M Is For Mama - making quiverfull look modern

[PennySycamore]

@Loveday,  you and I must be about the same age!  That's the kid of talk we'd have at our sleepovers.  

We didn't call them sleepovers then, but slumber parties.  Before slumber parties, they were called pajama parties.  Pajama party was probably the most accurate name for them as we did precious little actual sleeping, but always put on our pjs or nightgowns.

[calimojo]

we did tell ghost stories at slumber parties and played with a Ouija board sometimes.  I suppose that is the type of bad influence she is talking about, Oh and we talked about boys,  a lot,  A LOT.  Whoever fell asleep first was likely going to have some sort of joke pulled on them.  Bra in the Freezer, Hand in warm water to make them pee, or something else equally silly. 

[hoipolloi]

A lot of fundies are terrified of letting their kids do sleepovers, as Rebekah Pearl Anast says here:

Quote

Another precaution my parents took was to limit—almost to nothing—our staying overnight with cousins or best friends. Now, as a mother myself, I plan to eliminate that possibility altogether for my children. Even the most conservative friends and cousins of mine had told me things I shouldn’t have heard as a kid. Now that I’m grown, I’m amazed to look back and find out that most of the few girls who spent the night with me once in a blue moon, had been molested, even during the very years I knew them. Once they grew up, they told on the criminals who molested them. Back then, they were silent through fear and were ignorant of the evil things that were happening to them.

These comments probably say a LOT more about the prevalence of sexual abuse & the impunity with which abusers prey on victims in the fundie world than they do about letting kids go on sleepovers.

[imokit]

@Four is Enough does the ma'am/sir actually make it more polite? - I don't get the difference between no mom and no ma'am - they're both Nos.  Forcing an arbitrary ma'am instead of the natural mom just seems like an extra rule for a veneer of politeness which isn't actually adding to the conversation.

No vs No thank you.  There's a difference.  The thank you shows consideration.  Mom is a polite title, which can show respect, love, authority and a bazillion other things.  Ma'am is a generic polite title to people in authority. Anyone can be a ma'am, only one person (two depending on the family) can be mom, it shows exactly who's being addressed, and is the one which will come more naturally.

[smittykins]

Speaking as someone who never did or had it done to me, did the hand-in-warm-water thing actually work?

[Shiny]

We don't do sleepovers, at all. My husband was in law enforcement for a number of years, and many of our social circle still is. Molestation and grooming happens at sleepovers way more than people think. I know not everyone has those concerns, but I can't let my kids do sleepovers knowing what I know. 

 

[desertvixen]

I prefer to have the sleepovers at my house, and my daughter currently has one friend with whom she is allowed to have sleepover with.  I have to know the parents very well before they happen.

[FundieFarmer]

No ma'am and no sir are normal here too. It wasn't the only thing I could respond to my parents- no mom/dad and plain no were fine too because my parents were chill- but in formal situations I'd never dream of saying anything but yes/no ma'am/sir to an elder.

[EmiGirl]

1 hour ago, FundieFarmer said:

No ma'am and no sir are normal here too. It wasn't the only thing I could respond to my parents- no mom/dad and plain no were fine too because my parents were chill- but in formal situations I'd never dream of saying anything but yes/no ma'am/sir to an elder.

I'm in my 30s and I address everyone I come into contact with as ma'am or sir for the most part. It's just a respect thing for me.

[alba]

13 hours ago, imokit said:

@Four is Enough does the ma'am/sir actually make it more polite? - I don't get the difference between no mom and no ma'am - they're both Nos.  Forcing an arbitrary ma'am instead of the natural mom just seems like an extra rule for a veneer of politeness which isn't actually adding to the conversation.

No vs No thank you.  There's a difference.  The thank you shows consideration.  Mom is a polite title, which can show respect, love, authority and a bazillion other things.  Ma'am is a generic polite title to people in authority. Anyone can be a ma'am, only one person (two depending on the family) can be mom, it shows exactly who's being addressed, and is the one which will come more naturally.

To me ma'am/sir are far too impersonal for parents. They're more equivalent to Mr/Mrs Surname; some of my more old-fashioned teachers would only accept yes/no answers if followed by either Mr Surname or Sir.

That being said, what bothered me far more about the ma'am/sir rule was that the children must respond *cheerfully*. I'm sure every parent has been bothered by their child's arbitrary or petty sullenness at one point or other, especially when they're busy trying to make dinner and their kid's refusing to empty the dishwasher or some such thing, but expecting them to always respond cheerfully represents an utter lack of respect for the child's emotions. To the parent it might be picking the first visible child to do the dishwasher, but to the child it might be the parent *always* selecting them to do the chores, and if the child is forced to be cheerful the parent won't ever even realise their kid's upset and so be able to talk with them and understand their concerns.

[TShirtsLongSkirts]

I was glancing through her Q+A post and found she talks about "sleep-training from an early age". Do we know if she advocates Ezzo / Pearl?

Quote

Before that, she was the easiest kid in the world to get to bed, and the boys were good too. Part of that is due to sleep-training from an early age. Part of that is due to natural temperament. Part of that is due to the fact that we’re pretty consistent with our bedtime rituals, so they knew what to expect.

 

Quote

I give you that long, convoluted history to encourage you that, if you’re still in the stage of only small ones going to bed, you may have some training to do yet, and that’s okay. Just hang in there!

 

Just idle speculating, here. I don't believe most people when they talk about "training" their kids to go to bed mean any harm, they just mean getting into a routine until the kid gets used to it. When I hear it from a fundie though, I get worried.

