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SpoonfulOSugar

Some of Winston Blackmore's family presented at a symposium in Salt Lake City.  

Since the FLDS and their break-offs are some of my pet fundie topics, I found the article interesting - but the comments are often even more so.

http://www.sltrib.com/home/4165574-155/polygamists-describe-how-to-live-in

Blackmore's more sophisticated than the FLDS, but I'm not convinced the lifestyle is any healthier.

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withaj

I was coming here to post this! Been meaning to start a Blackmore thread. Glad this popped up in the news.

I do hope Sunstone makes the video from that session available. Would be interesting. Sara Burlingame moderated and there are more pictures on her Facebook.

Sophisticated isn't the term I'd use to differentiate Winston's group from Warren's, as I think the FLDS is much more sophisticated from an organizational point of view -- of course, that's partially a function of its size. But Winston's group is certainly more in step with the modern world, so I suppose in that sense it's accurate.

I have been researching and following the Blackmores for quite a while now, and I believe that they, on the whole, lead vastly "better" lives than the members of the FLDS. I don't think that necessarily means the family structure is any healthier, but I think given the choice, there's no question I'd rather be in Bountiful than Colorado City. 

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NeverQuivered

These ladies seem to be less robotic than the FLDS but I know better than to believe this is a healthy way of life. Any man with the ego to take on 37 wives is probably a narcissist to some degree. This will be interesting to keep an eye on. Good find @spoonfulofsugar

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NeverQuivered
On July 29, 2016 at 1:08 PM, SpoonfulOSugar said:

Some of Winston Blackmore's family presented at a symposium in Salt Lake City.  

Since the FLDS and their break-offs are some of my pet fundie topics, I found the article interesting - but the comments are often even more so.

http://www.sltrib.com/home/4165574-155/polygamists-describe-how-to-live-in

Blackmore's more sophisticated than the FLDS, but I'm not convinced the lifestyle is any healthier.

I went back and read through the comments. Lol. Definitely a polygamy apologist trolling the comment threads. Couldn't let anything go by without a not so clever retort. 

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devoe364

Winston is a narcissist. I will not deny that. I also think when he was Jeffs bishop, he did some eww things, and some very illegal things. That said, I have no problem with his lifestyle as long as all participants are fully informed, consenting adults.

Winston is also rich as hell. He can afford to support his wives and children, and as pointed out, many of his wives work, so they aren't abusing welfare to the same extent as the FLDS in the US.

The fact is, the charges against Winston will never stand up to a Charter Challenge with the Supreme Court... It's why he's never gone to trial in the past. All Winston has to do is prove that polygamy is a sincerely held religious belief and it's protected under the Canadian Charter of Rights & Freedoms.

I highly doubt this will go to trial. Even if it does, any guilty verdict will be eventually overturned by the Supreme Court, which would pave the road to legalizing polygamy in Canada (it was this kind of challenge that led to Canada legalizing gay marriage). Basically, the government in BC is wasting their time.

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devoe364

And Winston apparently thinks that legalized polygamy would exploit women...

http://www.calgaryherald.com/opinion/columnists/daphne+bramham+winston+blackmore+opposes+polygamy/12114859/story.html

This from a man who admits that many of his wives were under 19 and some were as young as 15 and 16 when he married them. *sigh* Hypocrisy, they name is Blackmore. 

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withaj
On August 10, 2016 at 3:42 PM, devoe364 said:

And Winston apparently thinks that legalized polygamy would exploit women...

http://www.calgaryherald.com/opinion/columnists/daphne+bramham+winston+blackmore+opposes+polygamy/12114859/story.html

This from a man who admits that many of his wives were under 19 and some were as young as 15 and 16 when he married them. *sigh* Hypocrisy, they name is Blackmore. 

Ugh. I saw this linked from Sound Choices (I think) last night. I really, really want to see recordings of those Sunstone sessions. They made last year's audio available to purchase. 

It's lot easier to feel better about Winston than the other FLDS goons until he starts talking.

 

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devoe364
On 8/14/2016 at 5:41 AM, withaj said:

Ugh. I saw this linked from Sound Choices (I think) last night. I really, really want to see recordings of those Sunstone sessions. They made last year's audio available to purchase. 

