Nathan 3: "She loves me, she loves me not, she loves . . . "

[SpoonfulOSugar]

Nathan is courting Ashley.

Or maybe he isn't.

But he might be.

Who knows for sure?

See the previous thread here:

 

[LittleSpouseOnThePrairie]

I thought it was interesting in that bedroom scene when Nathan said to his parents that they were still going to be friends and try to talk to each other as often as they can. If I was in break up that was really finished, I probably wouldn't want to talk that often. Made me wonder...

[Mela99]

3 hours ago, LittleSpouseOnThePrairie said:

I thought it was interesting in that bedroom scene when Nathan said to his parents that they were still going to be friends and try to talk to each other as often as they can. If I was in break up that was really finished, I probably wouldn't want to talk that often. Made me wonder...

Maybe it's a form of therapy in the hopes that one of them will change their minds and their convictions. Just given her blog posts and Nathan's obvious desire to stay in rural Tennessee, I think it might be a power issue. He wants her to want what he wants. Maybe her parents will knock some sense in to her or being without Nathan will make her grit her teeth and give in... All speculation of course. 

[Glasgowghirl]

They are both young and maybe they will work it out and be together. I hope none of them feel forced into marriage from their parents. 

[Purrl]

They seemed to have a lot of chemistry so it can't be easy for her if the move is the reason for the breakup. I just hope, too, that she can be honest with herself, her family & Nathan about what she needs and wants for her future.

[sunshine]

4 hours ago, Mela99 said:

Maybe it's a form of therapy in the hopes that one of them will change their minds and their convictions. Just given her blog posts and Nathan's obvious desire to stay in rural Tennessee, I think it might be a power issue. He wants her to want what he wants. Maybe her parents will knock some sense in to her or being without Nathan will make her grit her teeth and give in... All speculation of course. 

Blog? Do you have a link?

[OrchidBlossom]

7 hours ago, Mela99 said:

Maybe it's a form of therapy in the hopes that one of them will change their minds and their convictions. Just given her blog posts and Nathan's obvious desire to stay in rural Tennessee, I think it might be a power issue. He wants her to want what he wants. Maybe her parents will knock some sense in to her or being without Nathan will make her grit her teeth and give in... All speculation of course. 

Do you mean her old blog? Or does she have a new one. If it's new I'd love a link too.

Either way, I doubt her parents will be knocking any sense into her. They're deep ATI/IBLP aren't they? If anything they might be hoping she will be "convicted" to marry some ATI royalty.

[Mela99]

I don't have a link, I've just read the excerpts here. Her old blog

[BeccaGrim]

9 hours ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Do you mean her old blog? Or does she have a new one. If it's new I'd love a link too.

Either way, I doubt her parents will be knocking any sense into her. They're deep ATI/IBLP aren't they? If anything they might be hoping she will be "convicted" to marry some ATI royalty.

I thought the Bates were at this point royalty?  With the girls marrying the way that they did? 

[EmainMacha]

The title of this thread makes me nostalgic. My dad used to always say this rhyme (jokingly!) 'She loves me, she loves me not. It doesn't matter. I'm what she's got'. It's how I often view fundie marriages.

 

(My dad, on the other hand, was aware he was damn lucky to have my mum in his life.)

 

[OrchidBlossom]

5 hours ago, BeccaGrim said:

I thought the Bates were at this point royalty?  With the girls marrying the way that they did? 

Yeah that's what I mean, her parents maybe aren't likely to knock any sense into her if "sense" is not marrying a Bates.

5 hours ago, Mela99 said:

I don't have a link, I've just read the excerpts here. Her old blog

Oh, okay. Her old blog is sad. I wish I could remember the url. She clearly loved the city but I wonder if that could ever win out over her brainwashing to be a submissive helpmeet and go wherever she is told.

[BirthingGodsWarriors]

39 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Yeah that's what I mean, her parents maybe aren't likely to knock any sense into her if "sense" is not marrying a Bates.

Oh, okay. Her old blog is sad. I wish I could remember the url. She clearly loved the city but I wonder if that could ever win out over her brainwashing to be a submissive helpmeet and go wherever she is told.

This one?

feminineatheart.blogspot.com/

[OrchidBlossom]

1 minute ago, BirthingGodsWarriors said:

This one?

feminineatheart.blogspot.com/

Yes indeed! Poor girl.

[LawsonBatesEgo]

That blog makes me want to rescue her, one Latina lady to another. She seems kinda smart, cool and sassy underneath this awful indoctrination. 

--A Colombiana(-German) who hates cooking and has a boyfriend who doesn't care. 

