The Boyer Sisters, Part 3

[Nina]

Since my husband has not yet managed to make a valid account (do not ask me what went wrong, I have no Idea) I will try to tell you why he does not have warm feelings for the Boyer Girls and Brigid in particular. My H, his sister plus her Son (5) and I went to US and since my SIL needs a few "interesting" photos for her photography school map we decided to also visit the Reenactment at Linden. My Nephew and my H are both on the Spectrum. Both are uneasy in large crowds and allergic to eye contact. But Nephew is way worse since he is also still learning more basic social cues and opens his mouth too much;) I love them both fiercely. Nephew M. loves the Boyer Sisters CD my Mother bought as a Secret Santa and he was ecstatic to find the Girls were playing this day. The little guy went up to the stage, and climbed on. My Husband ran after him and encountered Brigid rudely yelling at the frightened boy. She stared into his eyes and restricted his movements by blocking potential escape routes. When L. Tried to explain why shouting was not working she called the boy a freak of nature. All three smiling and nodding. My SIL came over and removed her Son while I had to hold my Partner, helping him calm down. There were several other families with children that left after this. One family also had a Spectrum child. They told me that the Boyer have always been a bit strange around special needs people. 

Of course he went onto the stage while they were not yet playing. The stage was basically empty. 

[Palimpsest]

25 minutes ago, Nina said:

Since my husband has not yet managed to make a valid account (do not ask me what went wrong, I have no Idea)

Leo probably needs to email an admin if his new account is from the same location and  IPS.  It has to do with screening for sock puppets and technical issues that I don't understand.  They will then set up an account for him.   BTW, Leo is not supposed to post from your account.  From the TOU:

Quote

* Use of your account is expressly limited to you. Your account may not be transferred or shared with any other party, temporarily or permanently.

That is a very sad story.  The Boyer sisters probably have very little education about or experience with people or children on the autism spectrum - or with people with disabilities in general.  

I hope you and your family wrote letters to the Boyers and Reenactment organizers explaining how upsetting it was and educating them about the issues.

[Destiny]

@Nina what@palimpsest said. Do not let your husband post from your account. It's against the rules. Contact an admin if he is having trouble making an account.

[acheronbeach]

56 minutes ago, Nina said:

Since my husband has not yet managed to make a valid account (do not ask me what went wrong, I have no Idea) I will try to tell you why he does not have warm feelings for the Boyer Girls and Brigid in particular. My H, his sister plus her Son (5) and I went to US and since my SIL needs a few "interesting" photos for her photography school map we decided to also visit the Reenactment at Linden. My Nephew and my H are both on the Spectrum. Both are uneasy in large crowds and allergic to eye contact. But Nephew is way worse since he is also still learning more basic social cues and opens his mouth too much;) I love them both fiercely. Nephew M. loves the Boyer Sisters CD my Mother bought as a Secret Santa and he was ecstatic to find the Girls were playing this day. The little guy went up to the stage, and climbed on. My Husband ran after him and encountered Brigid rudely yelling at the frightened boy. She stared into his eyes and restricted his movements by blocking potential escape routes. When L. Tried to explain why shouting was not working she called the boy a freak of nature. All three smiling and nodding. My SIL came over and removed her Son while I had to hold my Partner, helping him calm down. There were several other families with children that left after this. One family also had a Spectrum child. They told me that the Boyer have always been a bit strange around special needs people. 

Of course he went onto the stage while they were not yet playing. The stage was basically empty. 

This is a really weird reaction. I mean, it's disrespectful to allow your kid to climb on stage,  but the reaction by the Boyer girls is just so... bizarre and OTT.  What was Brigid yelling?

[formergothardite]

1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

I hope you and your family wrote letters to the Boyers and Reenactment organizers explaining how upsetting it was and educating them about the issues.

ITA. The Boyers don't appear to think much deeper than fashion, so I wouldn't expect them to know about children or adults with disabilities. But I do hope you write letters and complain. 

