Ted Cruz MERGED

[chris]

Dammit all to hell. Im going to have to vote for Trump at the national convention....

[Sundaymorning]

On 2.5.2016 at 6:27 PM, Maggie Mae said:

There is one upside to this election. It has the potential to make Congress work together to reduce executive power. And maybe people will pay more attention to the midterm elections. 

You know, I almost find it funny how people like to dismiss this when I point out that government in general has way too much power of the lives of people, and how quickly this power can be abused and bring serious harm to the general population. This is a huge danger those who like to have a big government conveniently tend to forget by fooling themselves that only "good" people will get elected. Up until the day they are faced with a president Trump.

This is an interesting article about this problem, while I don't agree with everything they write, they do have some very good points.

Quote from the article:

"Limited government means that, no matter how bad a person is who holds office, he or she lacks the tools necessary to inflict great damage on the population.

Under a small government with limited and well-defined powers, Americans are safer, not because a “good guy” won the election, but because the institutions he or she controls cannot be used as tools of oppression. This is what the old liberals meant when they spoke of "a government of laws and not of men."

https://fee.org/articles/it-shouldnt-matter-who-is-president/

[EyeQueue]

Na na na na...na na na na...hey hey hey...good-bye!

But...Fucking Drumpf. :/

[Howl]

CRUZ IS OUT!   Holy crap, it's Trump for the Repubs. 

[bashfulpixie]

1 hour ago, Howl said:

CRUZ IS OUT!   Holy crap, it's Trump for the Repubs. 

I'm still not buying it.  Unless he's reached the minimum number of delegates, I think the GOP is going to try some bait and switch at the convention.

[Julifornia]

3 hours ago, bashfulpixie said:

I'm still not buying it.  Unless he's reached the minimum number of delegates, I think the GOP is going to try some bait and switch at the convention.

Even if he does reach the minimum, I still don't see them smiling and handing it over.  Not that there are many viable dark horse candidates out there, and not that Kasich has much of a prayer.

6 hours ago, Sundaymorning said:

You know, I almost find it funny how people like to dismiss this when I point out that government in general has way too much power of the lives of people, and how quickly this power can be abused and bring serious harm to the general population. This is a huge danger those who like to have a big government conveniently tend to forget by fooling themselves that only "good" people will get elected. Up until the day they are faced with a president Trump.

It's funny how the people who dismissed anyone who didn't love Obama as racists have done a complete 180 with the prospect of a President Trump.  Since there's no way you could possibly be bothered by government overreach or executive orders or laws that protect sovereignty being outright flouted by the powers that be or other forms of corruption.

[Toothfairy]

Is there a third choice? I could actually see trump as president. 

[meda]

3 hours ago, Julifornia said:

Even if he does reach the minimum, I still don't see them smiling and handing it over.  Not that there are many viable dark horse candidates out there, and not that Kasich has much of a prayer.

It's funny how the people who dismissed anyone who didn't love Obama as racists have done a complete 180 with the prospect of a President Trump.  Since there's no way you could possibly be bothered by government overreach or executive orders or laws that protect sovereignty being outright flouted by the powers that be or other forms of corruption.

it's funny how the people who dismissed anyone who didn't support George W Bush after 911 and thought invading Iraq under false pretenses was a splendid idea didn't have a problem with the bolded either.  Executive orders by president:

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/every-presidents-executive-actions-in-one-chart/

 

[Howl]

8 hours ago, bashfulpixie said:

I'm still not buying it.  Unless he's reached the minimum number of delegates, I think the GOP is going to try some bait and switch at the convention.

Excellent point.  I was so thrilled to see Cruz in the rear-view mirror I hadn't considered that very likely scenario.  That said, I do not think Trump would have a snow ball's chance in hell of beating Hillary in a general election, BUT there are a lot of disaffected people in this country, so you just never know.  

[ShepherdontheRock]

55 minutes ago, Howl said:

Excellent point.  I was so thrilled to see Cruz in the rear-view mirror I hadn't considered that very likely scenario.  That said, I do not think Trump would have a snow ball's chance in hell of beating Hillary in a general election, BUT there are a lot of disaffected people in this country, so you just never know.  

I think demographics will be Trump's undoing.

I'm imagining that his nomination will end up with voters who are not white men, especially black, latino, and female voters, turning out in droves for Clinton.

I mean, she basically can beat him with his own racist rhetoric.

[samira_catlover]

Folks, please pray for me/hold up good thoughts/send energy, because last night, for real and true, I had my first Major Nightmare in sleep about Trump as president. Honestly. Really.

