Bates Family: Babies Galore! Part 12

[tumblr]

My Aunt and Uncle made a list of names as soon as she was pregnant the first time and always knew what the baby would be named as soon as they found out the gender. Some people are just very decisive, I am doubtful that the network would have much of an impact on what or when they name their baby. 

[ophelia]

Although I'm single for more than 3 years now I still have a list with baby names on my cell phone. Whenever I see or hear a name that I like I add it to the list. I guess I'm a little bit desperate.

[picklepizzas]

6 hours ago, actuallyjessica said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if a baby is very much wanted by its parents, don't they always think of it as a living thing, rather than a 'clump of cells' as some people put it?

Oh yes, for sure, I didn't mean to imply that it was weird to think of the baby as alive. It's just that most people don't publicly name the child until birth. It strikes me as a strange action and I was just wondering if the naming thing was the beginning of a Fundie trend to emphasize that the most significant event is conception rather than birth. I may be overthinking.

[IrishCarrie]

A friend of mine while pregnant kept a list of potential boy and girl names pinned to her fridge door - as she heard names she liked she just added them to it, but had no intention of picking one until the child was born and she had seen its face.

A bunch of us were over in their house for drinks one night and got a wee bit giddy, so after the expectant momma had gone to bed we amended the list a little...you know, a few drawings, a few definitions, a few comments about people we knew with the same name.

Expectant momma NOT happy the next morning  Strangely, she didn't end up going with anything on the list. And didn't DO a list for the subsequent pregnancies.

Whoops....

[ophelia]

When my mother was pregnant with my little sister she couldn't agree with her husband what to name her. Then they finally decided to call her Leonie, but when she arrived and was placed on our mother's chest they looked at her and changed her name to my mama's favourite since she didn't look like a Leonie at all.

[anjulibai]

7 minutes ago, picklepizzas said:

Oh yes, for sure, I didn't mean to imply that it was weird to think of the baby as alive. It's just that most people don't publicly name the child until birth. It strikes me as a strange action and I was just wondering if the naming thing was the beginning of a Fundie trend to emphasize that the most significant event is conception rather than birth. I may be overthinking.

I'm not sure I agree with the bolded. Most people I know do announce the name, and I don't know any fundies IRL, besides an Orthodox Jewish woman who teaches at the same high school with me (and I'm not sure she even counts as a fundie, more like just really observant).

I think I know of three people that didn't: one woman because she likes controlling her image so her life appears perfect as a way to get attention (long story, but trust me, this was her intent); a woman I worked with last year, because she and her husband were arguing over a name, though she did discuss ideas with people; my aunt, who didn't find out the sex of her kids, because she was over 40 and feeling superstitious about losing her babies. And even with my aunt, we all knew what they were going to be named if they were a boy or a girl, because she had been talking about those two names for decades.

So, maybe in your circles it's unusual, but I don't think it's unusual everywhere. I announced my son's name when I found out he was a boy, and I'll do the same with the one I'm carrying now when I find out what I'm having. 

[feministxtian]

I had my first two in the days before ultrasounds were routinely done, so I had a girl's name and boy's name picked out. They were referred to by nicknames before birth. My third (and last), we knew what it was so he had a name before we left the doctor's office (my X was thrilled to have a boy so he wanted a junior). With my first, she looked nothing like the name I picked out so it was changed when I saw her face. Her name still suits her, 33 years later. 

[Thorns]

Some friends of mine had a name set and ready, very decided. And when the boy came, they changed it  Apparently, he "looked like" a ZYX. My friend says it was like he told them his name. And it fits. Much better than the one they originally intended him to have!

[PennySycamore]

We only knew what sex the baby was with our youngest.  We got a really good "moon shot" on one of the ultrasounds and we knew that we were having our fifth girl.  I think we may have told people the name, but I'm not sure.  I did tell my OB what we were naming our second when I went in for an ultrasound a few days before my scheduled c-section.   I remember telling him that I thought that the girl's name was great for an Irish setter.  I did not have an Irish setter, but I did have a red-haired little girl.  

[karen77]

We had our top two names for each sex before we were married! Worked out pretty well for us!