It's lot easier to feel better about Winston than the other FLDS goons until he starts talking.

 

Very, very true. I mean, many of his wives do work. He does help his children get an education if they want one. He doesn't seem to judge the ones who don't choose polygamy. Then he talks... ERG. 

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Bethella

Did anyone else see this article about the RCMP investigating polygamy in Bountiful, British Columbia? They're investigating the cases of three young Canadian girls who were taken across the US-Canadian border to marry Warren Jeffs. One girl's parents have been charged with one count each of removing a child from Canada for the purposes of sex. Their trial is scheduled to begin November 14. I think it's interesting to see how the authorities outside of Utah/Arizona are handling things- they've gone after Winston Blackmore for under-reported income, kind of like when they went after Al Capone for income tax evasion.

http://www.vice.com/read/the-search-for-the-missing-child-brides-of-mormon-polygamist-leader-warren-jeffs

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quiversR4hunting

I read most of the article. I wonder if the cult will make these parents martyrs for the religion because evil outsiders are charging them, etc. Don't get me wrong, I think Canada did the right thing, I am just wondering what the brainwashed followers will think of all of it.

Are the people in Bountiful as cut off from the world as Short Creek?

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Bethella

I don't know about Bountiful's connections to the outside world. The father probably won't be held up as a martyr becuase he has already been excommunicated and it sounds like he lost all five of his wives (they mention him living alone). The article doesn't really mention the mother's current situation but if she hasn't been excommunicated she might be a candidate for martyrdom. Winston Blackmore (who was charged at the same time) has been playing up the persecution factor with his charges.

Quote

In the end, Brandon's father was excommunicated anyway, after FLDS leaders got wind of the RCMP investigation into Millie's marriage. The younger Brandon Blackmore assumes that the church was trying to avoid paying his father's legal fees.

 

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BobTheWalrus
On 01/09/2016 at 3:03 AM, quiversR4hunting said:

I read most of the article. I wonder if the cult will make these parents martyrs for the religion because evil outsiders are charging them, etc. Don't get me wrong, I think Canada did the right thing, I am just wondering what the brainwashed followers will think of all of it.

Are the people in Bountiful as cut off from the world as Short Creek?

I think they are.  I saw a documentary on them and it seemed to be a similar set-up, although I don't know if they control the town in the same way Colorado City/Hildale are controlled (cops and local government all FLDS). Carolyn Jessop's maiden name was Blackmore so I think there are strong family connections that way too.

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Unimpressed
seattlechic

Damn, this is a GREAT read. I'm familiar with the Bountiful groups from several ex-FLDS  memoires (can't remember which ones right now) and from a documentary I watched on Youtube. I didn't know the indictments were active again. 

 

I think the Bountiful people are a little less cray-cray than the FLDS in the Creek. But then again, they are still polygamists. 

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Howl
On 7/29/2016 at 9:58 PM, withaj said:

Sophisticated isn't the term I'd use to differentiate Winston's group from Warren's, as I think the FLDS is much more sophisticated from an organizational point of view -- of course, that's partially a function of its size. But Winston's group is certainly more in step with the modern world, so I suppose in that sense it's accurate.

Yes, FLDS is a sophisticated and well run crime syndicate, although it's being dismantled one bit at a time.  Dismantling the United Effort Plan and now the food stamp fraud trial are big dents.   The SNAP debit card fraud brought in about 12 million dollars and 9 people will be going on trial for that fraud beginning in January 2017.  Lyle Jeffs is still at large; I'm assuming he'll be tried in absentia but don't really know how that works. 

Not familiar with Canadian laws, but if there is legal malfeasance, somehow, someway someone will screw up and the government will get to the meat of it if they just keep chipping away.

 

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quiversR4hunting
8 hours ago, Carm_88 said:

I hope they end up in jail just like Jeffs. 

Me too!

Thanks for the article @Bethella and also keeping tabs on what is going on up there. 

 

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FundieFarmer

I'm glad to see they're catching heat. The first thing I thought of was Carolyn Jessop's family there. I'm interested in the outcome of the trial, for sure.

