His staff said that he was working on a series of speeches; Pence is set to deliver the commencement address at Notre Dame on Sunday. Pence's one public event was to honor Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders late in the day.

Pence's schedule today is a bit more robust. He spoke at the US Chamber of Commerce in the noon hour. He was scheduled to give another speech at the Laffer Associates Washington conference this afternoon before attending a bilateral meeting with President Trump and Colombian President Juan Manuel Santos.

Still, Pence has spoken nary a word about the blockbuster news that Trump divulged classified information in an Oval Office meeting with two top Russian officials or the bombshell that Trump reportedly asked then FBI Director James Comey to leave off an investigation into the Russia ties of former national security adviser Michael Flynn. Pence has also said nothing publicly about the fact that Trump directly contradicted his version of events surrounding Comey's firing 9 days ago.

What we did hear from Pence on Thursday was via a statement, reacting to a New York Times report that Flynn had warned transition officials that he was under federal investigation for secretly working as a paid lobbyist for Turkey.

"The vice president stands by his comments in March upon first hearing the news regarding General Flynn's ties to Turkey and fully supports the President's decision to ask for General Flynn's resignation," an unnamed Pence aide told CNN.

The issue with that statement, of course, is that Pence was the head of the transition team. In that capacity, it seems somewhat hard to believe that Flynn's warning to White House counsel Don McGahn that he was under investigation never made it to Pence's ears.

Even as he has remained largely silent regarding Trump's current troubles, Pence began laying the groundwork for his own political future. On Wednesday, Pence filed paperwork with the Federal Election Commission to establish the Great America Committee, a leadership political action committee that will allow him to raise money for his political interests and make donations to downballot candidates. Nick Ayers, who ran former Minnesota Gov. Tim Pawlenty's 2012 presidential campaign, will run Pence's PAC. (An email to Ayers seeking more information on how Pence plans to use the PAC was not returned.)

The last 48 hours, however, have highlighted Pence's political problem: He is serving under a deeply unpredictable president who he will likely be latched to -- in the public's mind -- no matter what happens over these next four or eight years. Pence has, to date, benefited politically from his willingness to embrace the Trump enigma. (He is vice president, after all.) But Trump is a double-edged sword and Pence has been feeling the sharp end of it since Monday.

Nah, Pence isn't the second most powerful person in the country, Kushner is.

I hate to disagree with you, but... It's not Kushner either. It's Putin. 

[formergothardite]

I'm going to disagree with both of you.  It isn't Putin, it is Trump. Putin is the one running the show, Trump does what he says. If Putin says jump, Donny jumps. I just don't think Putin realized how incredible dumb Trump was before making him a lap dog. 

[fraurosena]

If anyone had any doubts about Pencey-poo's allegiance:

 

"They're trying to get rid of us. SEND LOTS OF MONEY." 

 

[AmericanRose]

I think a lot of Republicans like to think they're being persecuted and are constantly under attack. Of course, they probably wouldn't like it if they really were, but cognitive dissonance is strong!

[GreyhoundFan]

Good one from the WaPo: "Mike Pence wants us to believe he’s innocent. Don’t buy it."

Spoiler

Mike Pence would like you to know that Mike Pence is not involved in any of this. At least that appears to be the message coming from Pence’s allies, and perhaps the vice president himself, as the Trump White House reels from a series of interlocking scandals that threaten all manner of political peril, even potentially an impeachment or resignation that could make Pence the president of the United States.

All of a sudden we’re seeing a wave of articles in which anonymous sources close to Pence tell reporters that he’s completely out of the loop, to use the phrase that then-Vice President George H.W. Bush uttered so memorably when claiming his innocence in the Iran-Contra scandal. But can we believe it? And even if it’s true, isn’t that nearly as much of an indictment of Pence?

Let’s begin with this report from NBC’s Vaughn Hillyard:

Vice President Mike Pence has been kept in the dark about former National Security Adviser Mike Flynn’s alleged wrongdoing, according to a source close to the administration, who cited a potential “pattern” of not informing the vice president and calling it “malpractice or intentional, and either are unacceptable.”

Nobody tells him anything! How can he possibly have any culpability for administration wrongdoing when he’s barely involved in any of this running-the-government stuff? Sources close to Pence would also like you to know that “Pence was not consulted about the decision to bring on Flynn as the national security adviser in November.” I barely know the guy, I tell ya.

You’ll recall that Flynn was supposedly fired because he told Pence that he didn’t discuss the potential easing of sanctions with Russian ambassador Sergey Kislyak when he and the ambassador talked multiple times during the campaign, a lie that Pence then repeated to the press. This affront to Pence’s honor was so profound that President Trump had no choice but to give Flynn the boot. But that’s not all.