[MissBitters]

Alyssa and John are quizzed about potential family size in this video.

[Snarkle]

My husband's only requests for a name was that it was biblical (Old Testament, because he is Jewish but non-observant), and no place names (like Austin and Cheyenne that were popular at the time, so I guess that would include Brooklyn?), or presidential names (Harrison, Lincoln, etc.), or names that could go for either gender (Taylor was very big at the time).  Obviously requirement #1 pretty much ruled out the other three requirements, but when people asked, that's what he said.  We both wanted a traditional name as well - and one that was easy to remember and spell because my first name is ALWAYS spelled wrong and I get tired of correcting people.  And since my husband is Jewish, there could be no naming our child after any living family members, so that narrowed things down, along with the fact that my brother, my husband, his brother, and most of our cousins already had Hebrew names.  So a week before our ultrasound we settle on Abigail for a girl, but didn't know for a boy.  Naturally we found out we were having a boy.  For the rest of my pregnancy I kept a list of boy names on my Palm Pilot (this was the late '90s), but we could never agree.  When our son was finally born and the nurses asked what his name was, my husband said the name I liked best, Jacob, probably because I had a hard pregnancy and a tough delivery and he let me win that one.  I did say we could wait until the next day to name him, but my husband said no, I am already going to call the relatives. Fortunately it fits our kid, and he likes his name a lot (but usually goes by Jake now), so it works.  [Although perhaps deep down subconsciously I just wanted to name him after Jake Ryan from Sixteen Candles, my favorite film of all time.] 

[SweetFellowshipper]

Definitely agree with everything that's being said. In a (potentially sociopathic?) way, it'll be interesting to see who, if anyone, out of current or impending Bates and Duggar marriages gets divorced. I'd bet it wouldn't be any Bateseseseses, but as I read on the "wtf fundie families" tumblr once, sometimes the Chads and Erins of the world who are extremely public about their spouse being "perfect" and "amazing" and the best person ever to grace the planet have a hard time when their spouse does something that disqualifies them from that category. I don't mean just Joshie stuff; in their world, watching porn, lying, drinking, flirting, having doubts about Jesus or the marriage, looking at others, etc., are all equally devastating. I think their marriages seem strong and beautiful, but also sheltered. It's interesting to see marriages that appear so "perfect" from kids who have been entrenched in ATI. ATI is insidious, but I could see how for kids of parents like the Paines and Bates, it could result in something truly idyllic for a time. They've been sheltered in constant hardcore family-love and not much else since birth, and then marry one another while young and gorgeous. I do wonder if any of those couples will face that sort of thing and how, say, a Michaela or John Webster would handle it. The miscarriages were devastating for the Paines, but I mean truly personal failings here. Would they have a strong foundation and be able to move past it, or would it be a total breakdown of the "perfect" image they had? Are some people just really that lovely and perfect all the time? 

I don't really count Zach and Whit in this for some reason, I guess because she has a very different background and he seems to value that. 

[ElegantMajesticPearls]

7 minutes ago, MissBitters said:

Alyssa and John are quizzed about potential family size in this video.

Alyssa says she wants six kids for those who can't watch the video.

[Snarkle]

Speaking of names...  Since Michael/la had to legally change her name when she got married, could she have permanently changed it to Michaella at that point, especially since she had to get a new license, etc. in Illinois?

http://uptv.com/shows/bringing-up-bates/videos/bringing-up-bates-whats-in-a-name/

[justmy2cents]

6 minutes ago, ElegantMajesticPearls said:

Alyssa says she wants six kids for those who can't watch the video.

Yeah, sounds like she won't be letting god dictate the size of her family and John is just going along with whatever she wants. Hope she sticks to her guns.

[MissBitters]

Those particular videos are very interesting. While Alyssa said she wanted six, Michael said she wanted as many God gave her. Zach and Whitney both said "we will see." As far as i can tell they haven't asked Erin and Chad about family size, which makes me hope both the Bateses and UP are sensitive about her health issues.