FFS, my ancestors fled from Sweden to the USA for religious freedom. (The 1870s-and-later were NOT good times to oppose the State [Lutheran] Church.) I am so very afraid that our blessed freedoms, protected by the US Constitution, will be considered "optional" under a Trump presidency.

Kasich is the best of a bad litter (he's anti-choice, so NOT much of an option here--we are SEVERELY pro-choice)---but am desperately hoping the Republican convention somehow goes to brokerage.

Manohman and womanohwoman, I am really hoping that millennials, women, people of color, college-trained folk, other interesting demographics turn out by the millions in November. 

 

[CloakNDagger]

The Democrats don't need much turnout. Plenty of Republicans are not going to vote for Trump, and if the alternative is a McCain or a Romney it will be just as bad.

[Maggie Mae]

My state Republican party voted to allow the delegates that are pledged to Rubio to keep their votes through the first round of the national convention. The previous rules required that votes be allocated equally. I can only imagine that other states are following similar protocol. Old timey republicans are finally leaving the party saying that it has left them. 

I think the next few weeks will be interesting.

[Witherwings]

14 hours ago, bashfulpixie said:

I'm still not buying it.  Unless he's reached the minimum number of delegates, I think the GOP is going to try some bait and switch at the convention.

The interest in this is waning. There was a lot of talk of this earlier in the primaries, but I am very doubtful that they would undo the first ballot. After Indiana, it is fairly clear it won't be a contested convention. 

We are looking at a Trump vs Clinton ticket. 

One thing that can be said for Trump is that he has brought attention to the disconnect between voters and delegates. This is something my husband and I discuss all the time.  I though this piece was interesting the other day. 

Update On The GOP Presidential Race

 

4 hours ago, CloakNDagger said:

The Democrats don't need much turnout. Plenty of Republicans are not going to vote for Trump, and if the alternative is a McCain or a Romney it will be just as bad.

There are also plenty Bernie supporters that say they will either not vote at all, write in Bernie or vote for Trump. I think it is too early to know if that will actually happen, but if it does, that could hurt the Dems.

[Hera]

I'll say this: there's a big difference in being a Republican and not voting for your party's racist, sexist, war crime promoting, nuclear option loving buffoon of a candidate on principle and being a Bernie supporter refusing to support a candidate who is basically on your side, though not as radically, and risking a Trump presidency because you're pissed your guy lost.  The Republicans are being smart. The Bernie supporters risk cutting off their noses to spite their faces.

[EyeQueue]

14 hours ago, CloakNDagger said:

The Democrats don't need much turnout. Plenty of Republicans are not going to vote for Trump, and if the alternative is a McCain or a Romney it will be just as bad.

Old Man McCain is possibly going to end up there?

We don't need an octogenarian as President, FFS! He would, however, be better than any of the alternatives (she said, begrudgingly).

[CloakNDagger]

28 minutes ago, EyeQueue said:

Old Man McCain is possibly going to end up there?

We don't need an octogenarian as President, FFS! He would, however, be better than any of the alternatives (she said, begrudgingly).

I doubt it, but a candidate LIKE him or Romney, or Paul Ryan, or Boehner will not solve the crisis.

[Antimony]

34 minutes ago, EyeQueue said:

Old Man McCain is possibly going to end up there?

We don't need an octogenarian as President, FFS! He would, however, be better than any of the alternatives (she said, begrudgingly).

I am honestly baffled we didn't see a second McCain run or a Condi run. McCain is what I call "the Democrats favorite Republican" -- he's recently been anti-racist, generally anti-torture. But, mostly importantly in the contrast with the Republican line up this year, he seems like an actual human being (whereas Cruz is....something. A flesh suit. A lizard man wearing a flesh suit? And we have Trump, a talking ear of corn, running...so, there's that.) 

But it doesn't look like they're gonna pull any major convention stunts. I think Trump/Cruz was a rock and a hard place for the GOP (and the entire country too) but Cruz is really truly hated by his own party. If they feel like they dodged a Cruz bullet, they might accept a Trump one. 

[Cleopatra7]

5 hours ago, Antimony said:

I am honestly baffled we didn't see a second McCain run or a Condi run. McCain is what I call "the Democrats favorite Republican" -- he's recently been anti-racist, generally anti-torture. But, mostly importantly in the contrast with the Republican line up this year, he seems like an actual human being (whereas Cruz is....something. A flesh suit. A lizard man wearing a flesh suit? And we have Trump, a talking ear of corn, running...so, there's that.) 