[princessmahina]

A failed courtship might be good for Nathan. It certainly seems like it was for Zach, even if Kelly didn't approve. He and Whitney seem much happier than he did with Sarah. That was just an awkward mess. 

[Bye Bye Birdie]

I had a mad crush on Zach growing up (ie. *out loud* ''I am praying for my future husband'' *meaning* "and I sure hope it's Zach Bates')  He was always a really nice, good christian boy, who loved his family (everything I wanted back then, when I had no brain of my own).. I don't think he changed that much going from Sarah to Whitney, he just grew up and matured more- think about your first boyfriend and how awkward things might have been if it was touted on your family's blog and it was proclaimed all throughout your community.

This was the case with Zach and Sarah- everybody was just so excited (except for Sarah) it was like a royal wedding was approaching or something! And I think Zach really really liked her, but was disappointed when she wasn't all that into him and the courtship didn't turn out as he was promised his whole life. So he just gone and got a new girl who would be a submissive little baby machine while lookin pretty in her skirts. Or one that had potential to be manipulated into it all. 

[OrchidBlossom]

9 hours ago, Bye Bye Birdie said:

I had a mad crush on Zach growing up (ie. *out loud* ''I am praying for my future husband'' *meaning* "and I sure hope it's Zach Bates')  He was always a really nice, good christian boy, who loved his family (everything I wanted back then, when I had no brain of my own).. I don't think he changed that much going from Sarah to Whitney, he just grew up and matured more- think about your first boyfriend and how awkward things might have been if it was touted on your family's blog and it was proclaimed all throughout your community.

This was the case with Zach and Sarah- everybody was just so excited (except for Sarah) it was like a royal wedding was approaching or something! And I think Zach really really liked her, but was disappointed when she wasn't all that into him and the courtship didn't turn out as he was promised his whole life. So he just gone and got a new girl who would be a submissive little baby machine while lookin pretty in her skirts. Or one that had potential to be manipulated into it all. 

Did you know him personally, or were you just aware of him? I have a friend who grew up very southern Baptist, but had extended family members who somehow ended up more IFB (I think very loosely) associated with ATI/IBLP and apparently her cousin also had a crush on Zach growing up, or so my friend told me once (when the subject of my fundie fascination came up). But her cousin was *much* younger than him so I think it was a bit of a pipe dream.

[Bye Bye Birdie]

8 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Did you know him personally, or were you just aware of him? I have a friend who grew up very southern Baptist, but had extended family members who somehow ended up more IFB (I think very loosely) associated with ATI/IBLP and apparently her cousin also had a crush on Zach growing up, or so my friend told me once (when the subject of my fundie fascination came up). But her cousin was *much* younger than him so I think it was a bit of a pipe dream.

I knew him personally. He's only a bit older than me, but he was just the fundie dream you know  Plus, my family were basically their leghumping patient zero, so not only would we hang out with them as much as we could, but I honestly think it was my mom's wet dream that I end up with one of the Bates boys- so out of the three, Nathan was younger, Lawson was unbearable and Zach was perfect!  Just like Goldilocks! 

[OrchidBlossom]

Just now, Bye Bye Birdie said:

I knew him personally. He's only a bit older than me, but he was just the fundie dream you know  Plus, my family were basically their leghumping patient zero, so not only would we hang out with them as much as we could, but I honestly think it was my mom's wet dream that I end up with one of the Bates boys- so out of the three, Nathan was younger, Lawson was unbearable and Zach was perfect!  Just like Goldilocks! 

Lol well... sorry that didn't work out for ya! Lawson's sort of cute when he keeps his mouth shut (so he's pretty much never cute) but Zach never did anything for me. Then again, I was not trained up in IBLP so what do I know?

It was definitely interesting, I grew up in the northeast and then moved down to the south. As a kid I knew some people I would describe as fundie, but they were VERY rare (or possibly just quieter about it). When I got down south I felt like I couldn't turn around without meeting someone who was fundie, grew up fundie, or had family members that were fundie. That is definitely where my interest started, because all of a sudden I had friends who were shocked and offended when I started dancing randomly.

[backyard sylph]

17 minutes ago, Bye Bye Birdie said:

...leghumping patient zero...

Sorry, though.

[Bye Bye Birdie]

14 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Lol well... sorry that didn't work out for ya! Lawson's sort of cute when he keeps his mouth shut (so he's pretty much never cute) but Zach never did anything for me. Then again, I was not trained up in IBLP so what do I know?

It was definitely interesting, I grew up in the northeast and then moved down to the south. As a kid I knew some people I would describe as fundie, but they were VERY rare (or possibly just quieter about it). When I got down south I felt like I couldn't turn around without meeting someone who was fundie, grew up fundie, or had family members that were fundie. That is definitely where my interest started, because all of a sudden I had friends who were shocked and offended when I started dancing randomly.