[catlady]

1 hour ago, acheronbeach said:

This is a really weird reaction. I mean, it's disrespectful to allow your kid to climb on stage,  but the reaction by the Boyer girls is just so... bizarre and OTT.  What was Brigid yelling?

i'm with you here, but under the circumstances, i don't think the family was being disrespectful.  it sounded to me like a 5-year-old in a new and highly-stimulating environment acted on impulse, and the family reacted in a timely and appropriate manner.  many children in that age bracket have not seen a stage up close, and it caught the attention of this one (spectrum is really irrelevant here; i'd think most kids would find a stage fascinating).  it doesn't sound like the family let him run around unsupervised up there.  Granted, Brigid did not owe him a guided tour, but she certainly could have found a friendlier way to steer him away from potentially hurting himself (an accident/injury would be my biggest worry here).  As Nina describes it, Brigid was flat-out mean to a little boy.

[JermajestyDuggar]

Yet another reason why you shouldn't keep your children in a bubble of protection their entire lives. They can't handle real life interactions with individuals with disabilities. Or anyone outside their tiny dress up bubble for that matter.  

[Palimpsest]

19 minutes ago, catlady said:

 Granted, Brigid did not owe him a guided tour, but she certainly could have found a friendlier way to steer him away from potentially hurting himself (an accident/injury would be my biggest worry here).  As Nina describes it, Brigid was flat-out mean to a little boy.

Shouting might have been anxiety (about the child injuring himself).  Staring into his eyes and blocking his exits probably ignorance of people on the spectrum but also perhaps fear that he would run into equipment.

Calling him a freak of nature - inexcusable.  Although it is strange to think of an angry shouting Bridget suddenly flipping into a smiling a nodding one, along with her sisters.  I don't quite compute this bit.

3 hours ago, Nina said:

When L. Tried to explain why shouting was not working she called the boy a freak of nature. All three smiling and nodding.

 

[SoybeanQueen]

22 hours ago, BackseatMom said:

To me, that is one of the big advantages of going to school. Let's say my little guy is really in to art, and I am a history buff. I could probably do a really good job finding all kinds of great art and/or history experiences and learning moments. But those subjects we enjoy and are good at would probably always be prioritized at the expense of other subjects. And since I hate math, it would be hard for me to help him learn to love it, or maybe even learn it at all (even though he might have been good with a better teacher). 

It depends on how much effort parents are willing to invest, and whether or not they're willing to look for the best curricula and seek other teachers if necessary. I'm not naturally good at geology, but my son has won purple ribbons at state competitions for his geology collections because we made it a priority to get access to experts. Finding the right mix is a huge responsibility, but it was part of the job of homeschooling, for me.

I think I said it earlier in this thread, but other homeschool families bring their kids to me for writing classes. Modern homeschooling is generally not 100% at home.

I have kids in public school, so I'm not slamming that option, but even public school teachers have areas of weakness or preference. Some go heavy on one subject or topic area. Frankly, given our rural area and small schools, my children had vastly better class options at home. The closest school to me does not have an art class, for example. One class per grade, the only option to choose is whether you take band or do study hall in that time slot. The closest high school offers only one foreign language and limited electives. My oldest daughter considered homeschool for high school but didn't want to give up sports (our state does not allow homeschoolers to participate). Her academic options would have been better at home.

[anachronistic]

This echoes exactly the point I made earlier. Homeschoolers do not get exposure to or experience with people of different abilities. The incident that Nina describes is Brigid showing her true self: intolerant, rude and unable to cope with anything outside her very limited experience.

also, Nina, just FYI, autistics aren't allergic to eye contact. We (I'm autistic) find it very overwhelming like looking straight into someone's soul. And please don't describe anyone's neurology as being better or worse than anyone else's. There is no better there is no worse. We are all equal with unique challenges.

[Vex]

I don't think you can blame Brigid for looking your nephew in the eyes, it's not as if she could look at him and immediately know he's on the spectrum. Someone with experience might be able to work it out easily enough, but to people with no experience with autism they're just going to see a rude and excitable child. It's not as if their parents taught them about people who are different to themselves.

Calling him a freak of nature was absolutely unforgivable. Gabe, I hope you read this and talk to your wife (since this is your god-given role) about how it's important to be patient and kind to those who suffer from different challenges.

I really hope you wrote to them and educated them about autism after that, and that your poor nephew wasn't too scarred from that experience.

[DancingPhalanges]

3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Shouting might have been anxiety (about the child injuring himself).  Staring into his eyes and blocking his exits probably ignorance of people on the spectrum but also perhaps fear that he would run into equipment.

Calling him a freak of nature - inexcusable.  Although it is strange to think of an angry shouting Bridget suddenly flipping into a smiling a nodding one, along with her sisters.  I don't quite compute this bit.

