Anna Duggar and the M kids part 6

[Bad Wolf]

I wasn't able to watch the sex talk, but I saw Josh singing the song about being faithful. Also saw Mr. Keller (?) explaining that Jesus turned the water into grape juice. OK, I'm confused. I thought the KJV was the only interpretation allowed, and it definitely says wine. Also, the guests were impressed that they'd saved the best wine for last, most people serving the good stuff first, and bringing out the bad stuff when everyone was too snockered to know the difference. I don't think there are that many variations of grape juice for the people to be impressed.

Those fundies have such cute interpretations. It's OK to say they don't drink wine.

Back to Anna, she will never be able to watch her wedding video again, Iwouldn't think.

[ClaraOswin]

Didn't one of Anna's brothers have a blog or something where he talked about how the sex talk was super staged? Or did I imagine that?

[season of life]

1 minute ago, ClaraOswin said:

Didn't one of Anna's brothers have a blog or something where he talked about how the sex talk was super staged? Or did I imagine that?

No, you're right, I read that too. He said it was mostly staged and the Keller parents are nicer than the camera portrays them. I disagree with the last part, as they let their daughter court and marry a child molester.

[Hera]

46 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

I wasn't able to watch the sex talk, but I saw Josh singing the song about being faithful. Also saw Mr. Keller (?) explaining that Jesus turned the water into grape juice. OK, I'm confused. I thought the KJV was the only interpretation allowed, and it definitely says wine. Also, the guests were impressed that they'd saved the best wine for last, most people serving the good stuff first, and bringing out the bad stuff when everyone was too snockered to know the difference. I don't think there are that many variations of grape juice for the people to be impressed.

Those fundies have such cute interpretations. It's OK to say they don't drink wine.

Back to Anna, she will never be able to watch her wedding video again, Iwouldn't think.

Oddly enough, out of all the ridiculous and, in some cases damaging, stuff I experienced in church as a child/early teen, the "it was fermented grape juice, not wine!" was the point when I was really able to just let it all go, if that makes sense, and realize that whatever these people were doing and saying, it was all their made up rules and had very little to do with the Bible.  

[19 cats and counting]

Isnt there a forum devoted to Christian married sex?  I can't think of the name but IIRC it's very snark worthy.

[biblelandjunkie]

On 3/18/2016 at 11:35 AM, DuggarWatch said:

That's exactly what Jim Bob thinks, too.  Here's the advice he gave to Josh on his wedding day to Anna.  He pretty much says that Michelle is a blithering idiot with nothing important to say.

"To you, one of the most important things about life will be having a physical relationship.  But, for your wife, one of the most important things will be to be able to talk and share her heart everyday with you. And, to you, some of these things may seem kind of trivial.  Some things that go on in her life may not seem that important, but, for her – to be able to express it to you and for you to respond that you care about her and that you care about the little things in her life – this will show her that you love her and that you cherish her and that you care about her.  Women speak a different language than men.  Women will tell all of these details of everything that happened even before they get to the main point.  And sometimes, after they tell you everything that happened in a given situation, you still don't understand the main point."       

sadly if the fundy families would send their kids to college they would be educated and have something to actually say perhaps.....

[Hera]

Not condoning this line of thinking at all, but, I mean, does Michelle have anything interesting to say? Within the rules of the cult she chose, she doesn't work; cannot complain; has to keep sweet all the time; has to agree with her headship no matter what; has no outside hobbies, interests or friends who at all think differently from her; cannot question her beliefs; has no exposure to pop culture; has no education or real experience in other cultures; generally spends most of her time with her husband, anyway and so on. So, while I believe there may well be many things Michelle and other  fundie wives would love to say; to comply with the cult rules, they really can't.  It keeps them pretty uninteresting.

[Denim Jumper]

18 minutes ago, 19 cats and counting said:

Isnt there a forum devoted to Christian married sex?  I can't think of the name but IIRC it's very snark worthy.

The Marriage Bed. Definitely snark-worthy, but also kind of sad, particularly the stories posts about their wedding nights. A surprising number of stories of using "dilators" for months in preparation for the big night, but still not actually being able to get it in the first few nights. I mean, even I have a hard time snarking on that because, considering how fundies make such a big deal about doing it god's way and they'll be blessed for waiting... meanwhile, a couple of heathen 17-year-olds fumbling around in the dark after Junior Prom manage to have a more enjoyable first time. 

[calimojo]

7 hours ago, Mothership said:

Anna's response about saying/doing the right thing for the next 15 minutes is just so sad.

She/her "counselor"/mostly likely JB &DQ have perverted a real survival thing:  usually it's just survive the next 15 minutes....just make it through the next 15 minutes....just feel something for the next 15 minutes.

Having to behave appropriately in 15 minute increments isn't helping her through anything...it's adding another burden to the crap they've already loaded on her.

I think it is reasonable to go through a crisis in 15 minute increments in some situations.  Like for example,  She would still need to be able to suck it up and be a good mom to her kids,  so having the ability to 'act normal' for 15 minutes is important.  But I feel for her if she is living each day that way.

 

In some ways, I can see why she stayed with the duggars.  With a brand new baby,  no home, no immediate source of income, I think being at the compound probably felt secure for her.  While I find it odd that she is bunking in the girl's dorm,  communal living is not unfamiliar to Anna based on her upbringing in her tiny parent's home and all of her siblings.

 

Anna has help with her kids, and probably very few adult responsibilities when she is living with Jimbob and michelle.  Anna has not been raised to be a decision maker.  She has been raised to be subservient and passive.  So suddenly being faced with single parenthood and being the only adult decision maker in her family would be overwhelming to her. 

 

We all would cheer for her to get out, and we all are disappointed that she would allow her kids to stay in such an unhealthy situation, but on her own, I am not convinced that Anna could provide a stable life for her kids.  The best she could hope would be to find a widowed or older single man in her cult who would become her new master, and who knows if that would end up being any better.  Sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know. 

 

If Anna were smart or shrewd, she could parlay her insider info about the Duggar clan into an income.  She could leave and sell her story and make some good money up front, but even then, would it be enough to raise her family alone?  And no doubt,  Jimbob and Michelle would sue her and tie up her money in legal fees.   

 

I don't agree with her decision to stay, but I guess, if I put my self in her shoes, I can see it.  And, I also believe that her story is not over yet.  She may end up leaving eventually.  Forgiveness is easy to talk about but harder to live day in a day out

 

 

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 hour ago, calimojo said:

I think it is reasonable to go through a crisis in 15 minute increments in some situations.  Like for example,  She would still need to be able to suck it up and be a good mom to her kids,  so having the ability to 'act normal' for 15 minutes is important.  But I feel for her if she is living each day that way.

 

In some ways, I can see why she stayed with the duggars.  With a brand new baby,  no home, no immediate source of income, I think being at the compound probably felt secure for her.  While I find it odd that she is bunking in the girl's dorm,  communal living is not unfamiliar to Anna based on her upbringing in her tiny parent's home and all of her siblings.

 

Anna has help with her kids, and probably very few adult responsibilities when she is living with Jimbob and michelle.  Anna has not been raised to be a decision maker.  She has been raised to be subservient and passive.  So suddenly being faced with single parenthood and being the only adult decision maker in her family would be overwhelming to her. 

 

We all would cheer for her to get out, and we all are disappointed that she would allow her kids to stay in such an unhealthy situation, but on her own, I am not convinced that Anna could provide a stable life for her kids.  The best she could hope would be to find a widowed or older single man in her cult who would become her new master, and who knows if that would end up being any better.  Sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know. 

 

If Anna were smart or shrewd, she could parlay her insider info about the Duggar clan into an income.  She could leave and sell her story and make some good money up front, but even then, would it be enough to raise her family alone?  And no doubt,  Jimbob and Michelle would sue her and tie up her money in legal fees.   

 

I don't agree with her decision to stay, but I guess, if I put my self in her shoes, I can see it.  And, I also believe that her story is not over yet.  She may end up leaving eventually.  Forgiveness is easy to talk about but harder to live day in a day out

 

 

There are days where I think being in this life style would be better, the stress of making decisions, working, taking care of my home and kids, even with an amazing husband takes its toll on me.  I don't cope well with stress and have anxiety issues, on my worst days I think, someone anyone else just tell me how to think and how it is going to be.  But then I realize 95% of the time I would HATE this, I like being independent, I like not having to ask permission to do anything. Knowing what little I do of Anna, I can see where staying would just be easier because having to do it all alone would be terrifying.  I have a B.S. a work history, and was raised to be independent and be on my own. 

[Sundaymorning]

23 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

There are days where I think being in this life style would be better, the stress of making decisions, working, taking care of my home and kids, even with an amazing husband takes its toll on me.  I don't cope well with stress and have anxiety issues, on my worst days I think, someone anyone else just tell me how to think and how it is going to be.  But then I realize 95% of the time I would HATE this, I like being independent, I like not having to ask permission to do anything. Knowing what little I do of Anna, I can see where staying would just be easier because having to do it all alone would be terrifying.  I have a B.S. a work history, and was raised to be independent and be on my own. 

Even if I never feel so myself, I can see where you are coming from. But honestly, even if you were in such a cult and someone else would make all the decisions for you, you would be way more anxious than you are now. Imagine all the nervousness if your headship was about to make an important decision and you would worry if he will decide the way you would prefer him to.

Or all the guilt tripping from your fellow cult members, cause, as we all know, if something goes wrong, it's surely the wife's fault. The stress of having to play the submissive and godly wife all the time and presenting your perfect family and well behaved children to the others of your cult. And speaking of children, all the pregnancies with little to no real medical assistance, the constant money worries and raising and homeschooling eleventy kids? Sure, you can enslave your daughters to do most of the work for you, but at least in the first 8-10 years, you are on your own and it's really hard work.

I do believe that most fundie wives suffer from more secret anxiety than we will ever imagine. Only difference is that they aren't allowed to talk about it, but have to suppress it and cover it up. J'Chelle Duggar did have a nervous break-down, and then had the J'Slaves take over the parenting. Yes, it did work out pretty well for the Duggars thanks to TLC, but they are a big exception, many fundie families are dirt poor and struggling, certainly not a fun life for the wives, especially since, even if they officially don't have any responsibility, they still get made responsible for whatever goes wrong.

[Withagrainofsalt]

On 3/17/2016 at 3:59 PM, NeverAFundie said:

Question that I'm sure has been discussed a billion times here over the years, but would it be a sin to ejaculate during oral sex if the wife is already pregnant?  I would imagine that before the AM scandal, Anna seems as though she would have been fairly likely to consider some of the things Josh included in his profile.  But now?  I would think that for the rest of her life, she will worry that whatever boundaries she pushes won't be enough compared to what goes in the porn Josh watched, strip clubs, etc.

Also, count me in the group of people who think that some of these fundies (especially Chad Paine) could very well be engaging in Joshley-esque "non kink" like rose petals and shared baths.

I remember an episode of BUB right before Carson was born Chad booked a hotel room. In that room there were rose petals on the bed, and a gift basket of lotion. 

 

 

[season of life]

14 minutes ago, Withagrainofsalt said:

I remember an episode of BUB right before Carson was born Chad booked a hotel room. In that room there were rose petals on the bed, and a gift basket of lotion. 

 

 

Lmfao, I don't know why, but the image of fundies cavorting with one another and baskets of lotion cracks me up.

[Withagrainofsalt]

36 minutes ago, season of life said:

Lmfao, I don't know why, but the image of fundies cavorting with one another and baskets of lotion cracks me up.

I rewatched the episode. It was one night away at the Oliver Hotel in Knotville TN. 

 

Here are some screenshots. 

 

 

Erin made a big deal about having a tub. 

 

[QuiverDance]

On 3/18/2016 at 1:35 PM, DuggarWatch said:

That's exactly what Jim Bob thinks, too.  Here's the advice he gave to Josh on his wedding day to Anna.  He pretty much says that Michelle is a blithering idiot with nothing important to say.

"To you, one of the most important things about life will be having a physical relationship.  But, for your wife, one of the most important things will be to be able to talk and share her heart everyday with you. And, to you, some of these things may seem kind of trivial.  Some things that go on in her life may not seem that important, but, for her – to be able to express it to you and for you to respond that you care about her and that you care about the little things in her life – this will show her that you love her and that you cherish her and that you care about her.  Women speak a different language than men.  Women will tell all of these details of everything that happened even before they get to the main point.  And sometimes, after they tell you everything that happened in a given situation, you still don't understand the main point."       

I must be the most heathenest, ungodliest, unwomanliest, jezelbelish woman on the planet, because the last thing I want to do with my SO is talk about feelings all the time.  I am responsible for my feelings.  I am truly happy for the times we talk and connect mentally and emotionally, but I am just as happy for the times we connect physically, and I don't understand why fundie men and women can't acknowledge that we are all human and both have physical and emotional needs.  

On 3/21/2016 at 10:27 PM, Sundaymorning said:

Even if I never feel so myself, I can see where you are coming from. But honestly, even if you were in such a cult and someone else would make all the decisions for you, you would be way more anxious than you are now. Imagine all the nervousness if your headship was about to make an important decision and you would worry if he will decide the way you would prefer him to.

Or all the guilt tripping from your fellow cult members, cause, as we all know, if something goes wrong, it's surely the wife's fault. The stress of having to play the submissive and godly wife all the time and presenting your perfect family and well behaved children to the others of your cult. And speaking of children, all the pregnancies with little to no real medical assistance, the constant money worries and raising and homeschooling eleventy kids? Sure, you can enslave your daughters to do most of the work for you, but at least in the first 8-10 years, you are on your own and it's really hard work.

I do believe that most fundie wives suffer from more secret anxiety than we will ever imagine. Only difference is that they aren't allowed to talk about it, but have to suppress it and cover it up. J'Chelle Duggar did have a nervous break-down, and then had the J'Slaves take over the parenting. Yes, it did work out pretty well for the Duggars thanks to TLC, but they are a big exception, many fundie families are dirt poor and struggling, certainly not a fun life for the wives, especially since, even if they officially don't have any responsibility, they still get made responsible for whatever goes wrong.

Speaking from experience, any wife in a marriage with a controlling husband will feel those pressures and anxieties all the time.  My ex is an athiest, and I still felt constant pressure to be perfect, for the kids to always be perfectly behaved, etc.  It was all about him and his image, and I was so deep in the relationship that I didn't even realize how abusive and fucked up it was.  I thought I was lacking in coping skills.  I thought I was a bad mother because I didn't have it 100% together 24/7/365 (even when I was practicing law full time and being mommy).  I guess what I'm trying to say is... being in a situation where your autonomy is compromised is difficult whether or not there is religion involved, and I truly believe that these legalistic religions are havens for men who are controlling and disordered because their disorders are justified in the religion.  At the same time, they allow the wives to rationalize their codependencies.  I could easily see myself having drunk the koolaid if I were a wife in ATI.  And I am an educated woman most would perceive as strong and independent.  My fault is hating to fail.

 

[What a world]

On March 20, 2016 at 11:12 PM, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

There are days where I think being in this life style would be better, the stress of making decisions, working, taking care of my home and kids, even with an amazing husband takes its toll on me.  I don't cope well with stress and have anxiety issues, on my worst days I think, someone anyone else just tell me how to think and how it is going to be.  But then I realize 95% of the time I would HATE this, I like being independent, I like not having to ask permission to do anything. Knowing what little I do of Anna, I can see where staying would just be easier because having to do it all alone would be terrifying.  I have a B.S. a work history, and was raised to be independent and be on my own. 

I too have felt this way at times. I also don't deal well with stress and have anxiety issues. I call it "wanting to be a princess". Sometimes it would be nice to let go of the decision making and responsibility. Truth is though, I would absolutely hate that lifestyle. My sisters don't call me bossy for nothing.

[InThePrayerCloset]

On 20 March 2016 at 0:55 PM, Denim Jumper said:

The Marriage Bed. Definitely snark-worthy, but also kind of sad, particularly the stories posts about their wedding nights. A surprising number of stories of using "dilators" for months in preparation for the big night, but still not actually being able to get it in the first few nights. I mean, even I have a hard time snarking on that because, considering how fundies make such a big deal about doing it god's way and they'll be blessed for waiting... meanwhile, a couple of heathen 17-year-olds fumbling around in the dark after Junior Prom manage to have a more enjoyable first time. 

I just spent an hour reading The Marriage Bed... Oh. My. God... Crazy! I want to snark, but the terror and guilt some of these women express is heart-breaking.

As a comic aside, when i was well into "So You're Engaged - Wedding Night 101 for Grooms" (complete with diagrams of female anatomy using orchid flowers... rather than actual anatomical drawings... so ladies, blame The Marriage Bed if your groom suddenly starts humping your bouquet rather than you!) a national radio station called me to do an immediate expert interview about the unfolding Brussels terrorist attacks... which i had no idea had happened!! I had to hastily skim the BBC and not admit I was reading about virgin wedding night jitters in my PJs rather than monitoring the unfolding terrorist incident!!I'm a bad counter terrorism expert - but at least I can genuinely say I was reading primary source material about religious extremism 

As an aside... the "Christian sex toy" shops that the Marriage Bed links to has some of the kinkiest stuff I have ever seen... Adultshop.com has nothing on Covenant Spice and Bedroom Blessings!!!  No judgement at all if that's your thing, i'm just genuinely shocked 

[paulypepper]

26 minutes ago, InThePrayerCloset said:

I just spent an hour reading The Marriage Bed... Oh. My. God... Crazy! I want to snark, but the terror and guilt some of these women express is heart-breaking.

As a comic aside, when i was well into "So You're Engaged - Wedding Night 101 for Grooms" (complete with diagrams of female anatomy using orchid flowers... rather than actual anatomical drawings... so ladies, blame The Marriage Bed if your groom suddenly starts humping your bouquet rather than you!) a national radio station called me to do an immediate expert interview about the unfolding Brussels terrorist attacks... which i had no idea had happened!! I had to hastily skim the BBC and not admit I was reading about virgin wedding night jitters in my PJs rather than monitoring the unfolding terrorist incident!!I'm a bad counter terrorism expert - but at least I can genuinely say I was reading primary source material about religious extremism 

As an aside... the "Christian sex toy" shops that the Marriage Bed links to has some of the kinkiest stuff I have ever seen... Adultshop.com has nothing on Covenant Spice and Bedroom Blessings!!!  No judgement at all if that's your thing, i'm just genuinely shocked 

I ventured to The Marriage Bed a few days ago and after a brief perusal I bookmarked it to go back to later...after seeing the pictures and such I could see a rabbit hole for me.

However, I have come to appreciate flowers more...

[Ungodly Grandma]

2 hours ago, What a world said:

I too have felt this way at times. I also don't deal well with stress and have anxiety issues. I call it "wanting to be a princess". Sometimes it would be nice to let go of the decision making and responsibility. Truth is though, I would absolutely hate that lifestyle. My sisters don't call me bossy for nothing.

I think several of us here are alike in wanting the stress from independent living to go away, while keeping the independence!

[anotherone]

2 hours ago, What a world said:

I too have felt this way at times. I also don't deal well with stress and have anxiety issues. I call it "wanting to be a princess". Sometimes it would be nice to let go of the decision making and responsibility. Truth is though, I would absolutely hate that lifestyle. My sisters don't call me bossy for nothing.

You guys might feel this way (and me too)  but I don't think a lot of those women feel that way.  Some are glad to let others make all the decisions, it actually takes the pressure off.  If you have the knowledge and confidence to make good decisions, it would drive you nuts to have someone controlling, but think of a kid who is constantly told by the parents that they are doing something wrong yet again and it's never good enough.  They are scared to even make a move because they believe it will be wrong again.  So it's easier to let someone else make all the decisions and take the heat if it's wrong. 

I think being brought up in this kind of cult does this to women, makes them feel never good enough  and they are told all along women can't do anything, so how scary it would be to make a decision. They set them up to fail, because how can you live up to that perfect smiley face always sweet no anger or bad feelings kind of personality?  So you are always not good enough.  So you want the most knowledgeable person to always decide, and in this case it is always the headship. 

I think it all depends on how much confidence you have to run your life your way, vs. how scared you are that you will just end up doing it wrong.  Unfortunately many of them are in the latter.

 

[RoseWilder]

On 3/20/2016 at 9:54 PM, Hera said:

So, while I believe there may well be many things Michelle and other  fundie wives would love to say; to comply with the cult rules, they really can't.  It keeps them pretty uninteresting.

I wish I could find the article about the Duggars that I read once where JimBob was clearly censoring what Michelle was saying. The article was written before they had the show, back when JimBob was (whatever elected official he was at the time.) The interviewer mentioned that Michelle started to say something, then JimBob pulled her aside and they were discussing whether she could say what she was about to say. The person conducting the interview made it pretty clear that JimBob was calling all the shots and Michelle was basically his puppet. 

I've noticed a lot of people (both on this forum and others) say that they believe Michelle wears the pants in the family, but every since I read that interview, I've never believed that. And the police report stating that Michelle wanted to get Josh real counseling and was overruled by JimBob would also indicate that JimBob is calling all the shots in that family and Michelle has very little say in what happens.

[NeverAFundie]

On 3/19/2016 at 0:57 PM, Mothership said:

Anna's response about saying/doing the right thing for the next 15 minutes is just so sad.

She/her "counselor"/mostly likely JB &DQ have perverted a real survival thing:  usually it's just survive the next 15 minutes....just make it through the next 15 minutes....just feel something for the next 15 minutes.

Having to behave appropriately in 15 minute increments isn't helping her through anything...it's adding another burden to the crap they've already loaded on her.

This is a pretty close variant of an addiction recovery concept.  AA, NA, and Al Anon all talk about keeping the focus on one day at a time, of course, but also just making the next right decision.  It helps people in early recovery from being overwhelmed by the enormity of an entire lifetime ahead without their drug of choice.  I can actually see how the concept, properly applied, would be helpful to Anna in a situation where she is overwhelmed by the enormity of what she faces.  HOWEVER...I strongly suspect that her "counselor" is not licensed or trained in any meaningful way, and that they have bastardized an otherwise helpful concept into something that shames Anna if she doesn't do or say the "right" thing according to Jesus or the KJV or Gothard or whatever.

[MakeItSo]

I now wonder if Marjorie was just a little too opinionated for the Duggsies...she did seem to know what she wanted (spotlight?)...I don't know. Just random thought that popped into mind.

 

ETA: Ventured over to the Marriage Bed and when I read "he expects, and has his heart set on having sex. If you cant do that lovingly with fond anticipation and desire, do him and yourself a favor, break his heart a little bit now, call it off and have an invitro from the sperm bank to satisfy your maternal urges and marry a eunick or homosexual for the public image aspect of parenthood." I just about spat coffee all over my macbook. Do I laugh? Cry? Wow! Just wow! (not that I truly expected anything different)

[ClaraOswin]

5 hours ago, InThePrayerCloset said:

I just spent an hour reading The Marriage Bed... Oh. My. God... Crazy! I want to snark, but the terror and guilt some of these women express is heart-breaking.

As a comic aside, when i was well into "So You're Engaged - Wedding Night 101 for Grooms" (complete with diagrams of female anatomy using orchid flowers... rather than actual anatomical drawings... so ladies, blame The Marriage Bed if your groom suddenly starts humping your bouquet rather than you!) a national radio station called me to do an immediate expert interview about the unfolding Brussels terrorist attacks... which i had no idea had happened!! I had to hastily skim the BBC and not admit I was reading about virgin wedding night jitters in my PJs rather than monitoring the unfolding terrorist incident!!I'm a bad counter terrorism expert - but at least I can genuinely say I was reading primary source material about religious extremism 

As an aside... the "Christian sex toy" shops that the Marriage Bed links to has some of the kinkiest stuff I have ever seen... Adultshop.com has nothing on Covenant Spice and Bedroom Blessings!!!  No judgement at all if that's your thing, i'm just genuinely shocked 

What is The Marriage Bed? I must have skimmed the posts mentioning it before. Sounds...bizarre.

And I had no idea there were christian sex toy shops.

3 hours ago, RoseWilder said:

I wish I could find the article about the Duggars that I read once where JimBob was clearly censoring what Michelle was saying. The article was written before they had the show, back when JimBob was (whatever elected official he was at the time.) The interviewer mentioned that Michelle started to say something, then JimBob pulled her aside and they were discussing whether she could say what she was about to say. The person conducting the interview made it pretty clear that JimBob was calling all the shots and Michelle was basically his puppet. 

I've noticed a lot of people (both on this forum and others) say that they believe Michelle wears the pants in the family, but every since I read that interview, I've never believed that. And the police report stating that Michelle wanted to get Josh real counseling and was overruled by JimBob would also indicate that JimBob is calling all the shots in that family and Michelle has very little say in what happens.

This is probably the interview you are referring to....

http://www.quiverfull.com/articles.php/id20/

1 hour ago, MakeItSo said:

I now wonder if Marjorie was just a little too opinionated for the Duggsies...she did seem to know what she wanted (spotlight?)...I don't know. Just random thought that popped into mind.

 

ETA: Ventured over to the Marriage Bed and when I read "he expects, and has his heart set on having sex. If you cant do that lovingly with fond anticipation and desire, do him and yourself a favor, break his heart a little bit now, call it off and have an invitro from the sperm bank to satisfy your maternal urges and marry a eunick or homosexual for the public image aspect of parenthood." I just about spat coffee all over my macbook. Do I laugh? Cry? Wow! Just wow! (not that I truly expected anything different)

I would say....cry. That's really sad to me.

[Bad Wolf]

So, if you're coming down with the flu, or you've spent the last night and all day with a colicky baby, you smile and joyfully submit? I'm glad Mr. Wolf is considerate, and that sex is mutual. How awful would it be to believe this nonsense and wonder why you're so dissatisfied?