[maple802]

34 minutes ago, Snarkle said:

Speaking of names...  Since Michael/la had to legally change her name when she got married, could she have permanently changed it to Michaella at that point, especially since she had to get a new license, etc. in Illinois?

http://uptv.com/shows/bringing-up-bates/videos/bringing-up-bates-whats-in-a-name/

I don't know if you can change the spelling of your first name. I'm already gathering the necessary forms, etc. for the name change process after we get married in May (T-53 days) and you have to provide identity documentation, including a birth certificate and/or passport to change your name on your social security card. My guess is that you'd need to be consistent with what's on your birth certificate/passport.  

[anjulibai]

1 minute ago, maple802 said:

I don't know if you can change the spelling of your first name. I'm already gathering the necessary forms, etc. for the name change process after we get married in May (T-53 days) and you have to provide identity documentation, including a birth certificate and/or passport to change your name on your social security card. My guess is that you'd need to be consistent with what's on your birth certificate/passport.  

I don't think so. You can change your first and last name for a variety of reasons. It's easiest to do when you get married, because historically that's just what women did, but outside of marriage, you can get your name changed if you go through a certain process (different for each state).

I know when my aunt got married, she made her middle name her first name (she'd always gone by her middle name, never her first), made her middle name be her maiden last name, and then took her husband's last name as her own. 

One of my teacher's in high school, when he was born he was given one name, but his parents decided he looked like a different name. They called him that, and then when he was 4, they went to a judge to have his legal first name made part of his middle name (so he had 2 middle names) and then added on the new first name.

My gramma and her sister were given one name on their birth certificates, and then something completely different when they were baptized. They never used the name on their birth certificates; their marriage licences, social security cards, etc. were all in the baptized name. When they have gotten or renewed their passports, they end up showing their baptismal records (which are legally allowed by the federal government).

So, it's entirely possible that Michaella changed the spelling of her name. I wouldn't blame her if she did. All the spellings and pronunciations are just ridiculous. 

[bucherwurm]

Finally got to the honeymoon episode, and the part about going back to the room. Kinda funny, but I guess that  means they are pretty comfortable with each other.

[HereticHick]

Here is how Michael(la) can change her name in Illinois, where she currently lives

http://www.illinoiscourts.gov/forms/approved/name_change/nc-i_302.1_approved.pdf

It involves 3 different fees, a court hearing, and a newspaper notice

 

[actuallyjessica]

Yeah, sounds like she won't be letting god dictate the size of her family and John is just going along with whatever she wants. Hope she sticks to her guns.

I think the fact that they said a specific number which wasn't outrageously large says a lot, too.

Some may say "they're just towing the party line and saying that to appear normal" - but are they really? That kinda goes against everything that has been drilled into them and if their faith was everything they would've said "as many as God allows" or some variation, but they didn't. Very interesting.

[JillyO]

I do think Alyssa and John's answers are interesting. It's kind of fitting with what many FJers assumed, but we've never really had "proof" for: that they want to have a large-by-mainstream-standards-but-still-manageable sized family.

Of course saying that they "want" six kids doesn't mean they're doing something to prevent more pregnancies. However, the fact that John and Alyssa aren't saying "we'll be happy with however many the Lord will give us" is remarkable in and of itself, I think. I'll be curious to see how this pans out for them.

ETA: Crossposted with @actuallyjessica, so basically this ^^^.

[RoseWilder]

Wow, that's a huge admission from Alyssa!

Bud I'm also kind of surprised/excited by Zach and Whitney's "we will see." It's not as clear of an answer as Alyssa and John gave, but I think it's still a step up from "we would love to have as many as the Lord gives us." 

[Koala]

8 hours ago, EmainMacha said:

I also named my first baby/pregnancy who was a first trimester loss. Same reasoning as you. Although my husband found it unhelpful for him personally it helped me with the healing process. And you most definitely don't sound stupid or uneducated at all. Quite the opposite- eloquent and moving, especially when writing about a topic and emotions that can be so difficult to put into words.

I'm very sorry for your loss @VelociRapture.

I think it's probably fairly common.  I lost my first two pregnancies.  I had a boy name and a girl name picked out, and I didn't feel right using either of those names for my two children.  It's been almost 15 years, and to this day it catches my attention when I hear those names- I guess in a "what might have been" kind of way.