[alba]

Well, I fell down the rabbit hole a little bit this morning, and came across her Master Closet reveal (not gonna lie, I kind of love these house decorating posts, even though I'm currently sitting in a half-painted room filled with half-packed cardboard boxes and a laundry basket full of clothes that need to be taken to charity):

misformama.net/2011/07/master-closet-before-after.html

Too much stuff in too little space? That closet is almost as big as our master bedroom. I mean, I get it. I'd love a gorgeous walk-in closet. But, as someone upthread mentioned, she seems so utterly oblivious to her privilege because, frankly, most people would love to simply HAVE a closet with that much storage space, never mind what's being stored there.

[TShirtsLongSkirts]

29 minutes ago, alba said:

Well, I fell down the rabbit hole a little bit this morning, and came across her Master Closet reveal (not gonna lie, I kind of love these house decorating posts, even though I'm currently sitting in a half-painted room filled with half-packed cardboard boxes and a laundry basket full of clothes that need to be taken to charity):

misformama.net/2011/07/master-closet-before-after.html

Too much stuff in too little space? That closet is almost as big as our master bedroom. I mean, I get it. I'd love a gorgeous walk-in closet. But, as someone upthread mentioned, she seems so utterly oblivious to her privilege because, frankly, most people would love to simply HAVE a closet with that much storage space, never mind what's being stored there.

 

Oh man. I've always wanted a walk-in closet but it's not gonna happen any time soon. (Or ever, I live in the UK where houses are pretty teeny compared to say, the US.) I have serious, serious closet envy from those "after" pictures. I bet she would bust a gut at my closet which is essentially a metre squared.

I think Abbie is everything Erika Shupe would like to be!

[JillyO]

LOL at this comment under the master closet reveal post:

Quote

thought your ideas were really interesting – but got turned off with your jesus fetish

[Loveday]

This was done in 2012. I'd love to see a more recent picture of that closet. No closet stays that perfect for long.

And I have a hard time getting past all the cutesy commentary to the actual point of the post. Way too much editorializing, even for a navel-gazing fundie mom-blogger. 

[alba]

33 minutes ago, Loveday said:

This was done in 2012. I'd love to see a more recent picture of that closet. No closet stays that perfect for long.

And I have a hard time getting past all the cutesy commentary to the actual point of the post. Way too much editorializing, even for a navel-gazing fundie mom-blogger. 

Tbh, I only really looked at the pictures and skimmed the text. That's what I do with 95% of home decor bloggers (love the pictures, cba with the commentary).

[Loveday]

Just now, alba said:

Tbh, I only really looked at the pictures and skimmed the text. That's what I do with 95% of home decor bloggers (love the pictures, cba with the commentary).

I do, too, but in this case there's just so darned much of it it's like wading through thick sludge to scroll past it all. 

[lawfulevil]

That closet looks like it was designed while blackout drunk on Pinterest. I really don't understand. This look isn't functional or realistic, and it has all the soul and personality of tract house model home interior design.

It does crack me up that her "organization" keyword has 2 posts: this closet one from 2011, and one from February of this year about getting rid of 50 garbage bags of "clutter" in 3 weeks. In the closet one she talks about all the crud she got to decorate the closet from the dollar store and Goodwill. And in the garbage bag post... "I have 3 different storage areas full of decor that I haven’t used in at least a year."

Call me crazy but maybe your house wouldn't be so cluttered if you'd STOP BUYING SO MUCH USELESS SHIT.

[sophie10130]

Ugh. This lady.

I always read her blog as "misinformed mama"

[Anonymousguest]

1 hour ago, sophie10130 said:

Ugh. This lady.

I always read her blog as "misinformed mama"

Me too. 

[Rhetorica]

On 9/5/2016 at 8:32 AM, TShirtsLongSkirts said:

I was glancing through her Q+A post and found she talks about "sleep-training from an early age". Do we know if she advocates Ezzo / Pearl?

Just idle speculating, here. I don't believe most people when they talk about "training" their kids to go to bed mean any harm, they just mean getting into a routine until the kid gets used to it. When I hear it from a fundie though, I get worried.

I don't know exactly, but my gut sense is that she is too savvy to reference the Ezzos, Pearls, et al. She's trying too hard to fly under the radar. But I wouldn't be a bit surprised if she uses their methods. 

[bbfreethinker]

6 hours ago, Rhetorica said:

I don't know exactly, but my gut sense is that she is too savvy to reference the Ezzos, Pearls, et al. She's trying too hard to fly under the radar. But I wouldn't be a bit surprised if she uses their methods. 

Here is her post on how she sleep trains. It doesn't  sound quite as strict as Ezzo, but also doesn't seem to take into account a wee baby's tiny stomach. (Disclosure: I'm not a parent, so only basing this on what I've read)

http://misformama.net/2015/02/a-six-time-mamas-best-tips-for-sleep-training-babies.html

[treehugger]

Actually, none of the things that she mentions in her sleep training post are red flags to me (and I am a very attachment parenting style mother), except one.  Pillows in a baby's bed are a very big no-no.  So her last point is not medically sound advice, and should not be done.  

[bal maiden]

There I was, just going on living my life, not realizing closets had to be 'styled'. 

[jozina]

I personally go for a distressed, shabby chic style for my closet. The untrained eye could mistake it for "Unironed clothes hung haphazardly on clothes hangers that I no longer even remember acquiring with various clothing, toy and memorabilia lying on the floor".