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Giddy
Carm_88

I'm surprised this isn't making more waves in the national news. I wouldn't expect everything to come East but this seems like it should be a big deal. 

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Terahlyanwe

Reading the article by the Salt Lake Tribune, I've come to the conclusion that most of his wives really are happy. They seem to really love living in a huge community that's intensely close knit and loving. I'm totally pro polyamory as long as it's consenusal and overage, and while Blackmore rubs me the wrong way (ditto Kody and his weird reality TV family), I can see the appeal of having shared childraising, emotional support,  etc.

To sum, FLDS polygamy/Blackmore family squicks me out, happy in general polyamory seems great. 

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Howl
On 9/9/2016 at 2:49 PM, seattlechic said:

I think the Bountiful people are a little less cray-cray than the FLDS in the Creek. But then again, they are still polygamists.....

.....and still giving under-age daughters to older men for sex, which is the horrible aspect of it and what got Yearning for Zion and Warren Jeffs shut down.  It's not the polygamy itself that is bothersome, it's the very young and under-aged "brides" that are victims, and offered no life choices.  

These people are being appropriately charged with sex trafficking under-aged girls.  I hope it sends a strong message to various FLDS. Sadly, it seems the maximum sentence for sex trafficking in this instance is only 5 years.  

Edited by Howl

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quiversR4hunting

I saw this article earlier this morning about the SD camp. I thought I got the link from someone here but can't find it.

Here is the article: http://www.sltrib.com/news/4617334-155/despite-scrutiny-on-a-polygamous-sect

What I find very interesting in the article what the neighbor said about the encampment. The neighbor went over to ask them to turn off the lights shining in his house. rom the article:

Quote

"I asked who is in charge," Von Romp said. "They said nobody."

So according to the 2 people answered the door/gate nobody is in charge. How horrible is the brainwashing for the people to stay in an invisible prison.

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Bethella
On 8/30/2016 at 10:42 PM, Bethella said:

Did anyone else see this article about the RCMP investigating polygamy in Bountiful, British Columbia? They're investigating the cases of three young Canadian girls who were taken across the US-Canadian border to marry Warren Jeffs. One girl's parents have been charged with one count each of removing a child from Canada for the purposes of sex. Their trial is scheduled to begin November 14. I think it's interesting to see how the authorities outside of Utah/Arizona are handling things- they've gone after Winston Blackmore for under-reported income, kind of like when they went after Al Capone for income tax evasion.

http://www.vice.com/read/the-search-for-the-missing-child-brides-of-mormon-polygamist-leader-warren-jeffs

Both parents have been convicted!! Sentencing is April 13, they face up to 5 years. Unfortunately the third person was found not guilty. I think this is how the government is going to have to deal with polygamy. Criminalizing polygamy itself isn't working but by going after the people who use polygamy to abuse other members of the community maybe they can finally clean stuff up.

 http://www.sltrib.com/news/4899621-155/2-of-3-polygamists-convicted-in

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quiversR4hunting

Has anyone seen the latest article?

http://www.sltrib.com/news/5226387-155/wife-of-accused-canadian-polygamist-testifies

Jane Blackmore, left Winston in 2003, testified at the trial in British Columbia.  The trial of Winston Blackmore and James Oler, are charged with one count of polygamy. (James Oler is Jane's brother, according to the article.)

 

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Giddy
Carm_88
15 minutes ago, quiversR4hunting said:

Has anyone seen the latest article?

http://www.sltrib.com/news/5226387-155/wife-of-accused-canadian-polygamist-testifies

Jane Blackmore, left Winston in 2003, testified at the trial in British Columbia.  The trial of Winston Blackmore and James Oler, are charged with one count of polygamy. (James Oler is Jane's brother, according to the article.)

 

I didn't know that Jane had left Winston. Good for her! I hope that they manage to throw the whole set of them in jail. Weasely bastards. They should get the book thrown at them, but there hasn't been a lot of national coverage, at least not where I am. I want this to be a big deal so people realize that it's going on. They've had too long to hide in the shadows and do what they do. 

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