 

I had all of this as a first thought upon reading Nina's post but especially the bolded part (Bolding mine). Logically it doesn't make sense to me. They were performers accustomed to an audience of families that included children in various forms of behavior over the years. I am having trouble with the "freak of nature" comment then queue to all three sisters nodding and smiling.

[MargaretElliott]

I think that exposure = tolerance. If you're wrapped up in a bubble all your life, with no exposure to people of different cultures, religions, abilities, etc, then you're going to think that your way is the only way. I think that story is a bit peculiar (not saying it's not true, though), and definitely doesn't match up with the happy, sweet image the sisters portray on their blog. Of course, anyone can make themselves look better on the internet (my Facebook page is as carefully curated as any), and I bet the sisters haven't had a ton of exposure to those who don't fit into their local community. 

On another note, I'm not on the spectrum and I avoid eye contact like the plague. It's just way too intimate for me, and I'm never quite sure how long to hold it. Personal preferences.

[DaisyD]

Eye contact has always freaked me out and not the least bit autistic. I barely even look my kids or husband in the eye.

[ChunkyBarbie]

Okay @Gabe, where are you? What is Brigid's take?

[acheronbeach]

3 hours ago, DancingPhalanges said:

I had all of this as a first thought upon reading Nina's post but especially the bolded part (Bolding mine). Logically it doesn't make sense to me. They were performers accustomed to an audience of families that included children in various forms of behavior over the years. I am having trouble with the "freak of nature" comment then queue to all three sisters nodding and smiling.

Yeah something's not adding up for me with this post, either.  

Why was the little boy unsupervised long enough that he was able to climb up onto a raised stage, and far enough away that the closest supervising adult had to run to get him?  If all he did was climb onto an empty stage - nothing else disruptive or potentially risky - why would Brigid suddenly start yelling at him?  And why just blurt out that he's a "freak of nature"?  And if she's yelling, how does it suddenly turn into "all three" smiling and nodding?  How does an empty stage allow for Brigid to block all of the exits?  

It just sounds... odd... as if a lot of details are missing.  

 

[nickelodeon]

Did that really happen? Not doubting the nasty behavior, just the notion that people actually buy Boyer CDs.

[Palimpsest]

2 minutes ago, nickelodeon said:

Did that really happen? Not doubting the nasty behavior, just the notion that people actually buy Boyer CDs.

Apparently the Boyer Sister are much better known outside the US.  Who knew?

[ladyamylynn]

Either something has really been lost in translation or this totally didn't happen. I'm going with the latter, none of it sounds like how real people act. 

[ChunkyBarbie]

It is a crazy take for sure. 

[nausicaa]

36 minutes ago, ladyamylynn said:

Either something has really been lost in translation or this totally didn't happen. I'm going with the latter, none of it sounds like how real people act. 

Glad I'm not the only one who thinks that story doesn't pass the sniff test. 

[Nina]

Leo does not write with my account. WE merely talked about what happened. 

Let me clarify a few things:

1. All three smiling and nodding. No, of course they were not positive, they were mockingly laughing at my nephew and my Husband. L. was just not able to differ between laughing about and laughing with when he told me. I even doubt they were laughing at all. The nodding part is most likely one agreeing with the other. I Should have used other words for this one. 

2. A 5 year old is absolutely able to hop on a stage wich is about as high as my knees, in seconds. My SIL and L. were talking and he hopped onto the stage. He told me he was just sitting there. Even today he sticks by this. So I think SIL let him be until it went downhill. 

3. The CD was a secret Santa Dumpster Style present. I do not know where she got it from but Mama has always been able to collect the strangest things. Most likely scenario: She found their blog by searching for sewing tips and thought she could annoy SIL by gifting it to nephew.  

[catlady]

thanks for the additional info, @Nina.  since you said earlier that you were visiting the US (and i don't know where you live), i wondered if something might have been lost in translation, or your writing style just lends itself to brevity.

and as @ChunkyBarbie indicated, it would be interesting if @Gabe could tell us Brigid's perspective.  

[Nina]

I am wondering if the Boyer Sisters will update their blog next year. They are currently saying they are pausing and write that it probably will be a few weeks!

[formergothardite]

@Nina did you ever contact the Boyers or the event organizers to let them know what happened? I think it is important when these sorts of things happen to let especially event organizers know so that they can decide if they want to invite a group back and/or make sure participants in the event are trained in dealing with people who have special needs.