Haha! I count my lucky stars he never showed any interest in me! 

 

[SpoonfulOSugar]

4 hours ago, Bye Bye Birdie said:

Haha! I count my lucky stars he never showed any interest in me! 

 

Okay, so, dish:

Did you guys worship with the Bateseseseses?

What would you say is your belief system now?

You lived near them - do you still?  Would you say you are an escapee?  How did it happen that you've gone from "their" world to being here on FJ?  What's your life like now?

(And anything else you'd feel comfortable sharing . . . )

[Bye Bye Birdie]

6 hours ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

Okay, so, dish:

Did you guys worship with the Bateseseseses?

What would you say is your belief system now?

You lived near them - do you still?  Would you say you are an escapee?  How did it happen that you've gone from "their" world to being here on FJ?  What's your life like now?

(And anything else you'd feel comfortable sharing . . . )

My family was a 'normal christian' kinda family. When I was around 9ish my parents met the Bates at some conference, and became fast friends. We're from Chattanooga, so we don't regularly worship with the Bates, but sometimes we'd go to their church and to their house for Gil preaching. 

I disticntly remember my parents falling more and more in love with G&K, (and yes with the cult, but honestly that just felt like an afterthought- Gothard was never a big part of our lives, and I never even knew about him until I was much older), and how things just suddenly started to shift. I remember crying my eyes out when they told me I'd no longer go to my school because I'd be homeschooled from then on. But other things were good- my dad changed for the better and was really nice and patient, my mom was around more and happier. They were never so strict on me, like other families would be - I was never hit, and didn't have eleventy siblings to take care of. I was however lead to believe and not question. I remember sitting in church one day and hearing the story of Abraham going to sacrifice his son, and the preacher telling us this means we must NEVER EVER question God and sacrifice everything precious in our lives for the glory of God. At first I though, oh gosh, how awful, and then I felt this cold chill of 'I CANT think this, I'm not allowed to think this!!'- looking back at it, that was when my transformation into a submissive litte meek brainwashee was fullfilled- I was too scared to have an independent thought. 

When I was around 17, I started to realize that this kind of thinking is NOT ok - I was so frightened because I could see my whole life in front of me, already decided for me, following one straight line, no options, no freedom... So I started to talk to my parents about it. Luckily they really were nice people who loved me, and didn't want to hurt me- they just truthfully believed that the life they had and planned for me to have is where true happiness is; but they were supportive of me venturing out a bit- I want to a different church with one friend, and could have a look at Christian universities. Long story, but I ended up going to Covenant college, and ended up doing missions aboard with a Presbyterian ministry, where I met a guy who was a closeted feminist and liberal christian pretending to be a stiff  presbyterian  I ended up marrying him really young, but he's the reason and the way I escaped and why I'm a sane normal person now (well... ''normal'' - I'm still dealing with ton of issues and complexes, but slowly getting there)..

As for my belief, I am a Christian - I think (Michael doesn't think , for example - she's 'praying for me'). I'm still discovering what I do and don't believe- I know I don't like Abraham, he was a jerk! And Paul too! But I like Jesus, so that makes me a Christian I guess..  I'm also learning to be a feminst and value myself for being a strong independent woman, with the help of my wonderful husband. 

I see the Bates now and then, not as often because they all have lives and children now (the older ones that I was close with), but I try and keep in touch, mostly with Michael and Erin, just to love them and show them the other side.. They keep in touch to love me and show me the ''right'' side and ''pray for me''. 

That was a very long and hard story told in a very short space, but hopefully it was the jist of it. Thank you for asking, I feel like FJ is my way of healing and dealing with the issues from the past- so that's why I'm here. I will snark and criticize but I will also love on them , because they're my friends, for the lack of a better word (not G&K, just the kids, G&K can go to hell for all I care, with what they did to their kids!) 

[QuiverDance]

I am loving your insight, @Bye Bye Birdie 

Thank you for sharing g so much with us!

[samurai_sarah]

1 hour ago, Bye Bye Birdie said:

(snip)

 I feel like FJ is my way of healing and dealing with the issues from the past- so that's why I'm here. I will snark and criticize but I will also love on them , because they're my friends, for the lack of a better word (not G&K, just the kids, G&K can go to hell for all I care, with what they did to their kids!) 

Thank you for sharing your story! I'm glad to hear that you're doing well out of fundiedom.

*mod hat on*

To the bolded:

Just a friendly reminder that FJ is not and cannot function as a self-help group. I'm sure you are already aware of that, but sometimes it bears repeating.

*mod hat off*