But it doesn't look like they're gonna pull any major convention stunts. I think Trump/Cruz was a rock and a hard place for the GOP (and the entire country too) but Cruz is really truly hated by his own party. If they feel like they dodged a Cruz bullet, they might accept a Trump one. 

Condi isn't conservative enough; she's pro-choice and pro-affirmative action, so there's no way the base would ever accept her. She's a Republican because she didn't think Carter's foreign policy was aggressive enough, not because she's a Ben Carson-esque culture warrior. Besides, I think she's a policy wonk and doesn't have a desire to run for office.

[samira_catlover]

@Cleopatra7, you are also forgetting the REALLY obvious stuff about Rice. She's very well-educated, she's female, and she's black. That's NOT gonna play well in the modern Republican party, IMNSHO.  Did those fools not read their own 2012 papers concerning how they were losing ground? 

Moderate Republican here (pro-choice since 1970s, and I LIKE the ACA), but the party seems to be wanting to commit very nasty public suicide. Damnitall, though, I'm wishing we could draft her.

[Antimony]

2 hours ago, Cleopatra7 said:

Condi isn't conservative enough; she's pro-choice and pro-affirmative action, so there's no way the base would ever accept her. She's a Republican because she didn't think Carter's foreign policy was aggressive enough, not because she's a Ben Carson-esque culture warrior. Besides, I think she's a policy wonk and doesn't have a desire to run for office.

 

1 hour ago, samira_catlover said:

@Cleopatra7, you are also forgetting the REALLY obvious stuff about Rice. She's very well-educated, she's female, and she's black. That's NOT gonna play well in the modern Republican party, IMNSHO.  Did those fools not read their own 2012 papers concerning how they were losing ground? 

Moderate Republican here (pro-choice since 1970s, and I LIKE the ACA), but the party seems to be wanting to commit very nasty public suicide. Damnitall, though, I'm wishing we could draft her.

I guess that's what I mean. These are problems for an old school republican but for a moderate voter, they're much  better choices. I think a McCain/Condo ticket would have gone far and pulled in some undecided votes and moderates. That's the kind of ticket Republicans need to rally around, not whatever mess they brought. 

Also, I'm young but as far as I can remember she was well liked during the Bush administration in general. The GOP does have much better running options than they've been showing us. 

I also thought they would want to play the demographics card post-Obama but that didn't really seem to shake out either. 

[Cleopatra7]

1 minute ago, Antimony said:

 

I guess that's what I mean. These are problems for an old school republican but for a moderate voter, they're much  better choices. I think a McCain/Condo ticket would have gone far and pulled in some undecided votes and moderates. That's the kind of ticket Republicans need to rally around, not whatever mess they brought. 

Also, I'm young but as far as I can remember she was well liked during the Bush administration in general. The GOP does have much better running options than they've been showing us. 

I also thought they would want to play the demographics card post-Obama but that didn't really seem to shake out either. 

The problem is that the GOP is rapidly becoming of party of angry, white men based in the rural South, not unlike what the Democrats were pre-Civil Rights Act. However, now that blacks and other minorities have the vote (more or less anyway) even some Southern States may turn purple by 2020. To put it bluntly, demographics are not going to be kind to the Republicans. Their 2012 post-mortem memo mentioned that need to attract racial and religious minorities, but they ended up choosing the most reactionary candidate imaginable. Pre-9-11, the majority of Muslims in America (except for African American Sunni Muslims) were Republican, but after almost fifteen years of hysterical Islamophobia, they defected to the Democratic Party.

[samira_catlover]

Darkies have votes? Females (who ought to be in the kitchens and churches) have votes? EEEEEEKKKKKKK!

Next thing you know, we're gonna let Muslims vote.

And then, you will be telling me that folks who immigrated 20+ years ago actually have vote-right equal those of Chosen White Protestant Men. 
**frantically cheers on the solidly Democratic Blue states, and hopes Florida will shift**

***Also looks for a flameproof shelter, but hopes that FJ readers are well aware of Godwin's Law and also appreciate SEVERE sarcasm***

If Trump gets the US presidency, can SOME loving person please knock me out till 2020, or put me in hibernation, please, or arrange a refugee visa?

[RosyDaisy]

So, who paid Cruz to drop out? He didn't go from choosing his running mate to dropping out in a week. It doesn't make sense.

[nausicaa]

23 minutes ago, RosyDaisy said:

So, who paid Cruz to drop out? He didn't go from choosing his running mate to dropping out in a week. It doesn't make sense.

I'm wondering if the money ran out. If major donors don't see a path for him to the White House and tell him they're pulling funding, that could shut things down fast. 

But I agree, it was weirdly abrupt.