Flynn was paid half a million dollars to lobby on behalf of Turkey while he was advising the Trump campaign, and in January, on the advice of his lawyer, he retroactively registered as the agent of a foreign government. Though Flynn informed the Trump transition’s legal team of this fact, Pence says that no one told him, despite the fact that he was in charge of the transition.

Pence claimed in March to have just found out about Flynn’s work for Turkey. Yet Rep. Elijah Cummings (Md.), the ranking Democrat on the House Oversight Committee, sent Pence a letter on Nov. 18 going into considerable detail about Flynn’s Turkey connection. As of yesterday, Pence was standing by his assertion that he only learned about it in March.

As leader of the transition, it was Pence’s job to make sure that things such as appointing a national security adviser with troubling ties to foreign governments didn’t happen. So his defense in the Flynn matter comes down to: I was doing a terrible job leading the transition and had no idea what was going on.

That then brings us to the matter of FBI Director James B. Comey’s firing. Like other administration officials, immediately after the firing Pence went to reporters and claimed that Trump decided to fire Comey because he was following the recommendation of the Justice Department, offered in the form of a memo written by Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein. Or, as Pence put it:

“The President took strong and decisive leadership here to put the safety and the security of the American people first by accepting the recommendation of the deputy attorney general to remove Director Comey as the head of the FBI.”

We quickly learned, however, that Trump intended to fire Comey all along. Trump said so in an interview with NBC, and Rosenstein confirmed it to senators yesterday when he told them that he was instructed to write the memo after being told that Comey would be fired.

So the initial White House line was a lie, which was only corrected once Trump blurted out the truth. Did Pence know? I refer you to this Politico article from a week ago:

Pence, who hasn’t assumed the traditional role of power player in the White House but is liked by many, signaled support for the decision [to fire Comey], said one adviser to the president.

“Pence knew this wasn’t about Rosenstein writing a memo, the president seeing it and suddenly deciding to fire Comey,” said this person. “He knows better than that.”

Pence allies on Wednesday said the vice president was merely pointing to the factual turn of events: Rosenstein sent a memo on Tuesday recommending Comey’s dismissal, Attorney General Jeff Sessions seconded the opinion and Trump made the move. Pence had not specifically addressed who initiated the whole process, one noted.

In other words, if you parse Pence’s words carefully enough, you can come up with an interpretation in which he was being technically accurate despite giving an intentionally misleading impression. That’s what we call leadership, I guess.

Let’s recall that Pence, with 12 years in Congress and four as governor of Indiana, was supposed to be the steady hand that would guide Trump through the ways of Washington and the complexities of governing. According to at least some reports, the two men are in regular communication (“Lobbyists who set up meetings between Pence and their clients must warn them that the vice president may be an hour and a half late or have to leave after 10 minutes because Trump is constantly calling him into the Oval Office to confer with him.”) But if his job was to keep things working efficiently and effectively, he’s obviously failing.

And now Pence has another priority. Anyone who has gone to work in this administration risks being tainted with its excesses, its incompetence and its corruption. No one is more at risk than Pence, who plainly harbors presidential ambitions of his own — and might even become president without having to run for the job. So the steady narrative coming from Pence associates —  that he has nothing to do with the parade of horrors issuing from the administration — could be an attempt to inoculate him for some later date when he has to stand before the voters on his own. Sure, I was there, he may say, but I really wasn’t involved with that catastrophe.

If Pence thinks that argument is going to fly, he’s got another thing coming.

He needs to go.

[fraurosena]

Hee-hee!

 

[candygirl200413]

So many people on facebook were like "wow these students are so rude!" because allowing someone who loves conversion therapy to speak on your day is something wonderful (among other horrid things). So proud of these students though!

[nvmbr02]

14 minutes ago, candygirl200413 said:

 So proud of these students though!

Yes! It was THEIR graduation. Their day. Not Mike Pence's. They didn't shout out insults or attack the guy, they just chose to leave. 

[47of74]

I seem to remember how much these same reich wingers complained when President Obama spoke at a Notre Dame Graduation several years ago. 

Also I saw where one Tomi Lahren decided to lecture the "snowflakes" and the internet had some thoughts to share about that;

huffingtonpost.com/entry/tomi-lahren-snowflakes-job_us_59223a33e4b03b485cb25fc8?ncid=engmodushpmg00000003 

Quote

Tomi Lahren, who recently lost her job as a commentator on Glenn Beck’s The Blaze network, blasted the “snowflakes” who walked out on Vice President Mike Pence’s commencement speech at the University of Notre Dame on Sunday.

In comments many found lacking in self-awareness given the very public spat she just had with her former employer, Lahren suggested the Notre Dame grads would struggle to hold a job. 

Lahren and The Blaze settled earlier this month and she was released from her contract with the network.

As a result, her comments about “snowflakes” and “holding a job” drew a quick and sharp reaction: